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Then why does the 4-spd Five Hundred get better gas mileage than a similar equipped CVT Five Hundred?
I'm pretty sure that's the case, as a friend of mine pointed that out to me.
We never did come up with a good reason that the CVT should get worse mileage, though.
I know of no reason why a Hybrid vehicle would have to use a CVT. I've always believed they were used so that the vehicle would get the best possible fuel mileage, which is the whole point of building the hybrid to begin with. Cost of production was always a secondary consideration, allowing for the additional expense of the CVT.
A properly "tuned" CVT's milage advantage over a conventional transmission is somewhat masked by human operator variations, compared to operation by cruise control.
I suppose it's possible that the type of EPA testing would favor the 6-speed tranny (4-speed was my bad, thinking of my Taurus LOL) over the CVT, but I'm not sure why it would be that way.
And I stand correct on the CVT requirement for a hybrid. It seems that the Honda Insight has/had the option of a five-speed manual transmission or the CVT.
PS: No need to convince me of the CVT's "goodness". I love mine (on the Freestyle and Five Hundred). But, I didn't get it for any mileage differential, that's for sure. I got it because I love the way it behaves. I can't see why ANYBODY would prefer the herky-jerky of a typical automatic.
Honda and GM hybrids are mild hybrids with both motors mounted in series when ever one motor is turning the other is turning.
Mark.
Were the cars with exploding trannies (see first post in thread) AWD models?
Mark, you seem very knowledgeable, one of the few people here who seems to base his statements on actual information. Are you a Ford tech or something? I am considering buying a used Freestyle but like others am concerned about the seemingly unproven Ford CVT. Is my concern misplaced in your opinion? Is there any data on the percentage of Freestyle trannies that go bad?
Generally I don’t like the government meddling in people’s (or businesses’) lives, but since it’s already got its nose deep into the car business, I wish it would require car companies to keep track of warranty repairs – their frequency and nature – so that people would have good info on which to base judgments about reliability.
Any info would be appreciated. Thanks.
Sorry passat when everybody disagrees with you dosen't mean we are all wrong, just by reading the other responses i come to this conclusion.
I think anybody who believes any transmission doesn't need maintenace (believes it enough not to bother maintaining it) is probably going to need a new tranny some day.
The Transmission/AWD Haldex unit were not replaced due to them being "unsuccessful" they were replaced due to cost as they are both better solutions to the driveline(the Haldex works just fine on the Volvo XC90 and the CVT has not had that many failures. And if you "have no statistical information on occurences" why don't you keep your SPECULATION to yourself. Ford is simply trying to cut production costs for this vehicle.
Don't like my speculation then skip over it and don't read it, but it is going to keep coming.
And the CVT doesn't theoretically need a change until 60,000 miles, either. But I'm not gonna wait that long.
And then there's that 100,000 mile radiator fluid, too. I won't be waiting that long for it, either.
As for Trans. maintenance, yes they need maintenance, but they should not need maintenance and fail at 15k miles either, as CVT did.
Correct, that would be the exception rather than the rule as I don't think 100k+ CVT's in Freestyles on the road have all failed. If you look around and see some posts from Ford tech's you will see statments that they are more reliable than most.
No one really knows why the CVT was discontinued.
But I do know I have a friend that has been a Ford mechanic for 25 years and he states there have been far fewer Freestyles come in for CVT repair than compared to the average number of transmissions for other models of the same years.
P.S. Nissan's CVT rocks.
Mark.
so does ford's, that's a big part of the reason we bought ours...the lack of developing it is a function of the moron beancounters, not the engineering...
We really like the design of the FS so are hoping for the best.
We loved it when we bought it NEW but within the first year started having problems. It wouldn't accelerate, wrench light came on, putting noises, etc. Took it to the dealership where we bought it, they hooked it up, (Of course, wrench light wasn't on then) so according to the dealer, no problem! The light came on again and the dealer "fixed" it. Worked fine for a few weeks, drove it OUT OF STATE, wrench light came on, engine light came on, barely made it off the road. Took to a dealership, ran a diagnostic, transmission problems! No, transmission person to fix it for 2 weeks! Dealership assured me it would be fine to drive back to my state to get repaired. Had to drive 50 mph the entire way since it wouldn't go over that! Next day, wouldn't accelerate over 25mph - made it to the dealer I bought from. Huge hassle, it was just over the 12,000 mile warranty. Had to negotiate to have dealer even pay partial for it to be fixed. Suppossedly, it was taken care of....
11 months later,(now) the wrench and engine light came on again, wouldn't accelerate over 50 mph. Took to original dealership, told us the brake light wasn't working, then managed to hook it up properly to the diagnostic machine - transmission had major codes coming up! (They didn't have a transmission person there to fix either) The service manager said they couldn't help us, the regional mgr wouldn't help us since they had already fixed it twice before! They said they could offer us a trade in????? They wouldn't give us the printout of what was wrong with the transmission. We had to take it to another Ford dealer who finally told us that the entire Transmission needed to be replaced for $5000. (At least they offered to pay for our rental car since it can't be fixed for a week!)
Does this sound familiar to anyone else?? Should this be happening on a car that is only 2 years old? :lemon: ?
1) What is the total mileage on your Freestyle?
2) Did you buy it new or used?
3) If you purchased used.. what was the mileage at the time you bought it?
4) Was the vehicle within it's 3 yr. 36,000 mile warranty when the transmission first needed repairs?
5) Ok.. here's the big one. Do you have the vehicle's entire service records from when it was first put into service. (When it was first titled.) It really helps to have such records.
Huh? The mechanical warranty is for 36K, three years. There is 12K mile limit to fix minor issues like squeaks and rattles. Any transmission repair (including entire replacement) should not cost a penny unless the dealer could prove owner negligence in maintenance. The warranty is for the CAR, not the owner; even if you bought it used the original mileage and years apply.
You need to contact Ford corporate on this issue (and find another dealer).
Drivetrain: 3 yr. / 36,000 mi.
Roadside: 3 yr. / 36,000 mi.
Rust: 5 yr. / Unlimited mi.
if you bought new and are within the above limits you should not be paying dime one as it is a BUMPER TO BUMPER warranty with no exceptions
http://www.motorcraftservice.com/pubs/content/~WO5219/~MUS~LEN/41/05frdwa7e.pdf
Drivetrain: 3 yr. / 36,000 mi.
Roadside: 3 yr. / 36,000 mi.
Rust: 5 yr. / Unlimited mi."
I thought they went to 50K miles on the drivetrain for 2008?
have you noticed lately ford has beat toyota in initial quality and buick has beat lexus in some of the popular rankings...
while it's unfortunate you had your problmes, a cvt failure is still a rare exception considering how many ford produced rather than a rule.
so when you foreign hybrid has some sort of failure will you be on that forum posting "I see a domestic hybrid in my future".
there are no guarantee's with any manufacturer and to not give credit to the domestics for raising there game is just shortsighted...
Future trend for all manufacturers is to push more component production to outside supplies to save costs. The foreign/domestic built distinction will get even blurrier.
Mark.
We arrived at our destination where the car sat for 2 hours. Afterward on the drive home there were no such symptoms. I can't say for certain it was the CVT but it seemed likely. No warning lights came on. It was very hot, so not sure if it was temperature related. Anyone else ever experience this? The Freestyle is an '05 AWD with 42k miles. It seems to be fine again today.
- Chad
There's a noticeable whine at low speed (like parking), and vibration through the steering wheel. The vibration is more pronounced when turning (though you can feel a bit when not turning at all).
My understanding is that the electric motor on the CVT exhibits a 'whine', and that's how it is...
As far as the vibration, I actually wonder if it's the power steering pump? I took the car into a dealer once to have an issue with the rear seat checked out, and I figured I'd pay the rent by having them change the oil. That experience left me afraid to go back to that dealer (seat not fixed, crank case under-filled an entire quart), so bringing in a car that exhibits a symptom that only happens when hot probably isn't going to go to well, at this dealer at least...
Honestly, the 'vibration/whine' issue doesn't bother me in the least, though I too wonder if something is wrong/about to break. Since I have a 6 yr/100K extended warranty, I'm not overly concerned, but I would be curious if anyone else has had this issue, and if it lead to something catastrophic, or if that's just how it is.
Domestics still haven't raised their game enough and remain minor league.
in the first 1600 Mi on highway 12 MPG - front brakes replaced and rotors resurfaced.
Transmission died in the middle of freeway at 7500 M.
After 30 in service there is very inconsistent engine breaking and the alignment had to be done 5 times.
at 10k the rear brakes were done. < 1mm.
19k Transmission dies again, also rear brakes are done again.
In hot weather (100F +) the idle is going up and down, especialy when pressing the brake pedal. Try driving in slow traffic!
Ford bought the vehicle back.
A few problems were never "verified" by the dealer, like doors not opening with remote, fast blinking signals.
We test drove different cars to replace our Freestyle, and sadly, nothing drives as safe as it did. Mazda CX7 comes close, but the 08 Toyota Highlander is a disapointment. Oh, what to do.....?
Heather
I'm sure I would not get one as bad as this one, But...
The main problem was the dealers. Like in many other stories here, they limit their investigations to reading the codes. I tell them "the engine's idle speed fluctuates in 100F+ heat". It's 80F outside; they still connect the computer and tell me there is nothing wrong.
I'm sure there is a pressure sensor in the intake manifold that could be malfunctioning, there is an electronic throttle that could be flaky in extreme heat. They should test for these things...
Did I tell you that for my first three visits I had to show the tech how to read the odometer?
I took once a Honda Accord to a Honda dealer. A tech came out and told me a bunch of staff about my car that I did not know. Then proceeded with a quick investigation and told me what was going on about my problem.
I'm afraid to buy another Ford because of their dealerships. Hmmmm maybe I'll lease one, and if it works fine I'll buy it, how about that?
But it's true that if you can get good service after the purchase, then that will have a big impact on making a purchase.
8/30 drove daughter to grad school in New York City. Supposed to be a 3 hour drive but really took 5 hours with stops to eat, and 90 minutes to cross Geo Wash Bridge - 162 miles total one way. FS was totally packed with just enough room for a driver and two passengers.
FS ran great. Did not miss a beat at 70+ miles per hour for long stretches. Then totally bumper to bumper crawling city traffic. FS had no issues at all. As you can tell, I am totally happy with the vehicle on this trip.
I cannot really comment on Ford service as my wife usually takes it in for routine service. I did get involved with the transmission failure and found our dealer's service department to be knowlegeable and sensitive to our needs.