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But, with your predisposition to Toyota, My guess is that you will be less than satisfied with an american car. Even if only average mishaps occur, first impressions are hard to overcome. People get into a mindset and rarely change, especially when forgiveness is required. If a squeek develops in a toyota, the toyota fan forgives. If the toyota fan buys a ford and a squeek develops, well you know what happens. Just make sure you are on firm ground for leaving your place of comfort and be impartial should you choose the ford. Why not the RAV4? that would be less risky for you.
Im not trying to dwell into your psyche and you may not fit the mold, but what Im describing is well within human nature. We forgive our friends much quicker than strangers, especially strangers we initially think are bad.
"a much more practical alternative for someone who doesn't need the weight or the bulk of the Explorer"
Steve
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One reason I chose an Escape is that I anticipate being easily able to park it on busy Chicago city streets. I don't think I could manage as easily with a bigger vehicle. Though I live in a small town, I travel to Chicago enough so that I need an all-purpose vehicle up to wherever I happen to be going that day!
They anticipate being able to deliver my vehicle the first part of August, though they say oftentimes they deliver a week before that.
The escape gets better gas mileage, but isn't as good quality. I like the ride of the liberty and overall quality of the vehicle.
Does anyone have the spec on the 2002 escape packages. I know Shadow Gray is limited, no more wedgewood blue...what is the "true blue" like? How close is it to the wedgewood blue?
So many decisions, I am not sure which way I will go. Another test drive in both...maybe I should get one of each?! :-)
Anyways... True Blue is darker than the Wedgewood blue. It comes on Mustangs, so you can probably find one at the dealership with that color. I really liked the Wedgewood blue, and wish they had kept it, but the True Blue is pretty sharp looking.
For full details on all of the packages for 2002, check out:
http://www.downsford.com/order_guides/2002escape.pdf
I am disappointed about the limited colors with the escape. Wedgewood blue was fantastic. I will have to see what the true blue looks like. I like the steel blue and patriot blue on the liberty.
Also, pricing on the escape 2002 will be a factor as well.
but as with any other large decision its a matter of what you want and what's important to you.
if power & handling are what you seek go for the escape.
if you want more 4wd capability and the quality we spoke of - go for the liberty.
The Escape looks just right. It's clearly masculine in design. The styling is balanced with every element composed thoughtfully and elegantly: front-end, head lights, lower cladding, good profile, the entire rear-end design, the tail lights. It makes me think of all the best features of every good SUV ever made -- blended into a most effective small package.
The Liberty, on the other hand, looks downright ugly. IMHO. Its round headlights are definitely NOT cute. They strain the imagination trying to carry cues from an earlier Jeep model. It's a half-breed at best. The wheelwell flares are overdone. The side profile is awkward, rear-heavy and abominable. It has no styling element tying the front to the back to the sides -- as if each portion was concocted by a separate little committee, and the resulting glob of a compromise rushed into production at the eleventh hour. I'm so sorry to see it as an actual vehicle instead of at the bottom of a designer's trash bin.
IMHO, there's absolutely no comparison between the two. Except in price? -- but that would say a lot about a buyer's taste (or lack thereof). The Escape is a handsome all-American athlete. The Liberty is Frankenstein's face-smashed stumbling weakling suffering from a physical disease.
If you want to know what I got on it..scroll up a few messages and you will see.
As for the 2002 True Blue, it is more Glossy than the Med. Wedgewood. It is more of an Electric blue in color. Dodge have almost the same color blue on their Dakota's and Ram's.
Odie
Reliability is important, of course. *Reputation* for reliability is also important. Ford is obviously not on par with Toyota, Honda and Mercedes. But they are not far off! Jeep is notoriously further behind. See any Consumer Reports issue on cars and trucks.
So what gives?
If you're in the market for a new vehicle, then just get the latest production of the model you like WHEN YOU NEED IT MOST! Or wait a few months if you can -- if you think there are some quirks still to be worked out in the production of the model you want.
My Escape was assembled in March 2001. No rattles, no squeals, no odors, no noises, nothing wrong about it. Just as tight as anything. Knock on wood. It's going on 3000 miles. I think it's a good idea to buy one with very very low miles on it, like under 10 on the odo. There may be other signs. And also from a dealer who stores them indoors, if possible.
Besides that, it's just natural chance that some new cars will rattle more than others. Some will develop a weak water pump after 50k or something. Some will run strong for over 200k miles.
All in all, Ford is not that bad.
Thanks
I'd like to ask you which are the reasons to choose ford escape over hyundai Santa Fe??
I have made several comparisons betwen those two suvs.
And I find Santa Fe more comfortable with better quality materials inside.
I also checked chrash test results for both suvs and was surprised to see SF on the top with best safety and on the other hand , escape was rated so poorly.
But escape has more powerful engine 200hp against 185 hp in SF.
So , what do u. suggest? which are the pros/cons for escape/santa fe??
1)Frontal Crash-Driver-Excellent
2)Frontal Crash-Passenger-Good
3)Side Crash-Driver-Excellent
4)Side Crash-Passenger-Excellent
My choice of buying a 2002 Escape when they become available was because of these safety results. I don't know right off hand how the Santa Fe crash tests results compare to this, but I do know that by mosts car buyers criteria the results I listed on these particular crash tests would be considered a pretty safe vehicle to purchase.
Not sure but I think I checked out the Santa Fe and it was considerably higher priced than the Escape. I also went thru the process of elimination looking for a small size SUV and the ones I looked at were either too high priced, had too short a wheelbase(under 100"), tested poorly in the crash tests, or all of the above. Test drove all the ones I thought fit close to my standards on what SUV to purchase and the Escape had many more check marks on the "Positive" side of my Ledger than on the "Negative" side.
I will let you all know what comes of this.
Odie
Odie
problem that happens maybe, once every 2-3 weeks. Its a 4x4, 6cyl. made April 2, 2001, in Kansas. The service mechanic put the truck onto the computer and
it checked out fine. The mechanic took it home, no acceleration problem.
I again explained that it happens randomly. They said they couldn't fix something that
they couldn't detect and asked me to
come pick it up, unfixed. I returned to the dealer armed with some emails from an Escape
owner's site, featuring the same problem. They read the emails and called the Ford Hotline.
Yes, there is a problem with some Escapes. They said reprogram the truck's computer with
a newer program, this sometimes works (sometimes). Upon putting the truck onto their
computer, they found the new program was already installed on this vehicle. Obviously,
the new program has not solved the problem.
So here I sit with a beautiful little SUV, with 1340 miles on it, and a potential serious accident waiting to happen (I almost hit a tree when it flew backwards, and my husband was in a parking
lot when it flew forward just missing another car). Please, if anyone has this problem, post it &
Call your dealer to try to get it fixed. We need to get on the record about this. I also
filed this with the NHTSA . This car should be recalled.
I am going back to the dealer, and demand a factory rep.
I love the look outside of these vehicles and they look like the right size for me... However, what knocked them off my list was the interior. I didn't even DRIVE the thing once I sat inside. I realize this is my taste and to each his own but the interior screams "cheap plastic". Door handles, etc. Then when I saw the column shifter, that was it. I just don't like the column shifters PERIOD but that, coupled with the cheap appearing interior/dash did it in. The Explorer interior was much nicer and even the Hyundai looked richer/better executed in comparison. As for the Liberty, the exterior looks fine to me, really, and the interior is GORGEOUS. It looks like a $40,000 vehicle in there and the materials have that rich german look/feel that screams quality. I think ford needs to rework the interior (design and materials) and move the shifter to the floor. Just my 2cents
My approach in choosing the Escape must be the POLAR OPPOSITE of yours!
I had sold my Honda Accord due to its awkward clutch engagement and was shopping for a 4x4 stick shift truck like a Ford Ranger, Mazda B-series, Toyota Tacoma, Nissan Frontier. My rental was a little SUV called the Ford Escape. After each and every test-drive at the dealership (I tried about seven different trucks), I drove home pleasantly surprised by how much better the Escape feels!
I lived and worked with the rental Escape for a whole week, taking care of normal business as well as a full weekend of off-roading. The Escape proved to provide enough of the cargo space that I needed. I was impressed enough to decide on a SUV instead of a truck.
So I proceeded to test-drive small SUVs. The Honda CRV, Toyota RAV4 and Kia Sportage all had weak little engines. The RAV4 was also much more expensive, and we all know the maniacal hyenas that Toyota salesmen are. The Nissan Xterra was too massive and handled like a truck. It rolled nauseously around the same twisties where the Escape danced like an stout linebacker. My rental had better steering, tighter handling, better manueverability, and was generally more "tossable" at higher speeds. It had more power, rode more solidly, and was generally the superior road vehicle compared to those SUVs. All without the awkwardness of an external spare tire. Horror stories about Jeep reliability kept me away from the Grand Cherokee. Similar for the Isuzu Rodeo.
So my compromises were:
1) getting an automatic transmission -- there's an ABSENCE of good 5-spd SUVs
2) the awkward Escape shifter -- it was the ONLY blemish on the entire package
I figured that for such a perfect little SUV, I would gladly get used to its shifter.
The bonus goodies were finding the perfect color/options I wanted (including leather) and discovering that a new vehicle is much tighter and more solid than a rental!
Now I feel very safe and proud driving my Ford Escape -- not because it's a larger vehicle, but because it has better *control* and *handling* for me to AVOID dangerous situations. And all while I ENJOY DRIVING IT everywhere I go.
The base price for this model was $22,774 invoice, retail $24,450. I ordered the step bars at $248 invoice, $275 retail. With the charges for gas $20.50, delivery $540 and FDAF $210. Total invoice price was $23,792.50. I paid $23,466. Retail price was $25265.
Interesting that I priced out a 2001 XLT 4x4 with all of the options that you get as a 2002 and the 2002 was actually cheaper in the long run!
Am having problems finding any information on city gas mileage.
I will be driving about 80%city/ 20% why.
I have seen one posting on this site of 18.4 mpg city.
Are any of you V6 drivers doing better than this on city mileage?
Let's poll the other readers who have purchased the 2002 and see what they paid or have gotten for numbers.
I agree with you about the pricing. I've bought a lot of New Cars and when they come out with a Model with a lot of standard equipment they are usually cheaper than taking a previously base Model and adding the same options. I am going to use the X-Plan to either buy or lease. We haven't decided that part yet.
As soon as we get the prices we are going to place the order and then put her 1995 Pontiac Gran Prix GT up for sale.
It will be a snap to sell around here as there just aren't very many. We bought it brand new and it is low mileage and mint condition. Got all the options, leather,moonroof, headsup display etc. The only option we didn't get was the engine heater. In other words it's loaded. I priced it out on Edmunds and I'll use that as a starter. Around here I can probably add a few hundred more bucks.
Again thanks for the information.
SUBARU FORESTER
We all know that Subaru knows how to build a solid durable car and the Forester is no exception. I liked the storage room it has in the back. Butno matter what I did I found it kind of plain looking, even boring. Really a car that they are promoting as an SUV mini-ute. Decided to keep looking.
HYUNDAI SANTA FE
Nice entry level from Hyundai. Looks good and lots of cargo room.But I read some comments about it being kind of lethargic. And anyways, I was kind of concerned with HYundai's ability to build a quality SUV. I don't think I could bring myself te spend the $17,000 - $18,000 on one when I can get a CRV, with Honda quality and resale value built in Japan for the same or a little more.
FORD ESCAPE/MAZDA TRIBUTE
These are real nice. I prefer the Mazda. Impressive room in the back, 200hp engine. Great handing. Don't like the shifter on the steering column. Also what's with all the recalls? And then I read ALOT of negative comments and horror stories here and at epinions from new owners. Stuff like, the oil draining out of the engine, rattles and other problems. Too bad Ford always has to mess up in production an otherwise well designed car. Well....on to the next lot.
HONDA CRV
Now this cars smells quality! Build in Japan, probably by factory workers in white lab coats and with clip boards. Surprising room in the back. But the four-cylinder engine seems like a rip off when you compare it to the Tribute. True you get better gas mileage and all, but power IS a factor. And it was just TOO family for me what with the little table in the middle that folds up so you can jump to the back seat. And the picnic table was just too much. I can just see the whole family just headed to the park for a picnic. Yeachhh!! But, hey I don't have to use it. This was one of my top 3 picks. But one problem, I spent more that 2 WEEKS looking at every Honda CRV that rolled by. Not one was being driven by a male. All of them had women at the wheel! I guess it must be the picnic table.
JEEP LIBERTY
Looks like a nice vehicle. Good weight to it means it is well built. But just coming off the assembly line when I was ready to buy. I was concerned about 1st-year bugs that still might need to be worked out.
Well the punchline is that I ended up getting a 2001 Trooper S. With the 0% 60 mos. financing being offered by Isuzu My price of under $25,000 with 0% 60 month Isuzu financing of the vehicle works out to be about the same as the Forester, Tribute, Santa Fe or Jeep Liberty, and you still have to add on the interest you will have to pay if you are financing and of these. I could see no reason to get any of these mini-utes over the Trooper, a luxury SUV that can do battle with Expeditions, Tahoes, 4-Runners, Landrovers, Monteros and Landcruisers, not too mention the mid-size Explorer, Blazer and Durango. Isuzu has been building trucks and SUV's for many years. And the base Trooper comes loaded with full frame construction, 215hp 24-valve V6, rear-wheel drive, power windows, power door locks, power heated mirrors, stereo, alloy wheels, even remote keyless entry. All standard! The Trooper had over 90 cu. ft of cargo. So you don't usually have to even fold the seats for cargo. And when you do need to fold them down the rear seats in the Trooper are the easiest and best to fold down of any SUV. With most of the SUV's out there, you have to remove the headrests and find some place to stuff them. Then you have to fold up the bottom of the seat (this was really a pain in the Tribute/Escape with the metal bar device it has in the back. I think this was a kind of cheap mechanism to install. Like they could not afford hinges. So they put the cheap unwieldy bar instead)Anyways, try out folding up the rear seats on the Trooper. They fold forward with one hand. The is usually more than enough space. But if not, they tumble forward again. The seats fold on stron sturdy hinges with springs. The Trooper is built in Japan and it shows. The quality of the build is awesome! You look at this vehicle turn the knobs on the AC. look under the hood, and listen to that solid air tight sound the doors make when shut, and you can tell it will run well over 100,000 miles....And it does. Just read some of the reports by owners about their Troopers at epinions.com. They typically go over 150,000 miles. Trooper owners love their vehicles!
Yeah, Consumer Reports said that the Trooper can roll over easier that other SUV's. And no doubt that ANY of these mini-utes handle much better. Of course they do. They are basically cars. But the SUV craze started with real trucks being converted to SUVs. The pioneers were the Jeep Cherokee, the Isuzu Trooper, The Mitsubishi Montero, the 4-Runner, the Land Cruiser and Land Rover. And of course these are the most truck-like of all the SUV's. They WERE the first SUV's. And coincidentally, they are all probably more likely to roll over that the new car-like SUV's. No doubt. But trucks ARE more likely to roll that cars. They are trucks! It makes total sense. The criticism of truck-like SUV's like the Trooper and Montero by Consumer Reports is silly. In the real world, if I were in an accident, I'd rather be in a Trooper (or for that matter, any full size frame-body SUV)than any of the mini-utes.
Yeap.....one day I was in a shopping center parking lot. And I was lucky to find a Honda CRV a Mazda Tribute and an Isuzu Trooper that happened to be parked almost next to each other. I looked at the 3 vehicles and realized that they all were going to cost about the same.....Hmmmm..... And really, there was no comparison. The CRV and the Tribute looked like toys compared to the Trooper. One hell of a vehicle for the money! In my opinion, it is a steal! You guys out here looking at the mini-utes. Do yourselves a favor and look at the Trooper up against your favorite mini-utes.
My wife and I really love the lib, however, like most people we would never go off roading to justify the poor milage and the heavy duty truck. It is by far IMHO the best looking suv out there and drives nice too. The X isn't quite as nice except they are dealling on those to incent your purchase more than jeep is. so money almost took us to nissan over jeep.
We also went in to ford for the escape. It is much faster and quicker than the previous two and much MUCH better on the milage. That is for good reason. It is a Car !!!!!!! You can't be serious about the purchase of a suv and make the choice between the escape and the lib. they are not in the same league by any stretch. In fact IMHO if you are buying or thinking of the later you are only buying for the four wheel drive.
That is what we realized we were doing. Then we started looking at the subaru. It has better bang for the buck, I think. AWD and much cheaper than the escape. For the money...if you aren't looking for an off road vehicle and need the AWD of one you are probably not in need of a lib or a X for that matter.
Much like we realized when we crossed the lib off our list and eventually reserved an 02 forrester... we still want a liberty, but, like someone else already said, Why put up with the suv if you don't need to. I will get car insurance not suv and 22+ gpm. not to mention almost the same cargo space and the same 150# roof rack.
In closing the town hall and its participants with debates and info have been the best thing to car buying ever.
TO EACH THEIR OWN
thanks
david
Odie
to see more go here ;
Http://members.aol.com/losttreasures26
Odie
I should be getting mine by the end of this month/first week in August. Dark Highland Green.
Is that the color blue that they discontinued in the 2002?
I've looked, read and driven almost all of the SUV'S mentioned above by "tntmyth". I agree with some of his assessments, but to use a vehicles weight as a criteria for "better built" I ain't buying that one. If heavier were better we'd all be driving 3 ton cars and 4 ton trucks.
Keep us posted on your experiences with your Escape.
As I mentioned in a previous post I am still waiting to see a price list for the 2002 Models of the Escape. And then it's just a matter of ordering the Premium + maybe 1 or 2 of the 3 available options. Of course I'll have to be sure the dealer I am working with now will sell it to me with the X-Plan. He said they would, but I'm not one to believe it until I see it and sign it.
We have several Ford Dealers around here so I won't have a problem finding one that will go with the X-Plan assuming it is still available on the 2002's.
I'm getting anxious after seeing your pics.
Also I now feel like a complete doofus. I was at Wal-mart last night and my key would not turn. Knowing me after reading all the posts in the problems section I freaked. I thought that my key had been un-programmed. Turns out my stearing wheel was just locked. I then just looked in the rear view mirror and put a thumb and finger on my forehead to look like a " L ". and too make matters worse.... my wife was more parranoid than I was. I can now just laugh about it. LOL
.... Also I disagree with one thing Tntmyth had said ". But the SUV craze started with real trucks being converted to SUVs. The pioneers were the Jeep Cherokee, the Isuzu Trooper, The Mitsubishi Montero, the 4-Runner, the Land Cruiser and Land Rover. " If I remeber correctly the Wrangler body has been around since 1946 when it was the Jeep Willeys. Also the Dodge Ram Charger / Chevy K-series and Ford Bronco where around long before all but the LR and LC.
One other thing.... I'm probally the first to say this but (don't get me wrong I love my new littel truck)is it me or does the Escape have about the same room as the old Bronco II.
Odie
That post regarding SUVs being started with a truck is so ludicrous! He may be true to the fact, but that alone makes no sense in *choosing* to buy an SUV. It's like electing George W because his dad was president! Phooey!
If that neanderthal takes a second to pull his head out of the sand, he'll realize that his statement is precisely the reason why new SUVs are designed more like cars -- to IMPROVE them over those ancient trucks! Newer SUVs have independent rear suspensions for better ride. They have lighter, stiffer unibody construction so they handle better than separate body-on-fullframe. They have rack-and-pinion steering instead of recirculating ball -- so they drive better on the road. They are lighter to save fuel and improve urban performance.
Nothing wrong with his Trooper, however. It will simply waste more fuel, ride rougher, roll over and crash easier, get passed quicker by Escapes, take up more parking space, and generally drive like a truck. Might as well get a 4x4 truck!!
I will be ordering a car with this equipment as soon as I get a look at the color options swatches or something. I am considering the Satin Silver(?) or probably the White. I like the light color cars as they are cooler in the heat and also do not show not being clean quite so easily.
1)XLT 2WD Premium Package
2)Side Bar Option
3)Side Air Bag Option
MSRP= $24,165.00
Invoice= $22,463.50
I can buy it at invoice but I am trying to find out if the company I retired from in 1991(Then the AT&T Company/Went to Lucent Technologies/Now is called Avaya Company)has a PIN number with Ford Motor. If not I will join the EAA so I can buy with the X-Plan. My calculations show that I can probably get the car with the X-Plan for around= $22,240.
From some of the figures I have seen from other X-Plan orders it looks like you pay about 92.87% of the MSRP for the car.
Anyway as soon as I get the above finished I will be ordering this Escape XLT. Can't wait!!
The Escape is the same as listed in my previous Post but using the X-Plan Pricing.
My price without X-Plan: $22,463.50
My price with the X-Plan: $22,194.12
A few hundred bucks was worth the time I spent running down my PIN Number.
This 2002 came out lower priced(with the X-Plan)than a 2001 equipped the same way except that the 2002 has the 6 cd/changer that was not standard in the 2001. More car less price how can a guy beat that?
Ordered the new Satin Silver Metallic. Looked thru the Exterior Color Book at the dealer and this color really looked sweet.
Went with the 2WD mainly because I plan no Off-Road driving and after the winter we had last year here in Nebraska we got by with only a front wheel drive Pontiac Gran Prix. I drove both the 4x2 and the 4x4 and the 4x4 road much stiffer and much more road noise(drive train probably)than the 2x4. I thought maybe it was just the 2 particular Escapes I drove so I went back the next day and drove to different ones and the result was the same. The 4x4 had a stiffer ride and the same with the road noise.
Don't think they changed anything as far as the door locks. Did you also noticed that when you have your door locked you don't have to push anything to unlock it. Just pull on the handle and it opens. Never had a car that did that. Usually have to pull something up or down or a switch to unlock them.
Ford's reason behind this in case of a child or any emergency of some kind with someone being trapped inside the car you don't have to find anything but the door handle to unlock it. This is akin to their "In Truck" feature that illuminates should someone become locked in the trunk of a Ford Car.
Dealer said to look at 4-6 week delivery time. We'll just have to wait and see on that one.
Got the 2002 cheaper than the same dealer could sell me the 2001(with the X-Plan), and also got the 6 disc cd player to boot. I think Ford did pretty well with the prices.