Yea I'm in ESP...no choice. I have modified sway bars, and my displacement takes me out of STX. Ugh....come to think of it, I have 16x7 rims, not 16x6.5, that might actually bump me to SM. Yikes. I'll research that tonight.
Anyone out near Pittsburgh/OH border this weekend? TeamIAC.com will be out there doing an HPDE @ Beaver Run Raceway if anyone is interested in coming to watch/hang etc.
at Beaver Run Raceway. The Legacy did very well, especially in the rain on saturday. We were able to show off our new Subaru/Team IAC.com banner as well! Best run of the weekend was a battle I had with a race prepped mustang. In the instructor group you can pass anywhere w/o a pointby, so I was able to take him in the turns. Took advantage of the uphill cork screw to overtake him on the inside of the turn. Worked out nicely except he passed me in the up-hill portion of the corkscrew before the front straight. The next lap I outbraked him again going into the corkscrew and weaved a bit up the hill then drag raced him down the front straight, he braked at the 200m, I braked at the 50m, never saw him after that as I was significantly faster through the twisties.
Just to bring up an "old" topic, but does anyone (Patti) have any ideas for going to SIA in the fall? I would like to go, but as usual it is easier to plan in advance rather than a last minute trip.
I couldn't wait any longer to take vacation so I'm heading up to Illinois tomorrow to visit family. I was hoping to time trip to coincide with a SIA tour but I guess it wasn't meant to be ;-(
Should be a hoot. I'm glad Subaru is finally doing something like this.
They very by manufacturer, from my experience.
Mercedes rolls out the red carpet. Great food, massages, facials for the wives, and then a little seat time. The have a fancy demo, but they do not let you drive hard (no tire squeel).
BMW has snacks but includes an autocross tutorial and coaching, even track time at full-tilt, tire squeel and all. They are more fun but the rest of the stuff isn't as nice as Benz.
I went to a Volvo one and it was closer to what Mercedes had to offer. Also fun.
Finally, I went to a Chevy Malibu intro, it was definitely a step below the rest. You did get plenty of seat time and they include competitors' cars. But again, no tire squeel or they ask you to slow down. The event was scarcely attended, you could here crickets chirping, but that meant more seat time.
I imagine Subaru will be something like BMW's, with perhaps a little less leeway on hard driving and minus the classroom instruction.
These events are a HOOT, even the Chevy one was a ball.
was fun too, almost full tilt, just no tire squealling launches (remember my friend got a no-no warning after doing so in the T5 S40).
This will be my 2nd event of this type. And yes, it's brought to you by R&T/C&D. I'm hoping it will be similar to the Saab drive. I'm anxious to drive the S60 and the 325i, as I have yet to get behind the wheel of either. But, the real pleasure will be the Legacy, right? ;-)
BMW supposedly is coming to my area, at least the registration page where you put in a zipcode is telling me to check back next week (8/30).
So, DW & I headed down to the "Cell" for the Legacy Ride & Drive, presented by Car & Driver / Road & Track. (The "Cell" is Cellular One Field, home of the Chicago White Sox). Weather was a cool 67F, and patchy drizzle. It didn't drizzle during our 90 minutes there though.
Got signed in, got our badges, and headed over to the training tent. Here a professional driver/instructor went over a few basics about driving the courses. He spent most of his time talking about approaching a curve. Not just the basic apex stuff, but stressing brake early and straight, look out of the curve, not where the car is headed. Let the tires do 1 thing at a time, either braking or steering or accelerating. When you combine any of these, you introduce over or understeer. Applicable to the track (naturally), but can be used in real world situations as well.
The test vehicles - Legacy 2.5 GT, BMW 325i, Volvo S60 T5. Sedans on the handling and performance tracks. Wagons on the traction track.
Now out to the track. The first of three tracks - handling - was up. 11 people in our group. 3 instructors, 1 rides in each vehicle. Again, these are professionals from either driving schools or racing.
DW & I were the 4th bunch of our group, so we went last in the rotation. You start in one vehicle, each driver does 1 lap, then move to the next vehicle. This course had curves and sharp corners. Watching the first 3 bunches of drivers, there were a few cone catchers, especially on the sharp turns.
Let me mention that DW was a bit intimidated by the course, the instruction, and seeing the drivers hitting cones and squealing tires. She was thinking that you were 'forced' to drive fast in the cars. The instructors and I managed to ease her fears and just drive the course at her own pace. After a few laps, she settled in and was driving pretty aggressively. (I've created a monster!) Was fun and interesting to watch her transform on the course.
Next was the traction course. Some right/left/right/left accident avoidance manuevers, travel through wet sand, and a final sharp right through a puddle. The cars here were getting quite filthy from the course.
Finally, the peformance track. A straightaway to accelerate with a radar gun to show your speed, an S curve, and a couple of final short straights between a couple hard left and right.
The way the cars were lined up, we got the Legacy last on each course. Even though I hadn't driven the new Legacy yet, I felt 'home' in it. The drivetrain felt familiar and was easy to drive aggressively on the course and not get into trouble. Seemed to be a crowd favorite too, and was surprising to most as well (both for performance and luxury feel). AWD performed great on the tracks, the 2.5T was very nice, a little lag initially off the line, but power was nicely displayed coupled with the 5sp AT.
The Volvo was probably the most comfortable. But, it is the underdog in this lineup. Spongy suspension and fwd made it the handle the worst of the bunch on all 3 tracks. Was easy to understeer, brakes were awesome, and gave little feedback on the ride and steering.
The BMW was fun on the track as well. Held the courses well and gave decent power even being normally aspirated. Steering was tight and you felt connected to the road.
After all that, we filled out a 1 page (both sides) survey, asking about impressions of the Legacy and Subaru before the test drives and after. Also, how you perceive Volvo and BMW (luxury, peformance, safety, reliability, etc). Up to this point, there was no Subaru promoting. So, I think most folks came in not expecting to see the exit tent full of new Legacy and Outback models. Got a bag full of goodies, including a nice new Legacy brochure, a Subaru full lineup brochure, a Subaru cd case, and a R&T miniature steering wheel key chain.
DW loved the new Legacy and was quite suprised how upscale it felt. She was not impressed with the Volvo. The BMW to her was what helped her gain confidence on the course. Her top 3 went: Legacy, BMW, Volvo.
I too was unimpressed with the Volvo. I'd love to see how the R version performs, it probably makes up for some of the shortcomings. The BMW was fun to drive, even in wagon form. I too liked the Legacy (expected, right?) and thought it was among good competition.
It looks much like some of the events juice and I have gone to at FedEx field in DC. I noticed that there were some stadium lamp poles surprisingly close to the course.
Talking with the instructors afterwards, I was chatting about liking their job (who here wouldn't?). DW asked if anyone had gone too far with a vehicle and hit something. They've seen 'em happen, it's not something they like to see. The layout of our 3 courses was interesting due to space of the parking lots used, but nothing out of the ordinary for these guys. The last event for these guys was on an abandoned airstrip. The acceleration course was quite nice there - speeds up to about 90mph on the trap shot.
And since the instructor rides with you at all times, you're fairly safe. They've got liberty to pull the e-brake if necessary.
Yup and not only that but I started the 1hr enduro in 15th and ended in 13th or better (final results aren't tallied yet)
"You FIRST need to finish in order to finish FIRST"
I moved up in position due to spins or mechanical failures of other cars in the race. Further proof of the reliability of the subies. This race car is a 100% stock 2.2L engine and automatic transmission that has 156,000 miles on the ticker, with over 2000 track miles on it. It ran for the 1hr straight at near redline and didn't miss a beat!
Okay I've got a confession to make... I was signed up for the same event a month ago in Atlanta but didn't make it due to a stupid error on my part. It wasn't being held where I thought it was (Gwinnett Fairgrounds vs Gwinnett Arena). Ironically both locations are on the same road (the arena I’m familiar with but I’d not heard of the fairgrounds). I saw the street name and just assumed that it would be at the arena (of course I left the email confirmation that clearly stated “fairgrounds” at home). Just to reinforce how low-key of a Subaru event this was, when used my cel phone to call the local Subaru dealership to get directions, they weren't even aware that it was being held (almost down the street too). Needless to say, I was extremely frustrated that I missed out and disgusted with myself for such a careless oversight.
seems Karen linked my review over at the THTDT thread! 8-)
Juice: I was a bit disappointed that there wasn't food there. They had refreshments though (water and Pepsi products). Maybe they brought food out for those testing during lunch?
The Saab Drive event had food and drinks, but wasn't as fun as the Ride & Drive. I hope the Mercedes event in October is at least like the Saab Drive.
they would have thrown a C Class in there to complete the mix. And perhaps a S60R, since that's supposed to get better handling treatment (which would hopefully help the Volvo out). I actually think the S40 at the Saab Event was a better performer than the S60 was.
If you knew nothing about RWD or AWD, you most certainly should come out of there thinking that something was wrong with the FWD Volvo. The BMW and Legacy outhandled it by far.
Comments
Steve
-Dave
-juice
I got 3 months to find it
-Dave
-juice
Did you modify/change your entry?
I see that you're now slated to battle with the STi's in ESP 8o
juice-
address:
Ripken Field
923 Gilbert Rd
Aberdeen, MD 21001
-Dave
I'd go to the Auto-x but the track is more bang for the $. If you guys go to that on sat come out and visit at summit on Sunday.
-mike
-juice
Bob
-juice
-mike
-mike
My wife hosted a Baby Shower so I had both kids, and was changing diapers all day! Yikes!
-juice
Mark
-Dave
-Brian
I couldn't wait any longer to take vacation so I'm heading up to Illinois tomorrow to visit family. I was hoping to time trip to coincide with a SIA tour but I guess it wasn't meant to be ;-(
-Frank
I'll be attending comp school on saturday and competing in my first race on sunday. It's a 1hr enduro race!
That's right come see one of the only if not THE only road racing Subaru in the Northeast US.
Pocono Raceway this weekend. Check out http://Nasanortheast.com for details and directions.
-mike
http://TeamIAC.com
-juice
I'll be in Canada for a week, but Good Luck!
Mark
Owen
-Brian
How are these things? This will be my first.
-Dennis
They very by manufacturer, from my experience.
Mercedes rolls out the red carpet. Great food, massages, facials for the wives, and then a little seat time. The have a fancy demo, but they do not let you drive hard (no tire squeel).
BMW has snacks but includes an autocross tutorial and coaching, even track time at full-tilt, tire squeel and all. They are more fun but the rest of the stuff isn't as nice as Benz.
I went to a Volvo one and it was closer to what Mercedes had to offer. Also fun.
Finally, I went to a Chevy Malibu intro, it was definitely a step below the rest. You did get plenty of seat time and they include competitors' cars. But again, no tire squeel or they ask you to slow down. The event was scarcely attended, you could here crickets chirping, but that meant more seat time.
I imagine Subaru will be something like BMW's, with perhaps a little less leeway on hard driving and minus the classroom instruction.
These events are a HOOT, even the Chevy one was a ball.
-juice
Sounds like fun!
-Dennis
-juice
This will be my 2nd event of this type. And yes, it's brought to you by R&T/C&D. I'm hoping it will be similar to the Saab drive. I'm anxious to drive the S60 and the 325i, as I have yet to get behind the wheel of either. But, the real pleasure will be the Legacy, right? ;-)
BMW supposedly is coming to my area, at least the registration page where you put in a zipcode is telling me to check back next week (8/30).
-Brian
Pretty soon we'll have more of those than BMW owners have.
-juice
Got signed in, got our badges, and headed over to the training tent. Here a professional driver/instructor went over a few basics about driving the courses. He spent most of his time talking about approaching a curve. Not just the basic apex stuff, but stressing brake early and straight, look out of the curve, not where the car is headed. Let the tires do 1 thing at a time, either braking or steering or accelerating. When you combine any of these, you introduce over or understeer. Applicable to the track (naturally), but can be used in real world situations as well.
The test vehicles - Legacy 2.5 GT, BMW 325i, Volvo S60 T5. Sedans on the handling and performance tracks. Wagons on the traction track.
Now out to the track. The first of three tracks - handling - was up. 11 people in our group. 3 instructors, 1 rides in each vehicle. Again, these are professionals from either driving schools or racing.
DW & I were the 4th bunch of our group, so we went last in the rotation. You start in one vehicle, each driver does 1 lap, then move to the next vehicle. This course had curves and sharp corners. Watching the first 3 bunches of drivers, there were a few cone catchers, especially on the sharp turns.
Let me mention that DW was a bit intimidated by the course, the instruction, and seeing the drivers hitting cones and squealing tires. She was thinking that you were 'forced' to drive fast in the cars. The instructors and I managed to ease her fears and just drive the course at her own pace. After a few laps, she settled in and was driving pretty aggressively. (I've created a monster!) Was fun and interesting to watch her transform on the course.
Next was the traction course. Some right/left/right/left accident avoidance manuevers, travel through wet sand, and a final sharp right through a puddle. The cars here were getting quite filthy from the course.
Finally, the peformance track. A straightaway to accelerate with a radar gun to show your speed, an S curve, and a couple of final short straights between a couple hard left and right.
The way the cars were lined up, we got the Legacy last on each course. Even though I hadn't driven the new Legacy yet, I felt 'home' in it. The drivetrain felt familiar and was easy to drive aggressively on the course and not get into trouble. Seemed to be a crowd favorite too, and was surprising to most as well (both for performance and luxury feel). AWD performed great on the tracks, the 2.5T was very nice, a little lag initially off the line, but power was nicely displayed coupled with the 5sp AT.
The Volvo was probably the most comfortable. But, it is the underdog in this lineup. Spongy suspension and fwd made it the handle the worst of the bunch on all 3 tracks. Was easy to understeer, brakes were awesome, and gave little feedback on the ride and steering.
The BMW was fun on the track as well. Held the courses well and gave decent power even being normally aspirated. Steering was tight and you felt connected to the road.
After all that, we filled out a 1 page (both sides) survey, asking about impressions of the Legacy and Subaru before the test drives and after. Also, how you perceive Volvo and BMW (luxury, peformance, safety, reliability, etc). Up to this point, there was no Subaru promoting. So, I think most folks came in not expecting to see the exit tent full of new Legacy and Outback models. Got a bag full of goodies, including a nice new Legacy brochure, a Subaru full lineup brochure, a Subaru cd case, and a R&T miniature steering wheel key chain.
DW loved the new Legacy and was quite suprised how upscale it felt. She was not impressed with the Volvo. The BMW to her was what helped her gain confidence on the course. Her top 3 went: Legacy, BMW, Volvo.
I too was unimpressed with the Volvo. I'd love to see how the R version performs, it probably makes up for some of the shortcomings. The BMW was fun to drive, even in wagon form. I too liked the Legacy (expected, right?) and thought it was among good competition.
Pics here: http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4159890093
And I didn't feel bad getting back into my XT for the drive home.
-Brian
Bob
And since the instructor rides with you at all times, you're fairly safe. They've got liberty to pull the e-brake if necessary.
-Brian
-Brian
Paisan is now a licensed Road Rager... umm Racer ;-)
-Dave
"You FIRST need to finish in order to finish FIRST"
I moved up in position due to spins or mechanical failures of other cars in the race. Further proof of the reliability of the subies. This race car is a 100% stock 2.2L engine and automatic transmission that has 156,000 miles on the ticker, with over 2000 track miles on it. It ran for the 1hr straight at near redline and didn't miss a beat!
More details when I get up tomorrow!
-mike
How was the food and other stuff? I'm wondering if they went all out like Mercedes does, for instance.
-juice
Nice write up and photos!
Ken
Okay I've got a confession to make... I was signed up for the same event a month ago in Atlanta but didn't make it due to a stupid error on my part. It wasn't being held where I thought it was (Gwinnett Fairgrounds vs Gwinnett Arena). Ironically both locations are on the same road (the arena I’m familiar with but I’d not heard of the fairgrounds). I saw the street name and just assumed that it would be at the arena (of course I left the email confirmation that clearly stated “fairgrounds” at home). Just to reinforce how low-key of a Subaru event this was, when used my cel phone to call the local Subaru dealership to get directions, they weren't even aware that it was being held (almost down the street too). Needless to say, I was extremely frustrated that I missed out and disgusted with myself for such a careless oversight.
-Frank
Sounds like Brian had a lot of fun, those are 3 pretty cool cars. Also a good way to evaluate FWD vs. AWD vs. RWD back-to-back.
-juice
Juice: I was a bit disappointed that there wasn't food there. They had refreshments though (water and Pepsi products). Maybe they brought food out for those testing during lunch?
The Saab Drive event had food and drinks, but wasn't as fun as the Ride & Drive. I hope the Mercedes event in October is at least like the Saab Drive.
-Brian
If you knew nothing about RWD or AWD, you most certainly should come out of there thinking that something was wrong with the FWD Volvo. The BMW and Legacy outhandled it by far.
-Brian
-Brian
-juice
-Brian
Oct 23
http://TeamIAC.com
I hope to see some of the DC folks out there even if they just come hang and watch!
-mike
mike - Congrats speed racer. :-)
-Dennis