You can purchase 303 from their web site. They have a order form to print out and mail in with check or money order. This is great stuff since I detail cars I have tried everything under the sun from Mothers to Meguires and the finish that is left by 303 on rubber or vinyl is supper. Not greasy feeling or greasy looking. Not a glossy shine but a soft low gloss. I started using it on my tonneau cover and now I use it on anything thats vinyl or rubber. It softens and protects and has no silicon. On tires it leaves them like they were brand new and for trim and dashboards makes them look great.
Meguiar's now carries wipes. Protectant, All purpose, leather and shop. It's not on their web site yet, but is in their mail order catalogue. Cost is $5.99 for 25 sold under the Gold Class line.
Hi,I'm a new Forester owner(1 wk) and have read many posts here about the different wax and cleaning styles. So here is my question. I live in AZ and my Forester had been sprayed with this automate stuff(What s SCAM!) at the dealer. Does anybody know what this stuff is and can I just give it a good wash and apply Nufinish or a Klasse product right over the top of it? Or should I try washing with Dawn to try to remove some of this stuff first? All opinions accepted. TIA,Tony
Self Serving of course, but Here's the description from one of the sites.
303 Protectant protects any color plastic, rubber, vinyl, fiberglass or sailcloth from the damaging effects of ultraviolet rays. 303 Protectant works great on boats, penetrating the colored gelcoat to restore a like-new finish. Protects new finishes from oxidation caused by UVS exposure. Excellent on RV's, convertible and vinyl tops, rubber bumpers, dashboards and woven polyester.
Surfaces treated with 303 protectant repel dirt, dust, oils, and all oil based stains! Safe for rubber, plastic, clear and solid color vinyl, glass and paint.
I cant stop cleaning my outback .Im really scaring myself . lol I found this great product for the tires . Its from turtle wax and its great . You actually wax the tires let it dry then wipe it off .Very easy and it looks great . Even cleans the raised letters . Do I qualify for ocd cllub lol .
Washing the 2001 OB VDC last weekend, we found a 20" scratch on the hood running front-to-back that looks very much like vandalism. It's about 8-10" from the passenger-side edge of the hood. Thursday night, my wife came out from work to find two paintball splats on the driver's side, which washed off w/o problem. I suspect it was done at the same time.
About 2" of the scratch broke through the clear coat, but not the color. The rest did not break through the clear coat. What do we do now??? What will happen if we don't get it repaired and just use touch-up paint on the deepest part of the scratch? The auto body shops are saying it will probably require a complete repaint of the front end!! $7-800!!
Theo- Grrrr!!!! I'd be so mad if I were you! Let's hope the punk gets what's coming to him.
Re your options... AFIK the two you mention are pretty much it. There's the costly option of repainting the front end vs the cheap one of touching up the deepest scratches and buffing out the rest. The obvious down side of going the touch-up paint route is that it will still be apparent what happened. I've got Scottish blood (read: cheap) so I'd probably go with the touch-up paint but someone suffering from a sever case of OCD might not be able to stand constantly seeing the imperfection on their hood (then again, something like this could cure a bad case of OCD). Regardless, let us know which route you take and you have my sincere condolences.
Some years ago I received a pair of deep scratched in my hood in a Home Depot parking lot. Looked like someone used my car as a shelf while loading theirs, and dragged something across it. Damn near killed me!! I finally went the touchup route. Carefully and in layer with buffing in between to keep the paint in the groove and not on top of the clearcoat. It never looked like new, but I learned to live with it.
Then a year later I hit a deer. Big time damage. It put the scratch into perspective. Ended up with most of the front clip (hood, grill, bumper, fenders) replaced. Presto, no more scratches! Funny how life takes care of these things.
No negative humor intended - I do feel your pain.....
First off, I feel your pain! I winced when I read your story - my wife called me wierd and left the room!
I've heard dealers have people that come in and "touch up" their used cars when they take them in on trade or buy at the auction. Apparantly there is a process where these guys mix the exact color and then "inject" paint into the scratch with a syringe. If you got on good with the dealer when you bought it, they might get this done for you at their cost, or give you the guy's number.
Regardless of method, ask the used car manager how he would fix this if he got the car on trade. I'm sure he would neither paint the whole hood or use the touch up paint method....
If all else fails, just keep an eye out for a deer!
Try a very thin layer of touch up paint, applied with a tooth pick. Maybe even use paint thinner to thin it down. Touch the area and let it soak up the paint. Kind of like the syringe suggestion. Though it's hard to do that in a line.
I know how you feel I only had my car for a week when somebody hit me in a parking lot . 2" scuff mark on lower driver side rear door down to plastic on the cladding .And what really hurt me was a deep scratchs on the rear alum rim arrgghh! The only way to touch it up is like juice said with a toothpick . It will probable take a couple applications to fill in the scratch . Sorry again man I feel for ya . Mike k
Well I looked at it again last night. It actually is closer to the edge of the hood and about half of it penetrated the clearcoat. :-( There's an auto paint supply store here in town. They have clearcoat touchup for less than $4 that is in a similar container to regular touchup. They said it should last for several years. :-)
Thanks Frank, Steve, Mike, Pete, and Juice for the ideas and sympathy! I think I will try to use a hypodermic syringe to apply diluted touchup after washing that area with Dawn. What should I use to buff it after it dries and how long should I let it dry before buffing? I have a sanding disk for drills with a buffing sleeve that goes over it. Do I dare let that touch our car? Thanks again, Theo
I feel your pain. With the lack for a better term -- that just sucks.
I agree with all the advice you've been given. Luckily, it seems like most of the damage was to the clearcoat so I think it'll turn out pretty good.
Let the clearcoat dry for at least 24hrs before touching it. DON'T go near it with the sanding disk -- that's way too abrasive.
The rule of thumb is to try and use the least abrasive method first. If that doesn't work move it up a notch.
If you're lucky, the clearcoat might dry relatively flat and you won't have to do anything to it. If that doesn't satisfy you, then try some sanding and polish. Get the finest grit sandpaper and polish you can find at an auto store (3M has good stuff). Wet down the area with some car wash detergent and water the gently go over the bumpy area. Sometimes it helps to put a little masking tape on both sides of the filled scratch so you minimize the abrasion to your good paint. Finally, follow up with the polish -- it'll completely remove the vey fine scratches left by the sand paper.
I do feel your pain.you have three options, there are mobile units that specialise in paint chips and scratchs, I have used them for chips and the results although not perfect were actually quite good.
Next you can try to do it yourself and to do it properly is time consuming, you will have to build the scratch up proud slightly of the existing paint, over a period of about a week you have to allow a couple of days to let each application really cure.
If you do not do this the next application will soften the first,after letting the whole lot cure for about a week, carefully sand it down level with the old paint using. 1500. or 1600. wet dry paper, after you level it use Brasso, (yes thats the stuff for polishing brass)to bring the gloss up, follow this with scratchout or some similar product, then wax.
If you follow these steps and do not rush it will not be perfect but it will be very good.
Cheers Pat. Ps. the third option is to repaint the hood, and if you go this route shop around $800 is way too much about half that should be about right,
Theo, seriously, I hope you didn't take the deer story the wrong way. Deer outnumber humans here in Dutchess Cty, NY, & combine that with miles of twisty back roads, it spells trouble. I have hit two in the past 7 years, most of the people I work with have nailed at least one. My insurance agent said it is probably the #1 claim item he handles.
Anyhow, I had to stop by the body shop that may be doing work on my uncles (estate sale) Mercedes, when I saw a scarry sight. There sat an '02 OBW from the same dealership I purchased from. Temp sticker in the window was dated November 02. Had 300 miles on the clock. The side windows were blown in, C pillar and door frame crushed, roof bent down by the damaged pillar, but almost no damage below the belt line. Yes, a tall deer came out of the trees and hit the side of the moving car at full gallop!
Hi there. I was wondering what folks know about the coin-op car washes? Someone just told me the water is recycled and can be damaging to car surface. Argh. Since I'm an apt. dweller and I want to avoid automatic car washes, I thought coin-op the way to go. I just use the rinse cycle and wash by hand.
Also, can anyone recommend a detailer located in Bergen county NJ?
I use one myself because of apt dweller also . I only use there water , i bring my own soap an wash cloth . It really p&*^%%* the owners off because Im there about 30 minutes and only use there water twice for a total of 4 dollars . Some places do recycle water ,mine doesn't . You should be able to ask them .
Waxed our OB today with Zymol. This is the 2nd application this year (first was early summer).
I applied one coat, buffed, applied another light coat, buffed, and followed with a lightly damp buff rag to *set* the shine (as the bottle says). I think it at least gets the wax dust off!
Didn't wax the wheels yet, will try to tomorrow. My wife's Saturn had a couple of bulbs out. Replaced a front turn signal lamp and checked into why her backup lights don't work. Both bulbs were good, fuse is fine. Not sure what else to check - could it be in the shifter? Guess I gotta find me a Chilton's book for it.
I also have started using the coin-op wash near our house as it gets colder out. I spray wash it (costs $1.50), use my own sponge to clean it, and then rinse (costs another $1.50). The also claim that it's fresh water. At least it's warm water - keeps your hands warm!
Just wondering. Y'all all went to the extent of removing the wheels, cleaned it, then waxed it... How come not put a layer (or 3) of clear coat? Wouldn't it make waxing the backside more satisfying the next time y'all wax it? You know. See the gloss, shine,... :-D
I did put 2 coats of Meguiars Gold class on both sides of the wheels. I didn't want to use Zymol on the wheels since it was a cleaner wax (and I figured the Meguiars would last a bit longer with what the wheels are subject to in the winter).
I was expecting the insides to be coated with brake dust and all, but was surprised that they were relatively clean. Whenever I clean the wheels, I spray my wheel cleaner (Formula 2001 foaming wheel cleaner) not just on the outside of the wheel, but I also aim through the slots so it gets inside. Guess that helped keep them clean at least.
I had to remove the wheels anyway for a tire rotation, so it really didn't matter to me. I can add a hydraulic jack and jack stands to my christmas list this year. honest santa, I've been good.
Pretty soon new laws will force all car-washes to recycle the water. I'm sure they use a particle filter, but I wonder is some of the detergents make their way through.
Brian: some times the fuse is blown but you can't tell with a naked eye. Try changing the fuse.
I rotated the tires on all 3 cars recently, and it's nice to even handle a clean, waxed wheel. My wife's wheels were filthy, it's embarassing compared to mine, which you could cook on.
Now I understand about the waxed wheels. It's not OCD at all. You just want to be able to prepare turbot and rally bread on them while you have Sandy on the beach. Very clever!
This is something I want to do when I next wax the car, but I have a question: I seem to recall being told that wheels/tires need to be rebalanced each time they are removed from the car, ie tire change.
Is this true? It would make checking the brakes a pain in the neck, so I doubt it, but want to check before I do it.
Well, you don't have to. Some times shops will offer free rotation/balance for life when you buy tires there, and in that case I would do it, sure, it's free! But unless you feel your tires are off balance or have gone 30k miles or more, I wouldn't bother.
Thanks, Juice- when I got the RE950s I bought lifetime alignment and balancing, rotation is already free. By the second time for each, it pays for itself, and it's nationwide at any Firestone, so I thought it was a good deel. When I detail my OB, I'll know to do the wheels!
I just put on new winter tires and alloys on my 00 Odyssey. The OEM Honda/Enkei wheels that I took off are coarsely machined on the inside and picked up a lot of brake dust and other particles. What's the best way to clean them? I tried some Eagle Mag Wheel cleaner which is strong since it burned my hand and appears to make the bare aluminum white. I then tried 3M Cleaner/Wax but it didn't do much but remove some surface oxidation. On clearcoat and painted surfaces of wheels, I normally coat with AutoFOM first and a top coat of Meguiars #26.
By the way, does anyone know why Blue Coral AutoFOM was taken off the market? I swear by this stuff and horded every can I saw at the Odd-Lot stores last year in NYC.
Before I waxed the GT's Subaru/BBS wheels, I sprayed TurtleWax Formula 2001 on the inside and outside and wiped with a sheepskin mit (dedicated to wheels). A GT's wheel inside is smooth, painted light gray. The wheels didn't seem to be discolored by the Formula 2001.
Coarse on the inside? So were the wheels on our 626. We just had axle grease spill all over them (it was ugly), and I had to clean it up. I actually used WD40 spray, then wiped it up with a paper towel.
The wheels were so filthy that I couldn't get them totally clean, but I did manage to get the thick layer of grease off.
I think if you wax them right away and maintain them, you're good. But my wife's car is 6 years old and had never been cleaned, so it's kind of hopeless.
Here's a question. If you do start to see "crackling" (for lack of a better term) of the clearcoat on your wheels, is there anything that can save them? Short of having them re-clearcoated, that is. The Subaru is fine, it's the Trooper (FHI product, for those concerned about being on topic) that needs some TLC.
Hmm, that's a tough one. If you clean with a solvent you'll probably strip off what's left of the clear coat. It might look better than peeling, though.
Friday we went and cut down a xmas tree. We think Brooke loved it, but she was sleeping most of the time in her backpack carrier.
Anyway, I transported the tree on the roof of our OB utilizing bungees (and some rope after the bungees stretched a bit after getting wet from some rain, thus allowing the tree to almost fall off). Got home, removed the tree from the roof, got out the hose and rinsed our OB. Mind you it was after 9pm by that time.
The neighbors don't think I'm nuts, they know I'm nuts!
Well, my Forester arrived at the dealership last night and I am a proud new owner!! :-)
One of the offerings was a dealer installed teflon coating fot the outside and a treatment for the fabric interior. Both also included limited warranties (manufacturer, I believe). The teflon is supposed to help with the acid rain, bird droppings, etc... problems we have around here. (Northern Virginia)
The offered price was $595 for both exterior and interior treatment, and $495 for the exterior alone.
Does anyone know what it is they are offering me, and is there any merit to it?
Dave- join the OCD club and put on a good coat of wax routinely and it'll do just as great for less. And, don't forget to wax the back of the wheels. :-D
Hehe... recall an inter-departmental meeting I had a few years ago; 4 of 8 attendees including myself were Davids. The meeting was quite off-the-wall and the minutes came out just that. Which David said what? The minutes-taker left out our last name [maybe he got tired of figuring which David].
Back on topic - any recommendation for leather cleaning/maintenance? Tried Armor-all but my fanny won't stay put.
I may just have you beaten in the name game. I once did a community TV panel show and three of the four panel members had the first name of Ross! Care to calculate the odds on that?
Comments
I have a member in another club asking if the 303 protectant can be purchased through retail, or is it from a professional only?
avalanchemike "Avalanche Owners: Care & Maintenance" Oct 28, 2001 12:25pm
I'm sure he would appreciate any information you can offer.
Thanks!
KarenS
Host
Owner's Clubs
http//www.properautocare.com
I also use it on leather. Good stuff.
Mike
Protectant, All purpose, leather and shop. It's not on their web site yet, but is in their mail order catalogue. Cost is $5.99 for 25 sold under the Gold Class line.
Dennis
Last Saturday I put 303 on my daughter-in-laws dash. It produced a nice finish without the blinding shine.
I have found it on the Internet and was thinking of purchasing it online before I found my local source.
Here are a some other sites.
http://www.bmwz3.net/seriousz3/303.html
http://www.autogeek.net/303aerprot.html
Self Serving of course, but Here's the description from one of the sites.
303 Protectant protects any color plastic, rubber, vinyl, fiberglass or sailcloth from the damaging effects of ultraviolet rays. 303 Protectant works great on boats, penetrating the colored gelcoat to restore a like-new finish. Protects new finishes from oxidation caused by UVS exposure. Excellent on RV's, convertible and vinyl tops, rubber bumpers, dashboards and woven polyester.
Surfaces treated with 303 protectant repel dirt, dust, oils, and all oil based stains! Safe for rubber, plastic, clear and solid color vinyl, glass and paint.
I found this great product for the tires . Its from turtle wax and its great . You actually wax the tires let it dry then wipe it off .Very easy and it looks great . Even cleans the raised letters .
Do I qualify for ocd cllub lol .
-juice
Thanks, mrdetailer! I'll pass that info on to the Avalanche crowd.
KarenS
Host
Owner's Clubs
About 2" of the scratch broke through the clear coat, but not the color. The rest did not break through the clear coat. What do we do now??? What will happen if we don't get it repaired and just use touch-up paint on the deepest part of the scratch? The auto body shops are saying it will probably require a complete repaint of the front end!! $7-800!!
Frustrated Theo in Colo.
Re your options... AFIK the two you mention are pretty much it. There's the costly option of repainting the front end vs the cheap one of touching up the deepest scratches and buffing out the rest. The obvious down side of going the touch-up paint route is that it will still be apparent what happened. I've got Scottish blood (read: cheap) so I'd probably go with the touch-up paint but someone suffering from a sever case of OCD might not be able to stand constantly seeing the imperfection on their hood (then again, something like this could cure a bad case of OCD). Regardless, let us know which route you take and you have my sincere condolences.
-Frank P.
Some years ago I received a pair of deep scratched in my hood in a Home Depot parking lot. Looked like someone used my car as a shelf while loading theirs, and dragged something across it. Damn near killed me!! I finally went the touchup route. Carefully and in layer with buffing in between to keep the paint in the groove and not on top of the clearcoat. It never looked like new, but I learned to live with it.
Then a year later I hit a deer. Big time damage. It put the scratch into perspective. Ended up with most of the front clip (hood, grill, bumper, fenders) replaced. Presto, no more scratches! Funny how life takes care of these things.
No negative humor intended - I do feel your pain.....
Steve
First off, I feel your pain! I winced when I read your story - my wife called me wierd and left the room!
I've heard dealers have people that come in and "touch up" their used cars when they take them in on trade or buy at the auction. Apparantly there is a process where these guys mix the exact color and then "inject" paint into the scratch with a syringe. If you got on good with the dealer when you bought it, they might get this done for you at their cost, or give you the guy's number.
Regardless of method, ask the used car manager how he would fix this if he got the car on trade. I'm sure he would neither paint the whole hood or use the touch up paint method....
If all else fails, just keep an eye out for a deer!
Let me know.
Pete.
Try a very thin layer of touch up paint, applied with a tooth pick. Maybe even use paint thinner to thin it down. Touch the area and let it soak up the paint. Kind of like the syringe suggestion. Though it's hard to do that in a line.
-juice
The only way to touch it up is like juice said with a toothpick . It will probable take a couple applications to fill in the scratch . Sorry again man I feel for ya .
Mike k
There's an auto paint supply store here in town. They have clearcoat touchup for less than $4 that is in a similar container to regular touchup. They said it should last for several years. :-)
Thanks Frank, Steve, Mike, Pete, and Juice for the ideas and sympathy! I think I will try to use a hypodermic syringe to apply diluted touchup after washing that area with Dawn. What should I use to buff it after it dries and how long should I let it dry before buffing? I have a sanding disk for drills with a buffing sleeve that goes over it. Do I dare let that touch our car?
Thanks again, Theo
I would use a random-orbital drill, so you don't end up with swirls.
-juice
I feel your pain. With the lack for a better term -- that just sucks.
I agree with all the advice you've been given. Luckily, it seems like most of the damage was to the clearcoat so I think it'll turn out pretty good.
Let the clearcoat dry for at least 24hrs before touching it. DON'T go near it with the sanding disk -- that's way too abrasive.
The rule of thumb is to try and use the least abrasive method first. If that doesn't work move it up a notch.
If you're lucky, the clearcoat might dry relatively flat and you won't have to do anything to it. If that doesn't satisfy you, then try some sanding and polish. Get the finest grit sandpaper and polish you can find at an auto store (3M has good stuff). Wet down the area with some car wash detergent and water the gently go over the bumpy area. Sometimes it helps to put a little masking tape on both sides of the filled scratch so you minimize the abrasion to your good paint. Finally, follow up with the polish -- it'll completely remove the vey fine scratches left by the sand paper.
Here's one link that describes the method:
http://www.autopia-carcare.com/painchiprep.html
Ken
Next you can try to do it yourself and to do it properly is time consuming, you will have to build the scratch up proud slightly of the existing paint, over a period of about a week you have to allow a couple of days to let each application really cure.
If you do not do this the next application will soften the first,after letting the whole lot cure for about a week, carefully sand it down level with the old paint using. 1500. or 1600. wet dry paper, after you level it use Brasso, (yes thats the stuff for polishing brass)to bring the gloss up, follow this with scratchout or some similar product, then wax.
If you follow these steps and do not rush it will not be perfect but it will be very good.
Cheers Pat. Ps. the third option is to repaint the hood, and if you go this route shop around $800 is way too much about half that should be about right,
Anyhow, I had to stop by the body shop that may be doing work on my uncles (estate sale) Mercedes, when I saw a scarry sight. There sat an '02 OBW from the same dealership I purchased from. Temp sticker in the window was dated November 02. Had 300 miles on the clock. The side windows were blown in, C pillar and door frame crushed, roof bent down by the damaged pillar, but almost no damage below the belt line. Yes, a tall deer came out of the trees and hit the side of the moving car at full gallop!
Steve
Also, can anyone recommend a detailer located in Bergen county NJ?
Thanks!
However the soap is very strong and can strip your wax in one visit, unfortuately during the winter months many people have no other alternative.
Cheers Pat.
I only use there water , i bring my own soap an wash cloth . It really p&*^%%* the owners off because Im there about 30 minutes and only use there water twice for a total of 4 dollars .
Some places do recycle water ,mine doesn't . You should be able to ask them .
mike k
I applied one coat, buffed, applied another light coat, buffed, and followed with a lightly damp buff rag to *set* the shine (as the bottle says). I think it at least gets the wax dust off!
Didn't wax the wheels yet, will try to tomorrow. My wife's Saturn had a couple of bulbs out. Replaced a front turn signal lamp and checked into why her backup lights don't work. Both bulbs were good, fuse is fine. Not sure what else to check - could it be in the shifter? Guess I gotta find me a Chilton's book for it.
I also have started using the coin-op wash near our house as it gets colder out. I spray wash it (costs $1.50), use my own sponge to clean it, and then rinse (costs another $1.50). The also claim that it's fresh water. At least it's warm water - keeps your hands warm!
-Brian
-Brian
Just wondering. Y'all all went to the extent of removing the wheels, cleaned it, then waxed it...
How come not put a layer (or 3) of clear coat? Wouldn't it make waxing the backside more satisfying the next time y'all wax it? You know. See the gloss, shine,... :-D
-Dave
I was expecting the insides to be coated with brake dust and all, but was surprised that they were relatively clean. Whenever I clean the wheels, I spray my wheel cleaner (Formula 2001 foaming wheel cleaner) not just on the outside of the wheel, but I also aim through the slots so it gets inside. Guess that helped keep them clean at least.
I had to remove the wheels anyway for a tire rotation, so it really didn't matter to me. I can add a hydraulic jack and jack stands to my christmas list this year. honest santa, I've been good.
-Brian
Brian: some times the fuse is blown but you can't tell with a naked eye. Try changing the fuse.
I rotated the tires on all 3 cars recently, and it's nice to even handle a clean, waxed wheel. My wife's wheels were filthy, it's embarassing compared to mine, which you could cook on.
-juice
Ross
Juice - yeah, I figured I'd try switching a fuse on her SL tonight to see if that fixes it. It's only a 10 amp.
-Brian
Is this true? It would make checking the brakes a pain in the neck, so I doubt it, but want to check before I do it.
Thanks all.
Pete.
-juice
By the way, does anyone know why Blue Coral AutoFOM was taken off the market? I swear by this stuff and horded every can I saw at the Odd-Lot stores last year in NYC.
..Mike
..Mike
The wheels were so filthy that I couldn't get them totally clean, but I did manage to get the thick layer of grease off.
I think if you wax them right away and maintain them, you're good. But my wife's car is 6 years old and had never been cleaned, so it's kind of hopeless.
-juice
Thanks,
Jim
You could powder coat it instead.
-juice
Anyway, I transported the tree on the roof of our OB utilizing bungees (and some rope after the bungees stretched a bit after getting wet from some rain, thus allowing the tree to almost fall off). Got home, removed the tree from the roof, got out the hose and rinsed our OB. Mind you it was after 9pm by that time.
The neighbors don't think I'm nuts, they know I'm nuts!
-Brian
-juice
It's really in need of a wash.
-Brian
One of the offerings was a dealer installed teflon coating fot the outside and a treatment for the fabric interior. Both also included limited warranties (manufacturer, I believe). The teflon is supposed to help with the acid rain, bird droppings, etc... problems we have around here. (Northern Virginia)
The offered price was $595 for both exterior and interior treatment, and $495 for the exterior alone.
Does anyone know what it is they are offering me, and is there any merit to it?
Dave- join the OCD club and put on a good coat of wax routinely and it'll do just as great for less. And, don't forget to wax the back of the wheels. :-D
-Dave
[weird talking to self ain't it ;-) ]
Ross, middle name Dave
Back on topic - any recommendation for leather cleaning/maintenance? Tried Armor-all but my fanny won't stay put.
-Dave
Ed
Ross
Bob
BTW, sorry for a dumb question, but I'm drawing a blank on the "OCD" acronym. Help please?