Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/25 for details.
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/25 for details.
Options
Any Questions for a Car Dealer?
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
Anybody still seeing alot of '03 Max's still hanging around? The dealer closest to me has sold out...
Regards... Vikd
Are any 2003 automatic Camry LEs made in Japan? Are Japanese-made Toyotas of better quality than American-made ones?
Is an extended warranty useful, or is it just a ploy for the dealer to gain extra money?
I very recently bought a new Camry, and opted for paint & rust proofing, which isn't scheduled to be done till 3 weeks later. Now, I realise that I shouldn't have opted for it. Can I go back to the dealer and "return" it and get a "refund"?
Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
I don't agree with your method of reporting to the manufacturer if no loaner was provided because customer "didn't buy here." What if the manufacturer does not require a loaner car program, and the dealership has one but ONLY offers it to the people who bought there? Telling the manufacturer in that case won't do any good.
This is kind of the same question I asked about a few days ago. The difference being that I would buy elsewhere due to better pricing. Chornton (sorry if I misspelled your username), said basically to shop the better price at the closer dealership (but to buy at the closer dealership).
I think m5power has a legitimate concern. I would be miffed if some jerk got a share of commission off my car. But I agree with the dealership guys, some things are not in my control, it's best to simply let it be.
Mackabee,
Is it just me, or did you confess that your absolute bottom "no haggle" internet price is padded by a few hundred dollars in case someone grinds you? If they don't grind you, does the sale net a few extra hundred dollars or do you give the customer a lowered absolute bottom price?
He hasn't had any problems with his either, which for me personally is unusual with a new car. I almost ALWAYS have to go back multiple times to get little things fixed, or in the case of my 96 Jetta, towed back for major electrical system failures. The Maxima is an utterly flawless car, and one that I will be driving for many, many years.
That said, I can understand holding off if you just bought a house. For about the year after we bought our first house, we ended up pouring so much money into it! Nothing major, but stuff you don't even think about like curtains and lawn care costs an absolute boatload of money. I'd wait a little while, especially if you bought an older house. Six months down the road, you might realize you need a new roof!
Do I do more for my long-term loyal clients than someone new? Of course. Cultivating a relationship with a dealer is worth its weight in gold.
Thank you for your perspective. I guess I was looking at it a little differently. I see the dealership giving loan cars as going above and beyond on service to provide an incentive to earn business. I don't have too much of a problem of them saying "you didn't buy here so you don't get the loan car" because if the manufacturer didn't dictate it, I think it's fair for the dealership to set their rules.
dsattler,
I would think that the service would be nicer if the car was purchased there. Unfortunately I move a lot (just about to settle down for a little bit I think), so this doesn't usually happen. I am probably too picky; want the best price on the car and the best service.
Regardless, I will never return to that dealer because of this incident. The dealer I am currently going to for service is excellent and has treated me very well.
: )
Mackabee
My experience with loaner cars varies. Both the Ford dealer and the VW dealer I work with have relationships with local rental agencies. In the past, they have both given me vouchers for rentals if my car or truck is in the shop.
My Saturn dealer doesn't do loaners or rentals of any sort, even if you did buy the car there. In fact, they have a map that shows how far their shuttle van will go -- I think it's like a 5 or 7 mile radius.
On a related note, my Saturn dealer is quite a distance from where I live, and way out of the way between my home and my work. A new Saturn dealer is opening up later this year that is going to be much more convienent to my house. Would I be inconsiderate to switch my business to them, even though my current dealer has treated me very well?
BINGO .....!
Terry.
Another factor that falls into play here, is being able to "qualify" for any special financing that is going on at the time .. kinda remember, only 40% of the buying market qualifies for all that special financing .. so add an extra $2,500 in a pay-off, add a lower beacon score, then $100 doesn't effect the deal - it's the higher interest rate and Xtra dollars to be financed ~~ the funny part is, there is a lot of folks that drive around or fax 20 dealers looking to save a $100, when they have forgot about that extra $2,000/$4,000 on their part .. unfortunately this common.
Terry.
So, that sent us looking again, I hate car shopping. We thought about a Suburban, but $18k would buy one that was right at its mileage for needing repairs, plus the gas mileage is horrible.
Went to the *cringe* Ford dealer and drove a *double cringe* Focus. Needless to say, we ordered a fully loaded wagon, leather, heated seats, sport package, moonroof, stability control, and a few other things. Yes, I know they drop like a rock when you drive them off the lot, but we don't care, it will be with us until it dies.
I was ready to go buy my Escort back, its sitting on a car lot looking all pretty. That Focus impressed me and that takes a lot.
That was the first and last time I took any of my Ford's to them, which sucked for me because that dealer was within walking distance of my house.
As for the "Internet Fluff" question about "absolute rock bottom price"... Well, I never say my price is set in stone except on certain rare occasions. If I may,I would like to add another Famous:
"Bad Car-Guy Metaphor" TM
to the pile.
Think of best price as a suitcase full of straight pins. (Not the hard kind, the kind with cloth sides) - Trust me, I'm going somewhere here.
Now, asking best price is like asking if you can fit one more pin in the suitcase. (Or if you prefer, how many pins the suitcase can hold). Now, living in a universe of fixed space, logically there MUST be some mathematical point where the suitcase can really and truly not hold ONE MORE PIN. In practice, you'll find you can always fit "just one more". If you take emotions out of it, I can't imagine any situation where a salesmanger wouldn't take off "ONE MORE DOLLAR" to put a deal together. I've seen deals go that really and truly "lose" money, even taking holdback, etc into account just to keep the deal from the competiton. For that reason, I see "Best Price" as a mythical figure. There is no acceptable number at which if the customer signed a document saying "I will buy for one dollar less" a deal would not be done. (If you take an irked sales manager out of the equation) What I quote is a fair, competetive price. I know I'll be shopped. Will someone beat my offer? Probably. That's the whole idea of why any number can be shopped successfully. My goal is to present my offer in a straightforward and honest manner so that if a customer DOES beat my deal by a few hundred bucks, they come back to me for a second chance. There is no number you can throw out there that SOMEONE won't beat just to say they did it. If you put it on a $50 loser, someone will take $100 loser just to get your sale.
Well, I guess I have it coming, go ahead. Flame on.
: )
Mackabee
I was looking for a car that most closely match it for driving position, shifting, and just in general driving. Suprised the heck out of me when it turned out to be the Focus. Now, if I could just get my darn salesman to return my calls.....ugh.
I don't know if they have a support group for what you've got. But there should be one, and you should be in it. I recognize your problem because I've got the same bug.
Anyway, time for an intervention: Don't buy that Focus.
When you say how you're going to keep the Focus "forever", we both know it's unlikely it'll have more than two birthdays at your house... just write down a list of the cars you've bought/sold over the last four years... show me yours, I'll show you mine, it's easy to go through a half dozen cars in three years, isn't it?
Add to that some credit problems in your past, and I'd say: If ya gotta buy new, buy something that REALLY holds its value... if a Focus is OK, how about a Matrix? You'll see more $$ back on that one, and it'll do everythign the Focus wagon will. Or buy used, which I realize is an adventure in Alaska.
Like I said, I've got the car bug as bad as you do, so I sympathize. Your hubby has it too, apparently -- didn't you just ask about a 3/4 ton pickup with the big motor he bought 4 months ago?? Oy vey.
Anyway, think about it. Good luck,
-Mathias
East Lansing, MI
Good points, but overstated a little?
Margin on net shopping is $100? Maybe even even less for a grinder, is my guess. Prob higher for a non-grinder, a non-negotiator. My thought is that the savings is primarily in sidestepping the grinding while still getting a low price. For folks who enjoy the negotiating, I figure the bucks savings is minimal. Even for them, however, it's quicker to find the desired car on the net than by driving (or even calling) here, there, everywhere.
Trade-ins - I do agree. The way I'd put it, if the buyer doesn't know as much about selling his trade as about buying his new car, he's gonna get bit. Not a prob for me the last two cars I bought, though; I was replacing 'totals'. Prior to that, 'twouldn't have been a prob, either; I private sold my used cars. Given the spread on used cars, private selling is the only reasonable way to go, to me.
Financing - I agree again. If the buyer doesn't know what he's doing, he's gonna take a hit on the financing. What worked for me net buying was to request a quote, stating I'd use either my own financing or the dealer financing. In my shopping, many of the netguys offered special financing; and we finalized the price contingent upon that credit deal. Dunno how much sway the dealer has in approving the credit deal, but I'm pretty sure in one of my buys the dealer qualified me for a loan in spite of an ex's junk credit showing up on my credit report.
Financing doesn't really matter, however, if the buyer is honest with himself about the credit he qualifies for and has alternative financing lined up like he should. The dealer holds rate or withholds special financing? The buyer walks to another dealer or uses his own credit.
The cool thing about the net is that the buyer can participate competitively in a competitive market.
There's the 'asking price'
There's the 'liking price'
There's the 'taking price'
Mack and TK's quotes sound like they are in lower range of their 'liking price' but above their 'taking price'.
As a buyer,
Mack's quote sounds like there's no room for negotiation. It's 'no haggle'. I can't tell the tone of TK's.
If Mack's quote isn't low, it's gonna take something special for me to even look twice. He better be closer, have a stellar rep, be nicer, have a scarce color I love, something.
If TK's quote isn't close enough to the low one(s), I'm probably not gonna pester him with a counter unless there's something in his quote e-mail to suggest that he's got room to go lower. If it close enough (Dunno how much is close enough. Within $200, maybe?) and his dealership is near, I'd be replying by phone: "Good deal. Confirm the numbers, and I'll right there."
For me as a buyer, there's
a wishing price
a liking price
a taking price
With the net, there's no need for me to do worse than my liking price.
That said, I'm not as bad as I used to be about buying and selling......let's see, in the past year and a half I've owned a 1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee, lost it, a 1990 Suburban with 161k and a bad engine, trans, and rear end, traded it for the 94 K2500, a 1994 Escort that I sold to make it possible to get a new car with functioning seat belts and 4 doors. Other than that I've got an 85 Jeep Cherokee (does that count?) sitting in the yard for emergencies, it runs, sometimes.
As for selling the 94 K2500, that only came up because it had an electrical problem and was popping fuses left and right. Its fixed and has absolutely no problems, well, other than the HUGE sucking sound that it seems to produce anytime its started. He'll keep it for a while, he usually keeps his trucks at least 2 years. Sometimes longer, he had an 88 F-150, bought new in February of 1988, sold in May of 1997, bought back in October of 1999, sold to my little brother in February of 2001 and he's still driving it.
Now, on to the new car. I doubt it will be a Focus, the ford dealer done ticked me off yesterday. Tried to negotiate price on this special order car and it basically came out that they wouldn't take more than $100 off MSRP. Thanks, but no thanks. So, back to the drawing board.
The Corolla is out of the question, can't stand the driving position, only reason we were getting one was because everyone said they were so great. Drove one and hated it, could I live with it? Sure, but I wouldn't be driving it much.
Other than that I'm ready to go back to my junkers, then I don't feel so bad buying and selling every few months, heck, I rarely lose anything on them, at least not more than a few hundred.
Now, on to the money, our bank is financing $6000, the rest is coming in cash, another reason we have to keep this car, can't come up with that kind of cash every day.
Our credit problems started with buying and selling cars every 6 months, I don't want to go back there. We have our own business and hubby is a career gov't firefighter, I think we can afford more than a base model.
Allright, that all said, I have no idea what kind of car I'm buying anymore. Like I said I'm ready to fix this 85 Jeep and drive it to death, although its not the safest thing in the world since it was rolled.
I was about to congratulate you and mention that if your dealer's parts department carried the Ford Racing line, you could pick up a Torsen limited slip differential for the Focus and have it installed there, which might be a nice thing to have during those Alaskan winters.
The Focus I wanted was a ZTW wagon, fully loaded (leather, heated seats, moonroof) with the Advance Trac and a manual transmission.
Oh well, I will probably go with my second choice which is a Mazda P5. Since my friend works at the Mazda dealer I can get it for $100 over invoice and they have a good service department there. Add to that its $3000 cheaper than the Focus, thus giving us the money to fix our darn driveway so I can actually get my new car down it. Right now its 4x4 only and its even a challange for our Chevy truck.
: )
Mackabee
: )
Mackabee
: )
Mackabee
Did I tell you I bought an MR2?
I turned a 58.78x to its 1:05.xxx
To be fair, FTD was 52.xxx turned in by a Vette, 03 ZO6. (Well it was a Corvette club event, so if we want to remain invited, we have to let the Vetts win, LOL.)
TB
My MR2 will run in stock until about the end of June when it will transform into a CSP killer.
I'll be hunting Z06s then!
Too bad I can't autocross my new (to me) CBR 900 RR....
: )
Mackabee
Well not to mention this is only my 2nd season and I have nowhere near the mods allowed by STS. Only different wheels and tires, the bigger rear bar and a Borla cat back.
Still running on the now 6 year old factory springs and struts.
I'm taking the Evolution school this Friday in STL, so I should make some improvement after that.
Then maybe I'll make more mods to the car.
However, swerving back into the topic, I wonder where the nearest cart dealership is. I've considered a cart for my 13yo step daughter.
TB
$2000 can get you a great entry level race cart.