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It stinks though that another Coastal Blue is on the road...I have only seen one other LX around here, and so far we have the only ES that I can tell. Great color choice though!
I do have an interesting story to tell...I haven't posted here in quite a while (have gotten sidetracked by the RX-8 stuff going on).
I was coming back by myself from filling up the van for my DW, and picking up a few groceries. There is a nice wide deserted divided entry road on the way home, which I make a right hand turn onto. I usually have a little fun with my Protege, so I decided to see how well my MPV handled. I hustled into the curve, and felt the front start to understeer as expected, but suddenly the rear broke loose too and I was in a 4-wheel drift in a minivan. I couldn't believe it. Fortunately, it came out of it fairly easy.
Great fun, but not recommended(the don't do this at home bit)...get a car that has a bit lower center of gravity.
Besides, my explanation to my DW as to why the bread had been compressed by the milk down to about 2 inches in height was not part of the fun experience.
Hey! Is the secret out already ???
It's beautiful.
Coastal Blue Metallic;
Grey interior, leather seats;
DVD System;
6 Disc CD;
Power Doors;
4 Seasons Pkg;
Front and rear AC;
8-Way Power Drivers Seat;
etc, etc (even the Cargo Net in the back)
I spent half the day just looking at it.
Love it.
I'll be taking it on it's first road-trip this weekend. Taking the family up to Leslie/lsinc's neck of the woods in Connecticut! ;-)
Hey Leslie - any recommendations on things to do with the family in the New Haven area? I've already got New Haven Ravens baseball planned for Sunday.
Gotta say thanks to everyone who has posted their thoughts on this vehicle over the last year. Reading it all gave me the necessary info to make my informed decision.
Gotta go and learn more about my "PeeVee" now. Will post my thoughts on it as they come to me.
Ok, let's see. If you like amusement parks there is Lake Compounce in Southington. Lot's of fun and easy to get to. If you are into a bit of history there is Historic Lock 12 in Cheshire. That wouldn't take too long to see. You could picnic and hike at Sleeping Giant State Park. That's one of our favorites. Museums? There is Peabody Museum in New Haven. Awesome! There is the Eli Whitney Museum which is also in New Haven.
If none of that stuff strikes any interest let me know. Luckily CT is not very big so I could recommend some other stuff further up I-91. There is also the beach. Hammonassett is very nice.
Happy Trails!
Leslie
Now, I may be out of touch with CT but try Hubbard Park (near Meriden off I-91) or Rocky Neck State Park (further along I-95) and then there was this Rte 77 which was a very scenic and curvy road (Would love to throw the MPV on those curves :-) If you have time for the commute, don't use I-95 .. Use Rte 5 (?Whatsthedamnname? Parkway) - Very scenic, very curvy :-)
Audia8q you hit the nail on the head when you said it would arrive this week!
Will look for your “golden retriever” plate on your Silver ‘PeeVee’. I (naturally) have NY plates.
Acedriver – we are “Coastal Blue ES brothers”. However, I didn’t get the moonroof because the dealer said the DVD system would have been pushed much further back as a result of it. It’s the only real option I passed up.
Thanks for your CT tips as well. Yeah, we are looking at Rocky Neck State Park. We origially were going to go to New London/Mystic (which we go to quite frequently) but there is some kind of “Sailfest” going on and all our usual places are booked up. I also usually do many annual baseball pilgrimage to Norwich to see the Navigators, but for some bizarre reason, the hotel rates in Norwich are absurdly high. I really can’t figure that one out, as Norwich has very little else to offer (and I’m being kind here). As it turns out, since the ‘Gators are no longer affiliated with the Yankees, I might as well go see the New Haven Ravens, which are much closer to get to.
Anyway, I will take up your suggestions on the “curvy roads”. I love the way the ‘PV’ handles so far.
Oh, and congrats Bottgers. I know you waited a long time. I'm happy to hear your PV is finally in.
dave_h2 I like Hammonasset better then Rocky Neck. Just my preference. Another point of interest would the Essex Steam Train. Not sure if you ever did that before. Gillette Castle is a fun trip to with beautiful grounds. You could take the ferry across in Chester. The only thing I would recommend if you are going to do that is to make sure the house is opened for tours. They were working on it a while back.
Hope this helps. Oh, I'm not sure of a Lighthouse park in New Haven. If I find out differently I will let you know.
Leslie
Here's the poop...I am torn between an '00 Ody, $23,500 w/ 40K & NAV system at the Honda dealership or trying to convince hubby to let me get into a new MPV. I have read a lot of problems with the Honda sliding doors and am worried that I just might get the lemon and he'll say,"I told you so." GRR
Please...any thoughts on this?...
I would put around $10K down and finace the rest , so the 0% from Mazda sounds great. Hubby thinks I can get a "great car" for under $10K...he's living in the dark ages! I am adamant about a minivan. HE wants me to get an SUV. I will never get behind the wheel of one of those. what other feedback/persuasive tactics can you offer me?
Or, do you think the Mazda dealership would be more willing to go down in price in a couple of months in order to make room for the '04 models?
arrgh! what do I do?
in the meantime, the Ody that I'm considering is still waiting for me in the other dealership parking lot. Is this an omen? I would have a better resale if I got the Honda,right?
I have previous posts about my deal and what I got. I bought my MPV the end of April. I have 5k on it and it's been running great. I had 10 miles on it when I bought it.
Here's what I got. '03 MPV LX, Silver, moon roof, auto sliders (love them) 6 cd changer, GFX package (makes the van look sportier) roof rack, traction control, rear air/heat (kids love it). My husband and I bought it under the S Plan for $100 under dealer invoice. We also took the cash back instead of the 0% financing. The MSRP was just under $28k and we walked out for just over $22k.
I have 2 children, 11 and 7 and the auto sliders are used and abused. They work great. They have safety features that I like. For instance, if you are moving and your child presses the button to open the slider it makes a beeping sound and won't open. If your child pulls the handle from the inside the door will open a small amount but makes such an aweful beeping noise. It will not however open all of the way. I think this happens because you can turn the auto sliders off enabling you to open them manually. It's just a guess. They also move very slow and will stop if there is something/somebody in the way.
I put a post in about seeing a child get her fingers slammed in a slider that released on a hill. It was horrible. The sound of the door slamming and the child screaming was enough to run my blood cold. I was happy to have the auto sliders, they move slow no matter what.
All in all, I love my MPV. I researched for months and test drove, crawled in, under, around the Ody., Sienna, Sedona, Venture, Chrysler T&C and the MPV. The MPV won hands down.
Good Luck.
Leslie
Zoom-Zoom!
So far I've got 33 miles on my new 'PeeVee'. When I picked it up it had 4!
After this weekend's jaunt to CT, we'll really begin to see how it performs.
Leslie, thanks for all the suggestions. My DW is now reading what you write. All of your suggestions will come with us. She seems to think she read there is a beach right there by New Haven. One with a 'lighthouse park' nearby.
pugnose, you can't go wrong with either vehicle. But just like Leslie said, I found the best "bang for the buck" was the comparably equipped MPV.
Good luck in whatever decision you make.
NEVER put money down on a 0% loan. It's free $$$$.
Put the $10k in a money market account (granted you won't get much $ in interest, but at least it's something) then take a bit out every month to pay the extra $ needed to pay the monthly payment.
I put $0.00 down on my MPV purchase. I only wish I could have borrowed more at 0% interest.
1) The MPV's sliding 2nd row seat is a good deal more functional than Honda's moveable 2nd row seat (not sure if the '00 Ody even has a moveable 2nd row seat). In my experience, people are more impressed by this feature than the disappearing 3rd row seat (available on both MPV and Odyssey).
2)The Mazda's 2nd row windows can be lowered, just like in a car. This is available on no other minivan, except for the 2004 Sienna.
3) The MPV's stereo sounds better. Reportedly, this is true even for the MPV LX model stereo.
4) As you've discovered by your test drive, the MPV handles much better. There really does seem to be a Miata in there somewhere.
5) The Honda's engine has more HP, but because the MPV is lighter, most MPV drivers (myself included) report being able to pass Odysseys as they struggle up hills.
6) Consumer Reports ranks the MPV slightly higher in reliability.
7) Edmunds user-ratings rate the MPV slightly higher in desirability.
8) The MPV is easier to maneuver in tight spaces, easier to park, and easier to back up without wondering what you're going to hit.
9) The MPV looks better (I think so, anyway).
10) The Mazda's warranty (48 mos., 50,000 mi.) is better than the Honda's, especially when the comparison is with a used Honda whose warranty has already expired.
11) Best of all, you get all the above advantages for a significantly lower price.
The Odyssey beats the MPV on resale value and size. The larger size of the Honda can be important primarily if you plan to often have 6 or 7 seats full, especially on long trips. In these circumstances, it's good to have the extra storage space behind the 3rd row, and adults are more comfortable in the 3rd row seats on the Odyssey. That's not to say the MPV's 3rd row is uncomfortable, but over long distances, it could make a difference.
In reading the message boards and talking to people, it seems to me that most Odyssey buyers never consider Mazda before the purchase, but assume that the conventional wisdom to be true (soon, that conventional wisdom will change from "The Odyssey is the one to have" to "The Sienna is the one to have"). But most people who consider the MPV in comparison to the Odyssey end up with a Mazda (the exception being those who really do need the larger interior).
Also, scott31 is right. If you go for a 0% loan, keep your $10k in the bank.
backy: Edmunds calculator had a flaw. It could not calculate correctly when the loan term was different. I was trying to compare a 4.49% for 48 mo loan against 0% for 60 months. If you run those numbers individually, get the monthly payment and total payment over the loan term, that will give you the accurate answer. IMHO, even if it is a 0% loan, you can still put a down-payment. The net effect will be to lower your total loan amount financed and hence bring down your monthly payment. It is the pre-payment on a 0% loan which does not make sense because even if you pay it sooner, you will still be paying the set amount. Now, if you pre-pay a loan which is greater than 0%, you save on finance charges.
pugnose: Power Sliders are an option both on LX and ES trims in MPV. For $24K, you can get a whole lot of a loaded LX MPV. Check if you qualify for S-plan (i.e. if you or your husband's company is a partner/supplier to the Ford Motor Company or Mazda Corp. Check : http://www.fordpartner.com). There is currently a $2000 rebate in effect for MPVs which is rumored to go up to $2500 in August. Also, 0% for 60 mo was announced on July 1. Since the 2004s are around the corner, there are very few 2003s coming in and those on the dealer lots are the only ones which you can choose from. If they do not suit your needs, you cannot "order" a 2003 anymore. Point your DH towards the SUV v/s minivan topic and let him see how a MV can provide more usability, flexibility, better mileage. Unless you two go serious off-roading, SUV is just a gas-guzzling chunk of metal. Do you intend to sell off the MV in a couple of years ? If so, then a used HonDuh might give a better resale value. A new MPV (as with any NEW vehicle) will depreciate once driven off the lot. If you intend to keep the MV for a long time, it is better to get a NEW vehicle with the mfgr warranty. MPV offers 4 yr/50K bumper-to-bumper warranty. Are you getting any warranty on the 2000 Hon-Duh Oddity ? Bottomline: Unless you NEED the space with the Oddity/04 See-n-Nah provide, MPV is the the only minivan to consider. And hey! The ONLY minivan which is actually manufactured in Japan (Hondas and Toyotas are now made in USA)
As far as cargo capacity with a full passenger load. I have had 5 kids, (3 are my sisters and 2 are mine) me and my husband on a trip from Mass. to CT with 2 laundry baskets (that's how my sister packs for the kids), 2 sleeping bags, 6 pillows (each of her kids has to have 2), 2 back packs (toys). We still had room for more gear and that was with the third row seat up and being used. The well where the third row seat hides away gives you extra storage in the back. I was very impressed! I never could have done that with my Villager.
Oh and I also agree. Don't put the $10k down on 0% financing.
Go Mazda!
Leslie
There are many things to do in CT. It depends on how far you want to travel. In Simsbury there is the Heublein Tower. It's an awesome hike up Talcott Mountain to the tower. When you first walk into the tower they have a museum and then you can actually go up into the living quarters. The view is spectacular.
Granby has the Old Newgate Prison which is usually pretty cool with the kids. It's underground. Also in that area, in Windsor Locks is the Bradley Air Museum which is a personal favorite.
All of the above can be reached in short order. CT is just not that big. My husband commutes every day from Cheshire to Simsbury. You could get up to Windsor Locks from New Haven in under and hour.
Can't wait to hear what you chose to visit.
Happy Trails in your new "PeeVee"
Leslie
And that relates to the depreciation one experiences with "any" new car. If I recall correctly, Edmunds estimates a first-year MPV depreciation of around $6,000, $3,000 in the second year, and about $2,000 per year for a while after that. But that's from MSRP. If you deduct the ca. $2000 difference between MSRP and selling price, and then deduct the $2,000 rebate, that instant hit you're supposed to take when you drive it off the lot is nonexistent. You could even argue that it's negative!
That seems to the popular opinion today :-) Maybe it's just me, but I like the option of no car payments at all and hence I always try to payoff the car loan as soon as possible. With $10K down on a $22K car, your loan amount is only $12K. In this scenario, I would adjust the loan term to get a monthly payment I am comfortable with and be done with the loan et al.
Plus, when you put a down payment, you are building some equity into the car (Not that the vehicle is an appreciating asset). This will prevent you from being "upside-down" on the loan if you do decide to sell the vehicle.
The devil's in the details though. Any money you put in the car will lose value as it depreciates. On the other hand, if you don't put enough money into the van, you run the risk of getting upside down in the loan should you wreck it or need to sell it before you pay it off.
At today's interest rates, it's hard to earn more than the 4.34% we got over 5 years. So we put enough down to make the interest expense roughly equal to the rebate, and plan to pay it down early to reduce our overall acquisition cost. That way, the total amount spent on the van is small, and the depreciate expense shrinks with it.
I'm basically kissing off any potential earnings on the money we put into the van, since I can't make more than the loan rate, let alone the loan rate plus the depreciation rate, without taking on unreasonable risk.
You're buying a depreciating asset. I don't see a way to turn it into an investment vehicle (pun intended). All the more reason to seek the best value for the dollar in your cars, and stay away from overpriced brands.
Outside of the lottery, there's no such thing as free money. I'm not even sure that the lottery's free...
Hope this helps,
-brianV
Besides from extra space and maybe resale, I don't think Oddity offers much ...
EDIT: Steve_HOST, I do NOT see a MPV against Oddy discussion forum. Maybe you can start one ? I am pretty sure you will end up having to work more .. :-)
Mazda MPV vs. Honda Odyssey
Thanks for asking!
btw, Ace, can you send a Feedback Form in about that Calculator flaw? (I'd do it, but I don't speak math <g>).
Steve, Host
The problem with portable DVD systems is there's no place to mount them where everyone seated from the second row back can view them. The only mounting location serving this purpose is on the celing.
zoompv
You are absolutely right about MPV pricing. I used the S-Plan, but I have seen some people who didn't use it and got a better price than I did. Using the S-Plan simply gets you a very good price without haggling.
I checked with two Mazda dealerships in the Northern Virginia area. Both dealers said the 2004s will be coming in November/December. Can someone confirm or deny or this?
Five months is a long time to wait for the 2004 model. Thanks.
Maybe AudiA8Q can give an accurate timeline ...
Re S plan: I checked the fordpartner web site, and it requires a special code that it says I have to get from my employer. Know of anyplace else to find out which companies are in the "S" plan? (Just finding the right person to ask in my company could take me many hours.)
On the car-for-$10k vs. SUV vs. minivan (MPV vs. used Ody) discussion: this husband seems a little inconsistent, saying on the one hand "get an SUV" and on the other "you can get a great car for under $10k". You can get a decent (compact) new car for under $10k, but not an SUV; try even getting a decent used SUV for under $10k! If it were my $20k+, I'd go for the new MPV in a second vs. a nearly four-year-old Ody with no warranty. I don't like buying used cars in general--who knows how it was driven? Who knows if proper break-in procedures were followed? Who knows if it was driven in the Salt Belt and whether the salt was washed off it regularly, or if it will be prone to premature rust-out? And so on. Also check the reliability ratings of the 2000 Ody--CR has it rated only "Average". It didn't get Above Average on CR's assessment until '01.
A) how do I go about finding the invoice price on and LX w/ moon roof/sliders/traction/ rear air?
The dealer said that he could not give me the info over the phone as I told him that taking an extra trip down there just to discuss $ with my toddler in tow would be difficult. I read on one of the sites that you should be able to offer 5% over invoice and that if they can't deal with that, just walk away. He also told me that he couldn't give me specific prices for each item (grr) and that I needed to just "tell him what I wanted" and that he would "work up a price for me."
Yeah right...
Well, you got me sold on the MPV I just need a little nudging and some more info as explained earlier.
I really, really appreciate yourimput. Please help with the financial stuff if possible..
thanks again
If you want to play w/pricing, go HERE.
You mentioned "rear air." To me, that means rear a/c AND rear heat, but to Mazda, it means rear a/c only. If you want rear heat as well as rear a/c, you'll need both the "rear air" option and the "4-seasons" package. But the 4-seasons package is an excellent value, in my opinion.
Also, since you mentioned an interest in the 0% financing, be aware that Mazda offers 0% financing OR a $2000 rebate; you can't get them both on the same purchase.
Before we even left the dealer parking lot, the kids had the DVD system figured out and were watching a movie. Since they had the headsets on, we tuned in some decent music up front. One thing I notice right off the bat. The A/C works better with the inside/outside air selector in the inside position. It actually works quite a bit better in this position.
During our 100 mile trip home, we encountered all the typical driving situations, city driving, stop and go traffic, highway driving, etc. In the city, the MPV is quite spirited. It wasn't quite as peppy on the highway, then again we were running 80 mph. Also keep in mind our elevation here is 6,000 ft, which costs you about 1/3 of the power you'd have at sea level.
I haven't found any flaws with the van yet, and I'm very pleased with every aspect so far. Even though we ordered our van on March 17th and our wait was almost 4 months, and even though I bellyached about all the waiting, it was well worth every day!
2003 Sage Green LX
4 seasons
DVD
rear air
roof rack
P.S. This sage green is a sleeper color. I barely liked it when I first saw it, but the more I see it, the more I love it!
Happy trails!
Zoom-Zoom!
Glad your delivery went well. enjoy your new van.
Rich
I'm not surprised you found the A/C works better in recirculate mode than fresh-air mode--that's typical. I've heard that it's not good to leave A/C in recirc mode all the time, however, since you won't be getting fresh air into the cabin then. If the fresh air setting can't cool a van of this size down, even with rear air, that's a bit troubling to me. How hot was it when you drove home? Did you need the recirc just at the start, to cool the van after it had been sitting in the sun?
For the record, I understand that a normally aspirated engine looses 3% of rated power per 1000' above sea level, so at 6000' you're only down 18%, not 30 something.
As to the oil filter, it's located on the bottom of the engine, near the front bumper (mounted upside down, which is handy.
I'm old school, so I'll be changing engine oil and filter at 1000 miles and again at 3000, then every 3000 thereafter. I've been following the oil grade debate for 2 years now, and have settled on 5w-30 year round for this engine. 5w-20 just doesn't sit well with me for 90-100+ degree days in the summer.
Having the filter mounted upside down means that you can fill it before installing it. Makes for less time without pressure/fluid on startup after maintenance.
-brianV
I interpret that to mean "keep it under 4000 rpm".
They also mention no full throttle starts (amounts to same thing, roughly speaking), no towing, drive at different vehicle and engine speeds (no cruise control), no panic stops, etc.
We plan on babying our new baby for the first 1000 miles, then change the oil and stop worrying about it. But that's just old school talking...
Hope this helps,
-brianV
The only thing you'll need to keep an eye on when changing the oil is the crossmembers that are nearby the oil drain and filter. To prevent spilage on these areas, just cover the surrounding area with some aluminum foil.
I've also heard that the first filter and oil drain plug are a bit tough to get loose the first time. Be patient, it will come off with some perseverance and perhaps a longer ended socket wrench.
-Brian
TB
Everything looked great. Our MPV is running great!
Leslie
As far as the break-in goes, I believe the concern is with keeping the engine rpm's under a certain rpm, not so much with speed. Since the engine is only turning about 2600 rpm at 80 mph, I'm sure that speed is well within the break-in requirements. I looked in the owner's manual concerning fresh air/recirculated air switch and it didn't say anything about it being bad for the system by running it in the recirculated mode. BTW, the temp while I was coming home yesterday was over 90 deg.
bsvoller
I've also been following the oil weight discussions for quite a while myself. From what I've seen on the Pennzoil 5W-20, not only is it superior to any other non-synthetic 5W-20, but it's also superior to most of the 5W-30's as well. Because it's made up of 70% group III base stock (which basically means it's 70% synthetic), it's far less suseptable to viscosity break down like the heavier weight oils. The Penn also contains moly. This oil gives me a warm fuzzy.
My husband and I have continued to read the various chats, hoping for as much insight as we can get about our new MPV.
We're looking for opinions about what we were told by the acting manager of our Mazda dealership's service department. They said that the oil in our new MPV is a "synthetic break-in oil" and we shouldn't change it for at least 3700 miles or even as much as 5000 miles!!!!!!!!
This advice goes against everything my husband has done in the past for our vehicles. And from what we've been reading, all of you are on the same page as my husband on this issue.
Do we really let this original oil stay in our MPV for so many miles? Any input would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks, Sharon
I would drain your first oil no later than 1,000 miles.
If your going to run dino oil, Castrol and Pennzoil are two of the better blends. Good additive packages, and a good dose of molly. IMO the Castrol resists shear breakdown a little better than the Pennzoil. This is important on a OHC engine.
Personally, I run Mobil 1 5w-30 in the DW's 02 LX. I drain at 5,000 mile intervals. I use a K&N Oil Filter. The Motorcraft FL-820S is a good lower cost alternative. 5w-30 is ok with Mazda. 20w is simply CAFE.
I also run the same set up in my 03 Mazda 6s.
Regards,
Mark. : )
All these folks who talk about break-in oil never seem to know where to buy it.
TB