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1971 Cadillac Fleetwood

nessie1nessie1 Posts: 2
edited March 7 in Cadillac
After nearly 30 years of mutual respect, my lovely
1971 Cadillac Fleetwood 60 Special Brougham and I
are parting company. The impending move to AZ and
condo living there just do not provide for her.
Here's the dilemma: she has but 37K miles, has
never been out of the garage after Labor Day or
before Memorial Day, is in beautiful condition (#2,
I would guess). All original. I have not the
faintest idea of what to ask for her or how to
market her. Any suggestions? Thanks very much for
your assistance.
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Comments

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,041
    You might ask $5,995 and see what happens. I'd take any cash offer in that vicinity were I the owner, down to maybe $4,500 or so.

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  • nessie1nessie1 Posts: 2
    Thanks very much for the information. I'll take your advice. Maybe I'll get lucky, there will be no takers, and I'll just have to take her with me.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,041
    The cleaner you can make it, inside and out, the better the chances. Put all your effort into cosmetics.

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  • ls1v8ls1v8 Posts: 34
    God love 'em. 2 1/2 tons of rolling steel. I think I lost my vir...er, wallet, (yeah that's what it was) in my Dads 71 Caddy!

    Infact, it was so big, on a family vacation, I think my little brother got lost in there too. Took two days to find him. ;)
  • tbonekirtbonekir Posts: 1
    sorry guys a little off the subject, i just purchased a 1989 eldorado with 60000 miles it is in pristine condition and would like to knw what u think about it? any problems that are common, what to watch for suggestions on improving? Any feedback would be mutch appreciated!!
    -eldo'llac
  • corlt1corlt1 Posts: 29
    Make sure you go to the dealer and buy the radiator pellets for $6.00 and add them to the radiator as directed. The 4.1, 4.5 and 4.9 liter Cadillacs had a problem with the different expansion and contraction rates of the cast iron cylinder heads and the aluminum engine blocks. This caused a problem known as (cylinder head) "gasket walk", which left untreated causes the gasket to leak and blow. Cadillac found out early with the 4.1 liters to add nikelsil (sounds like nickle seal) to the porous water jackets so that won't be a problem.

    Mine used a lot of oil up to 67,000 miles and then after driving it hard, the rings finally seated and the oil consumption actually got better and it consistantly went 3,000 miles without using any oil.

    Watch the lower crankshaft pulley as it is only pressed onto the crankshaft. When oil leaks on it, it could become cocked on an angle, or even come loose.

    If you a low spongy brake pedal, it usually comes from a poor adjustment of the rear disc brake emergency cables. Rather then explain the fix, it's best to take it to the dealer, not a tire place or a gas station. Take my word on this.
    Good luck as this is a good quiet smooth riding car.
  • voyager18voyager18 Posts: 3
    Am considering buying a 1988 Brougham in excellent shape. It has 22K miles only. Had one owner. Dealer is asking $7,770. Can anyone make comments on the car, asking price, etc.? Thank you.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,041
    Nice ride for not a lot of money, but the price is way, way too high....about double actual market value.

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  • voyager18voyager18 Posts: 3
    Thanks for the reply. Drove the car today. It is actually an '87. Super shape in and out. Drove well but seemed to take a while to reach 6o miles/hr - you could not hear it "roar" or change gears as you do in other cars.Is this normal?

    Dealer came down to only $7,500 (we offered $5,500) but looks like they will come down a little more. + they offer 90 days (or 4000 miles) warranty What is a fair price? The online Kelley Blue Book does not go further down than '88 and market value with the options and mileage was about $4,300.However on Edmunds, the '87, taking into account the leather seats and power passenger seat plus 50% of value for low mileage, comes up to $6,000. Confusing...
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,041
    About $3,500 is normal market price, and you could add I suppose a 10-20% premium for exceptional condition or mileage. There's really no such thing as 50% markup for low mileage, except in the dealer's dreams..certainly $4,500 is all the money in the world for the car. Keep in mind that these cars behave as used cars, not collectibles, in that the older they get the cheaper they are...you hang tough at your offer and the dealer might get tired of looking at the car.

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  • tucsonjwttucsonjwt Posts: 283
    buying an old Cadillac to get a better riding vehicle. In Arizona, we don't have to get emissions checks on vehicles 1966 or older, so I am looking for a model year in the 1960 -1966 range.
    What model year/body style would you recommend? What should I watch out for when examining potential purchases of 1960s vintage Cadillacs?
    Thanks.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,041
    Hmmm...let me think about that one for a minute.....


    I guess I'd have to say the 1965 model...it's a redesign from the 1964 and much handsomer, and the cleanest of the 1965-69 types. Also a very decent performer, and well-built, too.

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  • speedshiftspeedshift Posts: 1,598
    I vaguely remember reading something about the '64 engines being troublesome. I think that was the first year for the 429. Also the first year for the 3-speed Turbo-Hydramatic, I think. An acquaintance had one for a brief time, before he ran over a fire hydrant with it, and it was a remarkably smooth, quiet car with plenty of power. I've always been partial to the '61s and '62s, since they look almost downsized compared to other Cads of that vintage.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 22,007
    I always thought the design was clean and crisp, and like the way the wheel cutout flows all the way to the bumper, kind of like a 1957-58 DeSoto or Chrysler. They look especially cool as hearses!!
    -Andre
  • is in my opinion the best styled & engineered car of that era. I own a '65 DeVille Convertible & it drives flawlessly. The styling is so distinctive & is what a Caddy should look like. I wish I was old enough to buy one when they were new. This body style has received many accolades from enthusiasts & has been compared to the '41 for it's elegant fresh style & full length egg crate grill, along with the vertically stacked headlights makes it a real standout. My father owned a few Cadillacs from the '50 & '60s the one I remember was his'64 sedan DeVille, a beautiful car in it's own right, but it does not compare to the '65. So if you can afford the gas, go for it! But..whatever you do don't buy a rustbucket any car can cost a mint to restore find one in good shape, as I did!
  • Want to sell 71 de Ville, looks great, runs good, has small Ex manifold leak. I would rather buy '94 -'96 Fleetwood than fix. It is dark blue with vinyl top, no rust, CA-TX car. Located in Ohio now, never driven on ice or salt.
  • rea98drea98d Posts: 982
    Personally, I like the 59 ElDorados better than any other model Caddilac. I'm partial to chrome, tail fins, and whitewalls.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,041
    It is a well-liked car, actually, but I think more as a Tribute to Excess than for any real admirable qualities. It's kind of worshipped for its complete outrageousness--the Elvis of collectible cars, if you will.

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  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 22,007
    ...in an outrageous way like Mr. Shiftright said. I certainly wouldn't thumb my nose at one if it showed up on my doorstep one night! Personally I like the '57's and the '61-62's the best. They're just cleaner and more elegant to me.

    After 1963, they started looking more and more conservative, but I've always admired the big RWD Caddies, right up until the bitter end.

    -Andre
  • Did anyone read up on the ultra luxury sedan, 1957-1960 Fleetwood Eldorado in last issue's Automobile magazine? They said that the cost of the car is somewhat higher that an average-priced upscale home. Now that car was ahead of its time. Imagine if we have such a Cadillac to this day. It would maybe be around from $250,000 to $350,000 today.

    Cadillac of yesterday was the most sought after automobile in history for a long time in the 40s, 50s, 60s, and 70s. I like the early 40s, '65-'70 Fleetwood 60 special, '68-'69 Fleetwood Eldorado, and 49 Coupe Deville, '65-'69 Sedan Devilles, '65-'71 Eldorado, and '76-'79 Seville. Every time I see an old Cadillac, I always catching myself staring at the car.

    Today's luxury cars all blend to one another, except the Deville and Eldorado currently, but never been the most sought after for a long time like Cadillac. Maybe Mercedes and BMW currently may be the most sought afters but just started since early in the 90s with Mercedes now with BMW but may not be for long. Now back to what I was saying, if you were not a car enthusiast back then, you can tell what a Cadillac looks like because they were very distinctive.

    Too bad that fuel shortage, bad leadership within GM, quality control issues and among other things missed up Cadillac in the 80s. I like just about all the eighties Cadillacs and thought they looked good too just like the earlier 90s models before the pre-Northstar Caddies.

    Personally I don't think the future (next-generation) Cadillacs will be the most sought after but will be very cool again. Lets face, the luxury automakers have been very fierce and competitive in the car market for several years now. Interesting times, huh folks.

    I own an '84 Cimarron which has dark blue interior and exterior. I don't drive it much now since I drive another car but it is a classic true enough.

    I am a huge Cadillac fan. I was not old enough to take interests in Cadillacs up until late 80s to early 90s.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 22,007
    That was those "compact" Caddies that was styled by Pinin Farina, right? I think their MSRP was about 13,000 at the time. In all fairness, though, I read somewhere that the average 1958 Impala convertible went out the door for about $4000, and my grandfather bought a top-line Ford Fairlane in 1957 for about $3500. I think the typical Lincoln, Imperial, or lesser Caddy would base price at around $5000 or so back then.

    Considering that Crown Vics and Impalas go for about $25-26K tops, I'd guess the modern equivalent of that Fleetwood from the late 50's would be about $100,000. What do Caddies top out at nowadays, around $50,000 or so? I doubt too many people would buy a modern Caddy at that price range. Then again, I think those old $13,000 Fleetwoods only sold about 300 units in '57 and again in '58, while the '59 model was even scarcer.

    -Andre
  • Hey guys, go to this website and it has a history of almost all Cadillacs and have links to other Cadillac sites too.


    http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Track/2582/cadillac/cadindex.html

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,041
    I don't think the Cadillac suspension and braking was ahead of its time, though. They were superficially interesting and well put together, but for "competence" they weren't much to drive...but if you wanted to go in a straight line and not steer or stop, they were hard to beat for top down luxury, I will admit. Technically, they were 1948 all the way to 1978. That's why the Cadillac name means so little now. It's a shame that a million dollar name was driven into the dirt by GM, really too bad. It was Cadillac, after all, that taught Mercedes that you could mass-produce a quality car.

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  • I agree with you on that Mr. Shiftright.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,041
    But the car is coming back, slowly, and getting more interesting. Cadillac may revive into a respected name in the future. Let's hope so. The USA doesn't have a prestige car anymore....where have all the Packards, Peerless and Pierce Arrows gone, or the Duesenbergs and Stutz. Used to be the world respected these names and knew them by heart. We still have recognition for Corvette and Viper and such, but alas, not in the luxury car field.

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  • tpkentpken Posts: 1,108
    Great to see this topic and recognize some other forum buddies here.

    One of my earliest recollections was standing on tiptoe, peering inside the tuturquois 1961 model 61 coupe parked in my grandfather's garage (his tenant's car). I eventually learned to drive on that car after my dad bought it in 1969. My heart still flutters to remember that beauty.

    I have owned 3 Cadillacs. First was a yellow 77 Coupe DeVille purchased in 1980 when I was 25 yrs old. I'd always wanted one and particularly like that style to this day. An absolutely gorgeous Firemist gold 82 Coupe DeVille (terrible V-6 engine) followed for only 6 months 2 sets of head gaskets and $5K hit - OUCH!!

    I bought a beautiful low mileage beige 72 Sedan DeVille in 1989 (green top and gold brocade - it was the 70's!!) to haul the babies around in - we had 3 car seats at that point and we all loved the 'Big Daddy Car' !! Unfortunately, garage space was short and the car long - it started rusting very soon and I traded it a few years later. What a wonderful car - that 475 sounded great.

    Those older Caddies, particularly 50s and 60s, had the most beautiful 'jewel' appearance in front - headlights and grills designed like jewelry - too bad over time they have lost that touch. New models don't excite me anymore and I hope that something changes to reignite that fire that once burned whenever I saw a Caddy - new or old - drive by.

    Best to all

    Ken
  • Does anyone on here know much about Lincoln's success back in the day like being somewhat sought after automobile? Were they looked upon as the elite like Cadillac? I never hear people talk about how Lincolns use to be back in the day. Were they inferior compared to Cadillac? Sound like few on here where in your teenage thru young adult years to remember all of this in the late 40s thru late 70s.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 22,007
    I don't think Lincoln was looked at with much respect after the very early 50's. For one thing, they had the dishonor of sharing bodies with Mercury on occasion. Remember, back then, Mercury was either a "junior" Lincoln or a "senior" Ford, depending on the year, and didn't really get its own body until 1957.

    Lincoln came out with a nice new style around that same time, but unfortunately, so did the Imperial. No matter what anybody says today, 1957 was Chrysler's year. That was the only year that Imperial beat out Lincoln, Plymouth reclaimed 3rd place, a position it hadn't seen in years, Dodge, DeSoto and Chrysler all sold well. Chrysler took an unprecedented 18% of the market.

    For 1958-60, Lincoln carried on with massive, heavily styled bodies. Chrysler in general got hit harder than most by the recession of that time, but Imperial still got by with 1957 styling.

    But suddenly it was 1961, and Lincoln came out with a gorgeous new compact (relatively) body style, while Imperial threw on gobs of chrome, a toilet seat spare cover in the trunk, and free-standing headlights. At this point, Imperial was basically out of the game. The nameplate lasted through 1975, but it never totally shook its Chrysler image. Most people didn't look at it as a step up.

    But on to Lincoln. Cadillac was viewed as the standard of the world back then. And except for Imperial's brief claim to fame in 1957, nobody even put a dent in Cadillac's image.

    Unfortunately, as the 60's wore on, Mercury again began taking Lincoln cues. This was especially evident into the 70's. And to me, this waters down Lincoln.

    Back then, Lincoln did top Cadillac in a few areas.
    The Mark series personal luxury coupes overtook the Eldorado by the mid-70's. When the Eldorado downsized for 1979, it made a comeback though.

    Lincoln tried to fight the Seville, with a gussied up Granada called the Versailles. Few people saw through the charade. Same with its replacement, the guzzied up Fairmont they used to disgrace the Continental name.

    But then, in the early 80's, Cadillac shot itself in the foot with stuff like the V-8-6-4, the Olds diesel, the Buick 4.1 V-6, the Caddy 4.1 aluminum melt-down V-8, the Cimarron.

    Lincoln transformed the Mark personal luxury line into something of a mature hotrod with the Mark VII, while Cadillac downsized the Eldorado/Seville to the point that they could be mistaken for Olds Calais', Buick Somerset Regals, and Pontiac Grand Ams.

    For 1985, Cadillac downsized the DeVille, and with much success. Still, it was enough ammunition for Lincoln to poke fun at it. Remember the commercial where the guy at the country club had the valet get his DeVille, but the valet pulled up in a 98? Lincoln and Cadillac shot at each other a few times with those commercials.

    Since then, the DeVille usually outsold the town car, but now, with the Lincoln LS and the Navigator, the unthinkable happened. Lincoln started to outsell Cadillac.

    To me, the biggest problem with old Lincolns is that they look too much like old Mercury's, and, to an extent, some Chryslers. Mopar styling in the 60's was dictated by some ex-Ford guys, so that explains the resemblance there.

    Cadillac, at least, was distinctive. Chevrolet tried to pay homage to it. Look at the 1958 Impala. Also, some of the big Chevys of the 70's had a Cadillac influence, but not nearly to the extent of Lincoln/Mercury.

    Just my opinions...not necessarily facts laid down in stone ;-)

    -Andre
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,041
    Sounds pretty good to me....although the '61 Lincoln Continental with the suicide doors is a favorite of mine and sought after by collectors. I think it is the only postwar Lincoln that seriusly competes with the Cadillac. Even the earlier Continentals (1956), while a unique and expesnive car, just doesn't get people going, even today. But a well-turned-out '61 4-door Continental, in white or black with red leather, that turns some heads and gets the checkbooks out.

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  • Thanks for your knowledge of the automobiles of yesterday. It is great to listen to educated individuals like yourself and others share each other's opinions. Seems like to me your opinions are more than true. That is a complement.

    So, let me ask you this while I am at it. What do you think about Cadillac's new direction they are going with in the near future with cars like the 2002 Escalade, EXT, CTS, Evoq and rear wheel drive and all while drive models with vertical tail lights and headlights with that traditional eggcrate grill with advance technology; will alot of people come back to Cadillac in your opinion? Do you think Cadillac will be far more distinctive than the competition? Do you think quality will greatly improve such as fit and finish and reliability issues? Thanks for your thoughts.
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