Paint and Body Maintenance & Repair

brozhnik · November 2003

This is being promoted by a local trim guy. Costs a lot more than waxing. Anyone know anything about it?
Thanks.

swschrad · November 2003

it's either wax or acrylic polymer, which lasts a little bit longer.

he gets a larger chunk of the change than by selling turtle wax.

out of this world benefits: none. superior performance: doubtful. worth the difference? -- not to me.

jwilson1 · November 2003

Sure I have an opinion -- those who know me well would say I have little else!!! ;-)

Again, if you wish to be anal about the car (you haven't clarified that important issue), I would recommend having the car "clayed." This will remove any and all residue/pollution/sap/etc. I don't think any clay is especially better than another and all it amounts to is using a detailing wax as a lubricant and a wad of clay to rub over the surface of the car. Following that, a wash, then wax.

But if you're not going to be anal, the cleaner wax is still not needed (unless you see -- literally -- that the damage from the environment has had an effect).

You seem to be attracted to the high tech panaceas that are offered. Lots of passionate opinions out there. No convincing proof that I've seen. Sorry.

IMO. JW

brozhnik · November 2003

Thanks-- great advice re clay, wax, etc.
Yup, I admit it-- I'm being anal (first new car. Not sure I'll do this again!) And since I'm fairly ignorant as well, I'm easy prey for hawkers of high-tech solutions, so all the opinions I'm getting here are much appreciated. I'll forget the expensive wax stuff, as recommended.

One other high-tech solution I'm drawn to: the 3-M front-end paint protection film. I've heard good things about it and it seems to be a better choice in some ways than a front-end "bra." Any comments on the film? Worth the $300?
Thanks again-- really appreciate the help.

swschrad · November 2003

I'd have done it. a scuzzy bugshield left some pressure damage to the clearcoat on the front of my hood. now I've got to have some work done before I could get the 3M film applied.

recommended, and not just because they're a local outfit. my 90 ranger had similar film on the lower body, and it really turned the stones away.

jwilson1 · November 2003

...highly recommended if you'll keep the car long enough to get the pleasure of it.

Two words of caution -- it does yellow a little bit. So, especially on light colors, you might be thinking of perhaps replacing it every 4-5 years. The only real option to it is to have the same areas -- mirrors, bumper, lights, hood, etc? -- 'touched up' at a good body shop when it's needed. The clear bra is a more economical option.

Also: Make sure you get it done by an installer who has quite a bit of experience with your car. Some cars have lots of strange curves and the job will come out better if you're not the first one that the installer has done. Shop around a bit, ask for references, that sort of thing ....

Take care. JW

molocono · November 2003

I have a brand new 2004 Toyota 4Runner and I want to give it a good wash without scratching the paint. Which is better: a chenille or lamb's wool washing mit?

bretfraz · November 2003

Either 100% cotton chenille or pure lambswool will work just fine. Use two mitts, one for the upper half of the truck and one for the lower. That way you are not dragging dirt all over the place.

Use lots of water and rinse the mitt frequently. When the mitt starts looking and feeling grubby, replace it. I replace my chenille mitts every 7-10 washes.

molocono · November 2003

molocono · November 2003

Thanks for the info! How often do you wash your car/truck?

rgnmstr · November 2003

I'd appreciate some help on what the best and safest ways there are to remove dead bug bodies from the front painted areas of my car. I'm refering to the ones that are really stuck on that don't come off with normal washing. The ones that landed at 70mph and have been there for a while. Thanks.

alternator · November 2003

There is nothing on the web more detailed and intense than what you will find at autopia.com

bretfraz · November 2003

Every 7-10 days, depending on condition and weather.

bretfraz · November 2003

The longer they're left on the surface, the harder they are to remove.

Bug guts are quite acidic and can easily eat into your clearcoat. Some bug residue is very similar to shellac so sometimes a petroleum distillate like mineral spirits is needed. Most of the "bug and tar remover" products are nothing more than repackaged mineral spirits or naptha, which you can buy at the hardware store.

Here's how I remove them during a detail job:

1. Use a dedicated bug juice remover to dissolve the bond between the guts and the paint. This works great on fresh bug residue. I use a remover from Hi Temp Products that's designed for this very task.

2. Try some mineral spirits on the more stubborn guts.

3. Clay the area to remove the micro-sized residue that you can feel but can barely see.

4. If all else fails, bust out the compounds and polish off the residue.

None of the above is a guarantee of removing 100% of the residue. If the guts have been on the paint for months at a time, the damage can be permanent.

Don't forget to follow up with a coat of your favorite wax or sealant for added protection.

lexusrock · November 2003

like the ones caused by non-deep key or purse scratches that don't get into color paint but do scratch some of the clear coating. Repainting, re-finish it (for the coating part), or just wax/polish it away?

bretfraz · November 2003

A good detailer can remove or greatly reduce light scratches that are not thru to the color coat. Doing this by hand is an eternal task.

If buffing doesn't work, next stop is the body shop.

gene69 · November 2003

Well, it happened to me this weekend. I left my tan Grand Marquis with a hotel valet and it came back with white paint and scratches on the bumper. They took credit for it since it is immaculate and was inspected on check in, and I filed a claim with their head office, but I need to repair the damage.

The scratches are not too bad - in fact, I missed them first time around - and there's not too much foreign paint on the bumper (which is plastic, by the way). I think they can be buffed out. My first inclination is to find a real good detailer.

1. Does anyone know of a good detailer in the PG County - Washington DC area?

2. If I can't find one, what are your recommendations for a buffing compound? This is a two-year old car, always garaged, no scratches or swirls, in pristine condition. I keep it clayed and sealed with Zaino (now Diamond Plus) and don't even put it away wet if I can help it. It's never been buffed and I don't own a Porter-Cable, but I'm willing to laboriously polish by hand if necessary.

Thanks for your help, all! gene

kkollwitz · November 2003

My post #270 might help.

brozhnik · November 2003

I decided to go for that 3-m film front-end protector. To make it stay on, the guy who sells it says he'll strip off the wax first on the areas getting the film.
So I'm just curious, being completely ignorant (I've put wax on, but never removed it): how do you do remove wax without hurting the clearcoat? Thanks.

swschrad · November 2003

dish soap, diluted, does this. there are mild solvents that can also be used, stoddard solvent being one of them. since mineral spirits is a carrier for carnuba paste wax, it should also suffice with a little elbow grease mixed in. alcohol should also be safe on just about everything.

basically, they wash the car with stuff you are not supposed to wash it with to strip the wax.

now, when it comes to stripping paint off a car, you're into a whole 'nother kettle of crud....

bigfur · November 2003

If they are paying for it, take it to a body shop and have it done RIGHT! If the clear coat on the bumper is cracked it could start to peel even after a good buff job.

gene69 · November 2003

Thanks for your help. I haven't heard back about the claim. I'll start bugging them next week about it. Meanwhile it's just sitting there.

That's why I keep a commuter car. Scrapes and door dings don't faze me on that one.

brozhnik · November 2003

So, I put the 3m Film stuff on. It mostly looks good. But there are a few small bubbles (look like flaws in the paint, but they are actually harmless; and at least I will know what they are). And the edges, esp. of one of the mirrors, are sometimes crinkly. In short, it was not installed flawlessly. It won't actually harm the car, but it's not quite what I was hoping for. Any suggestions on what I can expect the guy who installed it to do now?
thanks

kkollwitz · November 2003

You can pop them with a needle or an exacto blade, then press them down so they disappear.

jwilson1 · November 2003

If it doesn't lay flat in 3wks. to a month after install, go back and have him do it over. JW

snuke59 · November 2003

My daughter has a red, 1998 Honda Prelude with a rear spoiler she would like to have re-painted only...no dings to remove. Can anyone recommend a good shop in the Houston, TX area and the expected price?

biggie2 · November 2003

http://www.waterworkscarwash.com/research.htm

Interesting article...

Many factors that the article does not go in-depth with could be the answer to the surprizing findings that came from it, but it still makes you think. I personally think it is a bunch of BS, but of course I am not exactly a guru of washing cars, I just do what I can to make my car look its best....

What do yall think??

alternator · November 2003

a statement such as "On the other hand, the motorist who uses the services of a professional car wash with their automatic carwashing equipment subjects the paintwork of their vehicle to the thorough, but gentle action of cloth pads and curtains which treat their paint job with tender, loving care". What a crock !!

jwilson1 · December 2003

at what? Dropping out of life?

Every form of "professional" car wash -- automatic or manual -- that I've seen features recycled rags, water, dirt, and grit. I may take the car there to get sanded, but not for a wash ... now the high-pressure hose bays that are attached to some and in which you can do it yourself by feeding a coin machine quarters seems to work pretty well .... so long as you just use their hose and water and skip the brush and detergent. The brush is obvious, I guess, and the detergent is the high-test stuff I think that eats wax. I take my own washing equipment, and a bucket of water to boot, and use their high pressure wand to clean off the surface dirt, then I wash it with my stuff, and use their wand again to rinse -- works in the winter when my driveway is frozen over.

JW

bjtjps · December 2003

when i put the film on the hood of my car, the spray "adhesive" was a very dilute solution of liquid detergent and rubbing alcohol. you could spray this under the crinkly edges and hold it in place until it stuck to try to smooth it down. i believe some products just use the soap solution without the alcohol. also, the installation instructions also said a blowdryer could be used to soften the material - this is mostly used to make the material pliable around curves.

boss6060 · December 2003

I have a black A4 and up until last weekend I only had about 4-5 paint chips on my front bumber and hood (down to metal). When I washed my car last weekend I noticed all these white dots all over my front bumber, front fender and hood all the way up to the windshield. Hundreds! I am very conscious on the highways and never get behind large trucks. I just can't imagine how this happened on one trip. I retraced all my trips over the past week and never even remember hearing a bunch of rocks or sand hitting my car. My windshield is not pitted? Anyone have any suggestions? I went over a small portion of the hood with wax and it made an improvement, some of the white dots actually disappeared, but not all. Should I try a rubbing compound or something. Or are all these really small chips? The only other thing I can think of is that it could be "ash" from all the recent fires in southern california. Maybe the heat from the engine caked it into the paint? I don't know. Any suggestions would be much appreciated as I'm just sick over it. Thanks.

jwilson1 · December 2003

If they disappear with wax, they're not chips.

My next step would be to clay the front end.

If you don't know about clay, ask and someone will surely explain. But don't go to an abrasive (cleaner wax) until you try that.

My guess is white paint from someone in front of you going across a fresh highway paint job and you caught their spray. So if my guess is right, you should do this asap as it won't get any easier to remove with time.

Keep us posted. JW

boss6060 · December 2003

Wow, that's an interesting thought. I'll try the clay and keep you posted. Thanks JW.

jc1973 · December 2003

does anyone know how to remove and install a drivers side mirror on a 1998 pontiac grand am what do u have to remove to take it out any info appriacitied

alcan · December 2003

Document ID# 532897
1998 Pontiac Grand Am

Mirror Replacement, Power

Removal Procedure
Remove the door rear view mirror bezel screw.
Remove the door rear view mirror bezel.
Remove power mirror wire harness.
Remove the insulator.
Remove the rear view mirror nuts.
Remove the rear view mirror.

Installation Procedure
Install the rear view mirror.
Install the rear view mirror nuts.
Tighten the nut to 5.6 N·m (50 lb in).
Install the insulator.
Install the power mirror wire harness.
Install the door rear view mirror bezel.
Install the door rear view mirror bezel screw.
Tighten the screw to 1 N·m (9 lb in).

bigfur · December 2003

Basically take the screws out of the trim panel go down to the local parts store and pick up a Panel Popper tool. Is the car two or four door?. Four doors is easier to get the panel off since its a smaller door. Once you get the panel off its pretty easy. Up where the mirror is there will be some black foam, pull that out and use i believe it was a 10mm socket to take the screws out. Make sure to hold the mirror with the last screw, can do a number on your paint if your not careful. Any questions ask, i used to do auto body for a Pontiac dealership for a few years.

fastpaul · December 2003

I have tried to fix some paint chips with touch-up paint, with minimal success. I've heard of also using polishing products from Zaino Brothers. Has anyone had experience with this process?

hammen2 · December 2003

Zaino may or may not be great for polishing/providing paint protection for your car (I happen to think it's great, but not everyone does), but it really doesn't do anything for paint chips...

jc1973 · December 2003

hey thanks alot guys for the info unfortauntly i was a victem of a hit and run luckily only my mirror got damaged

bretfraz · December 2003

You didn't mention what you've tried but in case you haven't discovered them, look at the Langka system (langka.com) or at paintscratch.com. Do a web search for both.

doitmyself · December 2003

I wish to mend a cracked plastic bumper. It will not be repainted and appearance is not that important. I would like to glue a patch of some sort on the back side.

What kind of adhesive works? Two part epoxy? Any application directions?

Thank you.

pallc · December 2003

I have a similar problem with my '99 Solara. An internet search yielded a company at WWW.Bumperskins.com. I eMailed them to see if they had anything for my car and are waiting for a reply.

dms3 · December 2003

The front bumper of my car scraped a wall and has now has the white wall paint on it. What is the best way to remove the wall paint without removing the underlying bumper paint? What do people use to "buff" out this sort of thing?

Thanks.

scottdude · December 2003

Has anyone tried these yet? I did a search and nothing came up. They look like an interesting product but I'd like to hear some comments from people who've tried them.

sphinx99 · December 2003

Do the high pressure hand-held water jets damage the finish of paint? I've heard "yes" and "no"

ms350 · December 2003

I use these on my car and they are great. I use the wipes and the California car duster. You only need about 3 of them for a full wash. The package is resealable and they don't dry out. They smell good and give a really good shine & don't leave any streaks or spots. With all the snow and rain we've had here in NJ in the last few weeks, they're all i've used to "Wash" my car. For about $4.29 for about 10 wipes, you definitely can't go wrong!!!!

bluick · January 2004

Has anyone experienced paint peeling off their GM car? My 94 Buick Park Avenue, which was always garaged by it's previous owner is now shedding paint from it's roof for no apparent reason.

The body shop I talked to said that this is a huge problem with GM vehicles due to very thin paint that allows premature oxidation of the primer and then peeling. The body shop said the only way to fix this is to completely strip the car with acid to the bare metal and reprimer and repaint, very expensive. I feel GM is liable for defects in workmanship and should reimbursh owners for this repair. You could sell the vehicle, but who is going want to buy it? Talk about built in obsolesence!

swschrad · January 2004

ford also had some peeling problems late 80s in some colors (predominantly silver and blue.)

if they repaint over the old primer, it's likely to happen again. sounds more to me like incompatible chemistry than a laughable top coat.

lexusrock · January 2004

I know this kind of things are bound to happen sooner or later on any car, and may not be worth really repairing via $$ repaint as it's only cosmetic (no rust issue). But between touch-up, which can make it even more obvious, and real repaint by a body shop, is there something in between?

swschrad · January 2004

if you decided to get after it yourself with a can of dupli-color, it would look decent overall... until... the first rock pit, cold day, bumper-toucher in the parking lot. at which point the spraycan paint, which does NOT have elasticizer additive to make it flex, would shard off in sheets.

the effect would be like you get when you squeeze a corner of a heinz ketchup bottle really hard. there are several layers of plastic in those bottles, and they get a shattered look.

you don't want that. so if you decide to go whole-hog, get it done professionally.

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