Subaru Legacy/Outback

ochssk

Does anyone know what car rental agencies rent Subarus? My wife and I would like to rent one for a weekend to check one out before buying.
Thanks

evilizard

Have em on my 96 OB. They work great. Call them up and ask what size you need.

ateixeira

Wasn't it Avis? I thought I heard that once, but only in certain areas. Was it Colorado?

-juice

hypov

Steve - Hertz is the only major car rental that I know features the Outbacks but, whilst in Arizona, they didn't have any in their fleet or have they seen any in a while.

-Dave

rogerab

I am new to this page and require some information. My wife is interested in the 2002 Outback with the 2.5 engine.
Is this vehicle realible & is the 2.5 engine powerfull enough for everyday city driving.
Is it recommended by Consumer Reports.

I look forward to comments.

99gs

I've driven quite a few suv's in this class and currently own a Honda CR-V. IMHO the Outback H-4 is in a league by itself. No matter what you compare - power, ride, handling, you would be very happy with the Outback. If I would have test driven an Outback first, I wouldn't have the CR-V. Jack

jay_24

My 2001 Outback is 6 months old and has almost 9K miles on it. Its been great. We are thinking of another next year to replace a minivan. You may want to test drive a Forester as well. They handle and feel just a bit different.

--Jay

rangerron7

I've had my H-4 OB Ltd for a year and am glad I made the decision. Great car!
(I did a brief 10k review - check message #2715)
Ron

ateixeira

Roger: Outbacks are popular for a reason. They are reliable and offer a great balance of utility and efficiency.

Subaru ownership is contagious. I bought a '98 Forester, then my cousin liked it and she bought a '99 Outback. My dad liked hers so much that he bought a 2001 OBLtd. Now my little sister is shopping and the Legacy L is on her short list...we'll see.

Mine has only been to the dealer for a single recall. Other than that, no problems. My cousin has only had scheduled maintenance. My dad went in once for a brake squeek, but it turned out to be no biggie.

He does have lots of mechanical failures - on his Taurus. ;-)

-juice

lark6

I have rented them in Massachusetts and South Carolina (twice). They're the standard H4 OBs. This past spring I'd reserved an OB in Mass and ended up with a Volvo XC instead, which made an interesting basis for comparison.

I've heard that Dollar rents Foresters out of Seattle, but I can't confirm that.

Ed

otis123

My wife and I are extremely happy with our LLBeanH6 we purchased 2/1/01. We were seriously considering the V70 wagon at the time (let's face it - it looks much better than the Outback), but several Volvo owning friends kept advising us to stay clear of the V70, especially the XC. We probably value reliability the most out of all ownership experiences, so we went with Subaru.

I'm glad we did. Go to Edmunds' "Volvo V70 Wagon Experience" chat room and check out recent #s 350, 351, and 352. True war stories say so much (thank God for the Internet - and Edmunds!)....

ateixeira

Ooh, no way. The XC uses tacky brown or blue cladding, and the stuff even creeps up around the grille. That plus the round front/square back makes it look like two different people designed it, and they didn't even know each other.

Venture inside and you'll find no less than seven interior colors, including fake aluminum grab handles whose paint had worn off on the one I test drove. OK in a Tiburon, but in a Volvo?

That plus the pillars are so thick that it has some big blind spots, and the price is too high. Top all that off with a suspension that never really settled down in hard turns, reminiscent of a Buick, and you should have no remorse whatsoever.

OTOH, the non-XC Volvos are much nicer, with more sensible interior color schemes and none of the brown/blue cladding. No AWD, though.

-juice

goosegog

Also, look at post #158 on the Volvo V70XC board!

fibber2

Thanks for the warm welcome to the 'family'. Must be something about car companies that begin with "S". Not since our investigation into Saab people when we considered a 900 Turbo some years ago have I seen such enthusiasm and passion about an auto maker and their products.

Sounds like the trailer hitch will go on my '02 without a 'hitch'. I want to buy a light duty trailer for getting the lawn tractor in for service, transport supplies home from Home Depot, etc. Things I used to be able to do easily when I owned a Ford F150. Small wagons like my old Corolla and the OB are great, but who wants to put 500lbs of CCA pressure treated lumber on those new seats???

Nobody with alarm kit experience? I assume that one must pick up some wiring harness points in the center dash area. I reviewed the scanned images that ORIGINALBITMAN posted some weeks ago for radio installation (thanks for the link, Bitman). Same basic procedure?

To NYGREG: Yes, we are as good as kin.... I leased my wife's 2000 Ford Windstar from Colonial Ford-Subaru. Excellent sales/service experience, at least on the Ford side. Trust me - I know. The Ford knows the way to the dealer only too well. Got to go back again today to pick it up and return their free loaner. Had one of their cars for 5 weeks last year when the tranny suffered repeated soft fails. I originally intended to buy my OB from them but 1) it is a bit too far away, even with the loaner car offer. 2) After Sept 11, I felt the need to buy local, if at all possible.

Question: Any suggestions about getting to the center diff dipstick on H4 automatics? I can snake my hand in and grasp it along the firewall, but cannot pull it out completely due to the positioning and inflexibility of both my hand and the stick itself. Would removal of the air cleaner assembly help?

BTW: In answer to another posted question, I rented an AWD Legacy Wagon from Hertz at SEATAC (Seattle) a few years back.

Steve

mrdetailer

With the manual you really feel a difference in steering and traction, especially on rough roads. The AWD automatic feels very seamless and I rarely tell the difference between that and 2WD for most conditions.

ateixeira

Steve: then you would have love the joint event we had in Pennsylvania. The Subaru Club of America and the Central Penn Saab Club had a covered bridge tour together. It was fun!

Photos from the event are here.

-juice

ashutoshsm

Anyone have any explanations for this? You need Quicktime to view this movie, and I believe its in Spanish 9I may be wrong). I found it at the caranddriver forum about AWD/FWD.

http://www.remarcable.net/misc/legacy_outback/gallery/video/volvo_filmen.mov

Also see

http://bilnytt.spray.se/frame_index.asp?mode=nybil&usepage=nybil%5CVolvo+XC+mot+Subaru%5C

Basically, the XC does really badly on an offroad track when compared to a Subaru Outback Legacy. With and without something being towed.

I'm sure other things like tire condition may come into play, however I would expect these tests were conducted fairly.

Is this a case of testing where the Subaru's system would inherently (for some reason) do better?

I'll also post this on the Outback Legacy forum

sweet_subie

Often times we miss Subaru's target market & get lost in comparing the Subies with accords/camrys/maximas.

Subaru(s) are a direct competitor for Volvo, Audi & VW. Of course we all know this. My point is that subaru costs thousands less than volvo, audi & VW but provides us an extremely reliable & long lasting product.

In my opinion, subaru wins over v, a & vw anyday when u look at how many thousands subie costs.

Often times I get irritated when magazines compare audi & subie, and say subie has cheap interiors........I am not willing to pay 10k more to get better interior material !

miksmi

Native language is Swedish (SE is ISO country code for Sweden). English translation:

http://www.remarcable.net/misc/legacy_outback/gallery/xlated.html

Thanks for the link; I've visited Mark's page but missed the Volvo XC vs. Outback comparison.

sweet_subie: I completely agree!

..Mike in MD

andyw1

I just bought an LL Bean Outback and find it terrific in the 130 miles we've driven it. My son has his learner's permit and has been driving our 1993 Taurus with ABS.

At some point, I'd like him to practice braking in a safe place with and without ABS, since not all cars he may drive have this. Is it possible to safely and temporarily disable the Bean's ABS by pulling a fuse (or similar easy maneuver)?

Thanks,
Andy

20llbean

When I went shopping this past spring, I compared the Volvo V70 and the VW passat wagon with the subie. I had never owned or driven a subaru vehicle prior to this so I was skeptical to a degree since I looked at Honda and Toyota as the pinnacle of Japanese car quality. The Audi was out of the picture from the start since it was high 30's, small interior space, and no immediate dealership around town. It came down to the Volvo, VW, and the Subarur. I test drove all three and was most impressed with the Subaru since it gave the similar powertrain features (AWD, 200+ HP) as the others but at a significantly less cost. On top of that, I have read discouraging comments on Volvo quality and at a list price of 38K+, that was enough to can the volvo choice.

ateixeira

Great comparo, thanks for the link!

I test drove a new XC a while back and shared my impressions, you'll recall I didn't like it much either. In fact, I'd take my dad's 2.5l OBLtd instead, any day. The Volvo is soft, has an unsettled suspension, and has mixed-message styling (7 interior colors). Price is high and reliability leaves a question mark, to boot.

Volvo AWD, if indeed that was an AWD model (they do have FWD now), is just pitiful. No torque to the rear wheels at all? That's exactly the situation where you would need it, too.

But the bigger question is this, how did they get an automatic 2.0l 156hp Outback to reach 62mph in just 7.7 seconds? And if that's the case, bring that engine over here to the USA, please!

-juice

nygreg

is overrated and overpriced IMO. Yes, they have a great safety record. However, their performance does not match the price tag. $0.02

Greg

20llbean

I apologize as I'm sure I asked this before but can't find the link: What is the part number for the H6 oil filter? Also, does any of the oil filters (Fram, AC/Delco, Lee, etc.,) make a filter for the H6? Every time I have been to Pep Boys, there is no reference for the H6 filter.

Volvo's again: IMO, it is hard for someone to admit that their $38K+ car has problems, even if they are the nuisance quality type ones. The V70 car (at least the one I test drove standard V70 not the XC) sway a lot when hitting a curve that it felt like an old bus turning. Subaru, from past owner that I met at a hockey game, have said that the powertrains can last forever. This owner had the problem of a rusting car (it was a 1986) but the powertrain was original at 200K miles.

20llbean

Also, Fuji has been making AWD powertrains since they got out of the battleship/aircraft carrier business at the end of WWII. They have a long history of boxer engines and AWD powertrains. I know that some owners have had issues with pinging, but generally things are good. Besides the H4 engine gives 165HP with the Volvo gives about the same on the 5 cylinder. When demanded to accelerate, the Volvo is a dog. To get the extra horses in a volvo, you need a turbo and I am not into turbos from either insurance or maintenance issues.

revka

this discussion is now linked from the Station Wagon's message board to the SUVs message board.

This means you now have the option to access this discussion from either one of these message boards. Hope you enjoy discussing this subject with participants from both of these message boards. Happy Motoring! ;-)

Revka
Host
Hatchbacks / Station Wagons / Women's Auto Center Boards

drcdrc

Hey all,

Thanks to all who replied with advice/feedback. It's appreciated. There is another car I am considering (which will remain nameless), and the people on that message board are much less friendly. Anyway, I dont think my search will kick into high gear until around the new year, but I am doing all of my homework ahead of time. Basically what I want is an H6 sedan (non VDC), probably in Wintergreen, and I will add on the very cool compass/auto-dimming mirror and security system upgrade. I wish they made a dark blue sedan! My second choice after wintergreen is white. Now I just gotta get used to the idea of having a car with gold emblems and wheel accents! (I swore that would never be me, but the Sube wears them well I have to admit). All the sedans I've seen lately have been VDC's, I wonder if its hard to locate a Non VDC one? Can these cars be special ordered? Anyway, any more dealer tips or general experiences, I'd love to hear them. I'll add my email address into my profile if anyone from my area wants to drop a line to discuss the car in more detail. Thanks again all...-D

ateixeira

At least the gold is very subtle. Go look at how gaudy the gold on the Jeep Grand Cherokee can get. There is much more contrast on those.

Wait until early next year and the price will only get better. You can special order, but by then supply should be pretty good.

-juice

c2t2

What I heard was that the non-VDC sedan was going to have a later introduction than the VDC sedan, and that production would start in October.

Check out www.fitzmall.com, where I think the VDC sedan is already being sold at invoice (including add fee). I used the fitzgerald's price to negotiate (without any hassle) about the same price for a VDC sedan at a dealer close to my mom's in NJ. We ordered the car (with auto-dimming mirror and security system), and it came within 6 weeks. Good luck!

drcdrc

Yeah you are right about the gold, it is kind of subtle. I need to get used to the rims, thats all. I will check out fitzmall.com, thanks c2t2. I have heard from a lot of people that is the place to check. One more question...anyone have the 6 disk in dash CD changer? My current car has a 6 disk changer in the trunk and I hate that. I need it in dash, but I was thinking a one disc would be fine (and would save me over $500 in options). Any thoughts?

ateixeira

I think the LL Bean has the 6CD changer standard, so I'd expect the sedan to have similar content. It's cheaper by far, too.

-juice

shortlid

This is the message I sent my Mother in New York City metro area when
she received the recall for the front springs on her '98 Legacy L Wagon.

Yes, I was aware of the recall over a month ago through the Subaru
on-line message boards I belong to. They was not sure it would effect L
wagons or if it extended down south as far as New York.
The problem seems to be that SOA (Subaru of America) spec.ed out a
coating for the front coil springs that was not corrosion resistant
enough. In New England and apparently NY. where road salt can wreck
havoc on the under body of vehicles, they have had concerns that if the
spring rusted enough it could break, resulting in a puncture of a front
tire! This would be a lawsuit ready to happen for Subaru, if someone
lost control while this occurred and crashed!

The problem is this, the recall only entails installing a shield on the
spring. This shield prevents a broken spring from puncturing the tire,
it does NOT prevent or rectify the corrosion problem with the front
springs. Seems GM might be using some of there "dirty" money fingers at
Subaru to boost profits and reduce Quality !!!

I did hear that one owner in New Hampshire brought his Subaru in for the
recall in the Tech. and he looked at the springs and they were BADLY
corroded. The dealer agreed to both replace the front springs with the
new improved version AND install the recall shields! This is the
situation I would like to see for you. If there is a known problem with
these springs we don't just want a temporary solution that we will have
to deal with 2 years down the road. We want the problem rectified the
way it was suppose to be from the factory!! Wilton Subaru is a good
dealer they should help you, and concur with you on this one. If they
do not, let me know and I will let the list know about this one.

nygreg

Not sure if I want to be linked to SUVs. That is one reason why I bought the OB - I don't like SUVs! Anyone with me here?

Greg

ateixeira

No big deal, it just makes the board easier to access. And if an SUV intender ends up buying an Outback, even better.

Joel: thanks for the heads up but cross-posting is a no-no. I've seen the same post several times now.

I bet that 20 years from now those springs will be in a junkyard somewhere with only surface rust.

-juice

nygreg

thanks!

drew_

That's the exact reason why it is liked to SUVs, for people who cross shop :-)


Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards

20llbean

Allow me a few minutes on this topic to let off soem steam.

I didn't even consider these beast for several reasons:
1. Everybody and their grandma has one, call me a maverick but I can't see being like the rest.
2. They are too big to fit in a garage. I have a garage that holds two cars and keeps them out of the elements as much as possible. All repeat ALL SUVs in my neighborhood are parked on the street as they are too big or too difficult to maneuver to get them into a standard new home construction garage that easily holds an Accord and a Subie OB with additional stuff like bikes, hockey gear, lawn equipment, etc.
3. Gas mileage sucks, across the board. My neighbors were requesting seizure of several oil producing nations so as to preserve low gas prices when prices went up last year. Bragging about "15 mpg with the A/C on".
4. Most are poorly constructed. I rode in a 2000 Ford Expedition (Yes, expedition), it rattled worse then my old 1984 chevy cavalier. I was afraid to tell the owner that quality was terrible.
5. Handling, enough said.
6. They are and will always be a hybrid. Never taking advantage of the advancements in car or truck features because they hybrids slapped together in a break room during lunch.
and lastly,
7. Space. It not as much as you think when you get inside.

stever

Nice post - you may want to visit the I don't like SUVs, why do you? message board :-)

Steve
Host
Vans, SUVs and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards

paisan

for starters...

1) So what?
2) My buddy lives in a town house and his Trooper fits in his garage w/o a problem
3) Gas milage sux, but try towing a 3500lb boat trailer with your subie, it just wouldn't work, trust me i've tried
4) You rode in a FORD. They are not quality vehicles, sub-par at best. You are making a judgement on 1 SUV out of 100s
5) My trooper handles just fine. Most state's speed limits are 65-70mph, maybe 75. You shouldn't be weaving in and out of lanes no matter what car you drive
6) My Trooper is not a hybrid, not based off any pickup truck. Was always built as an SUV. Lots of room inside. 4 guys + camping gear for a week + 3500lb boat. Try to do that in an outback (I did try)
7) See #6

I'm a big subie fan. Almost bought an OB or Legacy wagon, but it just didn't have the power/space/towing I needed.

-mike

andyw1

drcdrc Oct 2, 2001 6:16am

The 2 Bean's I test drove had a single CD player integrated with the radio. When I ordered mine, they could only find them with the 6-CD changer which sits below the radio in what was a storage area. I have no need of a 6-CD changer as I don't find removing and inserting a CD a problem; I'd rather have the storage space. By the way, I think the radio/CD player sounds excellent.

Andy

mikenk

Paison,
I agree with your arguments. SUV's make sense for serious camping / boating / off-roading. Unfortunately, the vast majority of people that own them do non of those things, and I would say that that is probably about 90% of those on the road. Most buy them because they are trendy; now that is stupid. If I was a serious camper, I would be embarrassed to be thought of in that light by so many. At least, buy a Hummer and leave no doubt that you are serious, or maybe a 350 series deisel truck.

Mike

shortlid

Just though every topic that is effected by this spring recall might want to know about it.

andyw1

nygreg Oct 2, 2001 10:25am

Excuse my ignorance please, but what does the linking of this and the SUV board actually mean? Is there now one board.

I am not a fan of SUVs either and didn't consider one. Most of the one's I see are not used the way Mike uses them. They mostly go to the grocery store or other local errands and are driven too fast (and badly) in the snow by people who think AWD vehicles stop faster than others. I am sure that there are people like Mike who need them for their special abilities.

Andy

paisan

Why do you care so much. This is a free country. People died to for this freedom. Vanity is enough reason for people to get SUVs IMHO.

PS: I've seen a trooper pull a hummer out of a ditch off-roading.

-mike

mikenk

Mike,
I again agree with you. This is a free country; people should have the right to buy what they please. The only thing that really bothers me is the gas guzzling part; I really think it is irresponsible to waste energy. A car getting 22 MPG will use 300 less gallons a year over an SUV getting 15 mpg. At the parking lot at my grandson's soccer game, it seems that about every other vehicle is an "Eddie Bauer" Expedition.

Anyway, that is why I care because so few do.

Sorry, for getting off topic of this thread.

The other Mike

paisan

If you go with that arguement about fuel efficiency, then you open yourself up...

A ford festiva carrys 4 adults (supposedly) and gets much better milage than your 22mpg car, same can be said for the metro, and civic. Do those people have a leg to stand on against say a subaru with AWD that burns more gas due to the AWD system?



-mike

mikenk

My beef is only with truck based SUV's that are everywhere in suburbia that never get off road, never tow anything, and don't fit in parking places. They use a hellava lot of gasoline compared to cars.

I have no problem with people justifying several mpg difference in the normal car range for comfort, handling, family room, safety or whatever. mpg differences in the 20+ range is not nearly as significant in gas useage as in the low teens.

Regardless, we just need to agree to disagree. I will continue to believe that it is really dumb and wasteful for a suburban family to be bouncing around in their truck to be trendy; you see it differently. so be it.

Mike

20llbean

I will admit that for serious off-road, most (read, not all) SUVs are invaluable and certainly better then an OB. We take my friend's Durango(V8/4x4) out to Cape Hatteras every year and it never has a problem getting there and back. Even at high tide with a foot of water under it. Take some pressure out of the tires and it rides fine. But we have had to tow some faux SUVs that either didn't have the HP or AWD/4x4 to get through the sand back to the gravel road. Just a dump mistake on the owner to think that his SUV(?) could get through. Then didn't even catch any fish!

But I have a serous question to ask of the forum, what is the oil filter number for the H6 engine? And, do any manufacturers make one? I can't find a cross-reference for the H6 engine in any auto store. Thanks.

miksmi

Re: andyw1 Oct 2, 2001 4:41pm

what does the linking of this and the SUV board actually mean? Is there now one board.

No, the boards remain separate. You can access this specific topic from the Station Wagons or SUV boards. This configuration broadens this topic's visibility. Perhaps some favoring an SUV will see this topic and consider a vehicle they hadn't considered (Subaru). I think it's a good thing.

..Mike

ateixeira

My problem with SUVs is that they block the view ahead.

But, at least with one of my cars, I found a solution. In my Miata I can actually see ahead of an SUV by looking under it! ;-)

-juice