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Ford Windstar Problems
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Dear w/s user. I am going to by an used van. My friend suggested me a wind star. I looked a 95 LX with 69000 mil. It looked OK for me, but after I checked this message board, I started to think that it may not be a good choice to have a w/s, or at least, I should check it more closely. Do you have any suggestion for that. The owner asked for $86,000. Is it too much. Thanks.
www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/recalls
It lets you see Recall details on various makes, models, and year.
The next morning, the car still would not start. When she had a tow truck driver come out to tow it to the dealership, the driver noticed that it was parked on a slight hill and the gas gauge was noted to be less than 1/4 tank, but at least 1/8 tank. He said that when Windstars are parked on hills, and less than 1/4 tank, the van thinks it is out of gas. The driver then towed the van to a more level area, whereby the van finally started.
We live in the very hilly SF Bay Area and I have never heard of this type of problem in any car. Has anyone had similar experiences?
Thanks.
President
Ford Motor Company of Canada Ltd.
The Canadian Road
P.O. Box 2000
Oakville, Ontario
L6J-5E4
It is with regret that I inform you of my decision to sell my Ford vehicle and refuse to consider purchasing another Ford product. Over the past 20 years I have owned a Ford Thunderbird, Granada, Grand Marquis, Crown Victoria,Mercury Sable and a 1995 Winstar Van. I would have to say that for the most part I have been very happy with the quality of my Ford vehicles. This year, my Ford Winstar van has had its transmission break down again for the fourth time, and the head gasket blow, both before the vehicle had 100,000 kilometers on it.
My decision to sell the vehicle is based on my unwillingness to continually spend money on a vehicle which is inferior in quality, and my dissatisfaction with the reception I have received in talking to Ford staff regarding this
problem. I did talk at length to a supervisor at Ford and was informed that there was nothing Ford would do about these transmission problems and that Ford had an extended warranty on the head gasket and there would be no charge for this service. I have found out since this conversation that the Ford dealership is going to charge me $460.00 for the engine overhaul and the towing charges and loss of a vehicle for a week was my problem. I was also told that my requests for any compensation by Ford was an unreasonable request. I did ask the supervisor at
Ford to have someone else review my request for compensation for these problems when I was told that “my decision represents Ford Canada and there is no appeal process” and that I could not get a written copy of her decision to forward with this letter and that “not even the president has access to my records”.
This vehicle was sold to me by an unhappy Ford customer ( although I only recently discovered this fact). I am going to sell this vehicle at a loss of $4,000.00 in the 5 months I have owned the vehicle. This vehicle is likely to be
sold to another potentially unhappy Ford customer and I am sure the circle of dissatisfied customers will grow. What I tried to impress upon the supervisor during my conversation was that my loss today will reflect in your
losses tomorrow as my family will not purchase another Ford product. I regret to say that I have always believed that purchasing a locally made vehicle would be a benefit to our community. Sadly I am now convinced that this is
not the case as Ford has failed to provide reliable transportation and placed undue financial stress on the thousands
of families like ours.
I did request that this file be sent to your office for review.
I would like to give you the opportunity to respond to this letter before I send a copy of this letter to the Lemon Aid buyers guide in order to advise others to look elsewhere for a reliable vehicle.
I look forward to having some positive dialogue with Ford regarding my concerns.
President
Ford Motor Company of Canada Ltd.
The Canadian Road
P.O. Box 2000
Oakville, Ontario
L6J-5E4
Dear Alain,
On Saturday June 16th I received a message in response to my earlier concern ( see attached), on my answering
machine stating that “we would like to resolve your concern” and “we want to talk to you to see how we can assist
you with this problem before you consider leaving the Ford family”. I responded to the message and the
representative informed me that she was able to handle the call ( even though she had not made the original call).
After a lengthy conversation with the representative I was told that there was nothing Ford was prepared to do about
my concerns. I enquired as to why Ford had called and indicated a willingness to resolve this problem, and then
told me there was nothing you were prepared to do. The Ford representative told me that “ I am sorry that our
original message gave you the impression that we wanted to resolve this problem”. To say the least I was
disappointed that there is no willingness on Ford’s part to engage in some positive dialogue regarding my concerns.
It was clear that the representative had not read my letter and I am still baffled as to why the representative called to
waste my time.
Since my last letter I have spent an additional $2,222.76 on a transmission repair to this vehicle, the forth major
repair on this component.
My original letter stated that “ I would like to give you the opportunity to respond to this letter before I send a copy
of this letter to the Lemon Aid buyers guide in order to advise others to look elsewhere for a reliable vehicle.”
Today I am sending the Lemon Aid buyers guide a copy of both of these letters as well as the rude response I have
received from Ford. I have also registered a internet domain name which I am prepared to tell the world my
concerns about your products and customer service should the outcome of our next contact not be a satisfactory
resolution to the problem. Further to this I am considering taking the matter to small claims court.
As I stated in my original letter, I am dissatisfied with the reception I have received in talking to Ford staff
regarding this problem I still look forward to having some positive dialogue with Ford regarding my concerns.
Please instruct your representatives to be polite and look for constructive ways to deal with this problem.
I still have my 95 WS--it is driven on weekends and when I need to haul more than 5 people locally. I have the AAA plus membership which includes flatbed truck transport for 100 miles and carry my cell phone at all times when I drive this vehicle. (useful when you are stuck on the side of I-95 on a 100+ F day with a blown head gasket!) I have offered my 95 W/S to a number of colleagues for use as transportation, vehicle to teach their kids how to drive, storage locker, target for whatever, etc. but they have all turned me down (they know the history of this thing!)
I have had 2 head gasket replacements, one transmission shift cylinder repair and then a factory rebuilt transmission at 6 years/60K ($2500!). At least the 2 headgaskets and first transmission repair were covered under the 5Y/60000K extended warranty. At 7Y/65K, the vehicle shifts rather abruptly and the engine surges at times. The aftermarket roofrack system and bike/canoe carrying attachments that I bought for this vehicle now are worth more than the vehicle itself! The kids seem to be attached to the WS and get upset when I mention getting rid of it. When something else major blows, I am going to junk it. I am not sure whether I can inflict this vehicle on anyone else!
We have adapted to my wife's Subaru Outback for long trips--you just have to pack efficiently. At least I do not have to worry about drivetrain/engine problems!
According to all posted information, Ford's extended warranty for 1995 Windstars covers 7 years or 100,000 miles. The service campaign number is 00M09 and this was an addendum to campaign 98M01 which only extended 5 years and 60,000 miles. Original AND subsequent/current owners are covered and it INCLUDES rebates for any costs you incurred for repairs from an independent (non-Ford) repair shop. See the following web sites for additional info:
http://www.autosafety.org/autodefects/FORD-3.8L.htm
http://home.att.net/~ccatanese/ford
The following excerpts comes from an Edmunds site (no longer a current site):
"The last type of service notification would be a warranty extension, which is just that: an extension of a part or whole of the vehicle's warranty. In any of these service notifications, it does not matter if you are the original owner or if you purchased the vehicle used; the service notifications go with the vehicle and not with the owner."
Also:
"...program 00M09, which basically extended the original program from five years or 60,000 miles to seven years or 100,000 miles, whichever occurred first, covering the same vehicles as the 98M01 program. Letters to consumers for this program went out in March of 2000. Ford obtains a current list of owners from R.L. Polk and several other sources".
Call Ford at: (800) 392-3673 to find out more.
Initially when my head gaskets blew and i contacted Ford they warned me that *I* would have to pay a $70 "Diagnostic Fee", and if the dealership felt that my vehicle had enough "symptoms" to warrant gasket replacement under 00M09/00M10, then my $70 would be reimbursed.
I said "listen pal, 2 weeks ago all my warning lights came on, my engine was hesitating, chugging, knocking Badly, felt like it was running on 3 cylinders, was burning white smoke out the tailpipe, was consuming 1 gallon of coolant per week, and now it is sitting on Jackstands in my driveway waiting for the Tow Truck to tow it to the Ford Dealership!! How many more symptoms do you Need??"
Also, the dealership said all the Courtesy cars were already taken by Other owners with blown head gaskets! and they Refused to cover a rental car!
Anyways, the total cost of repairs was $1300 and took TWO weeks! But the "Extended Gasket Warranty" program only covered $1050!
The dealership said *I* had to come up with $250!! I said WTF?!? WHY do I have to pay $250 for FORD's defective gaskets Scewing up MY engine??!!
The dealership said the Warranty *only* covered gaskets and installation, but I was responsible for things like corroded spark plugs, block flush, oil, coolant, and waste disposal fees!!
I just about got in my Ford and crashed it thru their dealership window!
But decided to drive it home and put a For Sale sign on it instead... at least now that it was running again.
Over the years of (unhappy) ownership i have spent Thousands of dollars out of my own pocket for parts & service not covered by the recall/warranty, rental cars!, towing, time taken off work, etc.
So with the Thousands of dollars i've WASTED i could've just bought a Toyota, Honda, or Nissan to begin with!!!
So what do you think?
Am I up the proverbial Windstar creek? Or could I get lucky and have it be something small and inexpensive (less than $100).
Any bets???
BTW - Brought it in to the dealer, they checked the codes and found no "Crisis" messages. Scheduled the van in to service on Thursday. They re-set the trouble lights.... no issues for about 20 miles... both lights are now back on.
The van has ALWAYS shifted hard at lower speeds. The village idiot, ah, er,I'm sorry - Ford mechanic, said that that is typical for the vehicle.
I think that I should have traded it in somewhere along that 20 miles....
Best of luck,
Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
If you are suffering the abrupt shift at very low and gradual speeds, then it is considered normal. If you are suffering the abrupt shift while speeding up more rapidly, then it isn't normal.
I have a 96 Windstar and it does the same thing, only in stop and go and slow accelleration. Because I hardly ever drive in that type of traffic, I seldom see the problem.
Thanks.
Now I worry about the tranny problems. Can anyone explain the symptons of what to look for when the tranny problems start. I see a lot of people getting them replaced but very little detail on the actual problems.
Is there any peventive maintenance that can be done to minimize the potential threat of tranny failure ?
Bloemie
Nonetheless, here are what I noticed-
Original Tranny Failure: Not shifting from 1st to 2nd. When it did, it was VERY HARD.
Replacement #1 Failure: Flashing overdrive light and tranny was not using overdrive (no shift from 3rd to 4th/OD).
Replacement #2 Failure: Same as original tranny failure with flashing overdrive light.
Note that there is no "leaking" fluid, however, I have been told that the tranny fluid can "smell burnt" and be a darker color red than normal.
Hope that helps!
2004 Honda Accord EX-L Graphite Pearl
2007 Honda Civic EX - Atomic Blue
2013 Honda Civic LX - Crimson Pearl
Anyway, we're taking it in to CarMax to have the transmission looked at.
I think we have the hard 1-2 shift problem (although it seems more like a 2-1 downshift) when we're a making low speed hard left and giving it even a little gas. The van will actually lay a small patch of rubber - after nearly a full second of hesitation. I haven't tested it enough to be sure but this doesn't seem to happen when we make hard right turns.
Is this the "hard shift" problem that is supposed to be normal?
As an aside, has anyone purchased extended warranties through CarMax - specifically with Ryan Industries? The Ford dealership said they wouldn't even look at the van because they anticipated problems with the warranty company...
Thanks in advance for help on either issue.
Jon
It's going to the transmission shop Monday. No more Ford dealer repairs.
Has anyone had any luck getting Ford to pay part of it ? The dealership would not contact the area re sing I had to go thou the Ford 800 number. It seems to me that since this is the same piston that was failing in 1993 ford transmissions and had extended warranty's against it, then had a service bulletin put out saying that after three versions of the aluminum piston the need a steel one for the transmissions to survive, Ford should pay at least 1/2 the cost.
Sell it to someone uneducated about the 95 WS.
In good conscience, I will not do this.
Trade It
I am not sure what the going rate is; KBB says $5000 and Edmunds had $4907 - Neither of which I believe. I still have a problem with this as it would likely be sold to another unsuspecting consumer...
Donate It
The nice thing about this is that I would be able to deduct the full trade in value of the vehicle. Since I fall into the 28% tax bracket, that translates to a tax credit of $1400.
Any other ideas on what to do with this vehicle would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!
2004 Honda Accord EX-L Graphite Pearl
2007 Honda Civic EX - Atomic Blue
2013 Honda Civic LX - Crimson Pearl
When we bought the van we had the same concern and we let the salesman demonstrate it. (I was not going to risk my fingers !!!). You may want to see it working in a different van to compare with your's and determine if is not working properly or your pain tolerance is different than the salesman
When the engine temperature exceeded the setpoint of the switch, it would shutdown the fuel pump circuit. The car wouldn't start until the engine cooled down again. Every time I had it towed to a shop, there was nothing wrong and it would start right up and no error codes on the computer. Somehow, instead of the switch just totally breaking, the setpoint changed to a lower temperature and would shut down the circuit at the higher end of the normal operating temp range.
Good luck at finding your problem, I hope this helps you.
I really like this van and so far has been an excellent vechicle. I would buy another one.
Thanks for any help
Chuck
The 3.8 engine in the 99s and later is completly redisgned from the ones used earlier. In mixed driving with my heavy foot I get 18-23 MPG.
The speedometer has always had a rather strange anomoly. It reads about 3 MPH fast at 75 indicated but the odometer is about 3-5% slow. Go figure. Never tried to get it fixed since it helps me stay out of the speeding ticket zone(:>
The transmission is supposedly redisgned as well but don't know for sure on that. The shifting is never predictable. Sometimes I get a really rough shift when driving around town and other times it seems to turn loose between gears. If I stick my foot in it always takes off and shifts with authority so I haven't really worried about it.
The company got out of the car business so they made me a deal on my WS. 2 years old and 53K for $7800. I figured that if a transmission went, I could afford to replace it after paying that price. Of course just after I bought it, a new trouble came up. The windshield wipers would take off and run and you couldn't stop them. After 4 trips to the dealer the problem seems to be taken care of. There was a TSB on this problem and replacement of the multifunction switch took care of it. The first switch they put in didn't fix it. They claimed the wrong switch was sent and installed the first time.
So now I await the next adventure. Probably the battery since most Ford OE batteries don't seem last any longer than about 2 years in my experience.
I wonder if keeping the cooling system flushed would minimize the head gasket failures since it seems that most of the failures relate to coolant leaks either internal or external.
not buying this VAN when the lease runs out!
Again, thanks for your help.
Chuck
Have filed suit against Ford of Canada, and at their insistence we all sat down and met with a court appointed arbitrator to try to avoid having to go to court. The whole arbitration process lasted less than 15 minutes with Ford unwilling to entertain any thought of "settling". Ford claims that the Head Gasket problem could have been caused by the water pump since they BOTH went bad at the same time. WHAT A CROCK!!
Does anyone have documentation of the "order of destruction" when a head gasket blows?