2011 Hyundai Sonata

chrono

Did anyone catch autoblogs real world mileage comments .. just impressive.

We'd be remiss to not discuss fuel economy, as the Sonata's left a huge impression on us. As mentioned, the EPA rates the automatic models we were driving at 22 mpg city and 35 highway. In usual fashion, we typically take those EPA number and subtract a couple points to get "real world MPG," right? Well, it seems the 2011 Hyundai Sonata is also out to dispel that age-old calculation. In our "real world" driving up and down the hills surrounding San Diego, the on-board computer calculated 37.8 MPG during the morning trip... and we could have easily pushed 40 MPG had we attempted some hypermiling tricks.

bobad

I bought my 06 Sonata because it was the best value and had the best warranty in the segment. The 2011 seems to be the best car in the segment, and still has the best value and warranty. Honestly, I saw this day coming back in 2005.

ergsum

http://www.automobilemag.com/reviews/driven/1002_2011_hyundai_sonata/index.html

jaimeson

It seems like a lot of the reviews are actually beating the EPA fuel estimates. I know that's common, but seeing near 40mpg (or more!) in a large family sedan is astounding.

bobad

http://www.automobilemag.com/reviews/driven/1002_2011_hyundai_sonata/index.html

"flinty-eyed sedan shoppers"

wolverinejoe80

CAR OF THE YEAR OR BUST!

wow, this is a mindboggling achievement.

backy

It appears rumors of a possible future V6 for the Sonata are incorrect. Here's a quote from the Automobile Magazine review:

Not having to design the front structure to carry a heavier V-6 allowed Hyundai to save about 100 pounds, helping make the Sonata at least a few -- and as many as a few hundred -- pounds lighter than the rest of the midsize sedan field, save the equally svelte Nissan Altima.

So the Sonata is simply not designed to handle a V6.

Who cares?

dash5

Not me, but I'm sure the people who previously owned a V6 will need convincing. Still the CEO claims that's about 10% of the buyers and they do have a turbo to address people who want more power. If the turbo is good and gets at or near the same mpg, that'll be quite interesting.

But yeah 0 chance of a V6, they've been saying they feel the V6 will "go the way of the dinosaur" and seem committed to the turbo as an alternative. If it puts out 250hp with good mileage and low weight I can see why they made that choice.

stickguy

Agreed. Who cares? Given the traditional take rate of ~10%, they will likely be $$ ahead going with the 4 only, especially with 200HP and as nice as it sounds.

And the Turbo should capture some of the lost 10% too.

Probably more of an issue in the luxury class, which is why the TSX just added one, even though it makes the car heavier, less nimble, thirstier, and only marginally faster (hard to keep to omuch power down with FWD).

But, it is 3K more expensive!

m6user

I've not read one auto writer complain about the new Sonata's power steering in that it's electric vs. hydraulic. It seems that many, if not a majority, of other new cars that have went to EPS have been gigged for it from a road feedback and maintaining a straight line without constant adjustments aspect.

backy

I think only some automakers have been taken to task for that, especially Toyota. VW for example uses EPS and you don't hear complaints about steering feel in those cars. My Rabbit with EPS tracked great, no problems whatsoever.

m6user

Maybe that's the case. Some just do it better than others. Appears Hyundai has done it right. However, several reviews of the Forte when it first came out kind of slammed the EPS in the lower cost versions but liked the steering in the SX which was still hydraulic if I remember correctly. Same for the Fusion if I think. Not really bad critiques but it was nice to not see anything about it in the Sonata reviews.

swingman

Motor Trend said the 0-60 time of the SE was only 8.1 seconds.

That's .4 seconds slower than they have for the Altima 2.5 SL

Anyone else find that strange given the Sonata has the best power to weight ratio in the class?

I wonder if smart use of the paddle shifters would help the 0-60 figure.

By the way, I know this car wasn't built for speed but it's always good to have a little get up and go power.

smarty666

well I'll have to tell you all, I never was that impressed with Hyundai and before the Genesis came out I didn't really give them a seconds thought, but with the Genesis and now with the new Sonata, I'm definitely giving Hyundai a good look at and serious consideration when I need to get a car the next time!

Hyundai is doing a lot more then GM or Toyota ever have with changing their company and taking some bold styling changes! Toyota and Lexus should take a cue from Hyundai on how to integrate some aggressive styling into their mostly bland mediocre body styles! Hopefully, Hyundai will continue some of their trend of bold, new body styles in several of their other models besides the Sonata!

Good Work Hyundai!

akuma

i guess German horses are stronger than Japanese horses. Korean horses must be the weakest of them all. the 0-60 times of Genesis sedan V6 and V8, Genesis coupe, 2.0 turbo and 3.8 V6, and the new Sonata and Tucson have all been very disappointing. really, the performance of those cars are similar to cars with 50 less horsepower. i have never been wowed by the acceleration of any Korean car.

mikemartin

This isn't Sonata specific (Sonata mpg is truly impressive if verifiable in real world driving, and not on some fuel economy challenge motivated by a steak dinner), but it's hilarious how auto rags that accept advertising dollars from car makers go all noodle legged and ga-ga in absolutely blushing, stellar reviews of new cars from industry heavyweights.

Let's see where things stand on this day next year.

I'm not making a prediction here, but paint me skeptical if RELIABILITY doesn't trump all else, and by a wide margin, when all is said and done. This is why the Accord is revered by husbands everywhere; they know the wife and children are unlikely to be stranded roadside in it.

chrono

I'm not making a prediction here, but paint me skeptical if RELIABILITY doesn't trump all else, and by a wide margin, when all is said and done. This is why the Accord is revered by husbands everywhere; they know the wife and children are unlikely to be stranded roadside in it.

Hmm, I don't think the new Accord has proven anything in it's current generation. Why not look at the braking issues forum for the Accord? I think your stuck on the Camcords perception of reliability. I think most everyone has caught up the Japanese in quality/reliability and now with the new Sonata surpassing them. You could pay me to take a Camry right now.

m6user

Hopefully, Hyundai will continue some of their trend of bold, new body styles in several of their other models besides the Sonata!

You must not have seen the 2010 Tuscon small suv. It's got the same styling cues.

smarty666

oh I saw the Tuscon, very nice looking too; they are on the right path, they just have to continue this trend, the Azera comes to mind of another model that could use this treatment!

m6user

Hey Mike, I'm still waiting for you to name a post 2008 model car that can't exceed the EPA hwy mpg rating by a conservative drive on the interstate. You seem to believe that the EPA ratings are way off but fail to give an example.

I bet it's not hilarious when they are blushing with stellar reviews for the Accord, huh?

backy

Both the next-gen Elantra and Accent have a swoopy profile similar to the Sonata's. And DI engines...

kingsalmon

I think the Korean horses are going to drink less gas and be much more efficient than their Japanese/German counterparts.

I'd make that trade any day unless my job required me to run 0-60 everyday. I'm not a racer by trade so I'll take the better gas numbers! Any way you see it, high 30's to low 40's on a mid-size vehicle(actual interior volume is considered "large vehicle"). Wish I needed a new car...

pegasus17

Finally had a chance to see one in person at my local dealer. It was a silver LTD sitting in the showroom and it looked great. Despite the sloping rear roofline, rear visibility was acceptable (and I am very picky about visibility). I need some of you that own one to tell me about the plastic fuel filler door. I was surprised that the entire door is plastic (at least on the Limited I saw).
On the plus side, the engine is on the small (i.e., compact) side and there is considerable room in the engine bay for what (I'm not sure). Also, the front brake rotors are quite wide (thick) compared to other models in this class. Looking forward to an extended test drive later this week. Definitely a winner out of the box and hopefully reliability will match its design/looks.

syitalian25

I can tell you that I drove from suburban NY to Brooklyn and back almost 120 miles round trip and managed 31 mpg overall. It doesn't get much more "city" than driving through three boroughs of NYC, the milage numbers are for real.

syitalian25

I think this quote from Cars.com pretty much sums it up:

The Sonata sounds almost too good to be true. Having driven it, I assure you that it is both very, very good and very, very true. I wouldn't go as far as saying it's my favorite mid-size car, although a little more time behind the wheel just might change my mind. Still, as an automotive journalist and a car enthusiast, I'm seriously impressed. If I was an executive at Toyota, Nissan, Honda or Ford, I'd be seriously concerned. But if I was an ordinary human being, I'd just go out and buy one. Seriously. -- Aaron Gold

swingman

It would be interesting to know what his fav mid-size car is. I guess he could be referring to one that costs a lot more but he could also mean a car in it's class.

syitalian25

well I think he was looking for Mazda6 v6 performance out of the 2.4 liter 4-cylinder in the Sonata because he is a "car enthusiast" ... even the 200 HP engine seemed to be enough for him to closely consider this as the best car in the class. Just wait until the 260 HP turbo comes out, then even the V6's will be far outmatched, not to mention underpriced.

Stupid Nissan Altima 3.5 with basic options that the Sonata has easily tops 30K

syitalian25

I find that hard to believe, the transmission is beautiful. Most likely what happened is that the fuzzy logic transmission is set to shift around 4500 rpms by default and ESC limits the force to the tires in the interest of driver comfort and refinement. I bet if they drove the car around revving the engine for a few days and turned ESC off the Sonata would destroy the Altima and every other car in the segment given the far superior power/weight.

Once the car has a few thousand miles on it I will record my own 0-60 times on video and get back to you. Just in case I'm wrong, I added a performance air filter good for about 10 extra horses as well haha.

swingman

most people will probably be stuck with the transmission that comes with it, so if it has fuzzy logic then most will be SOL.

Are you going to do a test without using any aftermarket add-ons?

backy

Got my April C/D today and looked for a Sonata review. None to be found, but there was a note about checking their web site for the review. So I did. Nothing. Only a note, which took some searching, to check back on Thursday. I suppose they want to see what everyone else is saying, then say something different so they'll stand out.

I did notice though I am not the only person who doesn't like the cloth in the black SE interior. Some of the reviewers didn't care much for it either. One even referred to it as "vinyl and cloth" instead of "leather and cloth".

syitalian25

well the fuzzy logic transmission changes when the tranny shifts depending on how you drive, so I am sure from the factory it is set to be pretty tame. After a while of driving aggressively, it would allow it to rev all the way to the red line. They could probably accomplish the same thing by using the auto-manual and shifting it themselves, which I doubt they tried for the 0-60.

yeah I will throw the stock parts back on before I test it and then maybe one with the intake on just to see the difference it is making.

akuma

C/D is probably scrambling to find a way to change their evaluation methodology so that the Hyundai doesn't win. it will be a cold day in hell before a Honda (Accord) or BMW (3-series/M3) loses a C/D comparison especially to a Hyundai. i guess they'll change the acceleration portion of the comparison to 90% of the score and fuel economy and price to 1% of the score. that might work.

wolverinejoe80

how is 5.4-5.7 0-60 for gen coupe disappointing? do you expect hyundai to build sub 5.0 in first try? also genesis v8 had a very good acceleration. well below 6 seconds in all publications.

akuma

5.4-5.7 compared to 4.5-4.9 from the BMW 135 and the heavier 335. 6 more horsepower and almost 200 less lbs, but almost a second slower. the Lexus IS350 is an automatic only and also almost 200 lbs heavier than the Genesis coupe, and makes the same amount of power (306), but does 0-60 under 5.0 seconds based on the various reviews.

the Genesis V8 (385 hp now) has the power to weight ratio of an E39 M5, but has the performance of a 1998 Lexus GS400 (rated at 300 hp under the old overrated system), that did 0-60 in 5.7 seconds with a 5-speed automatic. the 1995 Nissan Maxima did 0-60 in 6.6 seconds with only 190 hp and a 5-speed manual. it weighs about 100 lbs less than a 2011 manual GLS Sonata. will the manual GLS crack the 6s? does the 2.0 Genesis Coupe?

actually, to be fair, the traction control can not be fully disabled, the gearing is geared toward fuel economy, and Hyundai tires are much skinnier/wimpier, so when you finally do need the traction, there's not as much. but besides that, yes, i think the horses are a lot weaker, but they are also a lot less thirsty.

kwonc71

How much is Gen Coupe compare to BMW and Lexus?
$20,000 vs $40,000...,so 135 and IS350 are twice faster than Gen Coupe?
Extra $20,000 can give Gen Coupes a lot more power.
In Korea, they pump 362WHP out of 2.0T Gen Cpupe with GT30R turbo.
Can you imagine turbo on a 3.8L V6? It will be a monster.

chrono

RE:736

I bet your right about the scoring. The Accord has been on their top 10 list forever. The Mazda 6 lost to the Accord in the last comparo. It lost due to harsh ride, not as good brake feel and overall refinement. I think Sonata has aced those. I'd like to see what C+D nitpicks with during their reviews and comparos with the Sonata.

targettuning

After both reading the few reviews that exist on the 2011 Sonata and taking a very short slow test "ride" (the car was uninspected and therefore illegal to drive on public roads in PA) on snow covered back roads I like the car so far but what I did notice is a lot more engine noise at idle than I expected. The one review also noted this. I believe this is due to the much, much higher fuel pressure the DGI system needs. I am familiar with the theory of direct gas injection but not at all familiar with the sounds it naturally might make. So, can anyone who has had experience with another make that incorporated this technology (DGI) before Hyundai did confirm that ,yes, it is inherently noisier than the fuel injection system I (we) are all familiar with.

shabadoo25

I stopped by my dealer yesterday hoping that my 2011 had arrived yet, but no such luck. While I was there, I grabbed one of the newly arrived brochures.

I was hoping if anyone out there has bought one with nav if you could answer this question: there's a footnote on the options page that states that models equipped with nav don't get the ipod/aux jacks. Can you confirm or deny? The booklet also states that ipod/aux is standard on all models, so I'm confused.

My dealership in Atlanta also stated that they we will be pushing the 2011 hard come March 1st including lots of advertising. They are supposed to have 60 cars on their lot by that date (next Monday) to coincide with the ads.

nace818

Yesterday, I drove an SE and a Limited back to back to see the difference. The SE is a little stiffer but not any means harsh. It looks much better with the larger wheels and dual exhausts. I am supposed to go back for the deal tomorrow and will go with the SE. I only wish it had the same leather seats as the Limited. I'm not too crazy about the cloth inserts in the SE. They are going to add the electric sunroof for about $850. Too bad the roof and nav are a bundle from the fractory. While I would like both, it will be a little more than I have to spend. Wish me luck and I will be back on this forum soon I hope.

shuale_ejs

Well, I bought my car on Saturday. They wanted to give me the one on the lot. It was black w/gray interior...but I want Silver w/black so they are looking; but it seems as though there are none out there. Which means they'll have to order it and I'll have to wait 10 - 12 weeks for it. Not a problem except now I have no car. My BMW lease is up on Sunday and they don't extend their car leases unless you're getting another BMW. So I went online to search for a rental car. Man, they are expensive! I finally had to break down the rental in 10 day increments to get a fairly decent rate.

So just a word of caution. If you are looking for a Limited w/nav there are only a few of them out there so plan ahead.

shabadoo25

Re: 744

I can confirm this, as my dealer has been able to quickly fulfill some special orders w/o nav, like in a week. However, getting the nav models from Montgomery has been like pulling teeth. They are twisting arms now to get mine delivered.

Also, my salesman did say it was likely that the nav models won't have the ipod/aux input due to the space required for the nav unit. That's going to be a real bummer for me if true.

oceana143

If you live in an area where it snows, will you need dedicated snow tires in place of the 18" performance radials? Where I live it snows maybe four or five times a year. Thank you. Also, does anyone know the gas mileage for the SE?

roadcrazy

Did you notice a difference between the SE's 18" wheels and the Limited's 17" wheels as far as road noise is concerned?

wolverinejoe80

why are you comparing hyundai to bmw? compare genesis coupe to last gen 350z. it's comparable. remember gen coupe was hyundai's 1st attempt at sporty RWD coupe. also you have to keep in mind that it lacks the torque. and why don't you post lexus LS460 number? genesis holds it's own against LS460. and didn't you watch the genesis v8 vs. last gen 7 series video? and why would you compare genesis v8 to M friggin 5? E39M5 was a sports sedan masterpiece. you can't get any better than M5. it was meant to be fast. Genesis is a luxury cruiser. it's not meant to be blazing fast.

roadcrazy

I can't speak directly to Hyundai's implementation of DGI but I own a VW GLI with a 2.0 turbo that incorporates FSI (direct fuel injection). I've never thought the engine to be noisy at idle though every once in a while it will idle a little rough for a few seconds.

shuale_ejs

You know what, I test drove one w/a nav on Saturday but I don't remember if it had the ipod outlet in it or not. If it's not there then I wonder why they allow you to choose the Ipod cable as an option?

Seems like the system should delete that option when you select the navigation package. Oh well, I purchased the cable but it was only $35. So I guess it's not too much of a loss if it's not in the car.

napsfan

It "appears" that the iPod ports are there. Take a look at this picture:
car and driver pics

If you zoom in on this picture with the nav, I'm pretty certain there is the iPod USB / Aux lables and connectors at the bottom. So unless this is an early concept picture or something, it sure looks to me like it is there.

fragilemn

I found this page which gives more detailed info about the audio options and some other stuff:

http://www.hyundaiusa.com/about-hyundai/news/corpporate_release_2011_yf-20091202- .aspx

shabadoo25

Yeah, I've seen various pics that look like they are still there, too. I have trouble believing that they would have the cable included on the LTD invoice with nowhere to plug it in.

I will post what I find out when my salesman gets back to me.

jsmit86

RE - ... Also, my salesman did say it was likely that the nav models won't have the ipod/aux input due to the space required for the nav unit. That's going to be a real bummer for me if true.

That may be a show stopper for me. :mad:

I am seriously considering the Limited w Nav, but I won't buy it unless there is a way to get the ipod integrated. This would be a huge miss if true. I just checked the PDF brochure on line, and that is what it says.

Frankly, this does not make much sense, since the ipod/USB connectors are in the bottom of the center stack near the 12V sockets... this area does not appear to be any different than on non NAV cars.

If anyone has purchased a Limited w Nav, please post to let us know if you really lose the ipod/USB jacks.