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Comments
all of them the first time even though they knew they were not right for the car. Another reason not to buy a Jetta. Just a few days ago, my A/C was broken. Since all the dealerships are so busying fixing other more serious problems like engine and falling-apart windows, they won't have time for my little A/C problem until after this summer is over.
If the VW Jetta is as problematic as some of these threads indicate, then I must be extremely fortunate. I have had ZERO problems ! Even the alignment and tire balance seems to be right on!
I know the air filter is hard as hell to replace compared to some, because you have to remove a series of small screws to get it out.
The only time I had my service done at the dealer was at 5 and 10K, and that was because I had a coupon for one and a freebie card for another. It was $25 because I had a coupon for it from VW's website.
"OK... I have reviewed the list above
leaving out all of "checks" that anyone would do anyway; (so they can find something else to sell you!)
It is basically;
*)Change engine oil& Filter
*)Change Fuel Filter
*)Replace Pollen Filter
*)Rotate Wheels (I would suggest BALANCING them too!!)
That is no more than $70 worth of parts and the rest will be LABOR. Figuring about $70/hour labor rate... It is not unreasonable for this to be a $200 service. (Which engine you have makes very little difference on these items.)"
Are you saying that the dealership shouldn't check the listed items? If, so, who would check them.
Some of those items are easily checked by the owner, but a few would be difficult for most owners do do themselves:
1. check the timing belt - I don't know what's involved on the Jetta, but many cars require the removal of the timing belt cover and a whole host of components to access the belt and really check it thoroughly.
2. check air bag operation and components - how would the regular joe inspect the operation of this equipment?
for a 20,000 mile service, a few hundred bucks may be a little high, but definitely not outrageous.
I used to own a `96 Mercury Sable. The 60,000 mile service for this vehicle was around $350, or so. Conversely, the 15,000 and 30,000 mile services were proportionally less. I kept the vehicle for nearly eight years and including the cost of the services, the total cost to own and operate that vehicle (minus gas) was approx. $240 per month. Not too bad at all.
If you're planning on keeping a vehicle for very long (6 years+) my opinion is to keep up with the required maintenance schedules. I totally agree however that you should shop around, just don't let only the price lead you by the nose.
I have friends that have had volkswagen rabbits and jettas that they have put in excess of 250,000 miles on them.
Just exactly how do you think they CHECK the airbag system??... it is a ONE TIME deployment. If the airbags are deployed, they need to be replaced. (at great expense)
Every dealership I have ever bought a car from has presented me with THEIR VERSION of a maintenance schedule that is often very different from the one in the owners manual.
If they ACTUALLY did everything on the list, the cost is commensurate. Some folks just do not realize the hourly rate that a good mechanic costs.
(Notice I said GOOD mechanic)
Seriously, they check the actuators to make sure they are communicating with the rest of the system and that there are no faulty circuits or connections.
In MY experience, the dealer has followed the manual and the schedule of services. I have yet to get one that differs from what is recommended by the manufacturer. Just looked at my co-worker's 2001 Jetta. It appears that it would be more work than I would care to do to check the timing belt. I would probably have done it my self 10-12 years ago when I had time to do all of my own maintenance, but nowadays, life's too short.....I'll pay someone else to do it.
Have a drink, relax......chill, it's Friday.
Heck, my VW dealership did not even know that my Jetta MUST have Synthetic oil. (VW has issued a TSB about this) I had to tell them to put it in.
I also know that they are checking NOTHING... just do the work and move it out.
It is not in their intrest to "check" anyting unless it is to SELL you some more stuff.... They do those checks for FREE. (Why pay them to "check" my brakes?... I do that every day by looking at the brake pads thru the wheels.)
Timing belt? You are right, it should be checked. If it fails, the engine is a boat anchor. Do they check it? I really doubt it.
Do I sound cynical? Sure I do! Is is because I am trained in engineering and have "checked" these things immediatly after they claim to have checked them... And the BOLTS WERE NEVER REMOVED!
It is not possible that they actually did any more than check it off on their clipboard.
Have you ever been charged for 3 batteries? They claim that the vehicle burned out 3 batteries while they were troubleshooting a starter problem.
I say NO WAY, my car has only ONE battery and that is all I am willing to pay for.
Have you ever been charged for a hose that started to leak because it was "chafing" on the engine... then when you look at the brand new hose...it is chafing on the engine too? (Those boneheads did not even bother to correct the underlying problem.)
That is actually not true. Many times I have had DTCs without a Check Engline Light coming on - happens all the time.
In reference to the TSB and having to use Synthetic Oil - I haven't heard anything about that. What engine?
http://www.tdiclub.com/TDIFAQ/TDiFAQ-4.html
Again, bpebbles cites another good reason why it is better to be able to do maintenance and or share in a pool of knowledge and tools, both special and common.
Freedom of choice needs to be emphasized here. Unless you "have" to go to a dealer say for the 4 yr or 50,000 mile warranty. I would shop for independents that will step up to the plate. Many independants are accutely aware of their dealer competition and/or lack of it and usually are glad for the extra business. If one wishes to stay with the dealers' shops, then shop the dealer's. A lot of frustration and anguish can be avoided by doing one's homework. For example, in the research stage of getting a vehicle; to me the most important thing to do is fiqure out who is going to make things right when things go wrong? This is the time to find your top 5 dealers for service and top 5 independents or even if the car is worth buying. AFTER you need the REPAIR/SERVICE is really the WRONG TIME. All one is really trying to do is to increase the chances for a successful repair/service.
I ask to be introduced to the service manager and tour the service area DURING my vehicle shopping. (not after I have a problem)
Please read my post again. I did mention the VAGCOM software. If you are unaware the the VAGCOM software that one can install on their own notepad computer or PALM. You should do some research.
Not only does VAGCOM allow reading ALL DTCs. One can actually ADJUST the numerous settings that are availablem. (ie... alarm settings, keyremote settings, engine settings...etc.)
Here are a couple of links you can start at;
http://www.v-techuk.com/
http://www.prweb.com/releases/2003/2/prweb57712.php
http://www.shadetreesoftware.com/downloads/manual.pdf
And if you have the "climatronic" system, then some of it it actually built into your car...see this link;
http://www.b5glx.com/climatronic.html
Vocus: How is your PT Cruiser doing? Yup, my Jetta still has that pesky dash rattle. It seems to be getting a little worse. Therefore, I am hoping it will be easier to fix. I am also taking it to a different dealer so maybe I will have better luck.
Trust me, I am fully aware of what a VAG-COM is and what you can do with it. I didn't say that an airbag DTC wouldn't flog the CEL, but there can be MANY DTCs stored without the CEL coming on.
- Anthony
The best part is the dealer will provide me a loaner while my car is in the shop.
buy the car if and only if you're willing to put up with odd problems. Not all Jettas are unreliable. Mine never left me stranded. On the other hand, you're more likely to run into a Jetta owner with a story of some odd problem (sometimes you need to pry before they admit to strange issues), than an owner who never faced anything from rattles to failed engine coils.
In the 2 years I owned my Jetta 1.8T Wolfsburg I had it in several times to find rattles (I eventually gave up and lived with them), once for a brake recall, once to have window regulator clips fixed, once to have my AC fixed, once to have failed engine coils fixed, twice to have electrical problems fixed and twice to have broken trim pieces fixed.
I can't see myself ever owning a VW again. It was a fun car but just not worth the hassle.
How is the Bimmer doing? Everytime I see one on the roads.......I start to drool!
Anyone installed a K&N air filter in their jetta's? The regular filter cost $16 vs a K&N which is $46... so i decided to put a KN in my gf's car... anyone have problems?
i test drove a max, accord, and mazda6s this weekend. all had good points and bad. Mazda6 is closest to Jetta.
Numerous tests have shown that the dirt that gets past a K&N is significant. Enough to damage an engine over time.
Anyone that has a knowledge of airflow dynamics can tell you that the air filter is NOT the limiting factor in a vehicle intake system. (It is actually the throttle plate/venturi) Unless you spend 80% of your time at WOT and near redline... a K&N filter will do nothing except let more dirt in your engine and take some $$ out of your wallet.
Any claims of K&N improving HP is on a Dynometer at WOT. Not many folks are using WOT during normal driving.
While you are at it why no consider a "throttle spacer". They dont let more dirt in your engine but dont do anything else for you either.
What the K/N does do is let more air in, GIVEN the air box constraints. The trade off is the oiled cotton filter does not filter as well as the stock filter. While more dirt per se is not guaranteed
So how does that apply to the VW Jetta? 1. The $10. stock air filter is best, BAR NONE. 2. The lower part of the stock air box is really an air, water and snow prophalatic, with inherent restriction(ie like sucking thru different sized straws). So if you do not want or need the prophalactic qualities, just remove it, or don't screw down the air filter box with the two philips screws. So finding a way to secure the stock air filter to the upper portion of the part that leads to the MAF is all you have to do. On the Z06 dyno results show INXS of 10 RWHP ! AT almost NADA cost!
What proof is there that the problems are worked out? I bought the 3rd model year of the Jetta and it was still plagued with issues. 2002s were too. So if VW can't get it straight in 4 years, do we honestly believe year 5 will be solid?
i test drove a max, accord, and mazda6s this weekend. all had good points and bad. Mazda6 is closest to Jetta.
Yeah, a friend of mine was intent on getting an A4. I took her out Sunday and she's now leaning toward the TSX, Mazda6s and RX8. Thank God, I saved one more person from Audi...
BTW, if one has family with a Mazda, you can get a 1k loyalty rebate on the 6. Add in college stuff (which includes Grad school) and a loaed 6s rings in at about 21-22k. That's a deal.
Fish: How is the Bimmer doing? Everytime I see one on the roads.......I start to drool!
I love it. Every second in it is bliss. There's nothing quite like the feeling of dropping from 6th to 3rd and literally launching to 95 in a flash, whipping around a pod of slow moving cars and hitting the 35 off-ramp at 80+ without a whine from the car. It's sublime. Not sure I buy C&D's claim the ZHP 330i can hit 60 in 5.6 seconds but who knows.
yep, the 6 was definitely the "driver" of the three i test drove. but the Accord V6 was not bad at all. more punch, more luxury/heft (you know i like that tank feeling a lot of the time), but i just don't know that it is worth the extra money. i could get loaded 6s for 2 grand less than a comparably equiped EX-V6. oh well, can't go wrong with either.
but, you can't go wrong with a Jetta either! it is a much smaller car however.
you know i'll be ready for a new car in a couple of years if not sooner. the next generation jetta will get very serious consideration. it's my most anticipated new car.
Warning - the oil pan hangs really low, and it is aluminum, so don't hit any potholes or curbs.
Fish: The car's running fine. 3750 miles so far, and not a problem yet. I do miss the power from the 1.8t sometimes, but am better served by the roominess and (so far) reliability of the PT. (Never thought I would breathe 'reliability' and a Chrysler product's name in the same sentence, but stranger things have happend!)
the coolant light was trivial - the car still ran. the coolant sensor thingy was bad. replaced in 5 seconds. not a good thing - but i would have rather had that 8000 times than the coil issues that rendered the car unusable.
My jetta still worked with half the coils out.
Jeremy
Vocus: I, also, didn't like the fact that after 600 miles, I started to hear rattles.......
(Just found this out the hard way...:-))
Regards...
No incidents to report after 5000 miles.
Um, the current Jetta hit our shores in 99, thus making it five years of production.
Always use the MESSAGE CENTER button to 'back out' and return to your personal homepage with all of your subscribed forums on it.
Jeremy
You probably should find out how much remains on your car loan and then see what the dealer will give you. Maybe you should consider selling your existing car on your own. you would most likely get more for it.
Once you have cut your best deal on the new car... ONLY THEN do you tell them that you changed your mind about a trade in and ask them to give you a value on it.
Let me tell you that they HATE to have to give you a "real" value on your tradin but That is what you (as the OWNER of the tradein vehicle) should be looking for.
The above technique of saying "No trade in" completely circumvents their 'shell game' with YOUR hard-earned money.
===========================
Personally, I play the purchase game even differently than the above;
I do my research ahead of time...
I promenently carry my 'folder' containing all of my research.
I KNOW the value of my tradein.
I KNOW what the dealership payed for the new car.
I explain in no uncertain terms that I am not here to waste my time dickering and I have better things to do with my time.
I simply make an offer to the saleman and they either take it or leave it.
In every case, they have accepted my 'offer' and we write up the paperwork. I suspect they are afraid that the next dealership I go to will accept my offer...and they will be losing a sale.
Oh... BTW... it is best to make the offer near the end of a month. There is often an internal incentive' to the Salesmen each month and they are often more eager to cut a deal near the end of a month. (Even better near the end of a financial quarter)
After realizing I would walk if I didn't get the price I wanted, the finance manager came back in to the salesman's office and told him to give it to us at our price - he was red in the face and extremely short with us. BUT, we weren't there to make pals with those guys.
It's definitely best to be well researched and prepared. AND put yourself on a time limit for sure. No sense in pissing away 2-3 hours at one dealership.