Granted you may enjoy the Forester, and the way it rides/handles. But for me, the E46 handles amazing well and the X3 handles like an E46. The Forester isn't quite in the same league although I do think the ride/handling is good enough.
"Is it worth the money? I guess that all depends on what your priorities are."
That is a question one always asks themselves about any purchase, not specifically related to BMW.
For example, I had to ask myself if spending the moolah for an vehicle without a 5 speed auto, no steering wheel controls and leather really worth the money?
Ah but that's not what your saying. It's always true as you go up the price range a car that cost twice as much is never twice as good. A $30K Honda is not 3 times better than a $10K Elantra for example. A decked out almost $30K XT will never be 3 times as good as an Elantra. Some buyers however may elect to place a premium on certain things you don't want to place a premium on. I stand by my original comment that at $40K the X3 330i does the SAV thing much better. If I could afford it I would be driving around in a Cayenne Turbo.
It is truly amazing...being a first time ever Subaru buyer, it baffles me as to how this company does business. I do think their product are very good, but as everyone has said laready, they seems to "not care" about the little things that makes car buying a more pleasureable experience.
After getting geting home with my new car, I relized that the delivery of my car was just gosh darn aweful. The moon roof had a grease streak down the middle, the back seat had soem dirt on it, PIN STRIPPing was done to the car (wasnt there 2 nites previous when I went to look at it), the front plate didnt have mounting holes for the license plate, no plate frame or anything was mounted for given to me, the applied window tint look like champagne in a glass.
If it wasnt for Subaru's saftey record, I would never had even thought about it. I will need to think hard next when comes time to replace my 06 Forrester. Sheeesh....
While a $30k Accord isn't 3-times a nice as a $10k Elantra, it certainly is a LOT nicer. Personally, I don't see how you can honestly say that the X3 is a LOT nicer than the XT. While the X3 may indeed be somewhat better in a couple of areas, it's nowhere near 50% better overall. Hence I was perfectly happy paying $26k for my XT while I would have been miserable paying $39k for a comparably equipped X3. As for the Cayenne Turbo, what a way to waste $96K! The XT offers more functionality and is only a whisker slower 0-60. Sure the Cayenne handles better but again, it costs almost 4 times as much! Besides, larger wheels, better rubber and a stiffer sway bar (all of which I invested in) will narrow the handling gap for a fraction of the cost.
However, having said all that, I recognize that individual preferences and priorities vary so while the X3 may not provide sufficient dollar value for me, others will be perfectly happy with it.
"Personally, I don't see how you can honestly say that the X3 is a LOT nicer than the XT."
I can understand that statement and failed to take into account in my post that our values are different. I agree 100% with your bottom line. I would also say the X3 is a lot nicer than the Forester. That being said, I am in no way downgrading the Forester. They both are nice cars, but I believe you get what you pay for. Some people don't want to pay for it however.
I had the opportunity for a prolonged test drive of a friend's 2005 base Outback. While I enjoyed the car, front seat comfort killed the deal. I can't really articulate my gripe, but my back simply did not agree with this seat. Is the seat in the Forester the same? How do they compare? I realise that I need to test drive the Forester but my Outback seat complaint did not become apparent until I was nearly an hour behind the wheel.
The Forester has different seats. As for how they compare, since seat comfort is extremely subjective, I recommend that you arrange for an extended test drive if you're seriously considering a Forester. That's the only way to be 100% certain whether or not the seats will be comfortable for you.
LL Bean seats are very comfy for me. Give them a try, you may find them to be worth the xtra bucks the Bean costs. I also like the look of the Bean's interior.
You definitely want to get the power seat with lumbar support. I've driven all day in My Forester and am very happy with the seat. Now, getting in and out of the Forester is another story.
Now, getting in and out of the Forester is another story.
My wife has a Forester, I'm 6'1'' and have never had a problem getting in and out (except when she has the seat all the way up an all the way forward old lady style). Other than seat placement, I can't imagine why anyone would have trouble getting in and out.
>>I've read some reviews that say that the X has power issues going up steep hills<<
Darn I wished I had known that before I went up the mountain coming out of the Tetons passing huge SUV's and trailers with my five speed (04) having no problems at all and just cruising...pulling my 18 to 1900 lb pop up camper. I would have never tried it...and missed all the fun...
Maybe the automatics are the issue. The five speed has a lot of guts. And the gearing must have been designed for towing a trailer... My girlfriend didn't like Foresters when we got mine a year ago. We are going to get hers (automatic) in about a week... Oh, and dogs love em. The deck sits high compared to other vehicles and a good size dog can see out lying down.
I own an 06 FXT (auto), metal grey with leather. The seats only come second to my wife's 96 Volvo 850 Turbo. I really like the view from the drivers seat but wish there was a position memory like the Volvo. I specifically chose the XT because of the extra torque the turbo has.
My Bulldog loves the back area as he gets a great view as well.
Probably it's just me, getting older and over-weight. My vehicle before the forester was a full-size pick-up and I was use to just "jumping in". With the Forester, I have to back in to the seat and then bring my legs around. No problem, just different.
I presently own a 2.5i ltd outback, have had it 14 months now, almost 37k & very pleased with it. Want to trade in my wife's 97 Isuzu (a Honda clone) & considering the Foresters.
I can't believe how peppier the 173 hp 4 is compared to the 168 in my Outback. But I suspect the ride not as "car like" as Outback.
I can get the Forester X Limited with premium package for around 22,400, supposedly around $3000 less than list. Or, for $23,400 & I can get the 1.9 financing. How does that sound?
Comparing it to a 2005 Mazda MPV. Quite a few of those left over. Can get one quite loaded sunroof, auto doors, side air bags,, traction control, etc., for just about the same price. Still want the third seat option, which is not an option on Subaru, unless I spring for the Tribeca but too expensive.
I'm actually in the market for a Forester X Limited with the premium package. Was your quote of $23,400 (less $1,000) the price for manual or auto trans? I got the same quote (over the phone) for a manual before any options. I'm planning on going to the dealer with check in hand. At that time I expect to negotiate a better price ....maybe somewhere between 22,800 and 23,100.
Also, beware of extra charges like doc fees etc...
Does anyone know whether the $1,000 cash back will be extended past February 28th?
I got a quote based on MSWRP of 25,570 for the Forster X Premium of $22,284. That included the $1000 rebate. If I opted for the 1.9 financing would have been 23,284. This was from Somerset Subaru, Somerset, MA. I have a feeling I insisted, could have gotten a better deal. Turned out I fixed the brakes & installed new tires today on the potential trade in so will not be in the market for approx 18 months. In the meantime, my "Subaru Bucks" will keep accumulating!
I am sure I could have gotten the price down at least to $22,000 or less, and probably have received one year of free oil changes also if I was persistent (with the high mileage I put on of approx 32k per year, that's worth a few hundred dollars.
I have 2006 Forester X-premium. I am looking at getting a bug deflector put on at our dealership. The cost would be $98.00 instuled. A couple of questions.
1. Is that a good price? 2. Are bug deflectors worth puttin on? 3. When on, do they make a wistling noise as some others do? 4. Do they really keep the bugs off the windshield when driving? 5. Who has them on theirs?
Thanks for any information and thougths. I greatly appreciate it.
Walk through a parking lot and check the windshields on the cars and trucks that have bug deflectors. I had one on a Ford truck and all it did was mess up the spray on the windshield washers.
While we are on the topic of accessories, has anyone have any experience with the dust deflector for the rear window or the sporty spoiler. I like the look of the spoiler but know know if it serves any real purpose.
I just got an e-mail from a dealer saying to stop "buy" this weekend. They will have some X automatic Foresters for 19,995...exactly 1000 less than a month ago...
I had heard somewhere that Subaru was going to have a big March 06 sale of some sort. I am taking this as a hint...
My 1999 Forester died in a freak accident (it's only mostly dead... the timing belt snapped and a bolt bent a valve stem) so I'm in the market for a new vehicle. I test-drove a 2006 Forester 5-spd, the low-end model, on Saturday. The only problems I had were with the ridiculous head rests (I tend to like to look forward, not down, when I drive) and the clutch. The clutch was not as "tight" as the one on my Subaru. It felt very loose to me. Is this typical?
I also tested a Mazda5, which is the only other model in serious contention at this time. The shifting on the Mazda was so much nicer, but we also like to be able to tow a boat, or at least stick our bike rack in a hitch.
Has anyone else debated seriously between these two models? I know they're very different and that the Subaru is objectively a better car, but my family is fond of the lower price and the cabin space for passengers in the Mazda.
Vanity-wise, I have to admit I'm not crazy about the Forester colors. Why did they get rid of the Acacia Green? I can say right now that if there had been an Acacia Green 5-spd on the lot that shifted like my old Forester, I would have probably driven off the lot.
Up to $500 per year, 3% of purchases. No annual fee.
Bucks are good for 4 years so you can save up to $2,000 towards a new car. Check the application for details as I am not sure whether current ownership is required or not. I do know that you can't spend the bucks unless the VIN number is written on the coupon.
thanks John, I'll check it out and see if its for me.
While browsing at the dealer Sunday, read in peace, I noticed some cars marked "pre-price increase". Is this just typical dealer BS or is there really an increase coming? Since Subaru seems to be struggling, I would not think this would be a good move.
2021 Jeep Wrangler Sahara 4xe Granite Crystal over Saddle
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
There is always a slight price increase when the new model year arrives, but it is usually not much. For the record, Subaru is not struggling. They just came off of a record 2005 year.
$98. is a reasonable price if your having it installed (try installing it yourself and you will see why)It will not keep bugs off the windshield but will protect the front of the hood from rock chips. They do not make any noise if you use the Subaru product and it is put on correctly.
I just got an e-mail from a dealer saying to stop "buy" this weekend. They will have some X automatic Foresters for 19,995...exactly 1000 less than a month ago...
Is this price for an X Premium, or just a regular X? I'd be curious as to what this dealership is quoting for a base XT Limited in the automatic - does it say on the email??
I was also told there is to be a March sales event. The dealerhip near me ordered the XT Limited in the color I wanted and I'm waiting until March to buy it. Now wondering what they're gonna be offering as deals on the XT Limited in other parts of the country.
I could use this info to negotiate a better price, if one is to be had elsewhere. It's getting down to the wire now, so this info would be VERY helpful for me.
Even for a regular X automatic it's a spectacular price, almost unbelievable. Here in my area the base invoice is $21,870, there's $904 in holdback and the rebate is $1000. I'd watch out for added fees, maybe they didn't include destination at $625 (but even then it's a good deal).
No word yet on March incentives, we should know later today.
Occking, if you are getting quoted 22,874 against a sticker price of 25,570 take every chance you have to buy that vehicle. Looks to me you are buying it 1 hundred over invoice. Did you have to haggle your way there or was it your initial starting price. The largest Subaru dealer in the nation has a set price on all there Subarus of 112 over invoice. So it looks like you are getting a good deal. Au1944-the pre-price increase is not a dealer gimmick. All '06 Subaru models experienced a price increase of 200 on two different occasions. Kavoom-If your dealer told you the X and X premium had a different rebate he is wrong. in the '05 models there was a distinction b/c the x premium was called the XS. In 2006 it is considered the same for incentives.
Stereo - keep in mind it's a double-DIN opening. Be glad, as that is nearly universal, so you can put in whatever you want aftermarket. OE stereos tend to be poor anyway, just swap it out, no biggie.
And here the Legacy GT owner are complaining that they can't go aftermarket for the stereos, so Subaru just can't win, I guess.
X3 handles slightly better, sure, but ride is extremely harsh. I felt every seam in the pavement on our drive at FedEx Field, and the one we had was not even the Sport suspension. And before you call me a sissie, I went home with the "Best Performance" award, that miniature orange cone they hand out at the end of their events.
The handling of the X3 is maybe 10% better, but the ride is about 30% more harsh. Too high a price to pay for most people.
Perhaps Subaru could offer a Sport package on the XT, with 17" rims and the suspension off the Cross Sport model in Japan.
I've now saved up $500 in Subaru Bucks, so that would have been a substantial discount on an '06 Premium. I may wait to see if the 07s get stability control and SportShift.
"The handling of the X3 is maybe 10% better, but the ride is about 30% more harsh. Too high a price to pay for most people"
For another opinion and for what it's worth I couldn't disagree more. The Forester is a great car for the money and IMO the X3 is a better car for more money with much better handling and a much smoother chassis. Of course if one has only $25K to spend the point is moot, but for the additional $$$ you get a better handling car with more luxury features.... that may not be faster in the straight line. But so what?
Not sure what exactly you mean by that, but you feel and hear even small bumps while driving the base X3 suspension, imagine the Sport. I'm not saying the chassis flexes, just that you feel the impact harshness of even small bumps.
Put it this way, a Forester can absorb a bump better than a WRX, but an X3 is not as smooth as a 3 series wagon. Perhaps it's the extra mass. At the BMW store, I'd get the 3er wagon instead.
The 2.5l model was a bit slow off the line, fine after that, but they dropped it anyway. The 3.0l engine is fine, no complaints there at all.
I've been planning for months to buy a Hyundai Tucson but was swayed by the recent consumer reports top 10 and a test drive, to get a Forester instead. I drove a manual X Premium. I plan to buy within the next several weeks.
I live at 8000 feet and the model with manual transmission seems to have plenty of power for the type of driving I do. I had been planning to get a new car with automatic, since I'd like to eventually have a remote starter installed. (Remote starters won't work with manual transmission.) But I'm not sure how important the remote starter is to me.
My question is, will the automatic make a significant reduction in perceived power on hills and when passing? I told the dealer I may return to try an automatic but thought I'd ask for opinions here first. Has anyone here test driven both and decided to buy one way or another based on performance?
Power is a relative thing, if you've only driven other 4 cylinder competitors you'd find 173hp more than adequate. If you got a taste of the turbo, forget it.
Having said that, auto starters burn a lot of gas. It only takes my Forester about 2 miles to warm up, and by then it's putting out good heat, even on a frosty day.
Consider the Premium package for the heated seats. Those warm up even quicker, by the time you're at the bottom of the driveway.
"I like the remote starter, make sure you get the factory version that works with your keyless for warranty purposes."
That's interesting. I've been told by a Subaru salesman that Subaru doesn't make one. Here's a quote from his email to me on the subject:
"I just spoke with our service writer Chris. He said that Subaru does not make remote starters, and that he does not install aftermarket starter kits."
Raybear, do you have a Subaru remote starter in your vehicle?
A buck ninety-nine ice scraper does a great job on the outside glass, nor does it require 160+ horsepower to operate.
As for the inside, a clean windshield won't frost up if you don't bring extra moisture into the cabin with you. Taking a big steaming open mug of coffee to sip during the daily morning commute is a very effective way to humidify the air and frost up the inside of the windshield.
Comments
Granted you may enjoy the Forester, and the way it rides/handles. But for me, the E46 handles amazing well and the X3 handles like an E46. The Forester isn't quite in the same league although I do think the ride/handling is good enough.
Is it worth the money? I guess that all depends on what your priorities are.
Bob
That is a question one always asks themselves about any purchase, not specifically related to BMW.
For example, I had to ask myself if spending the moolah for an vehicle without a 5 speed auto, no steering wheel controls and leather really worth the money?
Not according to the sticker on my '06 X.
IINM, window-tinting standards differ by state, not vehicle type. For instance, New York allows much darker tinting than does Connecticut.
Bob
If you can find a new SUV for $15k that's even close to as good as the Forester then you should buy it :P
-Frank
Actually, that's exactly why they don't tint passenger cars because tint standards vary by state while tint for trucks isn't nearly so regulated.
So what does your sticker say?
-Frank
After getting geting home with my new car, I relized that the delivery of my car was just gosh darn aweful. The moon roof had a grease streak down the middle, the back seat had soem dirt on it, PIN STRIPPing was done to the car (wasnt there 2 nites previous when I went to look at it), the front plate didnt have mounting holes for the license plate, no plate frame or anything was mounted for given to me, the applied window tint look like champagne in a glass.
If it wasnt for Subaru's saftey record, I would never had even thought about it. I will need to think hard next when comes time to replace my 06 Forrester. Sheeesh....
However, having said all that, I recognize that individual preferences and priorities vary so while the X3 may not provide sufficient dollar value for me, others will be perfectly happy with it.
-Frank
I can understand that statement and failed to take into account in my post that our values are different. I agree 100% with your bottom line. I would also say the X3 is a lot nicer than the Forester. That being said, I am in no way downgrading the Forester. They both are nice cars, but I believe you get what you pay for. Some people don't want to pay for it however.
-Frank
My wife has a Forester, I'm 6'1'' and have never had a problem getting in and out (except when she has the seat all the way up an all the way forward old lady style). Other than seat placement, I can't imagine why anyone would have trouble getting in and out.
Darn I wished I had known that before I went up the mountain coming out of the Tetons passing huge SUV's and trailers with my five speed (04) having no problems at all and just cruising...pulling my 18 to 1900 lb pop up camper. I would have never tried it...and missed all the fun...
Maybe the automatics are the issue. The five speed has a lot of guts. And the gearing must have been designed for towing a trailer... My girlfriend didn't like Foresters when we got mine a year ago. We are going to get hers (automatic) in about a week... Oh, and dogs love em. The deck sits high compared to other vehicles and a good size dog can see out lying down.
My Bulldog loves the back area as he gets a great view as well.
I can't believe how peppier the 173 hp 4 is compared to the 168 in my Outback. But I suspect the ride not as "car like" as Outback.
I can get the Forester X Limited with premium package for around 22,400, supposedly around $3000 less than list. Or, for $23,400 & I can get the 1.9 financing. How does that sound?
Comparing it to a 2005 Mazda MPV. Quite a few of those left over. Can get one quite loaded sunroof, auto doors, side air bags,, traction control, etc., for just about the same price. Still want the third seat option, which is not an option on Subaru, unless I spring for the Tribeca but too expensive.
Any comments???
Also, beware of extra charges like doc fees etc...
Does anyone know whether the $1,000 cash back will be extended past February 28th?
I am sure I could have gotten the price down at least to $22,000 or less, and probably have received one year of free oil changes also if I was persistent (with the high mileage I put on of approx 32k per year, that's worth a few hundred dollars.
1. Is that a good price?
2. Are bug deflectors worth puttin on?
3. When on, do they make a wistling noise as some others do?
4. Do they really keep the bugs off the windshield when driving?
5. Who has them on theirs?
Thanks for any information and thougths. I greatly appreciate it.
I had heard somewhere that Subaru was going to have a big March 06 sale of some sort. I am taking this as a hint...
I also tested a Mazda5, which is the only other model in serious contention at this time. The shifting on the Mazda was so much nicer, but we also like to be able to tow a boat, or at least stick our bike rack in a hitch.
Has anyone else debated seriously between these two models? I know they're very different and that the Subaru is objectively a better car, but my family is fond of the lower price and the cabin space for passengers in the Mazda.
Vanity-wise, I have to admit I'm not crazy about the Forester colors. Why did they get rid of the Acacia Green? I can say right now that if there had been an Acacia Green 5-spd on the lot that shifted like my old Forester, I would have probably driven off the lot.
Thanks for any help!
I would love to trade my 4Runner for an LL Bean Forester, but would wait a few months if there is an opportunity to earn some 'credit'.
2021 Jeep Wrangler Sahara 4xe Granite Crystal over Saddle
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
Up to $500 per year, 3% of purchases. No annual fee.
Bucks are good for 4 years so you can save up to $2,000 towards a new car. Check the application for details as I am not sure whether current ownership is required or not. I do know that you can't spend the bucks unless the VIN number is written on the coupon.
John
While browsing at the dealer Sunday, read in peace, I noticed some cars marked "pre-price increase". Is this just typical dealer BS or is there really an increase coming? Since Subaru seems to be struggling, I would not think this would be a good move.
2021 Jeep Wrangler Sahara 4xe Granite Crystal over Saddle
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
Is this price for an X Premium, or just a regular X? I'd be curious as to what this dealership is quoting for a base XT Limited in the automatic - does it say on the email??
I was also told there is to be a March sales event. The dealerhip near me ordered the XT Limited in the color I wanted and I'm waiting until March to buy it. Now wondering what they're gonna be offering as deals on the XT Limited in other parts of the country.
I could use this info to negotiate a better price, if one is to be had elsewhere. It's getting down to the wire now, so this info would be VERY helpful for me.
Thanks in advance,
Samantha
No word yet on March incentives, we should know later today.
Sorry about being misinformed, guess you can't always believe ehat you read.
2021 Jeep Wrangler Sahara 4xe Granite Crystal over Saddle
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
So, my girlfriend was going to buy anyway and is now a very happy camper...
Au1944-the pre-price increase is not a dealer gimmick. All '06 Subaru models experienced a price increase of 200 on two different occasions.
Kavoom-If your dealer told you the X and X premium had a different rebate he is wrong. in the '05 models there was a distinction b/c the x premium was called the XS. In 2006 it is considered the same for incentives.
And here the Legacy GT owner are complaining that they can't go aftermarket for the stereos, so Subaru just can't win, I guess.
X3 handles slightly better, sure, but ride is extremely harsh. I felt every seam in the pavement on our drive at FedEx Field, and the one we had was not even the Sport suspension. And before you call me a sissie, I went home with the "Best Performance" award, that miniature orange cone they hand out at the end of their events.
The handling of the X3 is maybe 10% better, but the ride is about 30% more harsh. Too high a price to pay for most people.
Perhaps Subaru could offer a Sport package on the XT, with 17" rims and the suspension off the Cross Sport model in Japan.
-juice
I've now saved up $500 in Subaru Bucks, so that would have been a substantial discount on an '06 Premium. I may wait to see if the 07s get stability control and SportShift.
-juice
For another opinion and for what it's worth I couldn't disagree more. The Forester is a great car for the money and IMO the X3 is a better car for more money with much better handling and a much smoother chassis. Of course if one has only $25K to spend the point is moot, but for the additional $$$ you get a better handling car with more luxury features.... that may not be faster in the straight line. But so what?
Put it this way, a Forester can absorb a bump better than a WRX, but an X3 is not as smooth as a 3 series wagon. Perhaps it's the extra mass. At the BMW store, I'd get the 3er wagon instead.
The 2.5l model was a bit slow off the line, fine after that, but they dropped it anyway. The 3.0l engine is fine, no complaints there at all.
-juice
I live at 8000 feet and the model with manual transmission seems to have plenty of power for the type of driving I do. I had been planning to get a new car with automatic, since I'd like to eventually have a remote starter installed. (Remote starters won't work with manual transmission.) But I'm not sure how important the remote starter is to me.
My question is, will the automatic make a significant reduction in perceived power on hills and when passing? I told the dealer I may return to try an automatic but thought I'd ask for opinions here first. Has anyone here test driven both and decided to buy one way or another based on performance?
Having said that, auto starters burn a lot of gas. It only takes my Forester about 2 miles to warm up, and by then it's putting out good heat, even on a frosty day.
Consider the Premium package for the heated seats. Those warm up even quicker, by the time you're at the bottom of the driveway.
-juice
Personally, I go outside to warm my car up to defrost it in the morning but I'm only a few steps away from the back door.
That's interesting. I've been told by a Subaru salesman that Subaru doesn't make one. Here's a quote from his email to me on the subject:
"I just spoke with our service writer Chris. He said that Subaru does not make remote starters, and that he does not install aftermarket starter kits."
Raybear, do you have a Subaru remote starter in your vehicle?
As for the inside, a clean windshield won't frost up if you don't bring extra moisture into the cabin with you. Taking a big steaming open mug of coffee to sip during the daily morning commute is a very effective way to humidify the air and frost up the inside of the windshield.