Call Ralph or Bill Fleihman (SVC MGR) and ask the tire question. Then order the AVS db's from Tirerack and ship them to Northland, tell Bill when the new car comes off the truck to mount the AVS's on the factory rims and do a balance job. Then take the tires (they may arrange for a pick up) to the tire store who will probably make your total cost of new tires relatively low since they will give you something for the new/used tires. They will be considered new/used even with no miles on them as they have been mounted already.
But, do you actually know what tires are coming on the 2002 A6? As long as they are not the same crappy tires that the 2000's and 2001's (w/17" option) had on it, you may not need to replace them.
Just a thought.
Love to know when your new one is coming in so that I could go see it!
No tire issues to report timcar. I keep them @ 36 lbs (front and rear) I now have almost 15,000 on the car -- which is about 7K on the tires, I think. I have had the tires rotated and balanced once (since installation) and at that time had a four wheel alignment for good measure.
On a related note: My new cross-drilled rotors are presumably arriving at the dealer on Monday Sept 10th. I have meetings that preclude my dropping the car off until the 11th -- and if history is any indicator, I should have my "new rotors and pads" and any other service items that are due completed by September 12th.
If I had tire issues, I suspect they might be masked, unless they were REALLY obvious by my ever worsening chattering, shuddering and purring brakes. They are now back to full normal status which is they are symptomatic at any speed above 40MPH.
The praise for the new A4's brakes in the new C&D magazine have me envious.
So, I will dutifully report my experience with the AVS db's as time passes -- AT THIS POINT, I still give them "thumb's up." But with regular rotations, alignment and balancing, to say nothing of almost fanatical tire pressure checking, I do not have any reasons to suspect issues other than perhaps disappointing tire life -- but, after all, they are Ultra High Performance tires -- and all season or no, my experience has always been that the higher the performance of the tire, the shorter the tread life.
I would love to know if anyone on this board has any direct personal experience (on a quattro) with Pirelli Rosa tires -- in the last issue of European Car magazine there was a mini-magazine (an advertorial) devoted to all things Pirelli and they claimed that the Pirelli Asymettrico Rosa had "all the performance advantages" of the original Asymettrico plus it was quiet. With my experience with the originals -- which is to say they were "OK" in the noise department -- I was encouraged to think the Rosa's might be worth looking into next time. I am, however, hoping that my now 11 payments of 30 2001 A6 4.2 leased car will be replaced in about 15 months with a 2003 New A6 or New S4 4 door coupe (with a rumored V8 and interesting transmission choices). This would mean I hope not to have to replace my AVS db's before then.
Finally while we're on the subject of tires -- don't you think Audi should either offer or make standard tire pressure monitoring at a minimum and tire pressure automatic maintenance as an optional extra?
And, while dreaming, it seems that the allroad suspension, with appropriate modifications for more sporting sedan intentions, is just about ready for prime time across the entire Audi lineup. And I hear we are very close to full electric/electronic brakes (at least Bosch is working hard on this technology, so I've read -- which will probably mean Mereces first, Audi later).
So many advancements, so little time, and not enough money.
Well it's been some time since I have visited here, but thought that I'd cross-post this link in hope of getting a couple more people to come out for a little car-talk, drive, etc. day.
Please go to the link below (on AudiWorld.com) for further information.
I've heard that in the next few years, U.S. cars will be mandated to have tire pressure monitoring systems (like 3rd brake light in the '80s) in all new cars. This is in order to reduce wasted energy due to poor tire inflation...
I also have the AVS db tires. They are quiet, good handling, and great in the wet. My local tire shop (near Boston) gave me $125/tire for the stock Pirelli P6000s, making the total cost of the switch minimal.
I got a call from our favorite dealer today telling me that they would replace all my front end links on my A4 even though I am more than 6 months and 6K out of warrrenty and I am the second owner of my '98 A4. As you have reported in the past their support of their customer is second to none.
My service rep reported that they are impressed with your knowledge and passion for the marque.
I know that this is an A6 board but what's your feeling about the 2002 A4 3.0 plus CVT frontrack vs the 3.0 6 spd quattro. I'm leaning toward the CVT but am concerned about resale down the road. The sales rep said he felt it was to early to venture a guess.
Hello everyone, I'm new to this board. I just spoke with my sales rep and not only did he let me know that the '02s will be here at the end of the month, but he faxed me pricing info as well.
I am looking at an '02 A6 2.7t 6-speed in black/tungsten/PCC/PPX/17". After 2 years of driving a 300M I am ready to step up.
Last weekend when I test drove his last '01 I was truly amazed by this car. I was also amazed to have the salesman continually urge me to "push it harder" through the winding parts of the road.
Now, here's my question for you experts: I sell Real Estate and put Huge miles on my vehicles which has usually precluded leasing (I average about 30,000 miles each year). The salesman said I would be better off leasing and paying for the extra miles than buying. I was planning on paying cash, but perhaps a single-pay 2 or 3 yr lease would be better?
Also, has anyone out there dealt with Carousel Automobiles in Minneapolis? Any word on their service dept? Any info would be helpful before I write a rather large check...
I'm in sales and leased my first car a few months ago, A6 2.8Q. I never thought of leasing until I was told I can deduct a percentage of my business miles from my taxes. It was then a no-brainer for me.
" faxed me pricing info as well " Does this information include the A6 TT2.7 list price before any options? And any other specific options? I have not seen 2002 pricing posted anywhere yet... Thanks, - Ray Who is taking a break from watching the TV coverage of a horrific day......
Ray, I did not recieve any pricing other than the A6 2.7t pricing, although my dealership says that all dealers should have recieved '02 pricing on Monday.
For those of you who are waiting for the '02s, here is the info that I got:
2002 A6 2.7t Quattro Manual or Auto $39,750
Options: N1H Leather $1,550 D4D4 Pearl White $1,200 PPD Convenience $ 730 PCC Preferred Luxury $1,800 PPX Premium Pkg $1,275 PST Sport Pkg $1,425
Mark asked about Carousel's service department in Minneapolis. I've currently got a '96 A6 Quattro (wife's car) and just replaced my 2000 S4 (killed by Bambi) with a 2001 A6 2.7t with sport package (PST). I've been dealing with Carousel for years and have never had anything close to a problem with their service department. They actually care and will do whatever it takes to make sure their customers are happy. Between the fine automobiles that Audi continues to make and the fantastic service offered at Carousel, I can't see buying any other make of car.
Are you sure that Carousel will have the car you want? I too am dealing with them and took a look at their incoming '02's list. I decided to wait until November, which I am told, for my new '02 since they had 6 coming that were mostly silver and black. I might have missed the pearl white. However, I ordered the ming blue 2.7T.
You may want to reconsider the performance tires driving in our MN winters. I have a friend who bought an S4 last year and he had to purchase all season tires since he had trouble stopping. (granted the S4 is lighter, it may be worth investigating)
I ordered our second A6, a 2002 3.0 quattro, well over a month ago. My salesman faxed me the order codes. He called me this past week and informed me that the vehicle was at the port; he was not sure when it would be released, but surmised 2-4 weeks. However, he was going to an "Audi" conference on Friday and indicated that he would have a definitive date next week.
While I am gratified with my dealer/salesman's candor, I am disappointed in Audi's lack of same. We are all aware of the significant changes to the A6 posted on the Audi World web site. There are no secrets, here. Further, it is understandable that a company would want to dispose of the 2001's as rapidly as possible. However, the lack of official information is inappropriate. On the other hand, this is not unique; a friend recently went through the same scenario with a Volvo S60. C'est la vie.
All the more reason to be grateful for the internet and message boards such as this.
The AoA website says mid-October for the new A4's which certainly suggests that's the official launch date for the new model year. However, reports are the U.S. ports are jammed full of '02 Audi's waiting to ship to dealers. Could be they're watching inventory levels to make a judgement as to when to release them. There seems to be a large difference in inventory levels from region to region and dealer to dealer. I suspect they're trying to balance the various interests.
I agree with beerguy - Carousel's service dept. is second to none. I've had our '98.5 A4 2.8Q serviced there for 3 1/2 years - they've always treated me and the car VERY well. My only complaint is that their service dept. is overloaded. It normally takes 3-4 weeks to get in for routine maintenance, which IMO is 2-3 weeks too many. I purchased our '01 allroad from Maplewood (saved $1,000) and their service wait is about half of Carousel's. So far (2 oil changes, minor recall to wiper assembly, and towing hitch installation) they've done an excellent job also.
Speaking of Carousel and Maplewood, does anyone have a salesperson to recommend at Maplewood Imports? Since I'm east of the river, Maplewood is a lot closer to me than Carousel. TIA.
I am also from MN and I am down to either an A6 2.7T or a BMW 530 for my next purchase. All most everything being equal, I would prefer the A6 for the AWD, however Consumers Reports (believe them or not) would have you believe that the A6 has relibility issues. Anyone with a 2001 A6 2.7T for at least 12 months who would like to share their experiences?
I have over twelve (12) months experience, and live in New England, a similar climate to yours. My choice did not include the BMW; however, quattro was the deciding factor.
The various reliability difficulties have been well documented on this message board (front suspension, brakes, fuel sensor, etc). Most, but not all, were the subject of recalls. However, my main complaint and/or difficulty involved electrical gremlins. These were not the type that disable the vehicle; they emotionally inflict themselves upon the occupants. In our case, the brake warning light and chime would regularly trigger, for no apparent reason. This went on for about a year. It may sound humorous, until you are on a thousand mile trip, with an obnoxious ringing every 5-10 minutes. Eventually, Audi dispatched an engineer from the factory to tour the States, looking for intriguing electrical problems. He looked at our vehicle and, after almost a full day of exploration, replaced the entire instrument cluster/module: problem solved.
While this may come across as gross dissatisfaction, it must be interpreted in light of the fact that over one month ago I ordered a 2002 A6 Avant for my wife. I have no excuse for this irrational behavior; other than to say that buying a German vehicle is not a dispassionate, logical experience. Where else can I combine quattro and abuse at the same time?
In all seriousness, the Audi has been, for the most part, a reliable vehicle. Further, if you will permit me a BMW opinion: while I have no current experience with the 530, my background does allow me to state that bimmers have their own set of challenges, reliability wise. You may merely be comparing one set of problems with another.
To that end, I would choose the vehicle that best meets your practical (quattro) and subjective (irrational) needs best. For me, that is an Audi; your emotional mileage may vary and differ.
While it may be heresy, I sometimes envy friends with their Toyotas, Hondas, Lexus' or Acura's; I am not sure that the envy is reciprocal, nor do I care. If life was meant to be simple, I would drive a toaster and be warm in the winter. Instead, I have the Audi, with four (4) Michelin Arctic Alpins. I prefer the latter.
Thank you for the input, and yes I did see some of the previous discussions regarding reliability issues. Other than the fact that it is virtually impossible to sit and read hundreds of entries, the entries that I did read regarding reliability problems seem to be associated with the 2000 model. Some questions for you and anyone else interested in commenting.
1. Is your vehicle a 2000? 2. Were all the problems repaired under the warranty? No additional cost? Free loaner car? 3. How long was your car out of action, on average (other than the brake light warning issue)?
I agree with your conclusion that the driving experience outweighs the distractions of some reliability issues, especially if they are totally and completely covered by the warranty. However, a person can take only so much, so I am trying to get some measure on whether Audi has fixed any of the issues this board and others talk about relative to the 2000 models.
1.) yes, a "2000"; 2.) no cost, and always a free loaner; 3.) only once, overnight. all the rest, only a full day.
I do not want to scare you to the point of distraction. With the exception of the aforementioned warning light/chimes, the car has been reliable, but not perfect. My suggestion for any first time Audi buyer: lease for a period not to exceed the warranty; make your decision regarding long term ownership at the lease's termination. There is a sense of peace and calm that soothes the soul when you realize that your commitment is finite. There are no guarantees (only warranties); it is, however, a most enjoyable vehicle.
Help. I have about 13,000 miles on my '00 2.7T with the Sports package. Love the car, but I hate the Goodyear Eagle Touring tires on my car. Lately, they screach and howl on just about any turn I take. Highway ramps at 35-40 mph produce a singing choir from the tires. The other people in my car when we go out to lunch look at me like I am a nut. Can anyone recommend to me some new tires. I have heard that Dunlop and Pirelli make good compatible tires. Are their any other tires anyone can recommend? I live in South Florida, so most of my driving is on dry roads.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. SJF
I would call Eddie at Tire Rack (877-522-8473, Ext. 369). He is a real tire professional who will consult with you about your needs, preferences, etc and recommend something that you will be happy with. You should think about what's most important to you, ranking in your order of priority things like handling/braking capabilty, smooth ride, quietness, all season capability, and tire tread life.
P.S. This particular guy knows Audi's very well, as he monitors the "Wheels and Tires" forum at Audiworld.com, so he's very familiar with how each tire will work on your vehicle.
(Disclaimer - I get no benefit whatsoever out of this recommendation, which is based on personal experience only!).
My 99 GS 400 lease lapses in November and I am wondering if anyone posting on this board has made the switch from Lexus to A6 (specifically 2.7T). Any input, be it rational or emotional as regards the buying decision would be appreciated. As this is my 4th Lexus in 11 years with zero problems,the obvious concern of reliability keeps surfacing. I am no stranger to German marques,having had a BMW 2002tii(showing my age),530i and 97 M-3 along with 80 something Audi 500. So I guess it all boils down to German precision/handling versus Lexus rock-solid dependability/comfort.Any thoughts?
I'd call the GS400 one of the "flintier",Germanic cars in the Lexus range.And I look upon the A6 as one of the softer German cars.So you really are in the middle. To me,the LS430 is truly an original creation,in that Lexus has taken the English "ball of silk"concept about as far as you can go.But for sportier sedans,Lexus just seems to be a follower. I really like the A6;I considered one last spring.The turbo changes things,but the bade car has a very pleasing sereness to it.But the wheel wouldn't tilt up quite high enough for me.But it has a large back seat,and in genaral impressed me as a superlative. If you are attracted to overt performance,what about a BMW 5-series?Back seat should be bigger,but it is very performance.But really,if you are looking at an automatic,isn't the turbo A6 approaching Mercedes E320 territory?That is a very fine car,in my opinion.
I completely agree with the suggestion to call TireRack; I have found them to be knowledgeable and unbiased; a nice combination. When I replaced our Audi's tires, my primary criteria was lack of manufacturing defects, having been through some disappointing products ("American" Continentals). When I asked them (TireRack) for their lowest warranty claim brand, they said, without hesitation, Michelin. If this is a concern for you, I would take it into consideration; if not, ignore it. If performance is the most significant issue, I invite you to read the excellent dialogue on this message board, especially that of Mark, relating to the "plus" concept.
One final thought: I noted your comment "Lately..."; Have you checked your tire pressure? That is a primary cause of "new" tire noise. Of course, you could also have a defective tire, or two.
Four long, long years in an ES300. Few problems, all fixed quickly and expertly. But still a VERY unsatisfying car to drive. Haven't driven a GS, but think it would have to be more fun. Test drove a 2.7T just for fun, and was instantly smitten. Loved the car, 7 months after getting one, I still do. Did a lot of research and followed this board & AW for about 10 months. Decided I would rather have a car that's wonderful to drive most of the time, than boring to drive all the time.
Other pluses? Roomier interior than GS. More luxurious interior with better materials. (About the best there is.) No Pokemon styling. Quattro!
BTW, '02's have been thoroughly reworked, and as it's about 2/3 of the way into the car's product cycle, it should be the most reliable, best driving A6 ever.
If you're interested, make sure you take at least a couple of drives in both the sport and non-sport versions. Most performance oriented drivers prefer the sport suspension.
You guys were right, carousel will NOT have the car I want at the end of the month. They ordered ALL automatics....best I can hope for to get a 6-speed is mid-November. Unless I go to Wisconsin or Iowa?...
About the 17" tires, what do the experts recommend for our less-than-wonderful Minnesota winters? Thanks, Kurt
I am looking at purchasing a new 2001 a6 2.7t. I was wondering if any of you knew if the dealers were going to provide and incentives to get them off their lots. I know about the 2.9% financing, and I have heard about a dealer offering 3k off the msrp. Anything else? I am looking for a manual trans, I have heard they are hard to find. Has anyone heard of the autos being discounted or the manuals being more expensive because of the supply/demand? I would appreciate any information.
I am looking at a 2.7t with the following options:
6 disk changer bose guidance package mobile phone premium package rear seat air bags enhanced sport package
I am considering the purchase of this vehicle, replacing my 2000 Acura 3.2 TL, and am having difficulty deciding between the 4.2 and the 2.7T. I have the opportunity to get the 4.2 at a couple hundred dollars over dealer invoice. Would some of you current owners give me your thoughts and opinions? Thanks.
If you can find a dealer with inventory, you should be able to get an '01 for $500 to $1000 over dealer invoice. That's about $3,500 - $4,500 off MSRP. Edmunds has the DI pricing, with all options. Manuals have normally been hard for dealers to move. If you ask a dealer, whatever you're interested is in short supply. There are fewer manuals, but they shouldn't cost a premium.
Regarding 4.2 vs. 2.7T, it's a matter of preference. You have to drive both, and see which you prefer. Of course, 6sp is 2.7T only. Most think the 4.2 looks best. I agree, though I love my 2.7T.
hi, i'm considering leasing an a6, and i was wondering what have been some of the problems you have encountered? I currently have a '99 rl, and havn't had any problems with it, but i'm not sure if i want to get a 2002 rl, because they havn't significanticantly changed it. My other car was a '97 landrover discovery, and i don't want to return to the days of reliablility problems. Is the a6 generally reliable? What have been some of the listed problems of the current generation car? thanks mike
I don't think the A6 can even come close to the Land Rover's legendary reliability problems. LR makes gret offroaders, but their trucks have more problems than just about anyone.
I've got an '01 2.7T after 14 years of Japanese cars. My last car was an ES300, and the one before that a '92 Legend. A6's tend to be very durable, and are normally reliable autos. They are also complex, and tend not to be as bulletproof as Acura's and Lexus', but mmcbride1 points, comparison to Land Rover isn't realistic. The A6 is in its 4th model year. It was significantly revised and improved for '02. Succeeding model years have improved significantly, and it appears fixing issues was one of the major objectives of the '02 revision. I suspect the '02's will be the most reliable and best driving A6's yet. The most problematic cars/years appear to have been '98's and 2000 2.7T's. '01's of every variety have been significantly better. Most common problems have been corrected.
Problems have included:
1. Fuel Tank sensor - Fixed. 2. Front suspension - Fixed. 3. Windshield Distortion - Tends to be slight but can still be found. 4. Drivetrain vibration - Believe it's been addressed for '02. 5. Misc. electronic problems - Largely addressed 6. TBB on 2.7T - Fixed 7. Tiptronic Program - Changed for '02.
As stated, earlier model years tended to be more problematic. Any manufacturer can make a lemon. A few were, the vast majority weren't. My car has #3 and #4. #3 is slight and not noticeable from the driver's seat. The slight drivetrain vibration I had largely subsided after the 5K service, and is now usually unnoticeable. Earlier model years appeared to be more problematic, and I believe this issue has been addressed for '02. It appears it may be a byproduct of the application of the Torsen limited slip differential in the A6 quattro application.
BTW, I LOVE my 2.7T compared to the Japanese cars I've had. Surveys have shown that even owners with significant problems, have tended to love their cars. I suggest you drive one.
I just purchased an A6 4.2 (August)...the deal was just too good to pass up. Thw 4.2 is not as quick off the line as the 2.7, but has a nice, smooth power band. I simply prefer the looks of the 4.2. No problems at all so far (except for switching the tires).
We will be getting an A-6 more than likely. We were content waiting on the 3.0 ('02) but my local dealer has 4 '01 2.7Ts that they will deal on. I think Audi has 2.9% financing and I understand from above comments that we should be able to get maybe $4k off sticker. With that it seems to me that an '01 2.7T may not cost much more than an '02 3.0. Any comments on this? I like the acceleration of the 2.7T but with the increase in the base engine that may be enough. I'm wondering if the other '02 changes are worth waiting for in this situation. BTW, does anyone know 0-60 claims for the 3.0? I know the acceleration for the 2.8 was disappointing.
I am quite familiar with the 2.7T; it is an enjoyable vehicle with a first class engine. As to the 3.0, even though I ordered one for my wife, we did not drive it. However, with over 50,000 miles on a 1999 A6 Avant 2.8, I did not consider this a problem (famous last words). My assumption is that with 10% more horsepower, and a commensurate increase in torque, the complaints about the 2.8 would be dealt with.
A word about the much maligned "2.8": I like performance (my personal choice is the 2.7T); however, I think that the criticisms have been excessive. The zero-30 time is more lethargic than I would like; on the other hand, once rolling, the performance leaves little to be desired; unless you are into M5's or S6's.
You should, prior to deciding, look at the content of the 2002's, both standard and optional. I specified the Avant with the premium package (multi function steering wheel, xenon and parktronic). There were many other options, bring the msrp to $44,405.00. The standard features include ESP. Another feature I like: in dash cd changer.
These differences may, or may not, be important to you. I do not see how you can make a mistake with either choice. My suggestion: drive both and choose the one that makes you smile more.
One more thought: if you are well prepared, dealers will negotiate agressivley even with the 2002's. You will not get quite the discount as on the 2001's, but not as far off as you think. Let us know what happens.
In response to grogsuz's inquiry, I owned a GS400 from January 1998 until January 2001 and switched to the A6 4.2. I was very hesitant to make the switch, since I had very few problems with the GS400 and the level of service at Lexus was outstanding. However, I felt that the GS400 insulated the driver from the road too much. I also felt that the handling and lean into and out of curves/turns was too soft. Plus, the rear wheel drive combined with the strong engine slipped while accelerating on wet roads, which I found annoying.
So, I read every post on this and the previous A6 sites and found every one of timcar's post 1838 issues and problems. But once I drove the 2.7t and 4.2, the ride, driver comfort, sporty suspension and all wheel drive made the decision fairly easy. I chose the 4.2 because I wanted the bigger engine for smoother highway driving, found it almost as fast off the line as the 2.7t, and think it looks materially better than the 2.7t. Yes, I miss the Nakamichi stereo (vs. the Bose) and the 5.7 zero to 60 mph speed of the Lexus GS400, but the Audi is so much more enjoyable to drive, those are minor sacrifices to make. Fortunately, I have had zero problems in my 10 months of ownership.
However, don't fool yourself - Audi service will NEVER be in the same class as Lexus service. And the fit and finish of the A6 will NEVER compare to that of the GS400. But the enjoyment you will get from the German engineering and feeling at one with the road and the car will be so rewarding the few annoyances you will have to deal with will be easily overlooked.
Good luck in your decision - it's a great one to be able to make!
Just read Robert's post, and was gratified that he's confirmed my experiences. Though I have the 2.7T, I also think the 4.2 is the best-looking A6. The only thing I've found different is the fit and finish comparison. While my Lexus was only an ES300, I also looked over the GS300/400 pretty carefully. The fit and finish on both was the same; excellent. But the fit and finish on my 2.7T is even better. Body panels, interior panels, paint job, even the rubber hose that connects (I assume) the power cables to the door are all just about perfect. The level of detail throughout is exquisite and perfectly executed.
Certainly must agree with Robert about service though, while I have a "good" Audi dealer (Some are problematic.) Lexus can't be bettered, from top to bottom.
I, too, consider the 4.2 the best looking of the A6 family. I did drive both the 2.7 and the 4.2 back to back, and I must admit, the V8's ride and feel were simply regal. Not that the 2.7 is a pig by an stretch of the imagination; the 4.2 felt, to me, more substantial.
I am just having a difficult time pulling the trigger on the purchase due to recent events and their effect on the economy. Seems a little silly, I know. It took a long time to get my wife to relent to my impulsive ways...
and what's up with your brakes? A quick update on my problems which, dare I say, seem to have been resolved. After leaving the car at the dealer for a week and a half and installing two more sets of front and rear rotors, the problem seems to finally have been correctly diagnosed and resolved. The dealer and AoA rep drove the car repeatedly after re surfacing existing rotors (400 miles on them since new), installing a new set of rotors and re-driving the car, and finally install another set at which time it was noticed that the hubs were not being cleaned completely prior to installing the new rotors. A build up of rust was preventing the new rotors from seating correctly and thus as the brakes were applied the force varied, creating hot spots, which would then aggravate the symptoms and cause warpage.
Now with my new (and correctly rated) tires and 4 new rotors and pad sets, all finally seems to be back to normal.
It is sad that it only took about six to eight months and as many sets of rotors to solve the problem. I have not really driven the car hard yet as I want to make sure that I break these rotors in correctly, but so far so good.
does anyone know where i can find some pictures of the 2002 3.0 a6 sedan? I've seen the one here at edmunds, but does anyone know where i can find some interior, back, and side pictures?
I am close to buying a black/black 2.7t (auto) w/ 24,000 miles. Offered at $29,900 (Winter package/moonroof/leather).Is the warranty 3/50 or 4/50?? I was unaware of major cosmetic changes to the A6 until I spent too much time at "work" reading the many previous posts.
Are the changes only re: options and the addition of 3.0 vs. 2.8? Or has the body changed? I don't really want to buy a car that will be dated within a month or two.
This link is for an article on AudiWorld with the Audi AG (German) press release for model year '02 A6's. Cars are German spec, not U.S., but U.S. cars should be very similar. Likely differences on U.S. cars include body colored lower panels, not matte black, and slightly larger bumpers. The car looks very much like the '01 A6's. If you go and look at those, you'll be looking at something very similar. Revised stereo controls, a chrome ring around the instruments, and some new interior colors appear to be the only significant interior changes.
A recent conjecture by a knowledgeable poster @ AW suggests that the former sport suspension may now be the standard suspension. May include 3/4" lower ride height. I'd like that, if they retain the availability of the non-sport seats.
Comments
Call Ralph or Bill Fleihman (SVC MGR) and ask the tire question. Then order the AVS db's from Tirerack and ship them to Northland, tell Bill when the new car comes off the truck to mount the AVS's on the factory rims and do a balance job. Then take the tires (they may arrange for a pick up) to the tire store who will probably make your total cost of new tires relatively low since they will give you something for the new/used tires. They will be considered new/used even with no miles on them as they have been mounted already.
But, do you actually know what tires are coming on the 2002 A6? As long as they are not the same crappy tires that the 2000's and 2001's (w/17" option) had on it, you may not need to replace them.
Just a thought.
Love to know when your new one is coming in so that I could go see it!
Mark
On a related note: My new cross-drilled rotors are presumably arriving at the dealer on Monday Sept 10th. I have meetings that preclude my dropping the car off until the 11th -- and if history is any indicator, I should have my "new rotors and pads" and any other service items that are due completed by September 12th.
If I had tire issues, I suspect they might be masked, unless they were REALLY obvious by my ever worsening chattering, shuddering and purring brakes. They are now back to full normal status which is they are symptomatic at any speed above 40MPH.
The praise for the new A4's brakes in the new C&D magazine have me envious.
So, I will dutifully report my experience with the AVS db's as time passes -- AT THIS POINT, I still give them "thumb's up." But with regular rotations, alignment and balancing, to say nothing of almost fanatical tire pressure checking, I do not have any reasons to suspect issues other than perhaps disappointing tire life -- but, after all, they are Ultra High Performance tires -- and all season or no, my experience has always been that the higher the performance of the tire, the shorter the tread life.
I would love to know if anyone on this board has any direct personal experience (on a quattro) with Pirelli Rosa tires -- in the last issue of European Car magazine there was a mini-magazine (an advertorial) devoted to all things Pirelli and they claimed that the Pirelli Asymettrico Rosa had "all the performance advantages" of the original Asymettrico plus it was quiet. With my experience with the originals -- which is to say they were "OK" in the noise department -- I was encouraged to think the Rosa's might be worth looking into next time. I am, however, hoping that my now 11 payments of 30 2001 A6 4.2 leased car will be replaced in about 15 months with a 2003 New A6 or New S4 4 door coupe (with a rumored V8 and interesting transmission choices). This would mean I hope not to have to replace my AVS db's before then.
Finally while we're on the subject of tires -- don't you think Audi should either offer or make standard tire pressure monitoring at a minimum and tire pressure automatic maintenance as an optional extra?
And, while dreaming, it seems that the allroad suspension, with appropriate modifications for more sporting sedan intentions, is just about ready for prime time across the entire Audi lineup. And I hear we are very close to full electric/electronic brakes (at least Bosch is working hard on this technology, so I've read -- which will probably mean Mereces first, Audi later).
So many advancements, so little time, and not enough money.
The thrill of the hunt.
Well it's been some time since I have visited here, but thought that I'd cross-post this link in hope of getting a couple more people to come out for a little car-talk, drive, etc. day.
Please go to the link below (on AudiWorld.com) for further information.
http://forums.audiworld.com/a6/msgs/83763.phtml
Nice to be here and read up on what everyone's been doing - a lot of reading!
Best Regards,
-Larry
Might just be a rumor, but who knows?
I am in Florida.
My service rep reported that they are impressed with your knowledge and passion for the marque.
I know that this is an A6 board but what's your feeling about the 2002 A4 3.0 plus CVT frontrack vs the 3.0 6 spd quattro. I'm leaning toward the CVT but am concerned about resale down the road. The sales rep said he felt it was to early to venture a guess.
I am looking at an '02 A6 2.7t 6-speed in black/tungsten/PCC/PPX/17". After 2 years of driving a 300M I am ready to step up.
Last weekend when I test drove his last '01 I was truly amazed by this car. I was also amazed to have the salesman continually urge me to "push it harder" through the winding parts of the road.
Now, here's my question for you experts: I sell Real Estate and put Huge miles on my vehicles which has usually precluded leasing (I average about 30,000 miles each year). The salesman said I would be better off leasing and paying for the extra miles than buying. I was planning on paying cash, but perhaps a single-pay 2 or 3 yr lease would be better?
Also, has anyone out there dealt with Carousel Automobiles in Minneapolis? Any word on their service dept? Any info would be helpful before I write a rather large check...
Thanks in advance!
Does this information include the A6 TT2.7 list price before any options? And any other specific options? I have not seen 2002 pricing posted anywhere yet...
Thanks,
- Ray
Who is taking a break from watching the TV coverage of a horrific day......
For those of you who are waiting for the '02s, here is the info that I got:
2002 A6 2.7t Quattro Manual or Auto $39,750
Options:
N1H Leather $1,550
D4D4 Pearl White $1,200
PPD Convenience $ 730
PCC Preferred Luxury $1,800
PPX Premium Pkg $1,275
PST Sport Pkg $1,425
PQP 17" wheels/tires $ 675
7Q9 Audi Nav System $1,350
3FE Sunroof $1,000
8RY Bose Sound Sys $ 750
4A4 Heated F/R Seats $ 550
3Y5 Rear Sunshades $ 450
4X4 Rear Side Airbags $ 350
That's all I recieved. Now i'm just waiting for the cars to arrive, as I do not wish to wait 3-4 months to order one. Have a good one!
Kurt
Are you sure that Carousel will have the car you want? I too am dealing with them and took a look at their incoming '02's list. I decided to wait until November, which I am told, for my new '02 since they had 6 coming that were mostly silver and black. I might have missed the pearl white. However, I ordered the ming blue 2.7T.
You may want to reconsider the performance tires driving in our MN winters. I have a friend who bought an S4 last year and he had to purchase all season tires since he had trouble stopping. (granted the S4 is lighter, it may be worth investigating)
R
I ordered our second A6, a 2002 3.0 quattro, well over a month ago. My salesman faxed me the order codes. He called me this past week and informed me that the vehicle was at the port; he was not sure when it would be released, but surmised 2-4 weeks. However, he was going to an "Audi" conference on Friday and indicated that he would have a definitive date next week.
While I am gratified with my dealer/salesman's candor, I am disappointed in Audi's lack of same. We are all aware of the significant changes to the A6 posted on the Audi World web site. There are no secrets, here. Further, it is understandable that a company would want to dispose of the 2001's as rapidly as possible. However, the lack of official information is inappropriate. On the other hand, this is not unique; a friend recently went through the same scenario with a Volvo S60. C'est la vie.
All the more reason to be grateful for the internet and message boards such as this.
vty
Michael
The various reliability difficulties have been well documented on this message board (front suspension, brakes, fuel sensor, etc). Most, but not all, were the subject of recalls. However, my main complaint and/or difficulty involved electrical gremlins. These were not the type that disable the vehicle; they emotionally inflict themselves upon the occupants. In our case, the brake warning light and chime would regularly trigger, for no apparent reason. This went on for about a year. It may sound humorous, until you are on a thousand mile trip, with an obnoxious ringing every 5-10 minutes. Eventually, Audi dispatched an engineer from the factory to tour the States, looking for intriguing electrical problems. He looked at our vehicle and, after almost a full day of exploration, replaced the entire instrument cluster/module: problem solved.
While this may come across as gross dissatisfaction, it must be interpreted in light of the fact that over one month ago I ordered a 2002 A6 Avant for my wife. I have no excuse for this irrational behavior; other than to say that buying a German vehicle is not a dispassionate, logical experience. Where else can I combine quattro and abuse at the same time?
In all seriousness, the Audi has been, for the most part, a reliable vehicle. Further, if you will permit me a BMW opinion: while I have no current experience with the 530, my background does allow me to state that bimmers have their own set of challenges, reliability wise. You may merely be comparing one set of problems with another.
To that end, I would choose the vehicle that best meets your practical (quattro) and subjective (irrational) needs best. For me, that is an Audi; your emotional mileage may vary and differ.
While it may be heresy, I sometimes envy friends with their Toyotas, Hondas, Lexus' or Acura's; I am not sure that the envy is reciprocal, nor do I care. If life was meant to be simple, I would drive a toaster and be warm in the winter. Instead, I have the Audi, with four (4) Michelin Arctic Alpins. I prefer the latter.
vty
Michael
1. Is your vehicle a 2000?
2. Were all the problems repaired under the warranty? No additional cost? Free loaner car?
3. How long was your car out of action, on average (other than the brake light warning issue)?
I agree with your conclusion that the driving experience outweighs the distractions of some reliability issues, especially if they are totally and completely covered by the warranty. However, a person can take only so much, so I am trying to get some measure on whether Audi has fixed any of the issues this board and others talk about relative to the 2000 models.
Thanks for the continued feedback.
2.) no cost, and always a free loaner;
3.) only once, overnight. all the rest, only a full day.
I do not want to scare you to the point of distraction. With the exception of the aforementioned warning light/chimes, the car has been reliable, but not perfect. My suggestion for any first time Audi buyer: lease for a period not to exceed the warranty; make your decision regarding long term ownership at the lease's termination. There is a sense of peace and calm that soothes the soul when you realize that your commitment is finite. There are no guarantees (only warranties); it is, however, a most enjoyable vehicle.
Best of luck.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. SJF
P.S. This particular guy knows Audi's very well, as he monitors the "Wheels and Tires" forum at Audiworld.com, so he's very familiar with how each tire will work on your vehicle.
(Disclaimer - I get no benefit whatsoever out of this recommendation, which is based on personal experience only!).
To me,the LS430 is truly an original creation,in that Lexus has taken the English "ball of silk"concept about as far as you can go.But for sportier sedans,Lexus just seems to be a follower.
I really like the A6;I considered one last spring.The turbo changes things,but the bade car has a very pleasing sereness to it.But the wheel wouldn't tilt up quite high enough for me.But it has a large back seat,and in genaral impressed me as a superlative.
If you are attracted to overt performance,what about a BMW 5-series?Back seat should be bigger,but it is very performance.But really,if you are looking at an automatic,isn't the turbo A6 approaching Mercedes E320 territory?That is a very fine car,in my opinion.
One final thought: I noted your comment "Lately..."; Have you checked your tire pressure? That is a primary cause of "new" tire noise. Of course, you could also have a defective tire, or two.
vty
Michael
Other pluses? Roomier interior than GS. More luxurious interior with better materials. (About the best there is.) No Pokemon styling. Quattro!
BTW, '02's have been thoroughly reworked, and as it's about 2/3 of the way into the car's product cycle, it should be the most reliable, best driving A6 ever.
If you're interested, make sure you take at least a couple of drives in both the sport and non-sport versions. Most performance oriented drivers prefer the sport suspension.
About the 17" tires, what do the experts recommend for our less-than-wonderful Minnesota winters?
Thanks,
Kurt
I am looking at a 2.7t with the following options:
6 disk changer
bose
guidance package
mobile phone
premium package
rear seat air bags
enhanced sport package
Thank you!!
Regarding 4.2 vs. 2.7T, it's a matter of preference. You have to drive both, and see which you prefer. Of course, 6sp is 2.7T only. Most think the 4.2 looks best. I agree, though I love my 2.7T.
mike
Problems have included:
1. Fuel Tank sensor - Fixed.
2. Front suspension - Fixed.
3. Windshield Distortion - Tends to be slight but can still be found.
4. Drivetrain vibration - Believe it's been addressed for '02.
5. Misc. electronic problems - Largely addressed
6. TBB on 2.7T - Fixed
7. Tiptronic Program - Changed for '02.
As stated, earlier model years tended to be more problematic. Any manufacturer can make a lemon. A few were, the vast majority weren't. My car has #3 and #4. #3 is slight and not noticeable from the driver's seat. The slight drivetrain vibration I had largely subsided after the 5K service, and is now usually unnoticeable. Earlier model years appeared to be more problematic, and I believe this issue has been addressed for '02. It appears it may be a byproduct of the application of the Torsen limited slip differential in the A6 quattro application.
BTW, I LOVE my 2.7T compared to the Japanese cars I've had. Surveys have shown that even owners with significant problems, have tended to love their cars. I suggest you drive one.
A word about the much maligned "2.8": I like performance (my personal choice is the 2.7T); however, I think that the criticisms have been excessive. The zero-30 time is more lethargic than I would like; on the other hand, once rolling, the performance leaves little to be desired; unless you are into M5's or S6's.
You should, prior to deciding, look at the content of the 2002's, both standard and optional. I specified the Avant with the premium package (multi function steering wheel, xenon and parktronic). There were many other options, bring the msrp to $44,405.00. The standard features include ESP. Another feature I like: in dash cd changer.
These differences may, or may not, be important to you. I do not see how you can make a mistake with either choice. My suggestion: drive both and choose the one that makes you smile more.
One more thought: if you are well prepared, dealers will negotiate agressivley even with the 2002's. You will not get quite the discount as on the 2001's, but not as far off as you think. Let us know what happens.
So, I read every post on this and the previous A6 sites and found every one of timcar's post 1838 issues and problems. But once I drove the 2.7t and 4.2, the ride, driver comfort, sporty suspension and all wheel drive made the decision fairly easy. I chose the 4.2 because I wanted the bigger engine for smoother highway driving, found it almost as fast off the line as the 2.7t, and think it looks materially better than the 2.7t. Yes, I miss the Nakamichi stereo (vs. the Bose) and the 5.7 zero to 60 mph speed of the Lexus GS400, but the Audi is so much more enjoyable to drive, those are minor sacrifices to make. Fortunately, I have had zero problems in my 10 months of ownership.
However, don't fool yourself - Audi service will NEVER be in the same class as Lexus service. And the fit and finish of the A6 will NEVER compare to that of the GS400. But the enjoyment you will get from the German engineering and feeling at one with the road and the car will be so rewarding the few annoyances you will have to deal with will be easily overlooked.
Good luck in your decision - it's a great one to be able to make!
Certainly must agree with Robert about service though, while I have a "good" Audi dealer (Some are problematic.) Lexus can't be bettered, from top to bottom.
I am just having a difficult time pulling the trigger on the purchase due to recent events and their effect on the economy. Seems a little silly, I know. It took a long time to get my wife to relent to my impulsive ways...
Now with my new (and correctly rated) tires and 4 new rotors and pad sets, all finally seems to be back to normal.
It is sad that it only took about six to eight months and as many sets of rotors to solve the problem. I have not really driven the car hard yet as I want to make sure that I break these rotors in correctly, but so far so good.
Are the changes only re: options and the addition of 3.0 vs. 2.8? Or has the body changed? I don't really want to buy a car that will be dated within a month or two.
Love any thoughts.
A recent conjecture by a knowledgeable poster @ AW suggests that the former sport suspension may now be the standard suspension. May include 3/4" lower ride height. I'd like that, if they retain the availability of the non-sport seats.
http://www.audiworld.com/news/index.html