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2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
I think all of us that have a great deal of interest in automobiles do this. I have been known to "stalk" cars on expressways to get a good look at them from different angles. However, I've noticed over the years that unless I'm specifically looking for something, it could pass me by and and I wouldn't even notice it. That's why I won't offer an opinion on how well something is selling just because I haven't seen a bunch on the road, especially when it may not be a brand, style or model that I am particularly interested in.
To your other point, you are talking about a % sales increase over prior year and what you say is true. However, the fact that a vehicle recently sold more than just about any other competitor vehicle in it's class doesn't have anything to do with "last year". But I also agree with flightnurse in that the RDX is a brand new redesign which has been significantly changed and has a lot of advertising tied to it. Sales will die down and then one can see how well it does going forward. But I stand by my earlier statement that "dealers are selling the H out of them" but for how long is the question.
You are right that if they are outselling every key competitor in its class that it has nothing to do with last year's sales numbers. I must have gotten a post or 2 confused. I agree that sales will die down with regards to the new RDX.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
I will say either this statement is highly exaggerated, or the sales expectation was pretty low to begin with... We might say for the new generation, sales has improved and is much better than before.
"dealers are selling the H out of them"
When you go from almost dead last in a category to almost 1st whatever term you care to use for the increase is correct. Let's not play sematics.
Btw the Rdx is a little off topic
Finally got to drive a 2013 S4 that a friend is thinking of buying. Wasn't a long drive, but WOW!
Here's my biased opinion:
Audi > BMW = M-B > Acura = Infiniti > Lexus = Volvo > Cadillac
He mentioned that he may not need that much power. I didn't even think that would ever be a thought that crossed my mind or be even remotely possible.
I am actaully going over to the Audi Dealer in Greenwich today to take a look at the A6 Premium Plus with Sport and Cold package. I will probably give the S4 a look.
Sween- please note, I said look not buy because I know you are going to be all over me about getting rid of my beloved TL.
I think Infiniti is finally get serious.
But, I put the TL and the CTS up one size class from the G, 3 and A4...
I got to drive my wife's G37XS for the last three days, while she was out of town... I remain unimpressed (except for when I'm flooring it.... WOW)..
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Acura used to lead, or at least it appeared that they used to attempt to lead.
What have they done, what have they done? Well, look on the lots of one of their dealers -- it is really difficult to find an SH-AWD vehicle (other than the MDX). They seem to not get that FWD doesn't cut it in the Premium class. They could've simply looked at Audi (in the US). I would assume most US customers don't even know that many of Audi's cars are sold as FWD models (elsewhere). In the US, however, virtually all Audis are AWD and they have made their name as pioneers of AWD. Now 40% of BMW sedans sold (in the US) are X-drive models; and even the mighty 7 series can be had with four driven wheels. Much the same can be said about Mercedes -- RWD heritage, AWD sales aplenty here in the US.
Acura is cross shopped with Toyota? Of course, because the base products Acura offers are contented more like Toyota or Honda rather than Audi or BMW and with the Germans widespread use of 7 and 8 speed transmissions and Honda, er Acura continuing to bring out NEW cars (e.g., the ILX) with a 5 speed shifter is a dead giveaway.
The ILX should have been SH-AWD (only!) and come with -- at bare minimum -- the very fine 6-speed as is found in the TL.
The line should adopt the "X" suffix and it should mean "we're all, AWD" models. The new RDX comes out and it goes with the cheaper FWD biased AWD and eschews SH-AWD (and the thing can be had as an FWD -- who's dumb idea was that?)
The new ILX comes out, FWD only, wimpy engine and when auto equipped has the long since forgotten (by the Germans and other Premium Japanese brands) 5-speed (what were they thinking?)
My 2012 TL Advance w/SH-AWD should be the only way this car should be sold (in SH-AWD form, that is), and there should be a bunch more options to choose from and an "S" version to keep things interesting.
I think, too, the new RLX will be stillborn -- who will pay for an RLX when they can have an Audi A6 3.0T Prestige for about the same price?
Acura is the new Genesis, they just don't know it yet. I never would have imagined that Genesis cars and Equus autos could be sold at a Hyundai dealership, but here in Cincinnati the inventory of Genesis and Equus cars seems quite deep and I see them on the road virtually every day -- even the Equus.
So, Acura should fold up its separate dealership network and move back in with mom and dad -- sell Acuras as higher priced Hondas, just like Hyundai sells Genesis cars as a separate line, but from the same dealership.
And the reason that Lexus can "get away" with using some Toyotas as donor cars, is that the finished product -- from Lexus -- shares little with Toyota in its looks and interior.
My TL has waaaaaaay too much Honda in it, is my point.
Audis USED to have a whole bunch of VW in them -- over time Audi became a little less VW as every model year passed. Now, there certainly is "something" that reminds me of Audi in a new CC -- but there is virtually nothing in an Audi that reminds me of VW. Acuras are very nice, very smooth, apparently very high resale value cars and very much like "Hondas who know somebody."
The Premium class will miss Acura when it finally fades away.
I say all of the above not as a disatisfied Acura owner -- quite the contrary, the 2012 TL is very nice -- I'd give it an A-. It may be, however, that Acura has given up. It no longer wants to be the Japanese Audi. It never did want to be the Japanese BMW. I don't know what it wants to be anymore -- but it had better figure it out soon.
For the record, I've never liked Lexus -- until this year, with their new more sporting, less sofa-like, cars (esp the GS). I am liking, more and more all the time, Infiniti, helped by the fact that my wife now has 30K miles on her 2011 FX35, and for a CUV, this thing is as impressive at 30,000 as it was at 1 (mile); and the M's are worth comparing to A6 and 5 series if you ask me.
The only company that seems to be sailing the seas rudderless is Acura.
More's the pity. :surprise:
Plus there are rumors of a 530 hp ipl. The next few years will be interesting.
I like the Audi a4/s4 look- would love an s4, stick, quatro - they are a little front heavy and not cheap but it's a nice rig. The TL in current form and long name Should go away. Someone mentioned folding Acura into honda - makes since but I don't see it happening - and they just spent 1.5m on a Super Bowl commercial.
Also rented a CTS and agree with your comments.
Who is running their marketing? I want a name.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Anyway...he mentioned how great the Pontiac Aztek was. How it was one of the vehicles he could own; it had and did everything.
They'll probably still sell a few ILXs :shades:
According to edmunds - yes look to the right - they potentially can have 3 with this new rig.
I want someone in my family to buy one. Trying to talk my GF into buying one, as a matter of fact!
There is absolutely no value in buying this car over TL-SHAWD. For what you get without starting to adding in the options is just outright absurd. In my opinion, this is a nice 45K car- Premiun Plus Trim, I would put the Prestige at 53K. Dont get me wrong now- I like the car but I think its overpriced.
PS- Nice Dealership experience, the S4 I sat in, not pratical for me, way too tight in rear.
I'm still smitten with the S4....and that's coming from a 335i owner.
I think if you just add the driver selectable driving modes, with the torque vectoring to the options list, you come in just under $50K MSRP. Maybe buy it for $48K? That's for a Quattro, with 333HP, one of the sweetest sounding engines I've ever heard, running acceleration times near muscle car territory.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I'd be the first to admit that Acura (and Honda overall) has had a bit of an identity crisis the past few years. But, I think you could have said that about all the Japanese marks...even Toyota with their aspirations to be the biggest car company in the world didn't turn out so well for them. The tsunami only added fuel to the fire.
Hondas and Acuras are really good cars. However, most are used to them being great cars. Frankly, if I were one to keep a car for 200K miles (which I'm definitely not), my first stop for shopping for one would be my local Honda or Acura store.
It really is impressive what less than $40K (real world price) buys if you take a test drive of an Acura TL SH AWD.
My car only has 16K miles, he mentioned a buyout but I know some of the cost would be transferred to me. I am happy with the 09 TL TECH AWD,the car looks, drives and smell new.
The S4 no longer sports the V8, its a v6 Turbo.
I happen to like the TL SH-AWD styling & price for that matter. Electric power steering is a deal breaker for me though.
Still loving my 328xi;)
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
I know, ILX is much more separated from Civic, but the price premium over Civic is absolutely shocking. It is basically improved top of the line Civic at price of fully loaded Accord :sick: . What adds insult to injury, is that Civic itself is also acknowledged as underwhelming and underdelivering. I add my own experience with a rental Accord (base version) - a car I would put at bottom of my shopping list if I were in midsize market (obese floating barge with subpar interior). I see a seriously struggling company that is trying to live of its former glory (GM everybody?).
If Acura keeps going that path, they will be thrown into oblivion, even if the cars themselves are actually good. They seem to be misreading the market (or in general), threir brand cache. It may be just me, but there is something in it, if the Civic will go for facelift just one year after introduction. It is not all lost - Subaru had terrible start with new WRX (this was a textbook example of losing your way), but they listened and fixed it right away. Hope Honda will, too. But Acura seems all but finished in sedan world, even with their good TL.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
On another topic, the TL doesn't get any respect:
- sales are lagging
- doesn't seem to win many comparos
- CRs favorite ellps is the G
- etc
Don't know why that is.
BTW, if you want an experience of a outstanding engine note, drive a S5 or S6 with a V10 !!!
The EPS is one of the main reasons I dumped my TSX after only 2 1/2 years.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
I read an article the other day (can't remember the source, though) stipulating that Honda is becoming arrogant.....that they believe they know better than their customers. That's a slipper slope, if true. My experiences with both Hondas and Acuras has been sterling. All models offer good value, and performance/tech/reliability/build quality....again, especially for what they cost.
ILS....I haven't seen one yet. I doubt seriously I'll drive one in the foreseeable future.
On the other hand, while I doubt I can talk her into it, the GF has agreed to go test drive an S4 tonight. She's been driving my 2nd car (Ford Fiesta) and seems perfectly happy in doing so. That said, she's got an Avalanche and a Subaru gathering dust in my driveway. Hmmmmm....I wonder if an Audi dealer would be interested in those?
Never drove the V8 S4. From what I understand, the SC V6 is faster with better MPG, though. I do love the way it sounds, too.
The TL is too busy on the inside, too big on the inside, too ugly on the outside and has a bigger turning radius than the competition.
Having said that I consider the G and TL equals. Each one has something unique for the driver.
Again, I like the G. Just not enough to spend my own money on one.
Well....GF and I did a nice long test drive in the S4 last night. She liked it. I loved it. I didn't get the sense she liked it enough to pull the trigger on it, though. If she would get rid of both her vehicles ('04 Subaru and '05 Avalanche), she'd actually save a bit of money on insurance, and have no repairs (which are becoming more and more common on both vehicles recently). After I made the financial case, she's thinking about it.
The one we drove, wicked looking black on black, had Nav, B&O stereo (very nice), 7-speed s-tronic (love that trans), and driver select driving customization with a torque vectoring rear.
As good as my BMW handles and goes, the S4 does both better.
MSRP was mid $50s. To add to the sticker shock, it was the first 2013 they had in stock, so no discounts. We can't have that.
We'll see where this goes.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
There is much to appreciate...
- Ray
Still - happy with my choice...
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
ray....I like my BMW, too. I want both the S4 and my 335i :P .
But, I don't want to own both. GF likes AWD/4WD vehicles. She's also said she doesn't need two vehicles. And, she's been complaining about spending what seems like $200-$300/mo in repairs on both cars (which is why she's currently driving my Fiesta).
So, trying to "nudge" her a little bit towards the S4.
Clearly, I like it a whole lot more than she does. But, she does like it!