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I think you'd enjoy how the Focus drives better than the Sentra. The Sentra's ride is smooth enough, but the steering feels somewhat disconnected. The Sentra has more interior room and more features than the base Focus.
If the ride/drive test isn't enough to sway you to the Focus and you would buy the Sentra if it were not for the IIHS score, one thing to consider is to get a slightly used 2010 Sentra S. It's pretty much the same car as for 2012 except ESC was optional for 2010, so you'd want to be sure the car has that option. Also the side impact test results are better--apparently Nissan redesigned the side airbags for 2011, and not with good results!
Another very safe car to consider is a used Impreza (since a new one would be over $16k). Good crash safety plus the safety of AWD.
Didn't IIHS change the rules for 2011?
For 15ish it's not bad; 3k off MSRP seems like you're doing pretty good.
I am also worried because it's brand new and they don't seem to be selling very quickly (where I live). If you want a 2012 Elantra, you have to search the web for an area dealership who even has any Elantras on hand and then they sell them for above sticker as quickly as they can. I went to a Chevy dealer and asked about the current incentives on the Cruze and he pointed to the total price on the bottom of the sticker and said "That's the price they are. No rebates or discounts." When I said I was just looking around, he told me to have a nice day and walked off to find the next person to sell to. The Ford guy calls me every other day wondering if I'm going to come buy the car today. They marked it down $3k when even edmunds says they should cost more than that. That makes me nervous.
Not like I'm trying to persuade you into a Focus...but didn't the Sentra you mention also have a huge discount on MSRP?
I wouldn't necessarily come to the conclusion that a vehicle is inferior because they offer rebates...maybe they were too aggressive with the MSRP or underestimated the competition.
I really liked the Focus SE Hatch with sport package and 17" wheels. It was approx 22.5k MSRP but with TMV and rebates I could have had it for around 19K; but then I drove a new VW beetle (the man beetle...) and I liked it better even though on paper the Focus was a better vehicle.
I suppose you need to drive all in that price range (with rebates) to discover the best for you; with your criteria for IIHS, etc.
I don't see a dud in this category; they are are competitive and compelling for their own reasons.
For the salesman that walked away from you...many years ago I was at a Porsche dealer and the salesman didn't give me the time of day (I was in my 20's)...I left and the next day drove in with my new Audi...I told him too bad he didn't want to sell me a car and then drove off...his loss
The average price of a new Focus was $20K compared to $16K for a Civic. I expect the Cruze is closer to $16K as well. Ford may not sell quite as many Focii but they're sure making a lot more money on them than they used to.
All the better for folks like me who want an SE (hatch, please)!
I see quite a few SEs on lots but NOT with the 5-speed... despite reviews like those from C/D which recommends the SE 5-speed as the best choice in the Focus lineup (no MySync, no automatic).
Or maybe it's just that all the SE 5-speeds are already in the hands of happy owners? I pulled up alongside an SE sedan 5-speed in a parking lot the other day. So they DO exist.
When my wife and I were car shopping for her new ride a couple of months back, the Sales Associate we were talking with told us his dealership has a hard time keeping the manual SEs on the lot; this in spite of the fact that they order nearly 40% of their SE models with a stick. He also said they've lost quite a few sales to folks who wanted a manual transmission (preferrably a 6-Speed manual) and lots of goodies, and that his dealership is constantly recommending to momma Ford that they start offering manual versions of the Titanium.
Long story short, yes, they do exist. :shades:
And the Elantra is flying off the shelves here, too.
Though, Ford seems to be selling their Focus at above invoice, but below MSRP.
Steering wheel radio controls
Compass
Carpet Mats
Power rear windows
Trip Computer
Seatback pocket
Front center armrest
Automatic exterior lights w/ Delay-off
Illuminated entry
Fog lights
P215/55HR16 vs. P195/65TR15 tires
My other suggestion would be to take a look at the 2012 Mazda3 i Sport 4-door. MSRP is $18,490 but it is selling for $15,950 locally (Atlanta) after $750 Cash Rebate. It has almost every feature included on the Focus SE...just a thought!
About 2 years ago, as information became available of the 2012 design and upgrade to world Focus, I anticipated being one of the first out the door with this new model to replace my '04 Focus ZTS which currently has 115 k and is still is fun to drive and feels substantially new.
When I took a Test drive of an automatic SE model some months ago, It was probably unrepresentitive. I drove it in traffic and the sales rep was just to much in my ear and it was a bad experience. These sales people should know better, throw me a key, stay out of the way and let me drive the car. That is how I bought the last Focus.
Long story short, although there are certainly other considerations, I am now looking forward towards the launch of the 2013 Fusion 2 liter eco-boost with the paddle shifters.
but when I requested a mailed brochure I received an additional "personal" $500 rebate that could be applied to any other rebates...it Excluded the Focus S though.
& your '04 Focus ZTS most likely has the reliable Mazda drivetrain (2.3 w/ slushbox automatic) to begin with.
This new Euro-designed Focus III built in the US seems to warp more & more as it ages under the sunlight?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUXNNe1C9i0
& I am not even talking about the DCT tranny or MyFordTouch...
Forget it! I just placed an order on the "end of cycle" Mk6 Golf 2.5 made-in-Germany w/ "the unique-for-2012 luxury option like extendable front center armrest & rear adjustable A/C vents" & the (now "rare & precious") slushbox (but w/ frequent lock up) made by Aisin/Toyota. I call this car "proven technology" similar to Toyota/Honda (i.e., no turbo/supercharger, no direct injection, & no dual-clutch automatic) but w/o being boring-to-drive or bumpy riding :shades: Peace of mind...(beats 40mpg lemons)
"Road noise is better isolated from the cabin than before, but Honda claims the biggest improvements have been made to the driving experience, and to the ride comfort in particular. Here, at least, the company has been successful.
It’s instantly obvious that the rigid set-up of the old car has been banished and there’s now far more give in the suspension. Nasty potholes still upset the Civic a fraction more than the other cars and the suspension doesn’t cope with expansion joints as well as the Ford or VW, but the newcomer rides well.
There is a price to pay, though, as the changes have blunted the old car’s sharp responses. Make no mistake, the Honda still handles well, but the chassis and its reactions feel a fraction softer. Grip remains strong but there is less front-end bite than in the Focus and Golf.
The steering has also lost some of its precision and, compared to the Focus in particular, there’s less feedback, leaving you with little sense of what the front end is doing. Yet there’s no faulting the light but snappy gearshift action, and the Honda recorded the shortest stopping distances in our brake tests."
Focus:
"Driving the Focus is a different story, as the beautifully weighted controls soon help you feel at one with the car. The steering is accurate and delivers plenty of feedback, while the slick gearshift, progressive brakes and positive throttle response also impress.
The Ford has the most responsive turn-in of the trio, plus plenty of front-end grip, and its balance through a corner makes it fun and reassuring in equal measure. Plus, on the standard 16-inch wheels fitted to our test car, the ride is supple and comfortable."
Golf:
"Road noise is well isolated from the cabin, while the composed chassis and taut suspension set-up deliver a comfortable ride and excellent body control. In corners there’s plenty of grip, and vice-free handling makes the Golf reassuring and relaxing to drive. Plus, all the controls are well weighted and help the car communicate feedback better than the Civic."
This comparison test by Autoexpress are on diesel models only.
However, having read the issue with the transmission hesitation and the confusing usage of the center console technology, I am quite hesitating now!
What would be your suggestion? Also, is the focus as reliable as infiniti? (I barely had any issue whatsover with my infiniti in the past)
Many thanks to all of you!
Daniel
it's not "new...bee" but "newbie" :shades:
Have you driven one yet? (pun in there...)
I like the tech interface...you need to spend some time with it to see if you can live with it. It's not that unfamiliar to your Infiniti interface...
I don't own one but for the test drive I didn't mind the auto transmission...I liked the manual better though (only a 5spd :mad: ).
I didn't drive the Elantra but did drive the veloster (same engine)...it is really...really weak. NOTHING under 4k rpm...literally...you hit the gas and the tach swings up to 4 and you slowly creep ahead. I wouldn't buy it just for this reason.
If you have to downgrade for financial reasons I'd go really cheap. I don't see a huge monthly difference between a G37 and Titanium Focus. So if your safety margins are that tight I'd just go get a used Nissan Versa for 10K to give the finances the ole college try...
Obviously you know the numbers so if you go for the Focus make sure you get all the rebates...there's a number you may qualify for.
For 2013 you'll be able to order a Titanium with a manual trans if that matters to you.
The trans issues have been overblown to a degree. The latest software seems to have resolved 90% of the reported issues. My daughter has a 2012 SEL hatch and the only thing I've noticed with the trans is that it feels different at low speeds and when reversing, but it's not "bad" different, just feels more like a manual (which is what it really is).
You'd really need to drive one to be sure since some people are more sensitive about it than others, but I wouldn't hesitate to buy one personally. They're great cars.
Thanks in advance folks!
Anyway: 45%! That's astounding to me. Ford couldn't have wanted that. Is this because people are fleeing from mytouch, which Ford delivered in too many vehicles? Or is it because Americans are not ready to pay for a premium small car?
I sure hope it's the former.
"Joann Muller
As the author of the Forbes story that started this thread, I thought you should know it is indeed the 2012 Focus that went to fleet in great numbers. Production started in spring 2011, and as many as 90% of the first cars produced went to fleets. I'm told it was because of contractual obligations. Also, there weren't a lot of cars produced initially because of launch problems (bad dashboards, so they had to fly some in from Europe, and transmission complaints). As the year wore on, and production improved, that % gradually went down. In the third quarter, for example, it was 34%. For the first nine months, it averaged 45%. Fourth quarter registration data's not out yet. So it could be lower. It's still unusually high, especially for a new car right out of the chute."
I assume part of the fleet sales were commercial and not all rental sales, but it appears that Ford made a conscious decision to send a lot of the early builds (that sometimes get held for weeks) to rental fleets rather than customers.
I know there was not a glut of vehicles on dealer lots because I had to order one for my daughter back in June and that didn't change much until the last month or two.
You won't see high rental fleets going forward - I'm sure of that.
Expect the 2013 Ford Focus to make it's appearance as most other cars in the fall of 2013 not the spring of that year.
Here is another question: Is Ford actually reacting to the desires of auto enthusiasts with this decision ?
No, it doesn't mean that. That is always the case - the current incentives only apply to the current models regardless of when the new one arrives. Meaning you won't see 2013 incentives until the 2013s are actually on the lot for sale.
Overall, very happy with this car (so far)!
Consumer Reports testing shows that the Focus has the best acceleration of any of its automatic-equipped direct mainstream competition (Cruze, Elantra, Jetta, Corolla, Civic, Mazda3), beating most by a half second or more. It also holds its own on fuel economy with 28 mpg overall, beaten slightly by the Elantra (29), Civic (30) and more significantly by the Corolla (32). But everyone seems to agree the Corolla is about as enjoyable to drive as an ice cream truck.
That’s actually pretty impressive that it gets the best acceleration and gets only slightly lower economy than the slower cars in the group. The Jetta for example is a half second slower and only gets 25 overall. And the Civic gets 2mpg better economy but takes a full second longer to get to 60!
Personally I readily accept a 1-2mpg hit for a car that rides and handles this good. Mine was built in December and I have no issues with the transmission.
I don’t have Myford Touch so I might be less enthusiastic if I had to go through all that hassle but the standard stereo system in my SEL is much much better (great LCD graphics and usability) than what I’m used to in my other Fords or what I’ve seen in the Focus’s direct competition that I’ve rented for work in the past year.
Ford won't allow fleet sales to affect resale value. That only happens with fleet dumping to rental companies and that's not happening.
Focus sales for January were the best since 2003 and up significantly from 2011.
"As with the petrol version, the TDCI Zetec S suffers from slightly empty-feeling electric power steering. You get used to it over time, but it still takes the edge off the driving experience."
But then, does the Focus have to worry these days?
The king of steering feel -- Mazda3 -- is also ruined in the Skyactiv form...
Winding Road's opinion:
"To be fair, I’ve driven some great EHPAS systems, and in general prefer them over full electric units. For some reason it just hasn’t worked for me in the Mazda. It’s a fast steering rack to be sure, but in becoming so quick to turn, it’s sacrificed any real heft from the rack. Feedback is also hurt, as I just couldn’t get a great idea of what’s going on through the wheel. To be fair, suspension feedback is still quite good, but I’ve always appreciated Mazda’s ability to instill its steering systems with a very rich communicative experience.
Pros
Skyactiv powertrain is a huge win for the 3, with better power and econ
Communicative suspension makes for confident driving
Very little body roll and good stiffness (without harshness) from the suspension
Cons
Super-light steering is distracting
Automatic transmission isn’t the best choice for enthusiast drivers
Competition from the Focus is stiff indeed"