Mazda3

anon70 · May 2005

the 3i has a 2.0L engine and the automatic gives 34mpg hwy. (no Variable-Valve Timing)

the 3s has a 2.3L engine w/Variable-Valve Timing and the automatic is 5mpg worse? (29mpg hwy)

i shudder to think what's the mpg if it didnt have Variable-Valve Timing.

(heck, my Chevy prizm was 1.8L with Variable-Valve Timing and the automatic was 41mpg hwy!)

How can an engine that's only .3L bigger be so inefficient??

and why didnt the 2.0L have Variable-Valve Timing to improve mpg?

npaladin2000 · May 2005

Because the 2.0l is a cheaper engine.

Variable valve timing can be tuned 2 different ways: increased power, or increased efficiency. (Think Civic HX versus Civic EX...both have a VVT system, but the HX is for increased MPG, the EX is for more power). We're talking about "zoomzoom" Mazda here; which do you think they leaned toward?

That being said, VVT, when tuned to increase power, will usually impose less of an MPG penalty than an increase in displacement to get the same power gain. Compare the 160 HP MZR 2.3L (25/32 mpg) to the Toyota 2.4L (22/29 mpg) in the SCION tC, for example. Both are 160 HP. The numbers are for the manual tranny, BTW. Comparing with an automatic introduces other factors like torque converter efficiency and shift programming.

fowler3 · May 2005

I would definately get the ABS with side air bags and curtains!! My No.1 choice over any other option, or second choice if the AT was No.1.

fowler3

barry42 · May 2005

I sure do agree with you on the ABS !! The drivers here are so crazy that I have had many times to emergency brake [ and I don't tailgate ] , but , with the ABS and the conservatively designed brake this "3" really pulls down beautifully !!

Almost once a week we go to the local town of Antigua and it is in the mountains with lots of bends in the road -- we were there yesterday at an antique car show !! Boy, do I love the twisties in this car !!

Zoom, Zoom !! Barry.

npaladin2000 · May 2005

Yeah, fun, isn't it? This is the first car I've owned where I find excuses to go out just so I can take it for a drive on some of the more "fun" roads around here.

anon70 · May 2005

stopping distance is longer with abs on dry pavement.

autonomous · May 2005

anon70 said: stopping distance is longer with abs on dry pavement.

Really? Can you enlighten us with some evidence (industry/government/other) of this? I had always thought the introduction of ABS was to improve stopping distances. Thanks in advance.

gerapau · May 2005

Most very good drivers who know the limits of their cars probably can stop more quickly without ABS. If you are good at threshold breaking you can equal or better ABS. The problem is, even if you are good at threshold breaking, in an emergency most people tend to just mash the breaks. This locks them up and you lose all ability to avoid any obsticals and increases you stopping distance. Remember, ABS doesn't just allow you to stop quicker but also allows you to still have some control of the car while stopping.

There are a few situations where ABS does increase stopping distances though. Icy, snowy roads come to mind. On ice and snow you can usually stop quicker without ABS because the snow that builds up in front of your tires when you lock up your wheels actually helps slow you quicker. Of coarse, once again, when you lock up the wheels you lose any ability to steer the car. I would probably rather have the ability to steer and give up a few feet in stopping distance.

barry42 · May 2005

You can Blowviate ' ?spell? ' all you want !! This Mazda3 with ABS stops in a shorter distance and with better control than any car I have owned or driven -- dry road -- wet road -- gravel road -- ice or snow !! C&D article in the may issue agrees with me !!
Stop !! Stop !! Barry42.

audia8q · May 2005

I got a few 2006 details today...

They are changing the models around a little.....There will be 10 models of the Mazda3 sedan and the options will be limited. Here is what I know so far.

All versions will offer a manual and auto trans. Below is listed each model with the available options.

i ....auto, A/C
itr...ABS/SAC
s...auto, SAB/SAC
str..auto, roof/cd pkg, leather
sgt...auto, roof/cd/bose pkg, navigation

It appears that ABS will be standard on 's' models.

new color on the 's' models.....whitewater pearl and copper red
no new colors for the 'i' model.

klj2041 · May 2005

The other day I was at the local dealer, and the Mazda rep was telling me that buying an ' 04 would be a "rip off." I think b/c used they are going for ~15k and new would only be maybe 2k more, if that. What does anyone here think about that statement? Truth, or just trying to talk me into a more expensive vehicle?

Is anything about the 05 significantly better than the 04? (a/c, rotors etc...)

I live in a wintery climate, where snow is very possible 6 mo. out of the year. There is no way I am going to bother with buying another set of rims and tires, or even just tires. That is just silly and expensive . Keep in mind, I am not extremely performance minded, just want a fun looking and fun to drive car. How bad could it be on snow? Is this a good reason to decide against the M3?

npaladin2000 · May 2005

If you're not going to get a set of snows, find a set of all-seasons that are REAL GOOD in snow and replace the OEM tires with them. Those RS-As should never even SEE snow. They're bad enough to get you killed. They scared me to death when I got caught in a snowstorm before I got them off the car, and I'm USED to driving in heavy snow with mere all-season tires.

So anyway, if you feel saving your own life is silly and expensive, by all means drive on the OEM tires in the snow.

Honestly, if you live in a 6 month snow climate, then putting on snow tires every year is something you'd better get used to, for pretty much ANY car (even an awd Subie). It's simply a lot safer.

Incidentally, buying the 04 wouldn't be a rip-off at all...he just can't charge as much. Changes between 04 and 05 were minimal, and it's likely that the insurance will cost you less on an 04, since technically it's a year old.

fowler3 · May 2005

klj2041 said: There is no way I am going to bother with buying another set of rims and tires, or even just tires. That is just silly and expensive .

Tell yourself that when you are spinning your wheels in an 8-inch snow.

Reminds me of the story about a bullheaded driver who kept spinning his wheels when his car wouldn't go in the snow. He was determined to make the car move, the tires got so hot they caught on fire and he still sat there spinning them when the gas tank exploded. He preferred being dead wrong.

fowler3

gerapau · May 2005

I'm not quite sure why you wouldn't bother buying dedicated snow tires. It definately isn't silly and, when you consider that while you are using the snow tires you are prolonging the life of your summer tires, really isn't that expensive. Think about it, your summer tires will maybe last 50,000 miles. If you are an average driver you will have to replace them every few years. If you use winter tires for 4 or 5 months of the year you will probably be able to get 5 or 6 years out of your summer tires. Winter tires do tend to wear more quicky, and there is the expense of switching tires in the spring and fall (which you can reduce by buying cheap dedicated winter rims and switching the tires yourself) but buying winter tires is nowhere near as expensive as many people think. If they save you from one at-fault accident then they will probably save you money in the long run.

z71bill · May 2005

The Goodyears that came stock on my Mazda3 will be lucky to make it to 20K - no way - not even in a dream would these tires make it to 50K.

While washing the car over the weekend I found a nail in a tire - very close to the sidewall - lucky it could be patched (Discount tire - no charge)

Gave me a chance to really look at the tread - I just hit 13K - tires have 5/32 of an inch of tread left - I know you can go down to 2/32 - but I normally start shopping when I hit 3/32 -

Since I was at Discount tire I had them pull up the 205 50 17 tires they sell - Looks like a set of Kumho ASX are in my future - Drive out price was just over $500 - VS $750 for the stock Goodyears.

The sales guy said he has installed Kumho 712's for a few years and they have performed very good - He has only been selling the ASX for a few months - but has not had anyone come back with a problem. They had a few in stock - but not my size - IMO they look great - if they would have had my size it would have been 50/50 I would have dumped the Goodyears.

klj2041 · May 2005

Well my reasoning behind this is: right now I own a 1992 chev lumina sedan which has been great in the snow and for that matter every other season of the year with regular all-season goodyears. And, extremely reliable esp. in the cold. Until I started reading these boards, it never crossed my mind that I might need to buy another set of tires. I certainly don't know anyone that does this. As far as I am concerned, if reg. all seasons won't do the job it just might be enough reason to avoid this car

I mean, is this a common practice with any car? Or is the M3 just especially bad, making it warranted???

klj2041 · May 2005

npaladin2000 said: Honestly, if you live in a 6 month snow climate, then putting on snow tires every year is something you'd better get used to, for pretty much ANY car (even an awd Subie). It's simply a lot safer.

I have lived in North Dakota all my life and have driven through quite a few nasty winters. I guess I have never heard of anyone changing their tires throughout the year, especially on a subaru. My mom has a 2000 outback, and we have never once used different tires (and never had an accident either). I am not trying to argue with you, this is just my experience.

klj2041 · May 2005

What kind of tires are RS-A's? The 05 i sedan I'm looking at has 16"Toyo Proxes, are those bad too? What determines the type of tire that is installed at the factory? Are they all the same? Thanks!

npaladin2000 · May 2005

Depends on which Toyo Proxes they were wearing...1 or 2 of them are all seasons, but the rest of the line are spring-fall only.

fowler3 · May 2005

I had Kumho ECSTA 711s mounted on my 2001 Protegé LX last month, replaced the wornout Bridgestone Portenzas at 22K, at Discount Tire, and they are great! They are smooooth and quiet and yet still handle good. The size is 205 50 15HR. They cost $367. Rated as summer tires I have no problem with using them year'round even though we get some snow in NC. I don't drive anywhere when it snows.

fowler3

fowler3 · May 2005

klj2041: The tires you have on your Lumina probably have higher sidewalls than the tires Mazda puts on the S sedan and the S hatchback, the latter uses 205 50 17s, which are almost low-profile tires.
Mazda does not use *regular all-season tires*. Every Mazda owner living in snow country has bought steel rims and snow tires. Check the Canada Mazda3 forum and ask them, they will tell you.

For that matter, compare the Lumina tires or the Malibu tires to those on a Mazda3, see the difference, they are NOT sports sedans.

fowler3

z71bill · May 2005

Its always difficult to know if the sales guy is shooting straight or just trying to sell you on a more expensive item. I was told that the 712's or the ASX are a much better tire then the 711. I don't think Kumho makes a 205 50 17 size in the 711 - but I have been thinking about going to a 215 50 17 anyway.

The Kumho ASX 205 50 17 is an "extra load" rated tire. Which means a very stiff sidewall. The stock Mazda3 Goodyears are already as hard as a rock - so I don't want to go to a harsher riding tire.

Although the 215 is about 1/2 an inch wider than the 205 it should fit the stock wheels just fine. Also the diameter of the 205 50 17 Goodyear is 25.4 - the Kumho 205 is only 25.1 and the 215 50 17 is 25.5 - not enough difference to worry about.

I would guess the 215 50 17 (non extra load) would give a small improvement in the ride quality without much loss in handling - at least not enough that I would notice.

Now if I would just be lucky enough to pick up a couple of more nails I could justify dumping these Goodyears.

mz3b · May 2005

A convertable MZ3.....mmmmmm now that sounds delicious!

zoom-zoom

waygrabow · May 2005

I have driven through a fair number of nasty winters with regular tires and got where I was going, but when we bought a set of Blizzaks I discovered winter traction taken to a whole new level. When we put Blizzaks on our regular front-wheel drive car, it became a capable winter performer; when we put Blizzaks on our Audi Quattro, it was like winter never happened- the driving was like summer dry pavement. I use "Blizzak" only as one example of winter dedicated tires, but they are noticeably more sure-footed than your all-season tires. I just bought a set of all-seasons today for my Mazda3. When the weather is really bad, I'll just drive one of our 4wd vehicles. But, if you have one car you need to be able to use reliably in any weather, dedicated winter tires will give you significant added traction. That may not be important in N. Dakota, but mountains could change your perception.

dudleyr · May 2005

If snow tires are not worth the hassle, then why are airbags, seatbelts, ABS, traction control, stability control etc. They all only help very rarely and you can get along fine without them.

Of that group the most important is tires. Tires are the weakest link of what stops your car, and not stopping causes you to hit things. :sick:

BTW today is a good day for snow tires in ND. Down here in the "Banana Belt" of SD the weather is fine.

mdaffron · May 2005

Here in Virginia, people seldom buy snow tires because we'll go two or three years without a flake.

But we're in that "special area" where while the above may be true, every few years we get a 20-plus-inch snowstorm!!!

Is buying snow tires worth it for us? Good question. But then again, six inches of snow shuts down everything in our city for days because VDOT applies the same snow-tire-buying philosophy to their purchase of snow-removal equipment! You should see the bulldozers, road graders and other construction equipment churning down our streets a week after a 10-inch snowfall, when some folks are still hopelessly homebound!

So snow tires probably are not worth it, since no one in Richmond can drive unless bare pavement is showing. Get out on the road and our infamous black ice will either put you in a ditch or make someone else hit you. It's better just to stay home (there's nowhere to go anyway) and wait for the plows and sand trucks. Alas, that's our big problem -- we get more ICE, freezing rain and sleet than snow. And that's no fun to drive on -- and apparently the drivers from "up north" can't handle it either. Usually the lion's share of the wrecks and stranded vehicles we see along I-95 are the snow-tire-equipped SUVs with New York and New Hampshire plates whose drivers thought they were driving in the same nice fluffy, dry snow they get up there. NOT!

I actually love living in Virginia, where every snowfall is a school-closing, supermarket-emptying disaster. Especially when we get an active winter with lots of 3-day weekends! And this is probably one of the only places where the weather guys on TV can say there's a chance of snow, the schools announce they'll be closed the next day, and then nothing falls -- but the schools are still closed! Happens all the time! No wonder our kids are always in school until July ...

Meade

mazda6s · May 2005

A couple of points (OK, actually 3):
I lived in Wisconsin for many years and never put snow tires on FWD cars, only RWD.
Sometimes poor drivers think snow tires are going to help them driver better in snow. Not! Kinda like how a bad driver is somehow going to be "safer" driving a SUV. Doh!
The only thing snow tires do is sometimes help you from getting stuck in deep snow. Maybe.
Then again, I actually LIKE driving on ice, so what do I know?

fowler3 · May 2005

Every ice and snow storm is different. You cannot count on conditions being exactly the same with every change in the weather. There's always the driver who should have stayed at home or should have left sooner to get where he/she "just has to be in the next 20 minutes". Even with 4", 6", 8-inches of snow on the roads, if you have the wrong tires for the road conditions you could be at fault in an accident. If the police say to stay off the roads -- STAY OFF -- even with snow tires.

Like mdaffron, I use to live in Virginia, now live in North Carolina and the weather here is about like there, only NC gets more ice than snow. People here panic if there's a few snow flakes, they buy everything that doesn't require cooking from supermarket shelves. Sometimes I wonder what they do with all that bread, jelly, and peanut butter when the storm proves to be less than forcast. They drive like there is a tornado on their tails. The danger is the drivers, not the ice or snow storm. This is WHY you need snow tires or at least tires which will stop your car safely.

Getting stuck in snow happens to everyone at some point, be prepared, carry a blanket, water, and breakfast bars in your car trunk during winter months. Knowing how to get free takes experience. And you can hit black ice when the temperature is well above freezing.

How many times have you heard know-it-alls and naysayers say, "I know, I know, I should have..."?

fowler3

mazda6s · May 2005

Black ice, as we all know, a good excuse for not paying attention to road conditions and/or driving beyond one's abilities.

"But officer, it wasn't my fault, it was that EVIL BLACK ICE!"

But wait, isn't this supposed to be a discussion of the Mazda3? Where's a moderator when you need one?

pat · May 2005

Haven't you learned by now that the moderator only shows up to annoy you?

gerapau · May 2005

Mazda6s, I disagree fully with your statement "The only thing snow tires do is sometimes help you from getting stuck in deep snow. Maybe." While there is probably not anything that can be done for "poor drivers", most other drivers can improve their winter driving skills simply by buying a good set of winter tires. I am not saying that a set of tires will turn you into a vastly improved driver (and you should always take it easy when the road conditions are bad) but snow tires will make your car handle much better in snow (and thus help avoiding problems). The difference between a good set of winter tires and all seasons is like night and day when roads are snowy or icy. In addition to helping you from getting stuck in snowy conditions, the will also, more importantly, help you stop in snowy or icy conditions.

Now don't get me wrong, if I lived somewhere where we only saw snow once every few years (don't I wish) I would probably not bother buying winter tires either, but if you live somewhere where snow is a regular occurance winter tires are probably a very good investment.

fowler3 · May 2005

In the 1950s, '60s, and '70s small cars were much lighter than current compacts. Most owners who had VW Beetles or smaller Renaults got along fine on snow if the driving wheels carried most of the weight of the car. They never thought about winter tires much less chains. Often I could go where large American cars could not. But now, compact cars approach 3000 pounds and the weight bias doesn't always favor the driving wheels. All Season radials work much better than summer radials and, of course, dedicated snow tires have larger lugs to grip with.

It depends on the drivers experience and the conditions he is use to where he lives. For me, I never think about winter tires having driven FWD cars for 31 years in all kinds of weather. But I would not drive when the snow depth is deeper than the road clearance under the car or there is ice. The other thing is Mazda uses low-profile tires on the 3-series, or almost low-pros. I have them on my Protegé and I keep looking at them and at other compact cars which have thicker tires. They look odd. They definately do not look like all-season radials.

Hi Pat_HOST! Thought you got stuck in the snow some place!

Now, back to regular programming!

fowler3

ivan_99 · May 2005

I just drove a 3s with sport package and I must say it was the best handling car Ive ever driven; and Ive driven a few high end sports cars.

I was initially looking for a commuter car since we just purchased an expensive family vehicle (mini-van).

After looking at used cars and only seeing junk from anywhere between $6-10K (with high miles) we decided to look at cheaper new vehicles (teens to 20k). I even went to a chevy dealership to look at an Aveo (this was a definite low point from my days driving Audis and Infinitis). I thought that the Aveo was ok for what it was.

I found a Mazda dealership (not too many around here) and they only had 2 models, both automatic; since this is my commuter car I refuse to drive (and pay for) something I find worthless. I decided that since there were no m3s Id go look at a Scion tC. In our search for the elusive Scion dealerships we stumbled upon a new Mazda dealership; that had many (looked like over 40) 3s as well as a few manuals.

Long story short, Id be driving it now except the finance department seemed to think if I could afford higher payments then I must be willing to do it. Financing gap insurance and required additional warranty seems foolhardy at bestIf my financial institution offers me the rate I want, I will go back and get it; otherwise it may just be fond memories for me.

npaladin2000 · May 2005

That was probably just a tactic by the dealer to get more money out of you...financing at the dealer tends toward being more expensive anyway, since the dealer gets a percentage for providing you with the convienience of "one-stop shopping" so to speak. Fair enough, but I'll take a trip to my bank to get the lower interest rate. Besides, then you can just negotiate out-the-door price rather than payments...much less confusing that way.

Incidentally, neither one of those items is REQUIRED when financing a car, AFAIK. So if they're gonna pull things like that, it probably wouldn't be a good idea to finance through them anyway.

ivan_99 · May 2005

Can anybody tell me all the dirt on the 3?

I want to hear everything negative, specifically relating to the 2005 2.3s. Ive scanned the 3 problem board and found issues with the 2004 (brakes and AC), but in addition to mechanical problems, Id like to hear about real world problem and annoyances.

E.g. Seats wear out quickly, poor rear visibility, gas door doesnt always open, paint fads/chips easily, floor mats stain easily, cup holder dumps drink on lap etc.

Im close to going forward with a purchase, so I already like it. I actually think its great, so I dont need to be sold on it. I actually didnt even check out most of the optionsmy decision (which is almost finalized) was based on how it drove :shades: .

kyfdx · May 2005

Got a few hours to read?

z71bill, "Mazda3 Owners: Problems & Solutions" #1674, 15 May 2005 11:24 pm

ivan_99 · May 2005

Just read all the 2005 posts, still not sure if there are issues for 05posted question there.

ivan_99 · May 2005

Just drove it home todaya real joy.

I ended up getting an extended warranty ($1,200) through my credit union; 5 years, 100K mi, 0 deductible, if I sell its transferable or I can get refunded the amount not used.

I did it mostly for the miles, I usually dont intend to put a large amount of miles on, but I usually end up going 15-20K a year. Probably not a wise investmentbut neither are new cars

I think Ill get some good tint to keep out the heat to help with cooling (not that I noticed any problems).

Q: Does anybody have the clear nose masks installed; this is the 3M clear plastic sheets? I get easily annoyed with stone chips.

david6 · May 2005

My wife and I found ourselves buying an MZ3 s (for her) on Saturday, and picked it up last night after the dealer prepped it. We then went home, dropped off my vehicle, and I proceeded to navigate a nice windy drive for her. What a fun car! We are very excited by our purchase.

We very recently moved to North Carolina, so I've been interested by the posts regarding Carolina winter weather and the value of snow tires (and rushing to the grocery store). I guess I'll wait to see what it's like before I decide on the need for winter tires.

Thanks to all for the info we gathered by lurking on the various Mazda3 boards.

mdaffron · May 2005

Where are you in NC?

We live in Virginia, but I've got some friends in NC (including one named David in Charlotte).

Meade

fowler3 · May 2005

I live near Greensboro and posted about the weather here. Greensboro's weather is similar to southwest Virginia's. Except they get more snow.

fowler3

ellusionz21 · May 2005

Someone on one of my other boards (mazda3forums) posted that there was a recall for the airbag sensor I think? Dunno what year it was though. But they said it was just a few cars.

alfmz3 · May 2005

I'm still waiting for Mazda Motor Corp...

It will be installed in Mexico this year.

ivan_99 · May 2005

98F today...AC maxed out but it kept it cool.

Needs tinting.

jbollt · May 2005

109 degrees (yeah, it's a DRY heat! 14%) here in Southern AZ today, and my son says A/C got him cool after 10 min..05 Hatch ...Car was sitting in the sun for 8 hours, used windshield sun shade, no tint ..yet.....tomorrow he gets tinting.

anon70 · May 2005

and after 8hrs in the sun, will tinting help at all?

z71bill · May 2005

Not sure how much difference tinting would make - any car that sits in the bright sunlight for hours on a 95+ degree day will be very hot -

It seems like the main advantage would be to reduce the heat load entering the car WHILE you are trying to keep it cool.

If I am driving my Mazda3 on a bright & sunny 95 degree day the AC (surprise) does not cool my car - but if the sun goes behind a cloud / or if I stop under an overpass for a red light I can feel an improvement in the AC performance. The car will actually start to almost cool off - then as soon as the sun comes back out I can feel the additional heat load.

It is like the AC is just not able to handle the additional heat load that is generated by the sun hitting the car. At night the AC works pretty good.

A new car should not have to have dark tinted windows - or be driven only at night and on cloudy days - the AC should handle a 100 degree - bright sunny day - with a car full of people - stuck in traffic - sure the AC would be on max - and I don't expect people would be complaining about being cold - but the passengers should not be sweating like pigs (BTW I know pigs don't really sweat).

autonomous · May 2005

Not sure how much difference tinting would make - any car that sits in the bright sunlight for hours on a 95+ degree day will be very hot -
I agree. Moreover, since one cannot tint the windscreen (aka front window) its usefullness is diminished; I use a simple screen to deflect the rays and keep the car cool.

jbollt · May 2005

I agree, that the windshield is perhaps one of the biggest causes of interior heat, and we all use sun screens here in the desert. However, we also tint our side windows, as the suns rays beating on your arm thru an un-tinted window feels much hotter than thru a tinted one, so I suspect that side tinting will also do some to lessen the heat load....It is still very hot inside a car that sits in the sun for any length of time, in our summer heat.

We will walk much further thru the parking lot to the front door of a store, if we find a shady parking spot....

anon70 · May 2005

My Mazda3 that i bought last month has red tail light coverings.

I was at the dealer today and noticed all the Mazda3 cars (~10) at the lot have black tail light coverings, which makes it look much better.

Did they change the design mid-season???

Mazda3

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