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Like the latest one, in which USA Today (I think) showed a photo of the current generation Prius, but when you read halfway down the article, you find that the recalled vehicles include the 2001-02 Echo and Prius, that is the prior generation.
"The world-class quality that we've built is our lifeline," President Katsuaki Watanabe told a mid-year news conference dominated by questions over Toyota's recent quality woes.
"There will be no growth without an improvement in quality."
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2006-07-20-toyota-quality_x.htm
Agreed. I believe that it is due to the longevity of Toyota's seemingly impeccable quality reputation up until the last few years. A lot of Toyota's recalls haven't affected vehicles that were sold in North America; which is a tremendous portion of their worldwide market share. There are countless numbers of people in the U.S. that still feel as though a bad Toyota is better than the best Ford Motor Co. or General Motors product. I'm not so sure that they aren't correct. Toyota has always been pretty good about standing behind their products--with the one exception that I heard about recently where they tried to cover up a major design flaw that lead to a safety issue. The Japanese authorities are even involved in an investigative probe into the company over their reluctance to disclose information about the problematic vehicles. This particular issue definitely looks bad on the company, but I don't even think that this situation will taint Toyota's 'image' all that much in the U.S.--except with the die-hard domestic vehicle fans that already have their minds made up about Toyota and other "foreign" brands. All I know is that I am hanging on to my 2002 Lexus IS300, mainly due to the fact that it hasn't given me any trouble at all thus far. In fact, nothing that even remotely resembles a quality issue has cropped up yet. The only other car that I have ever owned that has been this good to me was also made by Toyota Motor Co. It was a new 1985 Toyota MR2. That little car turned out to be bulletproof--and I ran the absolute crap out of it for quite some time.
Ron M.
Rocky
They probably didn't know Ford had recalls recently either. That's not a perception thing, it's a generation not reading the news thing.
Rocky
The press must have decided to cover Toyota's problems the way they cover the troubles of other auto companies.
Read the article linked below - it was published this week. A year ago you would have been more likely to see an ivory billed woodpecker than a newspaper criticizing Toyota so bluntly.
http://www.sltrib.com/ci_4178250?source=rss
Thanx for the link pal. It's about time somebody plays fair in the negative news game.
Rocky
Rather than having some lionized and some demonized, it would be nice to see more even media treatment of all.
By the way: I notice more positive press about GM these days than for many, many years. It seems the media is abandoning their 'everything about GM is evil' template, at least for the moment.
Rocky
I think this is one more example of something I and some others here and elsewhere have argued elsewhere: Designing and manufacturing mass market automobiles is not easy. The only way to do it well is to limit wherever possible the number of things that can go wrong.
GM, Ford and to a lessor extend Chrysler pre-merger, used to approach the market with a shot gun. Any possible product niche was exploited, lest someone else get market share. The gremlin in this was always going to be quality.
Honda and Toyota rose to prominence in the US on a business plan that had them using two (Honda) and three (Toyota) basic platforms respectively. It worked. Keeping things simple meant keeping them good.
Toy lately got the market share bug big time. It started using the tried and true GM and Ford method: make something every possible piece of the market could ever want. The result is quality glitches.
I think as consumers we have to ask ourselves: do we want something uniquely designed for our particular lifestyle, or do we want to find a way to make a tried and true design work.
Honda never went away from the limited platform model. GM is slowly adopting the model. Ford may be doing so as well. I think Toy has decided it does not want to leave either.
Look at Toyota, even with all the recalls: it makes like 19 models that all drive exactly like a Camry (Scions excepted), even the trucks. This was intentional on their part, of course, but it doesn't lend much "pizzazz" to their line-up. Ford is rapidly going to the same model - the next five years will see the culmination of that process - and in doing so I think it will achieve the same goal, except for the Mustang. Ick.
Funny to me is that the Scions are the least recalled of the Toyota models, and yet they are the exceptions to the "sameness" rule. Of course, their volume is also lower, which makes QC a little easier to rein in.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
The Scions are tried and true as well though, aren't they? I understand Toyota has been using the platforms for a number of years before putting the cool little hatches and coupe on top.
But yeah, the choice is somewhat stark. GM, Ford (and a host of other makes long since dead) used to change models almost every other year. And they would make all sorts of really different creatures. But that was a culture where new car buyers would happily tell you they expect to sell before the thing reaches 50k miles.
If you want to go beyond to overarching socio-economic factors, compare a detailed map from the mid-1960s with one from today. One reason people did not worry about quality and reliability so much was they did not have to travel anywhere near as much as today.
Why would they do that-to save money? Why does Toyota need to save money, either? I mean, how much money did they make last year? 10 billion dollars, or numbers somewhat in that ballpark?
Come on, Toyota. I hope they haven't fired their most experienced engineers or Toyota is going to get worse before they get better. Pay some close attention to this, it might just get hairy for everyone's favorite.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
These recalls are being blown out of proportion too by those who'd like to bring Toyota down.
For example, the recall concerning stalling of Echo and Prius cars amounts to a relatively small number of 35,000 or so in the US, and these are 2001 and early 2002 models.
The FJ Cruiser recall was limited to only 9000 units. And the problem was their tires were damaged by improper installation onto the wheels. I've used a tire mounting machine, and I know it's easy to damage the bead area of the tire if you're not concentrating on the job.
Finally, let's take my personal examples: I've had a total of 3 Camrys in the last 9 years (2 currently). The '97 (which I sold in '04) was recalled ONCE, for a possible loose steering wheel. The '04 was also recalled ONCE, for possible improperly installed (twisted) side curtain airbags. Turns out on this one, my particular car was okay once the trim panels were removed to inspect the airbags.
That's it!
http://www.sltrib.com/ci_4178250?source=rss
One can look at GM, Ford and Chrysler quality of the 70's and 80's and can see how Toyota, Honda and the others picked up customers fed up with buying sub-par quality. Today the Big 3 quality is inline with the industry but their quality perception still is a drag.
one thing that bothers me is that for example, when honda has a transmission issue they repair and guarantee for a 100k. to me that is a cop out. their supposed reputation is to last for multiple 100k's.
Ditto Ford owners with the engines with problematic gaskets, and on and on?
Just wondering how far to extend that line of thinking. Indeed, Toyota and Hondas have the rep of lasting well beyond 150K miles in many cases, and I have experienced that repeatedly, but they have NEVER warranted their vehicles to match that rep. I don't think a manufacturer should be called upon to warrant ther vehicles to the extent of their "rep". It's a rather nebulous concept.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
It seems like there were reports of freezing all new model releases across the board. They have decided not to do that.
"Toyota President Katsuaki Watanabe denied yesterday that the company had decided to delay models across the board. He said the development of individual vehicles would be decided on a case-by-case basis.
"We try to affirm each process," Watanabe said at a demonstration of new safety features west of Tokyo. "And in that process, some may be delayed, and some may be on time." "
http://www.baltimoresun.com/business/investing/bal-bz.toyota26aug26,0,2689624.st- ory?track=rss
AUGUST 25, 2006
Autos
By Matt Vella
Toyota's Cuts: No Bleeding Likely
The announced production delays underscore quality problems but probably won't have a major impact on revenues
Just as domestic auto manufacturers, most notably Ford, are desperately trying to accelerate turnaround plans, Toyota (TM) may be ready to slow down a bit. The company's president said on Aug. 25 that the delay of some future models could be on the table to provide additional time to iron out reputation-dampening quality issues.
The Japanese giant—which nabbed second place in July behind General Motors (GM) by outselling Ford Motor (F) in the U.S.—said potential delays would be decided on a model-by-model basis and would not affect products across the board. But the public admission of fault is emblematic of a long-coming shift in company posture toward quality issues.
An ongoing series of high-profile recalls has focused industry attention on the potentially troubling underside of Toyota's trailblazing growth. In the U.S., the market many see harboring the most potential for future growth, Toyota recalled 2.38 million vehicles last year and 628,000 so far this year, according to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.
In Japan, meanwhile, the number of recalled vehicles has jumped 56% since 2002, to more than 1 million in 2006. Published reports have suggested that another six-figure recall could be waiting in the wings in the U.S.
SALES STILL STRONG. The recalls and quality reports have yet to affect Toyota's bottom line. The company's financial position is stronger than ever.
In the first half of this year, global sales rose 10.4%, to 4.26 million, while GM's fell 2.3%, to 4.60 million. Toyota's operating profits account for one-third of the combined global profits of all the world's auto makers. What's more, executives are sitting on nearly $20 billion in cash reserves.
Industry observers and analysts say that while some accounts of the effects on the company's sterling reputation for quality have been exaggerated, Toyota is seriously auditing its design and production processes to curb future quality issues. Joe Langley, a market analyst with the Northville (Mich.) market research firm CSM Worldwide, says: "There's no doubt that they've been publicly shamed by it. There is a fire, but they're putting it out."
Toyota's mea culpa, consisting of public apologies in Japan and today's announcement of potential corrective strategies, indicates increasing frankness vis-à-vis quality issues. Wes Brown at Iceology, a Los Angeles consumer research firm, says: "This is Toyota trying to be proactive, cognizant of public sentiment. If they want to maintain good sentiment, they realize they can't be so secretive anymore."
GROWING PAINS. Analysts familiar with Toyota's production procedures say the problems may indicate strains on human resources within the company, a result of unyielding growth. Langley notes: "They've been so taxed, they haven't been able to send as many people to work with suppliers before launches."
Speculation about delays that could stretch Toyota's famously short production cycles by three, six, or even 12 months revolve around the coming versions of the Avalon sedan, Sienna minivan, and Solara sports coupe. But analysts point out that those cars are due in the three- to four-year time frame and that sales of current versions are still healthy.
Toyota has confirmed the delay of some highly anticipated models due much sooner, though. A new version of the hot-selling Corolla small sedan has been set back twice, partly on the unexpected strength of Honda's competing redesigned Civic.
Toyota's Tundra pickup truck, finally poised to take on Ford's bread-and-butter F-Series, was delayed into next year. Brown says: "They're looking at the process, asking if it's design, engineering, a combination, or quality checks of cars coming off the line."
GOOD NEWS. Likely most important to company officials, analysts, and consumers alike is that recalls have yet to affect significantly Toyota's standings in quality surveys. Neal Oddes, director of product research and analysis at Westlake Village (Calif.)-based J.D. Power and Associates, says that his research shows Toyota improving initial vehicle quality by about 15% since 2003.
Although Toyota still trails Porsche, Lexus, and Hyundai in the rankings, two of the best five brands at the top of the list are built by the company. "I'm sorry, but as far as Toyota's concerned, I've only got good news for you," jokes Oddes.
Toyota's reserve of goodwill with the American auto-buying public may indeed still run deep. It appears that, to maintain those reserves, the company is beginning to acknowledge publicly nagging recalls and quality problems. After all, admission is the first step on the path toward recovery.
Vella is a reporter for BusinessWeek.com in New York
So despite what the naysayers are saying about TOYOTA's supposed slip in quality, the reality is that it is still better than the rest in terms of quality. As long as Toyota keeps doing well in JDP and CR survey, it is unlikely their reputation is going to suffer.
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2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Actually, J.D. Power has Toyota ranked 5th for dependability and 4th for initial quality. This is still better than most brands.
All these recalls will affect Toyota's image. We have seen similar situations in the past with GM, K Mart, IBM and others. When a corporation has any sort of trouble the media has a way of making every problem a news event.
Toyota's still on top, no doubt. But they are taking a step backwards while everyone else is going forward.
It is just a fact of the business in automobile manufacturing. Making autos is complex. Engineering is complex. There are multiple suppliers.
Like many companies in the midst of a very successful growth, Toyota began to believe its own press that it could do no wrong. Toyota began to deviate from the process that brought it so successfully to where it was.
Taking back what I said above, I see the development as positive. The market is in a place where it has to decide whether it wants an entirely unique car for every possible segment with the resulting quality risks, or does it want variations of platforms that allow greater quality control.
I do not think the auto world is at a point where it where you can have both. As the market really seems to prefer the latter - at least the mass market - Ferrari buyers will accept technical limitations for the chance to have the perfect driving thrill - then we have to begin to accept that car companies cannot throw out a different model whenever our whim seeks it.
"A journey of 1000 miles down the slippery slope starts with a first fall."
And do we ever have a first fall!!!
Don't give me that Toyota's being proactive stuff! How do you hide recalling more than 2m in America and 1M in Japan? They can't, so they do the only thing and acknowledge and apologize!
There's evidence that Toyota tried its best to hide it. NYT reported 2 Toy executives were being investigated for criminal misconduct in this affair by the Japanese government. The accusation was they knew about this for the last EIGHT years!
Let's correct this paragraph: two Toyota officials are being investigated for NON-CRIMINAL charges in Japan, related to one incident involving the crash of a Toyota Hilux Surf, where there was a suspicion that steering components were to blame (hence the recall on old 4Runners and even older pick-ups last year). The investigation is occurring because there was evidence that the steering had a known fault, and these two good people (ahem! :-<) ignored this evidence, and went with the design as it already was.
I owned one of the affected trucks out to 220K miles - no problems there. Toyota recalled my truck anyway, and put brand new tie rods on a 16-year-old 200K truck - certainly above and beyond the NHTSA's requirements.
I would certainly encourage Toyota to slow down its production and expansion at this juncture, and get things back under control. If treading water to fix QC glitches means a year or two of just-average profits and "only" a 14% market share in the U.S., then so be it.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I may look at the 2007 Sienna, being a slow learner and all.
That's the right approach, Nippon. The media believes they have a 'big story' on their hands with Toyota's quality troubles.
In our 24 hour media culture repetition shapes opinion. That's unfair, but it's a reality big business has to contend with.
Toyota can't let this "Toyota quality is slipping" narrative gain media traction. It won't get better on its own.