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Real-World Trade-In Values

245671060

Comments

  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    Sorry, i couldn't resist. You gave the fella sound advice, it's just, well, the 'real world', isn't it?
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Yeah.. prolly so...

    But imagine the charachters youd get selling that yourself!

    Bill
  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    We agree that trading it in isn't the best idea. Maybe he should sell it himself. THis way he can sell it to someone who needs it. If he doesn't trust it or he knows that it'll end up dying then he might as well donate it as he can get all the value out of it.

    Of course, if his income is as measly as mine, it won't make any difference to his bottom line as he won't have enough income to write it off from. :)
  • gcintendergcintender Posts: 36
    ...that's just the kind of straight-shootin' advice I've come to expect from you! I did get the '87 appraised at several Dodge dealers when I was thinking of buying a 2000, and the figures ranged from $500.00 to $1500.00 (the latter against a demo with 7500 miles). Needless to say, the dealers were less than entralled to see me pull up!
  • iscottsiscotts Posts: 28
    I'm not a dealer, nor a tax consultant, but blackcurrant got it right: the donation to charity is a mixed blessing. First, the charity will see a fraction of what you deduct, and secondly, the IRS will examine your deduction very carefully - you are only allowed to deduct what you would realistically be able to sell the car for (not nec. to a dealer). Be careful with the "charity" route, do your research on the charity, and document the value as well as you can.
  • gcintendergcintender Posts: 36
    ...right on with your post. I'm very leery of going the charity route for just the reasons you state. It's always a good idea to stay as far away from the IRS as practical! And blackcurrant, you must be clairvoyant about the income situation - I doubt if the deduction will do me a world of good. I strongly believe I'll go the trade-in route, without expecting the moon and the stars, of course.

    Thanks to everybody for your time and attention!
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Yeah,... $500 sounds about right to me..

    It's tough to put a hard number on that car..

    The donation route was an idea... who knows, right? :)

    Good luck, and may I make a suggestion...

    WHy not try and find a used 2000 or wait for a used 2001 Grand Caravan? That's one of the vehicles where you can save thousands buy buying a 6-mo old one...

    Just my 2c...

    :) Bill
  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    LOL Yeah, i used to recommend it too until i got myself into a situation where i had to budget my family's income month-to-month. (i'm not proud of it) Anyway, it wasn't long ago that i would've thought the same way as Bill. It can be a good deal if you have hi-income.

    Bill, right on about the used GC. When i was shopping for a minivan i tried to get a chrysler dealer to buy me a year old town and country for around 18.5 plus 1000. They're close to 30k new!

    Bill, what do you think about that clown who offered me 10.5 for my 95 Z28 and then backed out. Have you seen that happen in any of the stores you've worked at?
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Well,

    Yeah, the only way to buy one of those is to go used. They lose close to 40% Their first year!

    Remember, unless there's promotional financing going on, almost all banks give 1-yr old used the same rates as new cars.

    So.. maybe for peace of mine ya have to spend $900 or whatever on an ext warranty (Im prolly high there) you should still be at least $5,000 ahead of the game!

    That's like a Free Rolex!

    As far as the Camaro goes.. Who knows? I've never run into that myself, but it's very possible that what happened was that the UC Manager or GSM/GM decided that he didnt really want it that bad!

    What I'd do is to find a store that deals in cars like that... it shouldnt be too hard to sell!

    Personally, I have nobody local to you who could use it, (Or anyone I deal with for that matter) but I'd try using eBay to sell it. do it at $11,500 No Reserve no nothing.. but then you do have to deal with retail buyers... Selling wholesale is just sooo much easier!

    Bill
  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    and that's where i'm spoiled. I miss the easy deals, where the guy (dealer) knows what he wants and we usually agree on what wholesale is for that car for this week ;). and the bickering is over a few hundred and he cuts the check. No wife or parent to come in the last minute to squash the deal. Then waiting for the bank to come thru. OOOh, what about the insurance? Wholesale is so much easier.

    This guy just didn't have a clue. He was paying all the money (nada tradein) and his boss ripped him. That's just mickey mouse business. We had a deal! I don't think it's stupid money on a low mile Z this time of year, but, it's the SW man! They love their trucks! I hate that about this place. It's tough to peddle sportscars here. I keep thinking i ought to get it out to the east coast! ebay is an option but since it's been painted i'm hedging. It seems they don't pay good money unless the vehicle is flawless to feed the frenzy :)

    Great advice on the GC again. I sure hope people are paying attention here. WHat you said is what i discovered last year when i was shopping for them. BTW, i decided against the DC vans due to the rampant tranny woes.

    Thanks for your help. Good luck with the new job!
  • gcintendergcintender Posts: 36
    ...thanks again for your input. I am payong attention!

    I deceided to pass on the 2000s since I felt the upgrades to the 2001 (greatly improved headlights, iicreased horsepower and torque, and stiffer structure) were worth the wait sand extra expense. I haul a bit of weight in my business, and the beffed-up innards will come in very handy. Waiting for a lightly used 2001 is something I must cogittae on thoroughly, but when I buy a new car I want a NEW car, if you catch my drift.

    Another thing: since I'm likely to keep this van at least ten years, the massive depreciation becomes much less of an issue, at least in my view. Am I off-base with that?

    Plus, I have my doubts about the old bus lasting 6 more months! :-)
  • gcintendergcintender Posts: 36
    ...on Sundays. Sorry!

    :-)
  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    I agree with you about the depreciation thing over ten years. I had a similar thought with my recent new purchase of a 99 olds silouette. that's why i bought new. with the gm subsidized financing and keeping it a long time, i figured it would be ok.

    Anyway, a 1 yr old town and country i feel is the best minivan buy if you like DC products. I would have gone that route (1 year old with around 20k miles) for around 20k instead of my silo for 25 but i couldn't convince myself i wouldn't regret it later with the notorious DC van tranny problems. but, otherwise, i think the the t&c is the better buy! Anyway, good luck!
  • nt
  • markz2kmarkz2k Posts: 112
    Hi Bill,

    Great service you're providing here. Got one for you. My sister's got a '93 Ford Thunderbird, LX. All options, plus powered moonroof (Dealer installed when she bought it.) 3.8V6. Auto. Trans replaced/rebuilt this year. Mileage is about 95,000. Color is Silver, interior gray leather. Overall very good condition. Drivers seat has some wear. She has service records, all service done at Ford dealer. (Sunset Ford)

    What's it worth as a trade and as a private sale? (This is in Huntington Beach, CA)
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    I'd think that that car ought to be worth $2800-3200 or so on Trade, and I'd bet tha if you sold it yourself that you should be able to get about $5,000 for it if it's nice.

    It's the right color too!

    Bill
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Hey,

    I'm glad that I can help! However, I'll be out of town for about a week or so, so please post, but it'll be a little while befoire I can get to ya...

    Bill
  • audia8qaudia8q Posts: 3,138
    a while back on one of the board one of the regualr posters, i dont remember who, thought it might be good if a car maker was more responsible for rapid depreciation or poor resale value...
    Well forget cars, how about computers?....I dont see HP jumping up to help me buy a new computer...lets see $2500 6 months ago, open market value now is $300. if i find a "sucker" mmmmmmm. even GM diesels and Audi 5000's never depreciated like that.

    Rich
  • ccotenjccotenj Posts: 610
    lol... good luck on that one... if you figure out how to get away with it, i've got an old 80286 sitting in my den doing nothing that i'm afraid to admit how much i paid for...

    -Chris
  • ccotenjccotenj Posts: 610
    i think he meant "cogitate"... :)

    as far as charitable donations go, i've got an old 84 seville that's about to get donated, and i looked at it a couple ways.

    #1) i don't want to deal with the agg of even attempting to sell it.
    #2) fortunately, i can use the write-off.
    #3) even if i couldn't do #2, giving makes me feel good. even if the charity doesn't get every penny from the sale of the car, they are getting something from it.

    as far as worrying about the irs (to whomever brought the irs up), well, feel free to lose sleep over it, but generally speaking, if you don't cheat, you don't have anything to worry about. anyone want to take a guess at the percentage of returns that are audited every year for AGI's less than 250K?

    -Chris
  • mmcbride1mmcbride1 Posts: 861
    If you DO happen to make a lot of money (and I mean a LOT - several million, for example), you get audited EVERY YEAR. Regardless of whether or not they have ever found anything on your returns in the past, they will keep looking, because that's where the big $ is.

    As for your question, Chris, I would guess that less than 1% of those making under $250k are ever audited and about 40-50% of those making over $250k get audited.
  • ccotenjccotenj Posts: 610
    deloitte and touche's overall numbers. hunting for a reliable source by agi.

    -Chris
  • tboner1965tboner1965 Posts: 647
    But I do know that the company I work for, Sun Microsystems, does give you pretty good incentives to trade up your old equipment to more current. Additionally, we also offer competative upgrades, so we will take your obsolete HP equipment in trade for the latest offerings Sun has.

    Finally, the service often costs more than the hardware for high end systems, so it is often cheaper to upgrade than to purchase the additional support needed to cover the older (2 years old) hardware.


    Now, I work on the service side of the house, but we are concerned with "protecting" your investment. We have systems that have parts that you can move to a larger model. For example, if you buy a 3x00 series machine and later need a larger 6x00 series machine, most of your 3x00 parts will work in the larger machine, so you don't need to purchase all of the parts, basically you just need the larger box and you can put your existing system boards in that new, larger box.

    So, there are some of us in the computer biz that are worried about protecting your investement.

    Then there is the intel/ms folks...

    I can see your point, but I don't think the car/computer comparison is exactly fair. Automotive technology is not advancing at quite the same pace as computer technology. Let's face it, cars are not getting twice as fast, efficient, or safe every 18 months. About every 18 months, the speed and capacity of computing hardware doubles, and often at a lower price point :) than the hardware it replaces.

    Let's see cars double in capability every 18 months and cost less and we have an apples to apples comparison.

    Cheers,

    TB
  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    I got audited last year! It was interseting. They REALLY dragged their feet. What triggered it was an amended return i filed to recover 5500 i overpaid in taxes due to an inventory miscalculation (basically, the begining inventory was added in twice). Well, by the time my CPA was done with them, they paid us back with 9% int PLUS we found more rightoffs and we ended up gaining 1500 total MORE in our pockets.

    That'll TEACH 'EM!
  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    The only real reason to donate a car is cause it's not running well and it hardly has any book value(read old). I've seen lot's of these at the auctions and the charity hardly gets anything and then the sleazebag that buys it will put engine honey in it, a 200 paintjob and make a ckilling on some poor slob. If you want to feel good about it, then sell it yourself at a reasonable price to someone you know who needs transportation. We all know someone. Unless you don't trust it. But, donating it isn't the answer cause it just provides a way for the sleazes to take advantage disadvantaged.

    Wouldn't you rather have control over who TRULY benefits?
  • ccotenjccotenj Posts: 610
    you've got a point on the charity angle, one that i hadn't considered before... maybe i'll just find someone and give it to them directly....

    see??? GOOD things can happen when you get audited... just not very often!

    -Chris
  • willimjowillimjo Posts: 73
    Here's one that seems to be all over the map. 1992 Ford Explorer XLT, 4Dr, 4WD, V6, automatic, factory JBL stereo, factory sunroof, tan leather interior, roof rack, power bucket seats, power everything else, Cayman green, clean interior, no dents, couple of small rust spots in the lower rear door frames, Chicago area, and now the kicker ... 145,000 miles. The on-line sources have Trade-in from $4100 to $5600. What's your take?
  • SpyponderSpyponder Posts: 128
    If donating a car is so bad for the charity, why do we see billboards all over the place trying to persuade us to do just that? It must be the auto wholesalers footing the bill for those billboards...
  • ccotenjccotenj Posts: 610
    i guess the point bc is trying to make is that it's not necessarily "bad" for the charity itself, it's the final outcome i.e. someone gets really nailed at a "buy here, pay here" place... i had never really considered what happens *after* i gave it away, i didn't realize they wholesaled them, i imagined that they gave them to needy folks. guess i was wrong.

    -Chris
  • iscottsiscotts Posts: 28
    I didn't want to imply that an IRS audit is a terrible thing. I never lie on my taxes either and have nothing to fear. However, there were stories recently that the IRS is cracking down on all of those big car-donation write-offs, because people donate their rusty POC then claim blue book price instead of a real-world fair value (i.e., an amount which you could reasonably sell it for). There are also some "shady" charitable donation schemes which are nothing more than a channel for old cars to wholesale. Anyone who tells you that you can claim blue book on your tax return for a non-running junkyard car is shady in my book.

    I'm not saying that any of this applies to your car or your charity, but people need to do their research and gather their documentation up front.

    And blackcurrant does paint a rather sad picture of what happens at the bottom end of the market.
  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    It's not bad for the charity necessarily, but, did you know what they did with it? I know cause i worked the wholesale auctions as a dealer twice a week for two years. Whenever there's an opportunity to profit a profiteer will be there.

    I suppose you give to the united way.

    Giving CAN be personal, you know!
  • SpyponderSpyponder Posts: 128
    I'm not advocating taking your beater with the blown engine and lying about its value to get a tax write-off. If the car is junk, and you have any ethics whatsoever, junk it. But if the car is just old and rusty, but in running condition, there's nothing wrong with donating it and taking a write-off for the fair value. A lot of charitable organizations depend on these types of donations.

    Don't be jaded by your penance with the sleazebags at the wholesaler - if you are honest about it, everybody wins. You get the write-off, the charity gets their donation, the wholesaler gets their profit, and the eventual buyer gets basic transportation.
  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    I guess you don't want to believe what happens at the auction. Everyone wins except the eventual buyer. If you truly had an altruistic attitude you'd take the matter in your own hands and take care of it personally.

    That's all i have to say about this. Take care.
  • SpyponderSpyponder Posts: 128
    What exactly is it that I'm going to take into my own hands, selling a junk car to a personal friend or family member? That's charitable...

    Oh yes, I do believe what goes on at your auction. And I'm sure your buddies there have no problem foisting a lemon on some unfortunate soul who can't afford it (caveat emptor, but that's a whole different discussion).

    But any car I have that I wouldn't have a problem giving or selling to a friend, I also would have no problem donating to charity. If the car DOESN'T run, it goes to the junkyard.

    It sounds like your time at the wholesaler tainted your world view.
  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    ok, i tried. not sure where you get that impression. tainted. well, from a rose-colored perspective. These are the experiences i've had regarding this situation. If you have no problem giving it to a charity then you've simply dismissed what i've been saying. Whatever....
  • SpyponderSpyponder Posts: 128
    I'm haven't dismissed what you've been saying - I believe what you've said about unscrupulous wholesalers. What you are unwilling or unable to convince me of is that an honest person donating a servicable vehicle is wrong. If you aren't going to respond to this contention, I guess that is the end of the discussion.

    Cheers...
  • audia8qaudia8q Posts: 3,138
    I think what he is saying....

    if the person donating the car knows the cars problems and is aware that the car will end up eventually on "Lucky's buy here pay here lot" that makes the person making the donation an accossory, as is the charity. not saying the person a crook or thief just an accessory...

    Rich
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    This is a tough one, but I hate to tell you what I think...

    The way that you need to look at it is that it's an older, high mileage vehicle with rust, and with a lot of "toys" that can begin to act up.

    I really hate to say it, but the car hits me below where the guides say.. Im pegging it at about $2800-3200.

    If you can get close to KBB on a "real" deal, then you're doing quite well. Remember, very high mileage smacks a car a lot harder than the guides generally say.

    Bill
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    At least until Sunday night.. then I'll be gone until Thursday...

    Bill
  • caseyrcaseyr Posts: 4
    Hello. I'm considering purchasing the following vehicle:
    '97 Toyota Tacoma XCab 4X4 SR5
    auto
    37,590 miles
    power pkg.
    cruise
    am/fm/cass.
    premium sound
    tachometer
    bedliner
    alloys
    bucket seats
    sliding rear window
    sunroof
    Toyota certified

    What I'd like to know is 1)What do you think is the trade-in value for this vehicle (I've already checked KBB, NADA, and Edmund's), 2)How much was this Toyota dealership likely to have paid for it at auction (it is a former leased truck), and 3)How much (if any) does the Toyota certification add to the value of the truck? I've read elsewhere in Edmund's that it costs a dealership about $299 to have a vehicle take part in a manufacturer certification program.

    This site is a wonderful service and great help to buyers! Thank you for your consideration.
  • willimjowillimjo Posts: 73
    For the input on the 1992 Explorer.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Anytime!

    Glad to help

    Bill
  • caseyrcaseyr Posts: 4
    ...for the quick response. As for location and color, Ilive northeast of Baltimore, MD, and the color of the specific Tacoma I described above is black. Does that change your estimate any? The sticker price is $19,900, but the salesman told me it is not set in stone. I take it a dealership stands to pay more for this truck at an auction than from a customer as a trade-in, correct? In the past I have bought used vehicles (Fords and Mazdas) for 18-20% off the sticker price. Is it unrealistic for me to expect to do the same with this truck?
  • 1997 Chevy Lumina LS, dark blue ext/int
    34K miles
    Good to very good condition
    Chicago area
    In-dash CD, engine block heat, cloth seats, touring tires

    Thanks in advance -- great topic!!
  • tronsrtronsr Posts: 46
    BILL,
    I EMAILED BUT NO RESPONSE FOR THIS ONE.
    97 TOYOTA RAV 4, 4DR, 4X4,AUTO, ALL POWER,A/C, CRUISE, TILT, SEQUOIA METALLIC GREEN,ENKEI MAGS, TINTED WINDOWS, HARD COVER ON SPARE TIRE,SPLASHGUARDS,ROOF RACK,ARMREST CONSOLE, REMOTE KEYLESS ENTRY WITH ANTI-THEFT SYSTEM,EXT. POWER MIRRORS,FLOOR MATS, PINSTRIPE,HOOD BUG SHIELD AND WINDOW DEFLECTORS, ALL MAINTENANCE RECORD,NON SMOKER, GARAGE KEPT.
    I LIVE IN MELBOURNE BEACH, FLORIDA AREA.
    27,000 MILES, EXCELLENT CONDITION. WANT TO TRADE IN ON A 2001 FORD EXPLORER SPORT. PLEASE GIVE TRADE-IN ESTIMATE IN YOUR OPINION.
    THANKYOU,
    TRONSR
  • tronsrtronsr Posts: 46
    BILL, SORRY,
    I FORGOT YOU WERE GOING TO ORLANDO. THAT'S 72 MILES FROM MY HOME. HOPE YOU ENJOYED SAME.WILL LOOK FOR YOUR REPLY TO MY INQUIRY #103IN THE NEAR FUTURE. THIS IS A GREAT SUBJECT AND I KNOW IT WILL KEEP YOU BUSY BESIDES SELLING JAGS.
    TRONSR
  • blackcurrantblackcurrant Posts: 152
    Since Bill is temporarily detained, i'll take a stab at your car. 7000 would be a good price for you to get for a trade. Bill will confirm....the low miles helps.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Well,

    It all depends really! But like I said earlier.. with an idea of what they have in it, you could use that to your advantage I suppose, but dont expect them to do anything like $500 over cost. Bear in mind that dealers generally make a profit on their used cars. Like I mentioned earlier, at 3% Over invoice, the dealer is not really netting a profit on a new car.

    But I'd say that at anything under $20K is a very good deal... So if they're at $19,900 now.., anything below that is really very fair!

    Bill
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Well,

    I'm baaaaack! And Im getting settled in Orlando, which beats the hell outta St. Louis!

    Anyways, I did some checking on this car.. Blackcurrant may be a little low, but unfortunately, Luminas are very very common on the market. The color is neither good nor bad, condition helps, and the mileage is low, but it's still a 97 Lumina LS ant there's thousands of them running throiugh the auctions.

    Even so, I still think that the car is worth closer to $8,500 or so real money. That's if it's nice. Again, this is what I can go and buy them for at the sales.

    This is also why I always suggest that if you're buying a domestic sedan, that it makes a lot of sense to buy one that's a "program car"!

    Bill
  • tronsrtronsr Posts: 46
    BILL, THE ENKEI MAG SPORT WHEELS WERE A TOYOTA EXTRA FOR 598.00.THANKS FOR THE QUOTE ON THE RAV AS THAT IS IN THE BALLPARK. WHERE ARE YOU GOING TO SETTLE AND WORK IN ORLANDO.WHAT BRAND OF CARS WILL YOU SELL THERE,IF ANY?
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