Toyota Camry 2006 and earlier

lok888 · June 2003

I think so. I am sure the latest factory incentive, cash back and low APR financing help them sell a lot of Camrys. I and my wife's friend just bought a 03 Camry SE a week ago. We missed the Washington's Birthday sale event but we bought ours in the latest summer sales event. I am sure there will be one for summer end sales around Labor Day.

On the other hand, Honda year end sale only happens once a year with not too low APR on Civic and Accord. I think many past and potential Honda customers are losing confidence and faith on Honda because of its latest transmission and mechanic problems and slow on production on some high demand vehicles and mostly sold at MSRP.

alpha01 · June 2003

I think it helps that the new Camrys are perceived as having increased value compared to prior generations, and have shown Toyota's attempt to reverse the evident decontenting of the 1997-2001 MYs.

Food for thought:
A 1994 Camry LE 4 cyl auto with ABS stickered at $20,900 in 1994 dollars.

A 2003 Camry LE 4 cyl auto with ABS (and floormats) stickers at: $20,844 in 2003 dollars.

Certainly, though I would agree that the 92-96 Camrys were the most solidly constructed and best stylistically, there is no doubt in my mind, having had every generation of Camry excepting the first, that the current is by far the best riding, quickest, most fuel efficient, safest, quietest, and most capable handler of all the 4cyls. we've had.

(87 Base, 91 DX, 95 DX, 97 LE, 00 LE, 02 LE- first two were 4 year leases, next three were 3 year leases, and the 02 is a purchase.)

~alpha

camrysev6owner · June 2003

I was being sarcastic about the "isn't it just great" part. Why? I bought a 2003 Camry SE V6 half year ago and now they're offering a more powerful 210hp engine with 5 speed automatic transmission. Darn!

As you might already know, I live in Canada. I have just checked the Canada's Toyota website and I looked at the specs. It clearly says that the engine size is still 3.0 (as opposed to 3.3 in which I have read in the past few discussions). Perhaps the 3.3 is offered elsewhere?

If anyone knows the improvement in speed (0-60) with the VVTI please post a message here. I want to see what I have sacrificed by buying my car half a year early. My own reaches 60 in 8.1 seconds. I also would like to know if fuel economy is better with the new 5 speed automatic transmission. Is the car more quiet on freeways?

I've found that my own gives out a pretty loud grunt when it reaches 140 km @ 3000 rpm or so. I'm guessing that the new V6 VVTI doesn't do that.

My guess is that Toyota will stop selling 3.0 engines without VVTI once they get rid of them in their lots. My prediction is that there will only be two engines in the future available for the Camry. The 4 cyl VVTI and the V6 VVTI.

I have read in another discussion here saying that VVTI and VTECs are cheap ways to improve power. I won't comment on that because I've never driven a car equipped with them. Their reasoning was that BMWs never equips their cars with them. Any comments on this?

Finally, I am just wondering if the price will go up for the V6 Camry with the added VVTI.

everyday · June 2003

So you're that guy doing snow? angels in the middle of the street of that Camry SE commercial!

alpha01 · June 2003

It happens. Automakers constantly make changes to equipment, powertrains, etc. Our 02 LE had power drivers seat and keyless entry as extra cost options. Now, they are standard.

The speculation regarding the 3.3L V6 in the Camry is not as to it being the engine in the SE V6 now, but rather, starting for the 2004 MY.

"I have read in another discussion here saying that VVTI and VTECs are cheap ways to improve power. I won't comment on that because I've never driven a car equipped with them. Their reasoning was that BMWs never equips their cars with them. Any comments on this?"

These systems are technologically advanced, not "cheap" ways to improve power, if by "cheap" you mean "easy way out". BMW DOES use advanced valve timing systems, which I believe are called "VANOS". I will check this for you. What BMW DOES NOT DO is turbo or supercharge their engines, as the Bravarian King believes THAT is a "cheap" way to produce more power. OTOH, MB uses extensive supercharging.

I can't speak to the Candian Market, but the VVTi V6 has been on sale in the US since February. The old V6s are no longer on the lots, at least not here in the high volume central Jersey area. I do not believe there was a price increase for the new engine. In fact, I'm virtually certain.

~alpha

camrysev6owner · June 2003

Thanks for your input. Now I understand what the other guy meant when he said "cheap" power.

You should be glad that your 02 LE engine was all new and Toyota should be using them for the 4 cylinder Camrys for awhile. At least you only missed the chance to have standard keyless entry and power driver's seat.

I, on the other hand, missed the chance to drive a more powerful car! I really want to know how much faster/powerful it is when it comes out.

Enjoy your 02 Camry LE (WITH VVTI)!!! haha, sorry if I overexaggerated that. But I wished I had it in mine too!

masspector · June 2003

Coulda, shoulda, woulda. I have to go with alpha here. Things change. How could anyone in late 02 know that toyota was going to make this change? Toyota dealers may not have even known.

I know it seems like you had the worst timing. It is not like you are talking two model years apart on your car and the newer one, it was a matter of a few months. That is why I always suggest extensive research and looking at cars for at least a few months. I would never buy a car on a whim or do it in a few days time.

I OTOH was lucky. I started my search for a camry when the old v6 was still around and the newer one was just coming out. I, like you would have, decided to ignore the old v6. It was older technology and only a 4 spd auto and they were not being discounted any more for being older tech from what I could tell at the dealers. I drove the 4 and the 6 and decided that the 4 was fine and the 6 was not worth the extra $3000.

Sorry you missed out, you can always trade or at least go for test drives to see if you can tell any difference. Just file it away as a lesson learned. LOOK real hard, before you leap.

artc1688 · June 2003

Just bought a 03 Camry LE last week. Very happy with the car and forgot to purchase a mudguard...
Anyone knows of a discounted place for a Camry mudguard?

Thx
A

lok888 · June 2003

Beside ebaymotors, I would try www.camelbacktoyotaparts.com in AZ. I just ordered several OEM accessories for my 03 SE. like all-weather mats ($65), mudguards ($55), wheel locks ($31) and cargo net ($25). If you local dealer cost you less than $60, go for it. $55 is the lowest I have found.

drmp · June 2003

I went to a local upholstery shop and asked for some kind of custom made color-matched seat cushion at the front portion of the seat bottom. It resulted to a longer seat bottom with slightly raised front portion that follows the contour of my thigh. Very very comfortable. Hope that helps.

masspector · June 2003

Did you ever figure out the issue with your moonroof? On page 34-35 of my manual it explains the moonroof operation and how to reset it if the battery is disconnected. Sounds like it is a one touch affair. Hope this helps.

paul29 · June 2003

The grunt you feel at 140kph may be the lockup clutch disengaging (watch your tac for a 2/300 rpm rise) . The 4cyl does this at between 3800/4000 rpm . At this point and up you are working on the torque converter only.

artc1688 · June 2003

lok888 · June 2003

masspector - Congratulation on your XLE! That is a very good price. Isn't it V6 engine? My wife actually find out it is really an one touch power sunroof. She showed me by holding the open switch for at least a second, same thing with the close switch. The trick is I have to press and hold. In my Kia Sorento, I just have to press and open all the way.

Our two weeks old 03 SE (4 cyl) has over 300 miles. So far, there is no problem. But like many people say the sport tuned suspension is kind of bumpy on city roads. And the sport seats are much likely to attract lint and hair. Also, it doesn't seem the rear headrests are adjustable.

camrysev6owner · June 2003

Paul29 - Thanks for your explanation about the grunt I am hearing around 140km/h. As long as it's normal than it's okay. It's actually not loud at all, just loud enough so you can hear it. Actually it makes the car sound a little more sporty

Lok888 - I had the feeling about the sports suspension when I first got my car half a year ago. Once you are accustomed to driving it, you will love it. I have found another advangtage of having a sports tuned suspension is that when you're carrying 3 passengers at the back (perhaps with luggage loaded in the trunk as well), the rear of the car doesn't drop down as much. With the previous generation 4 cylinder Camry, I used to bottom out a lot when going over bumps in such situations. Maybe higher ground clearance in this the new Camry plays a major factor here too.

masspector · June 2003

Glad you got that figured out on the moonroof.

My XLE is the 4 cyl. I wish it was the v6 for that price. The v6 is only about $2000 more on a base model comparison, but with the options I wanted the difference in the 4 and 6 was more like $3000. This was due to market discounting on the 4 in my area.

I think the price was pretty good. The dealers kept grumbling about a $1400 loser, but by my calculations it was about $300 below edmunds invoice price and a $1000 rebate. The rebate is no skin off them. I too was surprised when they accepted my offer with no mention of SET fees, etc. Then I sweated each step of finalizing the order and waiting for the car to get here. I was expecting at each turn for them to try and raise the price for some reason. They did not to my pleasant surprise. The only thing I disliked was that the doc fee was supposed to be $389 and they added in a $110 loan application fee to this doc fee to make it $499. I did not squabble too much since I was getting 2.99% for 60 months.

mark_wny · June 2003

This weekend, I test drove the Camry - with both 4 cyl. and V-6. To my suprise, the V-6 did not seem significantly more powerful. Especially in low-end torque and accelerating from a stand-still, the 4 seemed to do pretty well. Which raises the question: why spring the extra $$ for the V-6? Where does the advantage start to be felt? On hills? In higher speed passing situations? I live in rural Western NY, where most driving is in the 35 - 55 mph range - 60 mph tops. Any advice from other board members will be appreciated.

dougb10 · June 2003

We bought a 4 cylinder XLE. We tried both the 4 and 6 versions. In our case, the price difference was just not worth it as the 4 cylinder has more than enough grunt. It is super quiet, smooth, and has unbelievable fuel economy. It also has a chain drive (as compared to a belt) which makes maintenance less costly.
Drive them both for some time and make your own decision, but from where I sit, the 4 cylinder was a great choice. There seems to be ample reserve for passing and I do not feel it is under powered at all. I used to drive a Maxima SE so we have had previous experience with a very quick car. In summary, you can't go wrong either way, but the 4 version is just perfect for us.

Doug

masspector · June 2003

exactly what doug said. I was in the exact same situation and went with the 4 also. I agree it does not have from a dead stop powerful acceleration, but it is fine and I am sure I will be able to agjust to it ok. My last car was a 96 sable with the DOHC duratec V6. It has good off the line acceleration, but the camry V6 did not compare. It seemed a little more powerful in passing but the only reason i would pay the extra bucks over the 4 would be if it had really good dead stop acceleration, which it did not, just like doug said.

gonkraz · June 2003

drmp Jun 13, 2003 7:19pm
Thank you very much for the information.

jmooth · June 2003

A few weeks ago I purchased a used 2002 Camry LE V6 with 18K miles on it. I noticed after a day or so a very subtle intermittent grinding sound in the front end. As (bad) luck would have it, I got a flat tire at about the same time. When I brought it in to the tire shop, they noted that the front tires had a significant amount of wear on the corners, due to either underinflation or hard cornering (though what kind of goofball corners hard in a Camry, I don't know). I had the tires replaced and front end aligned, and the grinding sound got a little better. But not much. It is still there.

I spoke to my salesman at Toyota and he said to bring it in for a look. I'll do that, but am afraid that they'll claim there is no problem after a cursory look at the car. How should I handle the fine folks at the dealership?

I also have a semi-related question about this car. When I was shopping, this particular vehicle was in the trade-in pen and hadn't been prepped or anything yet. As you know, Toyota has a Certified used car program. During my test drive, I asked my guy if the car was certified and he gave me a very noncommital "yes". However, I'm not so sure. I didn't receive any paperwork indicating that the promised 160-point inspection was done or anything like that. They cleaned it up real nice, but I have no record of anything else being done. How should I approach this? I'd like to have a Certified vehicle, and it seems that a one-year-old car should be in that category, but I'm not sure. What do you think?

lok888 · June 2003

masspector - My wife is driving this SE 4 most of the time for work locally. She feels very happy with the new car. The very first full tank of gas last her almost two weeks. We didn't drive and compare the V6 because we first looked at the LE 4. I read some discussion about the V6 is kind of under powered when compares with Honda and Nissan. Anyway, we bought this SE to replace our old Accord (4 cyl).

camrysev6owner - I will take a spin on highway once the break in period is over. Isn't it first 1000 miles or less? I drove it 60 mph on highway couple times. The RPM is less than 2K. The ride is smooth and quiet than city roads. I am not sure about the cornering. I assume the front strut bars will help a little. About the ground clearance, isn't it minimum 5"? But I noticed the rear section of the exhaust pipe (lead to muffler) is like a "L" shape. I was wondering that hurt the ground clearance a bit and properly will some ice and snow in winter.

canoe2 · June 2003

For little extra money ~ $1500 CAN you could have:
- 5 sp vs 4 sp automatic transmission
- Alloy rims vs. metal rims
- 4 disc brakes vs. 2 disc and 2 drums
- 210 HP vs. 157 HP

I think LE V6 is a good deal

mark_wny · June 2003

Looks like the 4 may be a good bet for my driving environment (which is gentle and forgiving - compared to Queen E Expressway in Ontario!). May go to Budget and rent a Camry for the weekend.
By the way, this is a pretty neat board - with very informed & helpful folks.

lok888 · June 2003

Isn't it 192 hp vs. 157 hp?

canoe2 · June 2003

If you got the car before Mar 2003, it is likely 192HP 4 SP. Any V6's were produced later, 210HP 5SP VVT-i

nippononly · June 2003

every certified car sold has certification paperwork that goes with it - to document the warranty etc. There is also a red and black sticker in those cars usually saying "certified". They do not have to certify every one-year-old they get, and if you did not get this paperwork, it may be that yours is not. If you go to the dealer and ask the question specifically, they will be able to provide the answer. If it is not, you may be able to get them to do something if the salesperson confirms they told you it was certified.

If the grinding is only when braking, that may be a normal sound some cars make as a result of the material in the brake pads. Or it may be a problem. The service department will be able to help with this - ask to do a ride-along with a tech, and point out the noise to him/her when it occurs, so that everyone is on the same page.

alpha01 · June 2003

There are many dealers in my area that offer a "certification" program on their vehicles, but they are not necessarily the MANUFACTURER's certification program, but rather some cheap dealer developed alternative, that is NOWHERE near as comprehensive or offers a warranty as long as Toyota's. CAVEAT EMPTOR. My friend almost fell into this trap purchasing a 99 Maxima.

canoe2-in the US, the SEs and XLEs, regardless of engine, have 4 wheel disc brakes. just wanted to point that out.

~alpha

alpha01 · June 2003

from a recent emailing that I got from BWW (regarding valve timing-I told you I'd get back to you with confirmation)

"Valvetronic: A new engine breathing concept

Valvetronic is one of the greatest advances in gasoline engines in decades. Seamlessly integrated with BMW's Double-VANOS "steplessly" variable valve timing, Valvetronic makes the BMW V-8 more powerful, responsive, smooth and fuel efficient, and excellent at cold starting."

~alpha

canoe2 · June 2003

Last weekend I made 400 Km trip on my 2003 Camry LE V6. The car had slightly over 2100 Km. Cruising around 115 Km/h 120km/h (72-75 mil/h), the gas mileage was better than my 89 Corolla. I got 7.4 l/100km on V6 engine with 2/3 full load ( 4 people) on the car. The car was super quiet (rattles free) on the highway.
I had chance to tryout the new fog lights which I installed last week.
I am happy with the performance.

dudleyr · June 2003

Another diff between the 4 and 6 cyl Camry is the gas mileage the 4 gets up to 33 mpg on the highway, and the v6 maxes out at 28 EPA.

nhepker1 · June 2003

Just upgraded today from a 99 CE Corolla to a Salsa Red 03 SE (I4). What a difference! I tested an LE as well but the SE had the options I wanted and I did notice a bit of a difference in handling (not a whole lot). I can't believe how smooth this car is. I can't wait until I'm done with the break in period.

canc · June 2003

That's great! I'm curious, do you use premium or regular fuel?

canoe2 · June 2003

I use regular fuel with 87 octane at Shell station for my V6 Camry.

canoe2 · June 2003

By selecting the knob to windshield position, does the air conditioner turn on automatically for defogging ? This is for 2002/3 Camry without climate control.

dilemma · June 2003

We are in the process of selecting a new sedan--I don't know how many times we've gone back and forth betwen the Accord LX and the Camry 4CYL (AT)-- wife needs an AT (tho I'm a stick fan). We live in the Rocky Mt. area and I'm concerned about how the 4cyl Camry AT will handle the passes. I've tried the V6 (not sure if the 4spd or 5spd?) and not impressed with the pickup for the extra money. Does anybody have any feelings on how the 4cyl AT will do in the mountains? The Accord seemed peppier (with its 5spd AT) but the wife likes the LE Camry. Any thoughts would help. Thanks.

camrysev6owner · June 2003

Congrats on your new purchase. I am pretty sure that you will be satisfied with your new purchases. I have Camry SE V6 in silver, although I think the Salsa Red looks a lot sexier!

I use regular Octane 87 fuel as well for my engine. I have tried using premium fuel but couldn't detect the difference. And in answer to your airflow selector question (Canoe2), you need to manually select A/C for windshield defogging, unlike the previous generation. I find it better to manually select A/C because at times, it is not necessary to use A/C to defog the windows.

alpha01 · June 2003

If at all possible, on the same day, test drive BOTH the 4cylinder and make SURE you have the new version V6 with the 5sp auto. Try to plan out a demanding course and drive both cars over this same course. Nail the accelerator from a stop, from 30 MPH, from 50 MPH, and up mountain passes.

We live in central Jersey and frequently take longer drives (we have 31K miles on our 2002 already!) and the 4 offers an excellent blend of performance and economy for our needs(well.. my parent's needs). Neither of them are leadfoots, though. The best 0-60 time I have seen for the Camry 4cyl AT is 9.2 in Motor Trend, and the best I have seen for the Accord 4cyl AT is 8.5 also in Motor Trend, but in a separate test. The Accord has a slight edge.

I feel the best value Camry right now is the SE 4cyl auto- optioned properly, to about $22,500 MSRP (and purchase price of about $20,000 as per carsdirect.com) you get a lot of car for the money.

I would caution you against the Camry LE 4 and Accord DX/LX 4 if you do a lot of heavy mountainous driving with substantial brake loads- both have the inferior rear drum setup which offer less fade resistance than 4 wheel discs. All V6 Camrys and the SE and XLE 4s have all wheel disc brakes, and all V6 and EX Accords have all wheel disc brakes.

~alpha

canc · June 2003

That's even greater news (about using regular grade fuel). As for the A/C question, I don't think it kicks in automatically (at least in my Solara). I have to press the A/C button if I want it to start. This, however, is the opposite in the Corolla--the A/C starts whenever you select either the defogger or the defogger and feet combo.

canoe2 · June 2003

Thanks for all replies. I think it's better manually to turn on A/C for any knob position. This would put less stress for A/C and better fuel economy.

nippononly · June 2003

Just so you know, the A/C does still kick on automatically in the windshield position for defogging. The change Toyota made is that in the new model, the little green A/C light does not light up as it did in the older ones. It is all automated now. If you read your manual, you will see that it mentions that it does this.

camrysev6owner · June 2003

I am pretty sure that the A/C doesn't kick in automatically in any mode unless you already have it on. I have tried turning the knob to windshield defogger mode and the little green light did not light up. I am sure that the A/C is not on because usually when you turn the A/C on, you can hear a little change in sound inside the engine (correct me if I am wrong). The most obvious reason why I am sure it wasn't on was because there was no cool air coming out when I turned the middle knob to the coolest point. However, I will check the manual to see if it should kick in automatically. If it should, then there's something wrong with my system.

Canoe2, do you have the new V6 engine with VVTI? If you do, can you tell me if it's a lot different compared to the old V6 (if you've tried it)?

everyday · June 2003

The AC does kick in automatically on windshield defrost mode without the AC light coming on. But I don't think it does so for the windshield/feet mode.

alpha01 · June 2003

in Canada, but I agree with everyday, nippononly, et al. that the AC definitely does come on automatically in defog/defrost mode w/o the light indicating that it is on- it says so in the manual!.

~alpha

suv4x4 · June 2003

I just changed my 98 Camry(44000Miles)transmission fluid in Toyota dealer this afternoon. when I drove to home, I pulled out transmission fluid stick and checked the fluid color on the white paper, the color was pretty dark. do you think it is the normal color, because I remember the color should be pink or dark red.

Thanks

jander111 · June 2003

Your dealer did a "drain and refill". If it's the first time in 44k miles, I think it's normal. Maybe only half or less of ATF was replaced in your tranny.

I drained and refilled my camry ATF 4 times in 6 months right after I bought it used. (The 1st time I also dropped the pan and thoroughly cleaned the pan, filter, magnet, replaced gasket.) One year later, did it the 5th time and added Lubeguard. The color on dipstick is pink. But if you drain it into a glass bottle, it still looks a lot dark than new ATF. I gave up -- you will never get the drained fluid look new. Anyway, the car shifts smoooooth.

If I were you, I probably would let dealer do it again at 60k miles. Better yet, DIY -- each drain and refill will cost you about $10.

By the way, how much does your dealer charge for transmission service? Just curious.

nippononly · June 2003

my dealer quotes $49.95 to do just a drain and refill (this is a "coupon special" that seems to run all the time), or they will do something they call a "power flush" of the transmission, which I would assume includes replacing ALL the fluid, for $150...how does that compare to other folks out there?

suv4x4 · June 2003

Toyota dealer charged me $69.95(parts $11.95, labor $58), the dealer told me that the service is included diferential oil change also.

bronzemaxell · June 2003

i change transmission fluid every 30,000 miles on camry on jiffylube, i always do a full change, don't know if it is necessary, but cost not much more. they do a complete change of fluid by draining out all old one at the same time pumping in the new fluid, whole process takes about 20 to 30 minutes. cost me around $70 or $80. i saw the color of the fluid is kinda reddish.

suv4x4 · June 2003

Toyota dealer charged me $69.95(parts $11.95, labor $58), the dealer told me that the service is included diferential oil change also.

Toyota Camry 2006 and earlier

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