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Did the Japanese ever make a hardtop sedan? I'd be inclined to guess no, because it would be kind of hard to make a 4-door hardtop on a short wheelbase. The smallest American 4-door hardtop I can think of was the later-60's Corvair, but its 108" wheelbase would've been massive by Japanese standards back then!
I don't think the Japanese ever made a 4-door hardtop for export. I'm sure that at home they tried one of everything.
70s Japanese styling has been referred to on these boards as "Atomic Cockroach", which is pretty good.
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Maybe kind of like Rambler in the early '60s when at one point they managed to get to number 3 with some very funky styling--they were the sensible alternative to the big flashy Detroit iron.
I'm not sure the Atomic Cockroach school of styling is completely gone. It's been years since the Sentra was a clean if boxy design (kind of like the 510) and the current Maxima looks pretty dorky from certain angles IMHO. The new Altima looks better than the one it replaced but that's not saying much--great taillights but everything else about the car is still (deliberately?) goofy and uninspired.
But yes the '61 Plymouth was a real piece of work. I occasionally drive past a green four door sedan that I imagine small planes use as a navigation landmark.
Just as a sidenote, I think early '60s Mopars are the only cars I'd have look up to remember. Every other line-up I could describe in minute detail. That says a lot for where Chrysler was in the early '60s. It was about that time that Rambler beat them for the number 3 slot.
By the way I think it's great that someone would spend that much time (and a few bucks) on an old Celica. The torch has passed.
Speedshift, I agree with you re 60s Mopars; for whatever reason(s), I have great memory regarding GM and Ford products of the 60s, but not Mopars.....I dunno why.
Maybe it was 1960? Dodge made a big comeback that year, mainly at Plymouth's expense, and that might've been enough to let Rambler slip on past. I have a book that list sales figures, but never bothered to add it up, but I have a feeling that the full-size Dart lineup actually outsold the full-size Plymouth lineup that year. The only reason Plymouth still beat Dodge was probably because of the Valiant.
I think Pontiac took #3 around 1962-63, as Rambler started a long decline and never really came back.
My mom had a '59 Rambler wagon when she was a teen. Her first car was a gray '57 Plymouth (leave it to my mother to get a '50's car in a bland color!), but she didnt' like it because it seemed too big for her. So she sold it and got the Rambler, a gaudy pink-and-black 2-tone job. I remember her telling me that one of the rear wheels fell off of it, and I think that was the point she decided to get a new car...a '66 Catalina convertible. Only thing I can't figure, is that if the Plymouth felt too big for her, how did she handle the Catalina? I'm sure the Catalina handled a lot better, though, which probably offset that additional length.
Another thing I just thought of that's interesting... her car losing a rear wheel, but doing no real damage. I have a feeling that if a wheel fell off of a modern car while you were driving, the resulting impact with the road surface would do some pretty serious damage. Now I don't know what exactly separated in her car to make that wheel fall off...maybe it was just the lug nuts, or maybe the whole axle separated or something? Whatever it was though, I think the expense ended up being fairly minor.
Pontiac took over #3 in 1962 when (one can surmise) the market was leaving economy for performance--Pontiac sold many more full-sizers than compacts. In fact '62 was the first year for the Grand Prix, a big sales success that may have put them over the top.
I think it's the full-size Mopars that are so forgettable. First, they didn't sell that many and second, styling in the early '60s swerved from No Holds Barred Exner to Official Repudiation of Exner. There really wasn't a steadily evolving styling theme, no consistent brand identity that made you say, "Yup that's a Dodge". I couldn't begin to tell you what a '62 Dodge looks like and that's absolutely amazing.
Sounds like your mother's Rambler's axle shaft broke, probably from all the wheelies she was pulling ;-).
The 1977 Celica project is coming along well. Today I finished the cooling system overhaul, replacing the radiator, cap, hoses, transmission lines, clamps, thermostat, and coolant all with new parts. Everything went together well and it doesn't seem to have sprung any leaks. I also replaced two rubber fuel lines after one burst a few days ago, spraying gasoline all over the engine. Fortunately, no fire. Next up is a transmission service and brake overhaul. After those are done, it should be mechanically sound and reliable. Then it's just more body work (RUST!) and replacement of various cosmetic trim parts. Hopefully all will go well...
-Andrew L
My hubcap business is no longer in full swing since I'm now a college student. I made most of my sales online while I was in high school, but since I can't bring all 4,000 hubcaps to college with me, I'm limited to selling on eBay, or locally when I'm home. So anyway, I would buy yours myself, but I already have lots of hubcaps and not enough time to sell them. I recommend that you clean them up and list them on eBay. If you need any help identifying caps for listing purposes, send pics to A_L_Hubcaps@yahoo.com and I'll do my best.
-Andrew L
The value of classic ('50s, '60s, '70s) caps varies a lot depending on what vehicles they're for. In most cases, wholesaling them for $5 each is reasonable. But if you have anything with a "spinner" center on it, or anything Mustang, Corvette, Chevy SS, or any five-spoke "mag type" covers, they could be worth quite a bit, so it might be a good idea to do a little research before you let them go cheap. Good luck.
-Andrew L
2 1958 Pontiac full wheelcovers
2 1955 Buick " "
3 1964 Wildcat standard
1 1965 Riviera wire spinner (some wires damaged)
3 1963 Olds spinners
1 1964 SS spinner (some damage)
4 1966 Wildcat standard
3 1965 Riviera standard
Plus one 1960 Corvair soupbowl I'll keep because it was about the only thing left from my first car after I totaled it.
Not to mention four '68 Cougar ultra-rare spinners I sold to a dealer about a year ago for $5 each. Not much about Cougars is hot so I can't imagine they were either, although he did seem a little too happy.
Too bad the Riviera spinner cap is damaged; that would be a good one if it were mint. The only other thing that caught my eye are the 1963 Oldsmobile spinners. I'm not sure which style that is (I'm not too great with caps before 1970), but if they're in nice shape, it might be worth ebaying them to see if they bring more money then you expected. It seems like anything with a spinner brings big money on ebay. I got about $25 for a fairly beat-up 1966 Mustang spinner cap awhile ago. Other than that, I would go ahead and sell them for $5 each if you have a buyer.
Shiftright-
I'd be glad to participate in a hubcap contest, but I'm not so good with the ones before 1970, and especially before 1960. But I'd do my best, and without sneaking a peek at the interchange book :-)
-Andrew L
Everyone always gives me a hard time for having hubcaps, but I think original hubcaps look really nice.
Andrew, I think I'm going to try peddling my hubcaps on eBay. Sounds like you had good luck.
I've found that the trick to getting lots of bids on eBay hubcaps (and all eBay items, for that matter) is to include photos, give detailed descriptions, and have a reasonable starting price ($5 is probably good for a decent hubcap). But you never know what will sell...I've had some caps sell much higher than I expected, and others I can't get rid of at any price. Good luck!
Chevytruck-
Do you have the large aluminum dog-dish caps on your Chevy? Those are nice looking if you keep them clean, but they do not stay on well at all. I have about 20-25 of them in stock, all of which I found on the road. In general, I too prefer original wheels/hubcaps over aftermarket wheels. I especially dislike alloy wheels on passenger cars, because they always come with low-profile tires that allow them to get damaged easily. My Pontiac still has the original 15" steel wheels with stainless full wheelcovers and whitewalls. It looks old-fashioned, but so does the whole car. I would never consider changing them. I can attest to the durability of big tires and steel wheels, because I've hit all kinds of potholes, driven over curbs, etc. in my efforts to retrieve hubcaps from busy NJ highways, and I have never had a tire or wheel failure. On the other hand, I've seen many people stranded on the highway with 2 flats and 2 cracked alloy wheels due to slamming a deep pothole. I would rather lose a hubcap than destroy a tire and wheel any day :-)
-Andrew L
I'm really pro-steel wheel. I've had quite a few sets made up to a specified width/offset. I don't think they are heavier (if anything lighter) than most aluminum wheels. Tire machines are easier on them. They bend in accidents rather than breaking. The quality level (balance, out of round) can be good or bad on both types, so that's a wash. The one advantage I can think of on most aluminum wheels is the ability to have goofy shapes cast up.
It wouldn't suprise me if the best aluminum wheels are better than the best steel wheels, but it would bug the heck out of me to pay $750 a corner.
Well I have hit some potholes where I was thanking god my a-arms didn't bend or snap, of course at 70 my trucks starts getting a interesting feel to it, but I don't think that is the wheels think it just isn't designed for freeway, plus all the busings have 340,000+ on them so eventually I'm going to put some energy suspension bushings on them.
Anyway, if you're interested, check out http://briefcase.yahoo.com/andre_1969/ . I posted a few pics there of a '79 New Yorker 5th Avenue that I recently bought. There's also a pic of my '57 DeSoto in there, if anybody's interested. Eventually, I'm gonna try to get the whole fleet online...
As for the R-bodies, they were a hasty response to GM's wildly successful downsized B- and C-bodies of 1977. Ford was also a few years late to that game, as they didn't downsize their Crown Vics and Grand Marquis models until 1979, and the Lincolns until 1980! To make the R-body, Chrysler mainly just took their intermediate B-body (the Furys, Monacos, Coronets, etc that we so commonly saw crunched up on the "A-Team" or the "Dukes of Hazzard"), and heavily reworked it. Mechanically they were the same...engines, suspensions, rear-ends, etc, but they were given a much more creased, angular look. They were a lot lighter than the cars they replaced, but the stylists gave them a heavy, massive look, which could be part of the reason they didn't sell too well.
They were available as the Plymouth Gran Fury, Dodge St. Regis, Chrysler Newport, and Chrysler New Yorker. The 5th Avenue was a trim package that added about $1500 to the base price of the NY'er, which was already around $10,000 in 1979. I'm not sure exactly what the 5th Ave package comprised though. Probably just different leather and trim variations. The Newport, St. Regis, and Gran Fury were very popular with police departments and taxi fleets, but just never caught on with the general public. The New Yorker sold fairly well its first year, 1979, with about 55,000 units moved. But with 1980 it was downhill fast...something like 13,000 units, and even less for '81.
Anyway, for the most part, they're just big old cars that nobody wants, but I have a perverse fascination with 'em ;-)
The New Yorker, well...I used to buy cars like that but they were usually 10-15 years older. They're why I'll be able to retire when I'm 85.
I also see where the K-car's got their dashboard design.
At the time I actually liked these cars. I thought the styling was fairly contemporary and certainly better than the new downsized Ford of that same year. But they seemed to have all sorts of quality woes. I remembered Consumer Reports testing one and finding an incredible number of things wrong with it, including a snapped front torsion bar. You certainly don't see many of them today, so I think they were fairly quickly taken out of service. The ones you do see certainly never seem as nice as yours.
My brother had a '79 New Yorker for a short time as a company car. I really liked the dash in particular. It did seem to me to feel like an intermediate rather than a fullsizer though. I think maybe that, along with the rumors of Chrysler's impending demise at the time, probably hurt sales more than anything. I recall my boss in 1980 announcing that she was going to buy a new Cordoba because she thought it important that Chrysler survive. We all looked at her like she was nuts (well, maybe she was, but...). She ended up buying a nice one, sort of a silver green with a matching half-vinyl roof. I thought the styling of those was great.
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But yeah, the NYer was pretty cheap. I ended up paying $900 for it. And about $250 to get it through Maryland inspection. I bought it from a dealership in West VA, who said he'd put it through inspection if I was tagging it in PA or West VA, so I guess Maryland is pickier about inspections. I just got the emissions test notice in the mail too, so that's my next hurdle. I guess that's one problem with playing around with old cars that aren't old enough!
The day after I bought it though, I saw a '79 St. Regis on the street around the corner, for sale for $500 or best offer. I'd been seeing this car around the area for years, and knew where the owner lived (you learn a lot delivering pizzas), and had always been tempted to make them an offer on it. So I guess it's only natural that it goes up for sale the day after I bring an R-body home! It was a dark emerald green with a green cloth interior, and had recently been repainted. I've always been attracted to greens (well, the non-pondscum/puke varieties ;-) and thought it was a neat looking car, with its raked-back checkerboard grille and plastic-covered headlights. It was a more basic model though...no power stuff, no 8-track, 318-2bbl, etc.
Oh well, I guess I can't take in every stray I find ;-)
I have been waiting to see your fleet for years!
Bill
Wish I had pix of the 3 Plymouths :parent's Fury, my 63 Valiant Signet and my little bro's Saporro [78/79?]. Seen one of those lately???
There was one I specifically remember. I was two tone. Dark blue on the sides with gray hood/roof/trunk. At the time it was an awsome looking car.
When the Cordoba first came out for '75, it was referred to as a cross between a Monte Carlo and a Jag. That first year, it also outsold every single personal-luxury coupe on the market, except for the Monte.
From a mechanical standpoint, was it the '75 that had the problematic "lean burn" engine?
Both cars would get crappy mileage around town, but both would also break into the lower 20's on the highway, probably partly because off tall gearing. 2.41:1, I think. I think Lean Burn was designed to start running rich when it crapped out, so it wouldn't burn up your valves. Probably wasn't foolproof though! From what I've heard in my Mopar clubs, it's also not hard to convert back to a regular, early '70's style electronic ignition.
It was a nice looking car, with its fake-hardtop look (no B-pillar, but those back windows were stationary). I also like the dash display on them. It looks like they took the dash out of an R-body and trimmed it a few inches to make it fit. About the only difference though, is the R-body has an oil pressure gauge, while the J-body (Cordoba/Mirada) only have an idiot light in that spot. I'd say it felt about as roomy as a Monte Carlo or T-bird of the time, although it was definitely wider inside than either of those, and the T-bird suffered from that huge Fox-platform driveline hump. But then, being as roomy as a Monte on the inside, but as big as a Caprice on the outside, probably isn't a very good advertising feature ;-)
About fifteen years ago I ran across a guy who was trying to coax a VW engine into one. I asked him what he was thinking and he gave me this "because it was there" answer. Frightening that someone would butcher a car so casually.
http://www.stationwagon.com/gallery/1960_Ford_Escort.html