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Idle or Stalling Problems - All Vehicles

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    77hchbck77hchbck Member Posts: 24
    Check your distributor for oil leaking past the oil seal. It will saturate the cam position sensor and cause this kind of problem. Fixed my sons 95 Alty with a $3 oil seal and cleaned all the oil out of the distributor, especially the optical sensor and metal timing disc area (cam position sensor) in there behind the dust cover.

    That was about a year and a half ago and still no further problems. He's over 240K miles now.
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    lfayelfaye Member Posts: 1
    Out of the Blue, my '97 Altima suddenly quit starting. Fortunately we were not far from home. In our attempts to limp it there however, we noted that if sat for an hour or so it would restart with no problems & go for a few miles or more. Took all day, but we finally made it to a mechanic. I was told the problem could not be located & to scrap the car. It has only 148K on it and while I was prepared to rebuild the transmission (which is slowly going), I had no reason to expect any other disfunction. Shouldn't it last longer than this? I have been shopping, but can find nothing in my price range under 135K so I'm now wondering if I should focus on the Altima again. The problem began so abruptly, I'm suspecting it is an isolated and very fixable part. Suggestions?
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    khallkhall Member Posts: 1
    I got in my van today, simply to move it out of the driveway and it started right up, but then died. Each time I tried, it would start right up as normal but then when it should begin to idle it simply stalled. Yesterday I drove it and it was fine. I'm stumped.
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    burdinburdin Member Posts: 1
    Recently purchased for my daughter, the car would run very rough after 10 or 15 minutes, (changed plugs, wires, distributor cap and rotor, coil pack, both inline fuel filters), occasionally the roughness clears itself up, other times it continues until it eventually stalls out. When restarted it strarts right back up, and runs fine for 10 to 15 minutes where it does it rought thing again. Got the advice to change the fuel sock on the fuel pump, so, I dropped the tank (which I later found out I didn't need to drop the tank to get to the pump), and replaced the pump and the sock. Reinstalled the tank, and started the car up, the car runs on its intial idle, then when it comes down to normal idle, it stalls. You can keep it running by keeping your foot on the accelerator, but once you pull your foot off, and the engine speed goes down, it stalls.
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Check for a vacuum leak, and try some very STRONG injector cleaner. If this car has a carburetor (I forget on cars this old), then that's where your problem probably is. Japanese carburetors have notoriously tiny passages that clog up with time and use.
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    lynn5lynn5 Member Posts: 2
    Hi, This is lynn s. I think i "fixed" my own problem. I disconnected the rectangular plug on the right side of the engine compartment and reconnected it. It didn't seem to have any problems i.e. corrosion or loose connections. Anyway it's months later, now has about 86,000 miles and we've had no further problems. I pray it stays that way as we had Volvos in the past that had weird intermittent problems.
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    jussijussi Member Posts: 3
    95 Alty still stalling after doing what you suggested, new seal. Glad it worked out for your son. There was indeed oil in my distrib but supposedly this was now cleaned out along with the sensor etc. Now check engine light is on, codes pulled were for cam sensor and knock sensor probs. Could oil be spinning through the center shaft being worn out? Think a new distributor is in order, or should another cleaning do the trick? Any additonal help is appreciated! Thanks :confuse:
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    97altima97altima Member Posts: 1
    I have a 97 Altima with same problem! I have very interested to see what needs to be done to fix it. I can only drive it for 15 - 20 minutes without it stalling. Nothing to date has worked and I've spent alot of $$$$. I have 130,000 mile and have kept up with the maintenance. The dealer had no idea what to do because they couldn't get any 'codes' to come up when it failed.
    :cry:
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    logansmomlogansmom Member Posts: 1
    I have a '96 Accord LX. My car startes the same thing yesterday, but has yet to stall. No check engine light either!! (No check engine light, no codes...) If you find out the problem with yours, would you be so kind to email it to me also? I also had my A/C go out the same day! What a pain. This is my 3rd honda and i've never had a problem with the other 2. Thanks a bunch!

    Amanda Parker
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    bgoldbgold Member Posts: 1
    My 2000 Subaru Outback runs fine for a couple of days and then starts a rough idle, becomes difficult to get going after coming to a stop (my daughter says it feels like being on a bucking bronco, not that she's ever done that!) and stalls periodically (usually after coming to a stop, but sometimes right after putting my foot on the gas again). I recently had the Throttle Position Sensor replaced per codes that were indicated from a computer check, but this time around the check engine light is not going on and there are no codes indicated (my mechanic has checked numerous times). Help, help, help!!!!! I am really worried every time I drive the car. Thanks
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    huskerfansamhuskerfansam Member Posts: 2
    My wife's 99 booneville did the same thing, took nearly 3 mechanics and finally a truly once one to fix and correctly diagnose the problem. The problem is you have a intake upper manifold that is cracked or defective, apparently is quite a problem with this year of booneville's with the 3.8 Liter engine, don't waste anymore money with diagnostic codes, etc. It will need about 600 dollars to repair and replace this part. But after her's was fixed the car ran like a champ. Apparently the factory or stock one is cheaply made and is suspectible to cracking and breaking. We had seriously considered trading off the car, but it was running so poor who would buy it. I am really glad to offer my experience to you, and trust me this is what the problem is. The manifold will leak antifreeze into your oil and if you don't get this properly fixed it will ruin the engine. GM should make good on these, but they have said "there's no problem." the local pontiac dealer here in Omaha estimated, the repair to be between 2-4000 dollars. Our trusted mechanic did it and much more for around 600 bucks, including new platinum sparkplugs, tune up and the coolant fixed. It's a real kicker to get diagnosed that is for sure. Good luck and you're car will be like new in no time. Sincerely,
    Huskerfansam
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    huskerfansamhuskerfansam Member Posts: 2
    I recently bought this nice little Nissan 94 Altima GXE for my daughter. It was bought off a "friend." They stated that it ran great for them, however it wasn't until we had a few days when you drove it a while (15-30minutes) that it wouldn't start until the engine cooled down. I suspect this is why they decided to sell it so cheap. My neighbor the mechanic thought it was the ignition coil; so I replaced it, and that seemed to resolve the problem. However it started doing it again and when I drove it to the store to get gas, the check engine light kept coming on. I did however notice that after just a minute of starting the engine, from a complete cold-start the temp gauge would be sitting in the middle, and it wouldn't move really up or down, this seemed odd to me. So when I let the car idle for 10-20 minutes the radiator fans would only come on for about 20 seconds and then shut off. While I was driving the car around with the AC off the car would sputter and stammer and the check engine light would come on, and when I turn the AC on this allows for the fans to be overriden and to operate, the car runs fine, will start and I suspect keeps it cooler under the hood. So I am pretty sure I am looking at a possible temperature sensor that is bad? Anyone got any guess, or advice to offer up. I thought the Distributor Module might be bad, due to the hot engine then having to cool down to restart, but it is apparent that the ignition coil was getting overr heated and wouldn't ignite until it cooled down, don't want to waste anymore money trying to solve it myself. Have replaced the following: fuel filter, spark plugs, spark plug wire, ignition coil. Thinking of taking it to the Nissan Dealer to have them diagnose it. Thanks. Huskerfansam
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    leaf68leaf68 Member Posts: 1
    1995 Honda Civic, 5 speed manual, won't idle. If you pull your foot too high up on the gas it will stall. Sitting at a light, you can't put it in neutral and just step on the break, the car quickly sputters and dies. It starts right back up, but you have to rev the engine to keep the engine running. Help!!!! Leaf68 :cry: :confuse: :sick:
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    misstmisst Member Posts: 1
    I own a 95 Mitsubishi Galant. It stalls out at stop lights/signs. Does anyone know what is causing this problem? I had a full tune up and the fuel pressure and EGR valve was checked - all O.K. Also, there were no codes stored in the computer. I am stumped. Please help me!
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    igiveupigiveup Member Posts: 1
    My Honda Civic 93 is always stalling too.

    I have had alot repaired in the past week. My car seems to be stalling when i stop at lights or turns, it's terrible. I bought the car two sundays ago and i am having stalling problems, the mechanic seems to say its the fuel injection pumps that are blocked. On thursday i am leaving it with another mechanic to finally tell me what the problem is. Anyone have any ideas?
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    bigmommabigmomma Member Posts: 1
    My 2000 Altima was stalling too, and getting worse. Putting the EMC into self-diagnostic mode kept pointing towards the Mass Airflow Sensor (MAS). I would reset the code, and 25 miles later it would begin stalling, idling poorly, surging when driving, etc. Finally I took the MAS out and cleaned it according to the Haynes manual. Re-installed it, and checked the voltages per Haynes manual - all showed okay, but car still acting up. Problem got worse, didn't want to buy a new MAS on spec, and didn't want Nissan to pick my pocket for a grand, so, in desperation, I removed the top cover from the MAS (it is sealed in with soft silicon caulk). It was easy to get open, and once inside, I discovered three broken solder joints between the circuit board and the connector socket. I soldered them, sealed the lid back on, reinstalled it, and the car now runs like a dream. Saved myself $500.00 just for the part alone. Who says you can't beat the system??

    The MAS had been intermittent, but getting more so as time went on. Intermittent problems are always hard to find. Its intermittent behaviour was causing other codes too, such as failed O2 sensor. When the MAS fails, the fuel injection system goes crazy, ...can't decide how much gas to feed the engine, injector pulse-widths all screwed up. Car runs poorly and burns too much gas, ...rear bumper was turning black. This also makes the O2 sensors unhappy. Soldering those broken leads fixed everything, and got rid of all the other aberrant codes too. If this ever happened to me again on this or any other OBD-II car, I'd check the MAS first thing.
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    junkmanjunkman Member Posts: 1
    My 96 Jeep is in good to excellent condition otherwise. 50+K miles and 4 years of troublefree driving. It has started simply dieing at random miles and conditions. About every 100 to 200 miles it simply dies. After a few minutes of sitting, it starts up again as if nothing happened. Dangerous and nervewracking!
    Local mechanic charged me $81 to tell me nothing is wrong that he can see.
    Any suggestions? Thanks! :confuse:
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Oh this is a chronic and common Jeep misbehavior....now I just have to remember what it was! :confuse: I THINK it is the ignition control module that takes a dump when it gets hot. You might ask the boys over in the Jeep Wrangler forum. You can find them by using our "browse by topic" or browse by vehicle functions to the left of this page. As I recall, this is a fix you can do yourself. I remember asking the Jeep boys a couple years ago about this, concerning a friend's Wrangler, and they directed me right to the problem.
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    huber53huber53 Member Posts: 3
    My Chevy truck runs for 3 mins, then dies--it starts back up-runs for a couple of mins, then dies again. It will do this about 5 times in a row. After it sits for a few mins, it fires back up. Have replaced fuel pump-and filter--any ideas--

    Thanks,
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    We'll need the year, model and engine size to go any further with this problem.
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    huber53huber53 Member Posts: 3
    It's a 87 C20 with a 350 fuel injected.

    Thanks,

    Chuck
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Will it always restart immediately when it dies, or does it die and then you can't restart it no matter what you do? Does this go away after a number of restarts or is the problem always there and the truck unusable?
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    huber53huber53 Member Posts: 3
    It restarts instantly for about 4 times in a row, then won't but after sitting for a couple of mins it will restart and then the same thing--
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Well the trick is to start diagnosis when there is a no start. You have to determine a couple of things:

    1. Are you getting a fuel injector pulse (test with a noid light that you can buy cheap from a parts store)

    2. If you are getting a fuel injector pulse, do you have fuel pressure in the fuel rail?

    3. If you have fuel pressure and an injector pulse, do you have spark when cranking?

    One of these is going to be "NO" and then you track down that issue.

    It's very hard to guess if you have a fuel or electrical issue going on here...one or the other is phasing in and out.
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    martinhuemartinhue Member Posts: 2
    HELP, my 90 300zx just got back from the mecanic. took it in because after shifting into drive engine stalled. was able to restart but stalled again after re-shifting into drive. Mecanic said car checked a-ok with NO problems, drove the car day and a half and it did it again. anyone has any ideas? ...note: if i rev engine, step on brake, drive off with engine revving sometimes it stays on mostly stalls. Noticed it giving of some black smoke-not burning gas properly? Thanks, any help greatly appreciated
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Yeah, usually this kind of stall is a result of a screwed up air/fuel mixture, either too lean (vacuum leak perhaps) or too rich (bad sensor?).

    Black smoke is not a good sign--certainly there is a problem with that. Let's run a read up the tailpipe and see what's going on.
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    marbles528marbles528 Member Posts: 1
    I have a 97 geo tracker 1.6L 4 cylinder engine. Car history: bought in 2001, one previous owner. I had the car one year when it started acting up, throwing the check engine light, bad idle (bouncing around, threatened to stall). The first time was legit (environmental part was hanging by a thread), then kept throwing the light without any codes, and the idle didn't resolve completely. Mechanic advised me to wait and see since it would cost $$$$ to replace a bad comp. Come to find out that the 'dummy light' is a common problem for geos, just makes it difficult to know when there is a problem. At the time, I replaced a whole lot of different things (filters, distributor), had a tune-up, etc. and the idling slowly improved, haven't had any problems until last xmas. All of a sudden, lots of hesitation, surging, BAD gas mileage. Had fuel system cleaned, tuned up after they read a 'sparkplug misfire' from the comp, ended up replacing a clogged fuel injector. My problem: Though improved, I STILL hadn't seen a return to my previous fuel economy as the weather has warmed, which it normally does, and it seems to require some force to get up to speed. I was strongly considering having the fuel filter replaced since it was last done in 2002 and 30,000 miles ago during my massive hunt for a 'fix' and the manual was calling for it. Yesterday and again today upon startup the idle trembles, dips, and tumbles down to nothing and stalls out. If I give it gas, it revs, but still tumbles when I let up. If I shift out of park it will regain ground and (seems to) behave just fine after a few stops (i.e. the idle will shimmy a little, but hasn't died). But if I shut the car off and restart, the cycle starts over again. I don't drive much, so the car HAD been setting for several days. But I will be making some trips this summer, and I'm concerned about how to resolve these problems and if they are related to the same thing or separate ones. I've looked through this thread and can't seem to find my specific issue, so I'd gladly listen to any advice before bringing myself to the mercy of a mechanic (I'm new in town and don't know anyone yet/don't know where to go) as I'm a student and my budget is tight enough already..Thanks--Katherine
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    michaelemichaele Member Posts: 2
    my 99 grand am gt is missing. shows #4 cylinder missfire.changed injector,coil,plug,and plug wire.still shows #4cylinder missfire.also checked compression on 4.can someone help.
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    christi100christi100 Member Posts: 1
    Hi,

    I own the same car and I'm having the same problems. Did you find out what was wrong with yours?
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    sandy_idasandy_ida Member Posts: 1
    i have a 93 mustang lx that i am trying to keep alive. i started having problems with it a few months ago. first while driving the check engine light would come on and the idle would drop to half, making the car shake and seem as if it was going to turn off. soon after that problem began if when i turned my ignition and if the check engine light would not come on the car would not start. i had the car checked and i was told it was my fuel filter so i replaced it two weeks ago and my car has had the same symptoms still and yesterday it died. any help would be great.
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    samiam5samiam5 Member Posts: 1
    I'm having a similar problem as those I've read in this forum, but it's a little different. First I started noticing my car was "surging, bucking" felt the same as when my spark plugs went but only very sporadically. Then, it seemed that it was just with the air on. Also, sometimes when stopped the idle jumped down and then back up and it hesitated when I accelerated. I've taken it to the mechanic, no codes, replaced the air filter, checked belts, and charged the freon, as it seemed to be that it was only with the air on. However, on the way home after having the freon charged, it started again, with the air on. So, it ran fine for a couple days without the air, but then it started doing it with the air off. It seems to start about 5 minutes or so after I leave the house and seems to be worse in the afternoon than in the morning or when it's cooler. It's very sporadic, it'll "stutter" a few times after I've driven for a few minutes, and then maybe do it once more in a 20-min round trip, so it's been hard to duplicate. Also, the mechanic checked the spark plugs and they were fine. Alternator is only a couple years old with maybe 20,000 miles on it. If anyone has ANY ideas, I would greatly, greatly appreciate it! Thanks for any help. :cry:
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    toomanyfumestoomanyfumes Member Posts: 1,019
    My 2001 Villager with the 3.3 V-6 and only 37000 miles starts up, then stalls. It might do this once or twice, then it runs fine. It seems to do it more when the car is warm, but it does it occasionally on a cold start also. I bought the car new, and has never been tuned up, ( 100,000 mile plugs, but I have changed the air filter.) Any help would be appreciated, otherwise it's going to the dealer, the wife does't trust it now.
    2012 Mustang Premium, 2013 Lincoln MKX Elite, 2007 Mitsubishi Outlander.
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    daenddadaendda Member Posts: 2
    I have a 65 Mustang with a 351W and 4 speed trans and everytime I want to start out of 1st gear especially from a complete stop the RPMs rise to about 3000 and then just drop to maybe 500. Inorder to keep the car from dying I have to "see-saw" back and forth between the clutch and the gas until 1st completely engages. If I try any other method then all I do is burn the clutch or look like an idiot having to restart my car in the middle of an intersection. Is there maybe a problem with my gear ratios cause I can start in 2nd easier than I can start in 1st? Thanks for any help you can give.
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    lou_williamslou_williams Member Posts: 2
    I have a 90 Tempo that has only one issue. The idle is low and it is causing the oil pressure light to go on when it is idling and it stalls many times when you come to a stop. I don't know how to make the adjustment to increase the idle. It is set about 500 rpm at this point and should be between 700 and 800 to operate correctly
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    daenddadaendda Member Posts: 2
    lou, dunno if that has a carburetor or fuel injector but most carburetors have a spring on the right hand side while youre looking at it that is attached to the pedal assembly (normally they have a red tint). just tighten or loosen that spring until you reach the necessary rpms.
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    pmetzpmetz Member Posts: 2
    I bought the car new and at 26,000 miles had to have crankshaft position sensors replaced in 2002 under warranty. Car would abruptly die. Now have just had to have them replaced again at 56,000 miles. This time I was forced to pay as car is out of warranty. I am trying to find if this is wide spread problem. I am contacting zone rep. to see if can help but am not confident. Is this problem part of a recall etc.?
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    lou_williamslou_williams Member Posts: 2
    Sorry it is multi port FI, Carbs I underdstand but FI is new to me.
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    nbarnettnbarnett Member Posts: 2
    Hello, I bought my 300ZX not running. I put a transmission, mass air flow sensor, replaced distributor, new battery, changed out all the hoses and belts, put a new crank angle sensor,and all new spark plugs. It was starting but wouldn't idle RPMS would spike and then die spike and then die and then the car would die. Now it wont even turn over. I have taken it to two mechanics and no one has clue. Any advice or help would be greatly appreciated.
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    jeep1051jeep1051 Member Posts: 1
    I have a 1999 Jeep Cherokee Sport that has 74000 miles automatic 4.0L. I will be
    driving along and it feels like I run out of gas. It has happened on the Highway
    and side streets it dies and some times it starts back up other times I have to pull
    over and stop the car, put it in park and restart. Most of the time it restarts right away
    and others it takes a couple tries. This happens with different levels of gas in the tank.
    I check and it doesn't have a normal fuel filter, it has a fuel filter/pressure regulator.
    It states that doesn't require normal maintenance to replace only if diagnostics
    requires to do so. I have just run some fuel injector cleaner through it and it is still
    occurring. Do you have any suggestions on what could be causing this?
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    rafalrafal Member Posts: 1
    I have the same problem with my 94 Nissan Altima. When driving for about 8-10 miles the engine jurks and eventually dies and after 16 months of on and off diagnostics I can't find the remedy. I changed the fuel filter the fuel injector the distributor cap and distributor rotor. It seem that the next logical part I would check as suggested by somebody in the forum is the Mass Airflow Sensor (MAS or MAF as it is refered in my Haynes repair manual).
    The manual states " The MAS is located on the air inteke duct. This sensor uses a hot wire sensing element to measure the amount of air entering the engine. The air passing over the hot wire causes it to cool. Consequently, this change in temperature can be converted into an analog voltage signal to the ECM (Engine Control Module which is located behind the center console, to the right of the accelerator pedal). which in turn calculates the required fuel injector pulse width".

    If by any chance you have fixed the problem would you share the good news and remedy. Thanks .
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    euphorbiaeuphorbia Member Posts: 14
    I have a 96 Sunfire 2.4 (4 speed automatic) with 140,000 miles on it. It has been a reliable car since new. Recently it has been stalling when I brake from high speed. I notice that the tach falls below 500 rpm at those times and I can hear a clicking sound coming from the engine compartment from inside the car. Does anybody have any experience with what might be the cause? I have replaced the throttle position sensor and tested and cleaned the Idle Air Control (IAC) valve and the condition didn't change. I have also checked for vacuum leaks and found none. The OBD II code checker indicates no service codes.

    Euphorbia
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    ken39ken39 Member Posts: 8
    We just moved to Colorado from Florida and after about 2 weeks here in this higher altitude the van started stalling at any speed, but mostly when I had driven on the highway for a while and then it would stall after stopping. Gas hissed when removing cap. (It was also a hotter set of days in the upper 90's when this started happening) Would let set for 30 minutes or so and start again only to get 15 miles or so. Stopped car overnight at home and removed gas cap next day before driving and van seems to run better. Was told by someone problem could be with thermostat so just for cheap kicks I will go ahead and try replacing it. Have also tried injector cleaner and octane booster too, along with expensive premium gas. Any help would be appreciated as gas vapors get very heavy when we drive with the gas cap off.
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    You might swap out your air filter for a new one. You need to have the car scanned and the fuel pressure on the injection rail checked.
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    richardjjuniorrichardjjunior Member Posts: 2
    I Have a 96 altima that is doing the same thing!!! I replaced the distributor and the coil as well as cleared all ecm codes. it ran better than ever for 3 days, then it started acting up when it wants to, and giving a trouble code for the knock sensor. every time I take it to get it looked at, it runs great, so the can't diagnose it. if you ever do figure out what is doing it to yours please send me an email!!!
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    richardjjuniorrichardjjunior Member Posts: 2
    Let me know hoe that turns out with the maf sensor. i am thinking about changing my ECM. i had been trying things on my own but i am taking it to a mechanic tomorrow. my email is richardjjunior@yahoo.com if you or anyone figures this out.
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    skabadelicskabadelic Member Posts: 1
    Hello, recently I have been having an odd problem with my Cadillac. I own a 1994 STS.

    When driving and while sitting, my engine revs on its own accord. It "bucks" as I'm driving, and it has recently began to stall when I am sitting at a stop light. It started off as an occasional problem, but is now unbearable. I somewhat get the impression that the car is almost dying [lights dim, power steering slightly fades] and the car "revs" to save itself. The check engine light is on when I have my foot off of the gas, but a lot of the time when I am pressing the gas the light goes off. My car also seems to have poor gas mileage. I’ve taken it to one mechanic. They seemed to have no idea what the problem was and recommended that I try a Cadillac dealer. The dealer was the last place that I wanted to go, but I did. Now the dealer seems to be somewhat unsure of the problem. I am told that they are replacing a sensor [I’m sorry I forgot what he called it] and that it MAY fix the problem and MAY NOT. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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    ken39ken39 Member Posts: 8
    I pulled the air filter for a new one and in a few days we are bringing it in for our mechanic to check all that you listed. Now we are getting a pretty heavy gas smell inside the van while we drive. Thanks for the reply!
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Well have him also check the Evaporative Emissions Cannister and the lines that connect to it.

    Remember also you will lose 3 to 4% of your horsepower for every 1,000 feet of altitude. So if you go to Pike's Peak you are down 40% or more!!!

    (not turbo cars though).
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    alan22alan22 Member Posts: 3
    This is common problem with these and all jeeps, I have one that had that problem. The trouble is with the Crankshaft position sensor. Over time it becomes temperature sensitive, Because it needs electrictiy to work it self heats and goes into thermal runawayand cause both spark and fuel systems to go crazy! Turn the vehicle off for 20-30 minutes to let it cool down and it runs like its ok until it heats up again. Get a new one for about $30.00 , the part is located on the bell housing, two screws but it can be difficult to get at without a lift, so you may have to have it replaced for you.

    Hope that helps!
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    steve34steve34 Member Posts: 4
    Can that sensor also act up when the engine is still cold? I have a similar problem with my vehicle but it will also act up when first starting out and the temp hasn't gone up yet.
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