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Honda Civic vs Toyota Corolla vs Mazda3
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Why is this car less $$ in 06 ; if I read correctly??
Does this include 05 rebates, incentives.....
SS Seafolk
1992 Protege LX: 28,000 miles, totaled in hydroplaning accident
1992 Protege LX no. 2: 83,000 miles, zero problems
2000 Protege ES: 91,100 miles, front strut bushings replaced at 85,000 miles
2002 Protege5: 52,000 miles, wife's current car, zero problems
2005 Mazda3s hatch: 7,600 miles, my current car, zero problems
Granted, I haven't kept one of these cars past 100,000 miles, but my 2000 Protege really took a beating over the five years I owned it, and it never had one problem other than the bushings -- which I caused by my, um, "spirited" driving around 25-mph off-ramps at 50 mph, "slaloming" down our street to entertain our 4-year-old, etc. I also had the Protege up past 90 mph more times than I can count, and once to 105. (I guess I'll defend myself here by saying NO, I'm not a college-aged kid -- I'm 40! But Mazdas are just too damned fun.) I guess it pays to be related to two of the judges in my county; I got let off with a warning twice in the last four years -- the most recent time I was stopped for going 70 in a 35 -- and yep, he let me off with a warning!
:P
Meade
I've got offers from one dealer today on the Civic EX SE 5-speed for $16,400. A Mazda dealer quoted me $16,600 for a 3 i 5-speed with CD/Moonroof. That dealer doesn't have any 3 s 5-speeds left.
I'm wondering if I should keep trying to find a 3 s or would a 3 i suffice? I kinda think I'd rather have the 2.3L, but with gas prices the 2.0L might be a good thing.
The looming '06 changes and the all new Civic also make me question whether to buy now. The new Civic isn't very pretty, but I do like the specs and equipment (particularly the AUX jack for the stereo).
Decisions, decisions....
My gut feeling is to hold out for a few more weeks. If the '06 Civic drives great, I might can get over the looks of it. If I decide to go with a Mazda3, it appears that the '06 pricing has gone down in some cases.
Why? It appears Honda's the one pulling up the rear in this case.
Meade
The disadvantage of both the basic coupe and the Si is that they're two-door vehicles with a cramped rear seat (3- and 6-inches less rear legroom, respectively, than the '05 coupe and Si), while the four-door sedan and hybrid versions of the new Civic are quite roomy in the back. The Si also uses premium gasoline, which is getting pretty pricey.
In order to get any more than two doors (and more legroom), you have to opt out of the Si's 197-hp engine and go for the standard 140-hp engine.
So ... Mazda3 sedan and Mazda3 5-door, you have no match. Only the diminutive Si 2-door hatchback will rock your world. So keep a watchful eye for tiny Hondabugs in your rear-view mirror. Any Civic capable of hauling more than two adults will stay way behind ya.
Meade
I was originally considering a Mazda 3. I live in the upper Midwest and found that the Mazda 3's were noticeably more expensive than both the Civics and Corollas. And the Civics and Corollas have many more years of dependability and quality under their belt than Mazda.
I don't believe that all the Civics are gone in the upper Midwest as one poster mentioned. If you do a little searching with a number of dealers, you should be able to find what you want at a great price!
My new 2005 Honda Civic LX Special Edition in automatic transmission costed $14,990. That includes mudguards which I had asked them to add. I also get free oil changes, free tickets to a water park, free $1,000 online shopping spree and free delivery of the car to my home. That beats anything else I was trying to get with a Mazda dealer or even a Toyota dealer (and I've had Toyotas for the last 16 years).
Apparently you didn't read me right. Putting it differently, you can only get the 197-hp engine in the "bug"-like Si or 2-door. The 4-door sedan is only available with the smaller, 140-hp engine -- which the Mazda3 in either trim level beats.
And ... looks are purely subjective. I personally think all Civics are way too low-slung both inside and out.
Meade
Well Pete, keep in mind that it's not "Mazda" doing that, it's your dealership. And they ain't all like that. Here where I live, the Mazda dealer (well, the one of three in my area that I deal with) is known for its impeccable service. The two local Honda dealers are known for being stuck-up and rude both in sales and service.
I would not base a car purchase decision on how pushy the service department is at one dealership. Besides, you know better and can say "no thanks," right?
Meade
Also, keep in mind that the 2006 Civics have 3 to 5 inches LESS rear legroom than the 2005 you just bought (according to the article). Why would Honda reduce the size of the rear seat? It's fairly small to begin with.
Not exactly, smaria. Here's the quote from Business Week again:
The disadvantage of both the basic coupe and the Si is that they're two-door vehicles with a cramped rear seat (3- and 6-inches less rear legroom, respectively, than the '05 coupe and Si), while the four-door sedan and hybrid versions of the new Civic are quite roomy in the back. The Si also uses premium gasoline, which is getting pretty pricey.
They don't quote the legroom, but from the way the comment is worded, it would appear that the 2006 models with reduced legroom are the basic coupe and the Si.
Meade
Look at how they're showing the "Civic" logo for 2006. Is that the way it's going to be on the car? I think a lot of college kids are gonna be asking mom and dad for a "Civid"!
Meade
(Numbers are Civic sedan first, then Mazda3 sedan)
EPA passenger volume: 83.7, 94.3 (cubic feet) -- Civic 10.6 cubic feet (9%) less!
EPA cargo volume: 11.5, 11.4 (cubic feet) -- Civic 0.1 cubic foot more
Headroom, front: 38.0, 39.1 (inches) -- Civic 1.1 inches less
Headroom, rear: 35.1, 37.4 (inches) -- Civic 2.3 inches less!
Legroom, front: 42.6, 41.9 (inches) -- Civic 0.7 inches more
Legroom, rear: 30.3, 36.3 (inches) -- Civic SIX INCHES LESS!
Shoulder room, front: 53.9, 54.9 (inches) -- Civic one inch less
Shoulder room, rear: N/A, 54.0 (inches) -- Civic data unavailable
Hip room, front: 53.0, 54.9 (inches) -- Civic 1.9 inches less
Hip room, rear: 49.2, 53.9 (inches) -- Civic 4.7 inches less!
Passenger capacity: 5, 5 (persons) -- Really, Civic? Children, maybe?
The expected commentary:
Reviewers have said the Mazda3 is a little cramped in the back seat. Well, let's look at the Civic's back seat which, compared to the Mazda3's back seat, has 2.3 inches less headroom, HALF A FOOT less legroom, an inch less shoulder room and 4.7 inches less hip room, and I'm starting to wonder if this is a 2006 Civic or a 1982 Civic! Why'd they even make a sedan?
2006 Civic sedan: A true driver's car. Because that's all that'll fit in it.
Meade
Also looked at the Corolla...packages are strange and I really can't get what I want...PLUS the engine is smaller. So, to make a long story short, I'm meeting with my Mazda sales person in about two weeks. He's on vacation until then and that's when they expect to have a decent selection of 2006s. I'll keep you posted. Take care.
(Of course, if you're using the 60K miles and the timing belt thingy to convince the wife of your need for a 3 ... I'll shuddup!) :shades:
Meade
Thanks for the information. I'll check my manual.
Where are you located? I'm curious about the $16200 quote you got the for the Mazda3 i sedan. Are you talking about '05 or '06? I'm assuming the '05 since the '06 doesn't have a power package. What other options are included in the $16200 quote? Is that also including air conditioning?
I did research the Mazda 3's and was pumped up after reading about them. But after going on a lot and looking at them, I changed my mind. They're cute but more pricey than the tried and true Civic.
I decided with the Civic because it's a classic. It's been tried and tested and it holds its value better than the Mazda hands down. Personally I think it looks better than the Mazda. I think you're getting more of your money's worth with the Honda.
Meade
P.S. "Tried and true"? The Mazda3 has an equal reliability rating to the Civic. And after having owned four Proteges since 1991, I can support that rating. All have been virtually problem-free.
These are for the EX sedan.
Passenger volume 88.4cf, not 83.7
cargo volume 12.0 cf, not 11.5
headroom front 38.1, not 38.0
headroom rear 36.7, not 35.1
legroom front 42.2, not 42.6
legroom rear 34.6, not 30.3
shoulder room front 53.6, not 53.9
shoulder room rear 52.3
hip room front 51.9, not 53
hip room rear 51.0 not 49.2
The rear seating area is bigger than what you have posted, your measurements seem more likely to be for the coupe.
Besides this is a Civic forum here. If you love your Mazdas better, they have a forum too. This is just opinions from passionate people about their cars.
Kyle
So?
Are you aware that the Mazda3 is the successor to the Mazda Protege (1990-2003), which was the successor to the Mazda 323/GLC (1977-1990s). In other words, Mazda3 is only the latest name of a long pedigree of reliable compact cars produced by Mazda. For an excellent history of Japanese vehicles, see Wanda James' Driving from Japan (Jefferson, NC; London : McFarland, 2005)
And yes, this IS a comparison discussion. Legalpenguin, methinks thou believeth thou is in the Civic discussion. Readeth the title of this discussion again.
Meade
I'd rather keep my Honda Civic. I bought a Special Edition LX for under $15,000. I definitely did get my money's worth and more.
Way back when I looking for cars on numerous occasions, I came across a Mazda 323 and Mazda Proteges. Test drove them, but for some reason they just didn't hold my attention like the Toyotas and Hondas when it came to doing my detailed research on all categories.
http://automobiles.honda.com/models/specifications_full_specs.asp?ModelName=Civic+Sedan&Ca- tegory=5
So ...
Will the REAL CIVIC please stand up, for goodness' sake?!
:sick:
Meade
I speak from experience as well. I've owned Chevy and Mazda (in high school) and then moved up to Toyota and now Honda. I can clearly see the differences.
Meade was interested in why you feel that the Civic gives you more for your money than the Mazda3, and I too am interested. Specifically, why do you think you get more for your money? What are you getting with the Civic that you're not getting with the Mazda3? Are you talking about tangible things? I'm interested.
"Meade, the subcategory is a comparison, but the main category of all these subcategories here is specifically Honda so that's what it leans toward the most."
This is the path to get to this forum:
forums/sedan/Comparisons sedans vs. sedans
The path is at the top of the page along with the title of the discussion. This is not an exclusively Honda Civic forum.
You are most likely going to a "view" of discussions that include the Civic. The reality is that what you see is a filtered list, it's not a "main category" or a "forum" or anything like that, it's just a filtered list of every discussion that involves the Civic.
This discussion is a comparison of the Civic, Corolla and Mazda3. If you filter your view by any of the three of them, this discussion will appear on the list.
Lots of people get confused by this, don't worry about it. But do understand that this no more an exclusively Honda/Civic-related discussion than it is a Mazda/Mazda3 or Toyota/Corolla-related discussion.
If you follow the "breadcrumb" trail at the top (or the bottom) of this page, as newcar31 suggests, you will see the actual physical structure, which in this case is a Sedans Comparisons board which is actually a subfolder of the Sedans board. But you don't have to do that if you don't want to.
Hope this helps!
You guys sure take these boards way too seriously! I'm not changing my mind. I did way too much research before I made the decision to buy my Honda and worked with dealers diligently to get such an excellent deal. I definitely did get more than my money's worth!
http://www.wric.com/Global/story.asp?S=3853330
Meade
"Nobody goes there anymore. It's too crowded."
:surprise: You guys really believe any car, much less the Mazda3, is a secret these days with the ton of information out there about every car on the market? LOL I think car buyers are getting smarter and smarter these days and use all the research they find to make the best all around deal to get the most for their money.
Why do you knock Hondas? Their cars have been rated Best Buy and Excellent for years. Mazda merges with Ford and that's why Mazda is a follower and not a leader and is behind the top three - Toyota, Honda, and Nissan.
Marching to the beat of a different drummer is good in some instances but not necessarily in others.
I don't think anyone is knocking the fact that Honda builds a good car...I think they are saying that Honda's are bland, boring and about as exciting as a 5lb bag of fertilizer. If you like bland, thats fine. Everyone likes what they like.....Mazda owners/fans don't care for bland generic cars and Mazda fills that desire better than Honda or Toyota....Mazda isn't trying to become the Buick of Japan like Toyota....
The point is, the Mazda3 captures the best of both worlds in the entry level compact market. It has the reliability of a Japanese car, albeit maybe not as reputable as a Honda or Toyota, along with the zip and excitement of a sporty vehicle.
But really, I shouldn't be trying to convince anyone to buy one! I want mine to be unique! Everyone go buy Civic and Corollas and Camrys and Accords!!! Those are the best cars and best bang for the buck!!!
Inside, I was quite impressed. A very roomy cabin, front and back. The oddest thing I find inside is the dash, it is huge! Very deep, about the size of the hood. But I don't find it to be a negative at all, just different. Hopefully there will not be a reflection on the windshield in strong sunlight as there is in some other cars with a large dash, such as the current Altima.
There is plenty of legroom and knee room. It was easy to find a comfortable seating position with the tilt/telescopic wheel, the two spoke steering wheel felt fine to me too. I also like the sliding armrest. All in all, I felt like I was in a larger sedan.
Then I went to the Mazda dealer to see the Mazda 3. The sedan is a bit more conventional looking than the Civic, the hatch has a bit of that futuristic look to me as did the Civic sedan. I find the cockpit of the 3 to be more confining than the Civic. The center console doesn't give you much room to move your legs. My knee was resting against it in a normal driving position, and if I moved my right leg at all, it was digging into my knee area.
I looked at on 06 Mazda 3s Grand Touring with the new 5 speed auto with manumatic shift. It was very well equipped and stickered for 22,010 vs. 19,610 for the Civic. The Mazda had xenons, fog lights, rain sensing wipers, leather, heated seats, auto climate control, a 48,000mile/5 year warranty and a loaner car program. The Mazda is rated at 25/31 for gas mileage while the Civic is 30/40. A big hit on fuel economy for 20hp, IMHO.
Now I need to drvie both of them and see how they feel to me. If I had to make my choice just by sitting in them, I would pick the Honda. Driving them may change my opinion.