I remember your Sienna supposed to be built on Sept. 8 which is the same date as mine. Have you heard anything from your dealer? I was trying to contact with my dealer but no response yet. Thanks;
Well, no one told me I couldn't say what I paid or where I bought it from so here's the info!
I got my Sienna from Toyota of Palo Alto. They responded to my email request for a quote and said they would beat any price in Northern CA by $100. I took my best quote to them and they did exactly what they said they'd do-- no arguing, no issues!!! They showed me what they had in stock (3 or 4 Siennas) as well as everything that they had coming in (20-30? Siennas). I decided to wait for the exact options and color that I wanted and it arrived on time or maybe a day or two early.
After our Sienna arrived they told us that they changed their "Beat any price in Northern CA by $100" to "Beat any price in SF Bay Area by $100" since they didn't expect us to bring in quotes from the Central Valley!!
Another great quote we got was from the dealer in Santa Rosa. That was for $600 over cost.
I don't know if dealers raise/lower prices on a daily/weekly/monthly basis or as supply/demand rises/falls but hopefully you can still get this deal. My sister's friend took my info to a dealer in the Sacramento area and said she got about $3000 off MSRP for an XLE Limited with AWD. I don't know the exact price. She has to wait another four weeks for it to arrive. Good luck!!
Those of you that have had success getting quotes from dealers via e-mail...what is your secret? I have had a tough time getting Toyota dealers to respond to my e-mails (and one or two of the ones that did just sent a form letter back). They've all completely ignored requests for a quote. Is it just my location? I'm in the Detroit suburbs.
Thanks for the prompt response and info! I don't mean to be a pest, but since I'm in the SAC area would be helpful if I knew who your sis' dealt with. With 2 kids now, finding the right price and minivan has become a family mission. ;-) Again, thanks for your info.
I'm considering to buy the 2004 Sienna XLE. Does anyone know how much most people have been paying for the new Sienna in Houston area and what the waiting period is? Thanks.......
I'm really frustrated with Toyota USA right now. I live in the Seattle, Washington area. I ordered a '04 Sienna XLE Limited with Nav in mid June. My dealer initially got a proposed build date for the end of August. In mid July, the proposed date was removed because, as I now understand it, of the fuel tank problem. At the time my dealer had no clue what happened and neither did the NW regional office. In early August, Toyota wrote a generic letter to my dealer informing them of the problem (good) and stating that the build weeks would likely slip a month. Since then nothing. I called the Toyota hotline and complained about lack of info. The complaint was sent to the dealer who was able (finally) to get in contact with someone in Toyota USA. That individual promised to get back to my dealer as soon as he "knew something". Since then, nothing. I think Toyota USA has a real communication problem with the dealers (and customers) and may have a real production disater on their hand. Just in Time only works when things go well.
Has anyone else had this problem? This experience doesn't leave a very good feeling about Toyota customer care in my stomach and is killing the enthusiasm I once had for the vehicle.
I'm willing to drive distance to find some of the deals I'm reading about, especially the $500. to $1,000. over invoice. Can everyone who bought a Sienna 04 in my area respond with names of dealership and price paid? I haven't had any luck so far with negotiating at the dealership or by email. Any help would be appreciated! Thanks
I've not heard of the Toyota Dealer Advertising charge. In my quote it's $510. The dealer is saying I'd have to pay both for the Toyota Dealer Advertising (TDA) and Destination Charge. Is that standard?
I ordered a Sienna 04 XLE from Taylor Toyota of North Augusta (SC) on May 20th and was told "2 months ... 2-1/2 months max" for the wait. In early August I was told it was "in port" but that my vehicle "had been madem already" and to expect another 2-4 weeks for delivery. In late August I was told "They're not telling us anything..." and then I was told that I was never told "2-1/2 months" ("we'd never tell you that!" ) and the one I love the most :"Didn't you know when you ordered this vehicle that it was in high demand? And yet you ordered it anyway." (like it is now MY fault.) Then he explained supply and demand economics to me. Only, ...the thing is... between the time I left a message with him to check on the status of my van, and he called me back, I had like gotten on Edmunds.com and seen the posts about the recall. So when he called me with his "DEMAND-side economics" I gave him every opportunity to inform me of the recall or the production delay ... only he must have forgotten about the SUPPLY side of the equation, because when I said "I heard they were rolling out 3000 a week" he asked me if I knew how many MILLIONS of Americans there were in the US (waiting on Sienna vans ahead of me.)
My former strategy was to call every 2 weeks and "get an update." My calls this week were not returned. Yes, they have offered to return my deposit (which I think, legally, they HAVE to.) But before I know whether to "get out of line" I feel like I need to now how many people are in line ahead of me ... and an expected delivery date. Now they will not even speculate or answer my well-phrased question: "is it more likely 2 weeks or 2 months?" It's all been good-guy/bad-guy song "Those people in Corporate, $@&*% them, they won't tell us anything! I sure wish I could get my hands on those guys !!!" (My paraphrase, and I hope I spelled the expletive right.)
The only "clue" that I have is that on August 16th th edealer called to offer my dibs on a different XLE (different color, different options, and that was presumably ordered by someone on April 7th and he ran out of tiome (as his engine broke and he had to get another van.) THe only problem, besides the fact that it aws a different color and different options and would likely re-start the negotiations on cost at square one (due to different/more option packages) ... I indicated that I (and my wife) "needed to know what our choices are ...ie, that van today or OUR van ... when ? If it meant waiting 7-10 days to get the van we ordered, we would wait... 3 or 4 months, we might take the OTHER one. Leaving unreturned messages, I told them that I needed an "expected date of delivery" in order to reach a decision. Before theyt could provide a "due date" they sold the OTHER van to another customer off the street.
But, the "clue" may be ... an April 7th order arrived August 16th ... and after the recall had been implemented... so a May 20th order may reasonably be 6 weeks behind. But that's my intuition, not theirs. I also wonder if my actual vefhicle was in port and got "turned around" at the time of the recall.
Anybody else out there got a story to top that one ? Any dealers wants to tell me what I should do (besides look again REAL hard at the Ody's and Quests) ? I know, it's those $%&@# guys at Corporate !!!
How did you find the zip codes out of your area to conduct your internet search?
Toyota and Edmunds require you to enter your zip code to get a list of dealerships in your area. I want to go out of northern VA and MD, but I don't know where to find zip codes.
I went to the Toyota web site and put in just the state i wanted Dealers names. It gave me a list of every dealer, name, address and zip in the state in wanted.
I'm in the Seattle area as well. I ordered my van on March 17th and picked it up on June 23rd. 14 weeks from order to delivery. The fuel tank recall will push back your delivery date by about 2 weeks. HTH
That's simply a way of extracting more $$$ out of the masses. If supply is short and demand is high, they'll probably get the extra $510 for "advertising costs" (read - "PROFIT"). In a competitive market, that charge would never appear.
I would hunt around at MANY other dealers within a reasonable driving range (2 hours,?? depends on your tolerance) looking for better pricing.
Keep in mind, they already get MSRP - Invoice + dealer holdback. On a Sienna, that's several thousand. Then many dealerships play the other games (rustproofing, scotchgard, etc) that adds on some more $$. Then there is insurance that they'll want to sell you (a LOUSY deal). Realistically, advertising is one of their costs (just like heating, electricity, salaries, etc). That simply comes out of the proceeds of the sale, whatever is left is "dealer profit".
i've been waiting months and months and months for my vehicle, and I live in cleveland, heartland of america, not a haven for Japanese cars, and I've been waiting 4 months with no Sienna allocation in sight. Dealer last told me in late August I was #2 in the XLE line, yet I didn't get a vehicle in their early September allocation. I'm disappointed it's taken so long, Toyota is going to hear it from me, esp. if my dealer screws me over on the trade-in he promised me.
Yet dealers in other parts of the country-- Palo Alto, foreign car heaven-- have them in stock or on order unsold? Something doesn't add up.
Recall only adding 2 weeks to the wait? That doesn't add up at all either, not at all consistent with experience in this part of the country.
Dealers who are discounting heavily in this supply/demand environment? They aren't very smart business people.
Don't get too hung up on destination and TDA; keep focusing on what it costs to get the van out of the showroom. Don't forget to figure in your trade or finance rate, if any, into the equation.
When I want to find a zipcode, I go to a net search engine like google.com and type in something like pa zip. Usually a real zipcode flops up in the first few hits listed and I don't even have to drill down any deeper.
I suppose you might wind up with a vitamin ad or worse if you search for zip for PA and MA, lol.
If you want a Sienna, and you want to order it now more or less, you are essentially playing the dealer's game. A Sienna buyer at this time, and pretty much regardless of location, just has to reconcile him or herself that their present need for the vehicle is going to make "dealing" very difficult in many areas,particularly metropolitan ones. IMO, being able to negotiate to any extent on this vehicle is pretty much inconsistent with getting it now.
The following is a letter my wife and I are sending to Toyota Corporate about their less than pleasureable car buying experience.
Dear Toyota On Sunday, August 24th, my wife and I experienced the worst car-buying experience of our lives. We are steadfast Toyota fans, and we or our extended family have purchased over 8 Toyotas over the last 15 years. Unfortunately Sunday’s experience has given us second thoughts about making our next car a Toyota.
We have been in the market for a 2004 Toyota Sienna for over 2 months. Getting the right model, color and package had proved elusive as it has been on allocation since it’s market release. We had visited 5 local San Diego, California dealers to look at different models. Each time we left unable to get what we wanted (White LE, 8 seater, w/ 3rd row air curtain). And dealers were not taking orders for special factory orders. Our only choices were to buy Siennas costing $5,000 to $8,000 out of our price range. We became frustrated with the market environment that Toyota seemed to be creating. We decided to reconsider other car buying options.
While out of town on Sunday, by chance we drove by an Orange County Toyota dealership, ELMORE Toyota. They had three white Siennas in the front of the lot. We were on our way to Church at the time, but made a note to call the dealership after the service. Perhaps the model we wanted might be there. After the service we phoned the dealer. The salesman said they did indeed have the model we were looking for. But we should hurry as there are people “snooping around the Siennas”.
We arrived at the dealership 20 minutes later and were ushered to the white 8 seater Sienna we had been looking for. It seemed to be a stroke of luck and we were excited we might finally have our mini-van. The salesman, an English gentleman I'll call "G", was enthusiastic about the automobile, saying that 4 people had looked at it that day. The message was that we should act quickly. So we did. Immediately after the test drive we told the salesman we wanted to buy the car.
We walked into the office to begin the paper work. I filled out a Motor Vehicle Credit Application for Purchase. Even though I was going to pay cash I was told I needed to do this for a credit check. So I complied with the request.
Then G said “The sticker price is $27,700. Usually we mark this price up a bit. But since you’re paying cash I may be able to get this approved at this price.”
The statement that the sticker price may not be honored took me completely by surprise. I had assumed we had an understanding out in the lot when my wife and I said we’d buy the car (at sticker). I sensed that I was about to begin the proverbial car salesman game. I said “The MSRP is $24,500. There is already a markup in the price.” G said he’d see what he could do. I had an uneasy feeling about what was to come next.
Five minutes later G came back saying that the credit check was still in process. It would be another ten minutes or so. And by the way, “there seems to be some confusion as some other customers are interested in the car as well. But since you’re paying cash, I don’t think it’ll be a problem.”
I couldn’t believe what I was hearing. We had been at the lot over 45 minutes at this point and no one had looked at the car we were interested in. And although we were told that others had looked at the car that day, no salesman had told us there was any one ahead of us trying to buy the car.
Right away I felt as if I was about to be scammed. I thought we had a deal, and now I was being told that not only was the price not firm, I’m one of three vying for the car. I felt as if he was looking for me to get into a bidding contest with the other customers. Feeling the whole experience beginning to turn sour, I said that we would wait five more minutes for them to make up their minds. If the price was not accepted and the van ours, we would leave.
Five minutes later G returned apologizing and saying that there were two other customers ahead of me, but that it should be worked out soon. Feeling as if I was being taken advantage of I told G I wanted my credit application paper work back and that I was rescinding my offer. He asked if I’d reconsider but I said that this was not a pleasant car buying experience. Walking to the office G asked me to wait outside while he got the paper work. A few minutes later another salesman, apparently G’s manager came out to talk to me.
He asked how it was going. I mentioned that my offer was rescinded and I wanted my paperwork returned to me. He begin to say that this is the way it goes, that there were two other customers interested in the same car.
At this point I begin to get angry. I said “I had not been told there were other customers ahead of me for the vehicle. I had been led to believe that this vehicle was for sale. Now you’re playing me for a fool. You’re supposed to be a professional!”
The manager angrily replied “I have two other customers ahead of you that I have to give priority to!”
I remember thinking there’s one van for three customers? I said, “Then you don’t need me as a customer.”
He yelled back, “You’re right, I don’t!” and stormed off.
Then another salesman ran up to me asking me how he could help. What did I want, he could get me anything I wanted…” Here we go again I thought. At that point G walked by handing me my paperwork and I walked out.
I had been treated like a sucker the whole time. It was a terrible experience that reinforced every negative stereotype there is about car salesman and the car buying experience.
I wanted to voice my extreme displeasure over this lack of respect rendered to my wife and me, customers about to hand over a significant amount of money. We were non-consenting players of a game where dealers manipulate multiple customers against one another in an effort to bid up the price of the car. I don’t know if this is unique to ELMORE Toyota. I do feel that Toyota, by limiting the release of Siennas has fomented an excitement for the car (deserved) that enables most dealers to take advantage of their customer base (undeserved). This behavior is predatory, offensive and unethical.
I hope that this is a rare occurrence with Toyota, but I fear that it is becoming all too common. Although we love the Toyota product, we now feel compelled to take a second look at other brands of mini vans.
Hey want_sienna: Thanks for referring me to that one. My wife's relatives are down there so might make the trek. I haven't pinged them yet, most dealers seem real bad about responding to e-mail. Roseville Toyota is the biggest dealer I think. I haven't had time to contact them. Those are the 3 though: Sac, Modesto, and Sanger that everyone is mentioning here. I may give them a ring this weekend and I'll let you know too. Thanks.
#2060 is a terrible story; I too am a Toyota fan but at some point you have to draw the line. Toyota is big enough with a popular enough product that losing one customer really isn't its focus. If you were a Porsche repeat buyer - you'd matter a lot more. Check the article located here on Edmunds on the undercover writing assignment as a car salesman. As a car fan, I found it one of the most fascinating articles. As expected, some dealers are just plain cheezy. I hope Toyota gets back to you. Once you read the article, if you're not that savvy or comfortable with the haggle/sales manipulation environment, you'll be a lot more empowered. Good luck.
Although we want to buy new Sienna, we shall put another year or so on our '91 Previa (185K). Prev is runn'n fine...even if we must put a few hundred bucks into unknown repairs during next 12-14 months. not worth extra expense and hassle putting up with typical undersupplied dealers. On vans, first it was Honda, now Toyota. Hopefully w/new Ody on horizon in year, things may change for better??
I think the question of whether options should be at invoice or MSRP depends. It seems to me that the quotes people are conveying here are comparing the total price. Thus, you would use total Invoice as the baseline and then negotiate up what you would pay in total; so $1000 over invoice is over total invoice including options. And I agree with prior suggestions that you want them to quote you the total $, that is key so they don't try to add incremental $ under some strange guise. Make sure they breakout the key costs by line item such as sf_sienna had discussed, including invoice+ad fee+lic+reg+tax. It might be possible that some special option you're seeking is difficult to acquire or a hassle so the dealer might want MSRP, but I'd fight that one. Good luck.
I agree, as much as I like the new Sienna, I refuse to be held hostage by dealers with their pricing games - BUT in their defense, that's the old law of supply & demand. FYI - Honda's redesigning the odessey next year so if they also throw in 4 wheel drive, that should give sienna some competition, until then, there's no competition and its a great van with high demand, nuff said about "discounts"
I predict that when the new '05 Ody comes out this fall that both Honda and Toyota will stick to very little off the sticker (i.e. $1,000 or less). The only reason better deals are being had now on the '04 Ody is due to it being the "older" model even though the new Sienna only has a few options not currently available on the current Ody - especially if you price them out to similar MSRP.
Anyone waiting on the '05 Ody to come out to drop the price on the new Sienna may never see that occur.
I agree totally. The Ody hasn't really seen much discounting (till maybe this year - at least here in the NE). That being said, at this point a 1000 discount isn't bad being relative to the demand for both models. It will definately be easier once the ody comes out though, and getting one at list should be a no brainer. Guess I'll wait & see!
I read your story from post #2060 with interest. But I noticed one thing which struck me as odd. You said that you and your wife were interested in an LE8 (white) with the side curtain airbags. Apparantly everything was going fine until the issue of 'sticker' price came up. The salesman said the price was $27,700 to which you replied, “The MSRP is $24,500. There is already a markup in the price.”
FYI - MSRP on an LE8 with option package #4 (side curtain airbags) ONLY would be $24,410 + $1610 = $26,020 + destination ($540 in Tx.) = $26,560. I would imagine that the destination charge would be the same in Seattle WA. Typically, these things usually have some kind of 'Extra Value' package of one sort or another tacked on by the factory (in addition to alloy rims, running boards, etc. etc.).
What it all boils down to is, it is entirely conceivable that the true MSRP sticker on the vehicle actually WAS $27,700. I know that, for an LE8 w/ side air bags, the MSRP definitely is NOT $24,500. It is also quite conceivable that salesman 'G' (who was only dealing with you), may not have been aware that salesman 'F' may have been dealing with a customer(s) by phone who had been searching low and high for an LE8 w/ side air bags and who were MORE THAN HAPPY to pay $27,700.
None of this excuses their attitude towards you in the dealership of course.
Paid MSRP. 2004 LE (8 pass) w/ BW package and mats. Phantom Grey. Ordered July 10 took delivery Aug. 21. MSRP + tax + tags. Ordered over the phone from a dealer in NJ. He was the only one to commit to a firm delivery date. So he got my order. Got a loan from the Credit Union. Bought a extended warranty from the CU for $736 + tax ( 7 yr/100,000 miles.) Had to wait because of the color and 8 pass. The 8 passenger is worth the wait.
I bought a 2004 XLE Limited. We order the van with running boards - but for some reason the van came without them. The sales rep that we are working with has offered to refund to us the price we paid for the running boards.
When we did the negotiating on price we did not have a specific line item for the running board. So we have no reference as to what the refund price should be.
Does anyone have any numbers on the price for running boards? It would be nice to have the retail number as well as the approximate dealer cost number.
I know that I could get this from the salesrep that I worked with - but I would rather have this information from an independent source.
Sorry about the delay in responding, I only read the board about once a week. I don't know which dealer my sister's friend ended-up going to for her Sienna but I recommended that she try Florin Road since that's who I was dealing with. I just heard that she saved about $3K over her initial offer. My best offer from Florin Road was $500 over cost (cost being invoice plus $492 for Toyota Dealer Advertising). The only reason I didn't take the offer was that my wife wanted Desert Mica Sand color and they only had Silver. I asked them to order it for me at the same price but they wouldn't. So, that's when I went to Toyota of Palo Alto and got the same pricing for the exact package and color that I wanted. I had the feeling that Florin Road wasn't getting as many Siennas as Palo Alto and they didn't want to give away a pre-order for such a low price. The guy I dealt with in the Internet Sales Dept (can't remember his name) was very nice and told me that he tried to get his mgr to do the deal but it wasn't working. That's my limited experience with them, you probably know more about them than me since you're in the area. I'll try to get the name of the dealer where my sister's friend bought her Sienna. I should be seeing her next weekend. Good luck! Steve
Currently, the running boards are PPO option only. They are only available from the factory even they are listed on the accessory brochure. The local Toyota parts probably can't find anything like part number or price. The price of the running board for the 2003 Sienna ranges from $360 (black) to $470 (painted). I would guess the one for 2004 model is from $650 to $750 installed ($600 for the retail). Check with your sales rep.
Toyotacenter.com has an XLE Limited with color-keyed running boards with MSRP of $499 installed - do not know what invoice is on these. Hope this helps.
Has anyone taken delivery on a LE with the BW (#7 safety) package in either Ohio, Indiana, or Kentucky? I'm trying to figure out the story on mine which is on order. (Dealership still saying they can ask but they are delivering to this area) Thanks!
We are finally buying our Sienna from far, far away as we could get the package we wanted at a FAR better price than anyone would offer anywhere near Ohio. We got an XLE #14 for $31285 with the auto dimming mirror and something else I cannot remember. Anyway, we are weighing our options for picking up the car or just having it shipped here by an auto transport company. Has anyone done this, what do you think? Some of the price quotes have been around $1000 give or take $100 or so, but that still leaves us with a price far below anything offered here! I did a generic internet search to get the companies and quotes, but would love if anyone has a recommendation for us! Thanks! April
Oh yeah, we have a build date of 9/15, as I know some of you do...do you have an estimated date of delivery? I don't know if I should look more at 10/1 or 10/7 or something else? Thanks!
We purchased an LE-8 with pkg 4 which includes rear audio controls on the roof - looks like it would house the DVD player if we had gotten that option...now wanting the built in DVD player for the kids instead of the kind that hangs b/w the seats. Can the dealer install a DVD where the rear audio is now?
Also, a caveat about Marietta Toyota in Atl - they delayed and delayed in getting title and VIN info to our local DMV office (said they had to wait for our check to clear - but 3 weeks?) plus they put a wrong expiration date on the temporary license plate and as a result of the delay in getting our license plate, we almost had to pay $400 in unneccessary taxes...but thankfully had a helpful manager at the DMV waive the extra fees.
Anyway, anyone buying from this dealer -keep after them to submit the information to the DMV.
I recieved an internet email from a dealership in Va Beach, VA offering $33,661.76 "out the door" price for a XLE AWD package #17. Edmond's MSRP is $34,875. Is this a good deal? If so, how should I proceed? What should I be careful of?
We did end up purchasing one that hangs between the seats, but our salesman told us that financially it was better to do it from an independent source because the dealership pays an independent source to come in, and you end up paying the source's cost, plus a dealership profit. It's financially better to go out on your own. My concern was warranty, and it interfering with the warranty of anything else in my vehicle, but the salesman said it isn't a concern. It's a separate system that only ties into sound system.
My first question to the dealer is when to expect delivery of the vehicle. I'm sure the dealer will order the vehicle and who knows when you will actually get the car. Maybe by January?
I live in the Seattle area. I went to the Toyota web site and got a list of every Toyota dealer in Washington State (about 35). I put an email together that was directed to every dealer. I included in my email exactly the car I wanted and an offered price (about $500 over Edmund’s invoice price). I got about 4 emails back. One email came from a dealership in Kirkland that reads as follows: "You have certainly made our day. We can't even get the vehicle as it comes from the factory. You want one special. Most dealerships are Adding $3500-$6000 2nd sticker to the MSRP. We have 33 people waiting for one. The invoice on your described vehicle is $27917.00 without TDA Which is another estimated $540. For as much as I appreciate your inquiry and your offer Michael, I cannot sell you any 2004 Sienna for anything less than MSRP + tax and fees. You are welcome to order one at any time".
I received two other emails that where very straightforward and contained no sarcasm or exaggerations. They did indicate that they would have to order the van and that it might take as long as 90-120 days. The two dealers are outside of the Seattle, Bellevue, and Kirkland area. Outside of the major urban areas.
One email said they would go $1,000 over cost, the other said they would go $1,150 over cost.
If all goes well, and we still have a ways to go before the car is delivered; I saved thousand of dollars.
I dealt with those guys as well back in March. Back then their story was that they had 40 people on their list. And this was before the Sienna was officially out. But they would let me buy the first XLE LTD for $1000 over MSRP.
Anyway, I told them that I had 7 other buyers with me and he just lost 7 sales. We all went a dealer just outside of Seattle. Things never change there.
Production is back to where it was before the stoppage, hovering between 2900-3100 vehicles per week. As of 9/13, 66678 have been produced this year.
The dealers I have been speaking with have been saying the wait for a new vehicle is as much as 16 weeks depending on model.
My local dealer haas already been discounting the Quest. They have not had many on the lot as of yet. Hopefully with low priced Quests, eventually there will be an effect. The Ford twins will be out soon as well as the 04 DC vans, so hopefully people will get discouraged with the waiting lists and buy something else.
Has any got the vichle delivery for Sept. 8 built date? Dealer told me the car I ordered should be built on Sept. 8, and told me should be deliveried within 7 to 10 days, but that's not the case since I called them last Friday, they still do NOT know when they expect the delivery, anybody has the similar situation, please be advised. Thanks;
The dealership I'm negotiating with wants a $500. nonrefundable deposit. They cannot give me a firm delivery date. They said that they would place the order upon reciept of the deposit, and once the order is placed, I will get a build date. Delivery will be within 2-3 weeks of build date. I feel uncomfortable giving a nonrefundable deposit without knowing when I will receive a car. Is a $500. nonrefundable deposit standard practice? Thanks for all your help!
Do not go to Modern Toyota in Winston-Salem, NC. They just "bait and switched". They changed their price after months of order being placed. Their reason? They need to scratch off the prices again and start on a new pricing list.
Been searching for a XLE or XLE Ltd. Seems most dealers in NY/NJ are asking for MSRP. Found a couple of dealers as far down as VA willing to go lower. But had one instance where the below MSRP pricing turned out to be for a van purchased in Canada. Is there any way to tell whether a van was purchased outside the US and being resold here? Seems like a number of dealers were doing this to be able to offer the vans for sale. Is the warranty still effective? What about replacement of the speedometer/odometer?
Comments
Thanks;
Well, no one told me I couldn't say what I paid or where I bought it from so here's the info!
I got my Sienna from Toyota of Palo Alto. They responded to my email request for a quote and said they would beat any price in Northern CA by $100. I took my best quote to them and they did exactly what they said they'd do-- no arguing, no issues!!! They showed me what they had in stock (3 or 4 Siennas) as well as everything that they had coming in (20-30? Siennas). I decided to wait for the exact options and color that I wanted and it arrived on time or maybe a day or two early.
After our Sienna arrived they told us that they changed their "Beat any price in Northern CA by $100" to "Beat any price in SF Bay Area by $100" since they didn't expect us to bring in quotes from the Central Valley!!
Another great quote we got was from the dealer in Santa Rosa. That was for $600 over cost.
I don't know if dealers raise/lower prices on a daily/weekly/monthly basis or as supply/demand rises/falls but hopefully you can still get this deal. My sister's friend took my info to a dealer in the Sacramento area and said she got about $3000 off MSRP for an XLE Limited with AWD. I don't know the exact price. She has to wait another four weeks for it to arrive. Good luck!!
Steve
I don't mean to be a pest, but since I'm in the SAC area would be helpful if I knew who your sis' dealt with.
With 2 kids now, finding the right price and minivan has become a family mission. ;-)
Again, thanks for your info.
Has anyone else had this problem? This experience doesn't leave a very good feeling about Toyota customer care in my stomach and is killing the enthusiasm I once had for the vehicle.
Can everyone who bought a Sienna 04 in my area respond with names of dealership and price paid? I haven't had any luck so far with negotiating at the dealership or by email. Any help would be appreciated! Thanks
My former strategy was to call every 2 weeks and "get an update." My calls this week were not returned. Yes, they have offered to return my deposit (which I think, legally, they HAVE to.) But before I know whether to "get out of line" I feel like I need to now how many people are in line ahead of me ... and an expected delivery date. Now they will not even speculate or answer my well-phrased question: "is it more likely 2 weeks or 2 months?" It's all been good-guy/bad-guy song "Those people in Corporate, $@&*% them, they won't tell us anything! I sure wish I could get my hands on those guys !!!" (My paraphrase, and I hope I spelled the expletive right.)
The only "clue" that I have is that on August 16th th edealer called to offer my dibs on a different XLE (different color, different options, and that was presumably ordered by someone on April 7th and he ran out of tiome (as his engine broke and he had to get another van.) THe only problem, besides the fact that it aws a different color and different options and would likely re-start the negotiations on cost at square one (due to different/more option packages) ... I indicated that I (and my wife) "needed to know what our choices are ...ie, that van today or OUR van ... when ? If it meant waiting 7-10 days to get the van we ordered, we would wait... 3 or 4 months, we might take the OTHER one. Leaving unreturned messages, I told them that I needed an "expected date of delivery" in order to reach a decision. Before theyt could provide a "due date" they sold the OTHER van to another customer off the street.
But, the "clue" may be ... an April 7th order arrived August 16th ... and after the recall had been implemented... so a May 20th order may reasonably be 6 weeks behind. But that's my intuition, not theirs. I also wonder if my actual vefhicle was in port and got "turned around" at the time of the recall.
Anybody else out there got a story to top that one ? Any dealers wants to tell me what I should do (besides look again REAL hard at the Ody's and Quests) ? I know, it's those $%&@# guys at Corporate !!!
Toyota and Edmunds require you to enter your zip code to get a list of dealerships in your area. I want to go out of northern VA and MD, but I don't know where to find zip codes.
Can anyone help me get started?
If you were to go to the USPS site you would be able to find them. You might start here:
http://www.usps.com/zip4/citytown_zip.htm
I would hunt around at MANY other dealers within a reasonable driving range (2 hours,?? depends on your tolerance) looking for better pricing.
Keep in mind, they already get MSRP - Invoice + dealer holdback. On a Sienna, that's several thousand. Then many dealerships play the other games (rustproofing, scotchgard, etc) that adds on some more $$. Then there is insurance that they'll want to sell you (a LOUSY deal). Realistically, advertising is one of their costs (just like heating, electricity, salaries, etc). That simply comes out of the proceeds of the sale, whatever is left is "dealer profit".
Yet dealers in other parts of the country-- Palo Alto, foreign car heaven-- have them in stock or on order unsold? Something doesn't add up.
Recall only adding 2 weeks to the wait? That doesn't add up at all either, not at all consistent with experience in this part of the country.
Dealers who are discounting heavily in this supply/demand environment? They aren't very smart business people.
When I want to find a zipcode, I go to a net search engine like google.com and type in something like pa zip. Usually a real zipcode flops up in the first few hits listed and I don't even have to drill down any deeper.
I suppose you might wind up with a vitamin ad or worse if you search for zip for PA and MA, lol.
Steve, Host
Dear Toyota
On Sunday, August 24th, my wife and I experienced the worst car-buying experience of our lives. We are steadfast Toyota fans, and we or our extended family have purchased over 8 Toyotas over the last 15 years. Unfortunately Sunday’s experience has given us second thoughts about making our next car a Toyota.
We have been in the market for a 2004 Toyota Sienna for over 2 months. Getting the right model, color and package had proved elusive as it has been on allocation since it’s market release. We had visited 5 local San Diego, California dealers to look at different models. Each time we left unable to get what we wanted (White LE, 8 seater, w/ 3rd row air curtain). And dealers were not taking orders for special factory orders. Our only choices were to buy Siennas costing $5,000 to $8,000 out of our price range. We became frustrated with the market environment that Toyota seemed to be creating. We decided to reconsider other car buying options.
While out of town on Sunday, by chance we drove by an Orange County Toyota dealership, ELMORE Toyota. They had three white Siennas in the front of the lot. We were on our way to Church at the time, but made a note to call the dealership after the service. Perhaps the model we wanted might be there. After the service we phoned the dealer. The salesman said they did indeed have the model we were looking for. But we should hurry as there are people “snooping around the Siennas”.
We arrived at the dealership 20 minutes later and were ushered to the white 8 seater Sienna we had been looking for. It seemed to be a stroke of luck and we were excited we might finally have our mini-van. The salesman, an English gentleman I'll call "G", was enthusiastic about the automobile, saying that 4 people had looked at it that day. The message was that we should act quickly. So we did. Immediately after the test drive we told the salesman we wanted to buy the car.
We walked into the office to begin the paper work. I filled out a Motor Vehicle Credit Application for Purchase. Even though I was going to pay cash I was told I needed to do this for a credit check. So I complied with the request.
Then G said “The sticker price is $27,700. Usually we mark this price up a bit. But since you’re paying cash I may be able to get this approved at this price.”
The statement that the sticker price may not be honored took me completely by surprise. I had assumed we had an understanding out in the lot when my wife and I said we’d buy the car (at sticker). I sensed that I was about to begin the proverbial car salesman game. I said “The MSRP is $24,500. There is already a markup in the price.” G said he’d see what he could do. I had an uneasy feeling about what was to come next.
Five minutes later G came back saying that the credit check was still in process. It would be another ten minutes or so. And by the way, “there seems to be some confusion as some other customers are interested in the car as well. But since you’re paying cash, I don’t think it’ll be a problem.”
I couldn’t believe what I was hearing. We had been at the lot over 45 minutes at this point and no one had looked at the car we were interested in. And although we were told that others had looked at the car that day, no salesman had told us there was any one ahead of us trying to buy the car.
Right away I felt as if I was about to be scammed. I thought we had a deal, and now I was being told that not only was the price not firm, I’m one of three vying for the car. I felt as if he was looking for me to get into a bidding contest with the other customers. Feeling the whole experience beginning to turn sour, I said that we would wait five more minutes for them to make up their minds. If the price was not accepted and the van ours, we would leave.
Five minutes later G returned apologizing and saying that there were two other customers ahead of me, but that it should be worked out soon. Feeling as if I was being taken advantage of I told G I wanted my credit application paper work back and that I was rescinding my offer. He asked if I’d reconsider but I said that this was not a pleasant car buying experience. Walking to the office G asked me to wait outside while he got the paper work. A few minutes later another salesman, apparently G’s manager came out to talk to me.
He asked how it was going. I mentioned that my offer was rescinded and I wanted my paperwork returned to me. He begin to say that this is the way it goes, that there were two other customers interested in the same car.
At this point I begin to get angry. I said “I had not been told there were other customers ahead of me for the vehicle. I had been led to believe that this vehicle was for sale. Now you’re playing me for a fool. You’re supposed to be a professional!”
The manager angrily replied “I have two other customers ahead of you that I have to give priority to!”
I remember thinking there’s one van for three customers? I said, “Then you don’t need me as a customer.”
He yelled back, “You’re right, I don’t!” and stormed off.
Then another salesman ran up to me asking me how he could help. What did I want, he could get me anything I wanted…” Here we go again I thought. At that point G walked by handing me my paperwork and I walked out.
I had been treated like a sucker the whole time. It was a terrible experience that reinforced every negative stereotype there is about car salesman and the car buying experience.
I wanted to voice my extreme displeasure over this lack of respect rendered to my wife and me, customers about to hand over a significant amount of money. We were non-consenting players of a game where dealers manipulate multiple customers against one another in an effort to bid up the price of the car. I don’t know if this is unique to ELMORE Toyota. I do feel that Toyota, by limiting the release of Siennas has fomented an excitement for the car (deserved) that enables most dealers to take advantage of their customer base (undeserved). This behavior is predatory, offensive and unethical.
I hope that this is a rare occurrence with Toyota, but I fear that it is becoming all too common. Although we love the Toyota product, we now feel compelled to take a second look at other brands of mini vans.
Ace
Anyone waiting on the '05 Ody to come out to drop the price on the new Sienna may never see that occur.
I agree totally. The Ody hasn't really seen much discounting (till maybe this year - at least here in the NE). That being said, at this point a 1000 discount isn't bad being relative to the demand for both models. It will definately be easier once the ody comes out though, and getting one at list should be a no brainer. Guess I'll wait & see!
Ace
“The MSRP is $24,500. There is already a markup in the price.”
FYI - MSRP on an LE8 with option package #4 (side curtain airbags) ONLY would be $24,410 + $1610 = $26,020 + destination ($540 in Tx.) = $26,560. I would imagine that the destination charge would be the same in Seattle WA. Typically, these things usually have some kind of 'Extra Value' package of one sort or another tacked on by the factory (in addition to alloy rims, running boards, etc. etc.).
What it all boils down to is, it is entirely conceivable that the true MSRP sticker on the vehicle actually WAS $27,700. I know that, for an LE8 w/ side air bags, the MSRP definitely is NOT $24,500. It is also quite conceivable that salesman 'G' (who was only dealing with you), may not have been aware that salesman 'F' may have been dealing with a customer(s) by phone who had been searching low and high for an LE8 w/ side air bags and who were MORE THAN HAPPY to pay $27,700.
None of this excuses their attitude towards you in the dealership of course.
to commit to a firm delivery date. So he got my order. Got a loan from the Credit Union. Bought a extended warranty from the CU for $736 + tax ( 7 yr/100,000 miles.) Had to wait because of the color and 8 pass. The 8 passenger is worth the wait.
with running boards - but for some reason the
van came without them. The sales rep that we
are working with has offered to refund to us
the price we paid for the running boards.
When we did the negotiating on price we did not
have a specific line item for the running board.
So we have no reference as to what the refund
price should be.
Does anyone have any numbers on the price for
running boards? It would be nice to have the
retail number as well as the approximate dealer
cost number.
I know that I could get this from the salesrep
that I worked with - but I would rather have this
information from an independent source.
Thanks for any help.
Thanks!
Thanks!
April
Oh yeah, we have a build date of 9/15, as I know some of you do...do you have an estimated date of delivery? I don't know if I should look more at 10/1 or 10/7 or something else? Thanks!
Also, a caveat about Marietta Toyota in Atl - they delayed and delayed in getting title and VIN info to our local DMV office (said they had to wait for our check to clear - but 3 weeks?) plus they put a wrong expiration date on the temporary license plate and as a result of the delay in getting our license plate, we almost had to pay $400 in unneccessary taxes...but thankfully had a helpful manager at the DMV waive the extra fees.
Anyway, anyone buying from this dealer -keep after them to submit the information to the DMV.
Thank you, in advance, for your advice.
My concern was warranty, and it interfering with the warranty of anything else in my vehicle, but the salesman said it isn't a concern. It's a separate system that only ties into sound system.
"You have certainly made our day. We can't even get the vehicle as it
comes from the factory. You want one special. Most dealerships are
Adding $3500-$6000 2nd sticker to the MSRP. We have 33 people waiting
for one. The invoice on your described vehicle is $27917.00 without TDA
Which is another estimated $540. For as much as I appreciate your
inquiry and your offer Michael, I cannot sell you any 2004 Sienna for
anything less than MSRP + tax and fees. You are welcome to order one at
any time".
I received two other emails that where very straightforward and contained no sarcasm or exaggerations. They did indicate that they would have to order the van and that it might take as long as 90-120 days. The two dealers are outside of the Seattle, Bellevue, and Kirkland area. Outside of the major urban areas.
One email said they would go $1,000 over cost, the other said they would go $1,150 over cost.
If all goes well, and we still have a ways to go before the car is delivered; I saved thousand of dollars.
Anyway, I told them that I had 7 other buyers with me and he just lost 7 sales. We all went a dealer just outside of Seattle. Things never change there.
The dealers I have been speaking with have been saying the wait for a new vehicle is as much as 16 weeks depending on model.
My local dealer haas already been discounting the Quest. They have not had many on the lot as of yet. Hopefully with low priced Quests, eventually there will be an effect. The Ford twins will be out soon as well as the 04 DC vans, so hopefully people will get discouraged with the waiting lists and buy something else.
Thanks;
Thanks for all your help!
Even with a refundable deposit, I'd want to do it on a credit card so I may have some recourse if the dealer goes banko or something.
my .02.
Steve, Host