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Comments
Skinnypoo, I got my jetta at Metro VW, in Philly near the airport. Dealt with Ray Snyder, a pretty good guy to work with. With the new 2002's coming out in August, a lot of dealers are trying to clear their old inventories. Good luck in finding a jetta!!!
INKY
JETTA. and if it were not for these I might have purchased
one. These are my 2 major beefs:
1) Why does Volkswagon keep on designing their dashboards
with the CLIMATE CONTROL KNOBS directly in BACK of the
automatic transmission shifter knob? It is virtually
impossible to put my hand on the climate control knobs
without touching the automatic shifter. VOLKSWAGON:
WAKE UP!! Have your interior design people take a much-
needed course in ERGONOMICS!! Compare your ridiculous
dashboard design with the Honda ACCORD....Honda's score
out of 10: 12. Volkswagon score out of 10: -5.
2) Legroom in the backseat area. Laughable! A joke!
Only Aly Mcbeal can fit in this back seat.
VOLKSWAGON.....WAKE UP! Think of people's comfort
instead of $$$ for a change.
Oh by the way, I purchased a 2000 Honda Accord EX V6.
At one point (before I made my final decision), I
considered:
Volks jetta VR6, Subaru Legacy GT limited and Honda Accord
EX V6. (all 2000 model year).
1) wayyyyy too small for a $20K car - the legroom in the back ? forget there are any if you're a taller person sitting in the front and put your seat back...
2) whats with the dial knob to recline? i have a maxima and i like to lay back if im just sitting in the car... there's no way i can with the jetta..or any vw.
3) cupholder..... it's laughable where they place that..... she has a cd player installed in that empty spot ...well, u can't change the cd if you got soda in the holder..
what about putting the cupholders right in front of the armrest in the middle of the car? like any other sedans?
i might've paid 6g's more than her car, but i got leather, a 222hp v6 engine, bose stereo, auto climate and most importantly, INTERIOR ROOM!!!!
To the guy with the maxima, you have a full size car, its a compact car, not a family car, why would you compare? Seems like something's messed up to compare a compact car to a full size car. The jetta seats are by far the most comfortable i've ever had the pleasure to sit in. I drove to seattle from wisconsin in one setting and I had no aches or pains whatsoever, the knob turns easily and you can get a perfect fit. No one likes whining for the purpose of whining.
I wholeheartedly agree with the view that VW's knobs are just poor engineering. They're essentially useless and frustrating for every person who gets into my car. Changing the angle of the seat should not be a forearm exercise. But I question the common sense of paying 26k for a Maxima...apparently negotiation is not a well honed skill.
Oh and regarding, the car being designed to be driven. That'd be great, if it actually handled well. As it stands now any serious cornering is accompanied by a frustrating amount of body roll. Plus one must turn off the blasted traction control or risk not having torque to pull through corners. I am forced into spending dough on sport springs for lowering and tightening up the handling.
Piceno...you're comparing apples and oranges. Accords and Legacys are not in the same class as the Jetta. It's not a family sedan, bub. The backseat, compares favorably with its other compact competition: civic, neon, focus, etc. If you want a competitor to the Camcord or Legacy, look at the far superior Passat or Maxima (an excellent, though large automobile).
More bothersome of late, both front windows have developer a rattle. 5 weeks old and the car is rattling?! I was worried about the quality before my purchase and now I'm petrified. I have a feeling this car will end up sold long before my lease is up.
But hey, you do not have to downshift.
INKY
I have the TDI with auto and it provides 40-50mpg.
It provides excellent power delivery at low RPM's and relaxed cruising at 70 MPH. The car holds the road in corners like glue and has better handling than any other car in it's class.
I like the design of the knob for the seat as it offers a much greater degree of adjustment than the levers on other makes that are 4 settings fit all. After 4 months with the car the quality is terrific and I have absolutely no rattles, squeaks or any problems major or minor.
Unlike almost every other vehicle I have owned the VW is comfortable for even the longest trip. All the controls are easy to use and within reach.
Heated seats, Moonroof, ABS, 6 air bags, heated mirrors, alloy wheels, excellent handling, superb comfort, 40+ MPG, What more can I ask for in a $20K vehicle?
? for blueguydotcom
Why did you get a manual trans. if your website is from the view of the disabled?
Do you know that the low height of the Jetta is a frequent complaint of owners? Snow, road debris and parking curbs cause problems with the front bumper/spoiler area and the oilpan also. I bring this up as I noticed you plan on lowering the car.
Did you know that a 6 speed is offered in 2002 Jetta?
Here are the changes:
2002 Jetta
New VR6 4V with 201 hp and 5-speed automatic transmission (first car in its segment to offer this feature) with Tiptronic® will replace current 2V VR6 by mid model year
Manual transmission (6-speed) will be available later in the year for the VR6 4V
Accentuated dual chrome exhaust on 4V VR6 models
1.8 T engine increased from 150 hp to 180 hp
5-speed automatic transmission (first car in its segment to offer this feature) with Tiptronic® available on 1.8T
Premium CD/cassette radio for GLS and GLX
New Color (Reflex Silver will replace Silver Arrow)
Trunk escape handle
Cruise control indicator light
On/Off switch for self dimming mirror
I want a SOLID car!...I live in NYC and its bumpy...and iam not sure that it is bumpy enough to justify a "rugged suv."
As for the manual, the 1.8T will not be available with a 6 speed even in 2002, so this problem is not addressed. Sure the VR6 gets a 6 speed, but the extra weight from the VR6 makes the already suspect Jetta handle like a pig. I drove a 5 speed VR6 decked out with the sport suspension and took the car through its paces. It handles like a Buick with the VR6. Nice engine, but too heavy for that car.
As for why I got the manual if the site is devoted to the disabled...well, as someone disabled I actually become extremely angry when car salesmen assume by my appearance that I would drive a slush box. I love cars and driving a car with an auto really makes the guy behind the steering wheel a mere passenger. I live for the feel of downshifting into a tight corner, letting that bad boy out and pulling hard out of a corner...something that cannot be done with an auto. Additionally, coasting is a pipe dream in an auto. Essentially, I live to row through my gears. As long as God's willing to give me enough mobility to safely shift, steer and have fun, I'm gonna exploit it. My site's focus is going to be about issues those with limited mobility might be interested in prior to driving the car, but I still think subjective performance/comfort levels are important. If you notice, my first two test cars are basically performance vehicles (WRX/IS300) and this weekend I'm borrowing a 2001 Tribute for a 1000 mile trip.
As for the lowering concerns. Yep, I've noticed you gotta ease the Jetta over some bumps and avoid parking curbs, but given its decidely piggish handling, I'm left with no other choice but to lower the car.
By the way, the 2002's cruise light will be a welcome addition on long trips.
INKY
you said that u questioned the sense of paying 26k for a maxima? well, the invoice for my car was 26,100 and msrp was 28,600. these numbers matched what was on edmunds. now...how much did you pay for your WE? my gf paid $19,970 for a WE with Roof, monsoon with cd player which was a couple hundred over invoice. i think we both did fairly well. maybe you just didn't realize how much a maxima sells for...
k_h_b,
i wasn't whining about the WE, i was simply stating that the cons of the car was... obviviously there are pros to the car too, which i didn't post..i apologize for that. i actually like my gf's WE very much...
I still feel that way. The car's size, seating position and ergonomics are top notch. The best fit I found in the innumerable cars I test drove. I like many aspects of the car and it feels on the cusp of being luxurious, a must for my purchase decision (the key reason I passed on the WRX). Unfortunately, the car's handling, while it seemed suited to me on my 3 test drives, now after close to 1500 miles feels decidedly ungainly. I still own the Stanza, BTW. Getting rid of it seemed silly as it only cost $90 a year extra for insurance, so for visitors I can loan off the Jetta and/or when it breaks down I have an extra car.
Blatic, I leased for 36 months and put down a touch of 1k off the lot. The lease has two purposes...low payments, I can switch cars in 3 years without a hassle. While I feel in love with so many facets of the Jetta over its competition, I was realistic about getting one and accepted this car will have minor, probably major mechanical/electrical faults. BTW, I did look at the 325i (loved it) but alas two friends with BMW's one with a '98 328 and the other a '99 M3 convinced me to avoid BMW as they both feel the cars are ownership nightmares. The extra cost on the lease didn't seem worthwhile when two good friends insisted they would never buy a Break My Wallet again. Oh, and the mods I'm making $300 on lowering a $220 on a CD player are not that much monetarily and certainly neeed if I must live with the car for another 35 months. $500 on a chip seems like worthwhile investment too.
Sorry if I offended anyone. These are just my observations from owning my Jetta 5 weeks. To say I'm underwhelmed is an understatement. Maybe with lowering, possible chipping in the future I will grow to love the Jetta.
YOU said:
"Piceno...you're comparing apples and oranges. Accords and Legacys are not in the same class as the Jetta."
Funny though, when I bought my 2000 EX V6 Accord, I paid $30,075 (Canadian), but the Volks dealer wanted almost $32,500 for a Jetta VR6. If Jetta & Accord are not in the same class, then the Jetta VR6 should be priced lower, right?
Also, the Subaru Legacy GT limited was $32,900. (dealer final price....no haggling, period).
So lets see by your well grounded logic because all of the following cars can be purchased for 23k they're in the same class:
Jetta GLX VR6
Celica GTS 4
Accord EX V6
Chevy Impala V6
Mazda Tribute ES V6
Ford Mustang GT V8
Mercury Grand Marquis V8
I think the marketing guys at all these companies would argue that leap of logic. To you based on funds to spend all of the above may be classed together but to the industry each vehicle mentioned fits a different class...Mini SUV, Compact, Sporty Compact, Sports Coupe, Mid-size, Full-size, etc. As I contended before, the Accord V6 is not in the same class as a compact car like the Jetta, regardless of price.
I think the "complaints" you have regarding your jetta are pretty fastidious save the rattles and squeeks. The Jetta, and in particular the wolfsburg is a 20,000$ car, not much for today. Is is also a Sedan 4 door, Obviously, your "complaints" on body roll don't have much bearing and are a waste of a read seeing as what the jetta is designed to do. It's not designed to take that curve at 60 mph, If you want to, make the modifications, thats fine. But instead you have to waste time bitching about a design flaw? Same with the seat adjustments, I don't know what car with manual adjustments you've ever used, but no car compares to the Jetta, I (and anyone I've ever talked to) can get more comfortable than any car and most chairs. 6th gear, again, I would like a 6th gear for the added performance, who wouldn't, but its a 20,000 SEDAN. The most inexpensive 6 speed BMW offers is in the 540i 6 speed starting at 50k+. Also in sports coupes and cars. It's a sedan. VW is well ahead of the curve when its comes to making aftermarket and performance items standard on their vehicles. They will be offering a 6 speed with the 201 hp 24 vr6 in the fall, I think thats very cool. I don't want the vr6 anyway, so I don't care.
The points you're making about "poor engineering , useless" etc are laughable. I applaud you for being quite the flamer. I enjoy dealing with people like you, who have nothing better to do than whine or draw attention about nothing, there's nothing better than telling people like you where to shove it.
If you have a concern about something this is the place to do it, however, do it in a manner which will warrant a resolution or some useful communication.
Flamer.
Why are you so annoyed by my dislike of the car's handling or gear ratios? I apologize for not worshipping at the temple of VW, but I see flaws; flaws that IMO as a consumer need rectifying. Guess we should just all suck it up and smile like Stepford wives when people ask us about our cars? I trust that when I ask people in here and more importantly in person, they will be brutally honest about their cars' habits, strengths and shortcomings. Wouldn't you want someone to draw attention to a deficient area? Perhaps a point often overlooked?
I've got a friend who claims to love her Cougar yet when pressed can list about a dozen things wrong with the year old car. I'd say she's doing everyone a disservice by saying her car's "great." Same of a friend with a VW who contends her car's been fantastic and in the shop "only" twice in one year for electrical problems. You sound like those people...gloss over the problems and act like the world of autos should be seen through rose-tinted glasses.
It's cool though. My WE is fun to a point and will be more fun eventually.
You state that the Jetta has piggish handling when nearly everyone else who reviews the Jetta praises the handling and recognizes the handling of the car as a strongpoint.
The items you mention are not "engineering flaws" but personal dislikes.
Recognize your audience.
Jetta Wolfsburg offers driving enjoyment that is rare at it's price and excellent quality of materials with decent reliability. I happen to think that VW makes too many Silver Jetta's and too many 5 speed Jetta's. This is VWoA making the cars the public wants, not VWoA trying to satisfy moparbad, and VWoA is not going to engineer the Jetta singly for blueguydotcom.
So how about having a tiny bit more objective viewpoint and less of a unique viewpoint.
In its class, the Jetta offers near luxury refinement, excellent ergonomics and a wonderful, eager, grin-producing turbo.
I will say with as much earnestness as possible that the seat knobs for one afflicted with an arthritic condition are just plain cruel. A simple lever can be accuated by nearly any person, regardless of the malady (short of an amputee).
BTW, there is no such thing as an objective viewpoint coming from a human. We all frame and manipulate. I do so unabashedly and prefer that we all keep our individual opinions.
Jason
is in the US? Next, I'll bet that you will never be able to guess what European Manufacturer
sells the most cars in the US...
Remember, most folks who are happy with what they buy are out enjoying themselves...The
FEW that are UnHappy are here complaining...their spouses have banished them to solitary
confinement & the computer because they are sick and tired of listening to them; so they come
here...
Email me at work again or call me if you have any additional questions...
blueguydotcom: The heat will be off of you now and onto me.
-Jim
I am a light driver but throttle it once in a while. I have had no problems. I am sure I will but at least it is not a plain Dane civic, carry or accord. The 2002 carry may change my mind on that but for now I am happy with Jetty.
INKY
I bet when you guys jack-off, you complain about your hand going to sleep during the action.
It doesn't matter what it's comparable to. I compare mine to a Bentley, same stockholders and either will transport me to work.
It's a car....a transportation device....to sum up what J_H_B....I think that's his "handle" or W_H_I_N_E_R said, "If I offended you, I really don't care"....and I don't either.
The loudest noise in the world is the first rattle a new car sustains. My Jetta doesn't rattle, hasn't needed any repairs or adjustments. Moreover, it IS NOT recommended by Consumer Reports. There are good cars and bad cars....my Jetta 1.8T is neither, it is a great car.
This has been a public service announcement.
It is true that people who have no problems with a product will not be as vocal as those who have experienced problems. For every person that has many problems with their car, there are many other people who have few or no problems. But, while researching the Jetta on various sites I quickly saw that many Jetta owners were reporting the same problems over and over again.
I was truly surprised to find out how many Jetta owners were reporting power windows not working, windows falling into doors, having to return to the dealer again and again due to the check engine light coming on, automatic transmission whine at 35-40 mph, having to have the transmission replaced once or twice in the first year of ownership, air conditioning not working very well, hardly any air coming out of side vents, and so on.
There are obviously build quality issues with this car. I have read the comments of owner and many admit that although this car is fun to drive, it is a pain in the butt to own. I will take the fun part, but the pain in the butt part VW can keep. Built quality should be better for a car that costs this much. I understand that build quality has improved this year, but it is still below average. Learning about the two-year warranty and having owners report long waits for parts and service appointments did not make me feel any better about this car.
Initially I was very disappointed to learn that the car's quality did not match its image, but I went back to the dealership several more times, and each time I sat in the car I came away less and less impressed, until I finally realized that I really did not want this car after all. Others comment about its "excellent" ergonomics, and I now wonder whether these people actually know what the term "ergonomics" means.
The radio and climate controls are positioned too low to easily reach and adjust while driving. They are not angled toward the driver as they are in some other cars. The radio controls are too small and similar looking. If you use the cup holders, the radio controls are blocked, and if anything drips from your can or cup it will drip onto the controls below. The wheel you have to turn (and turn and turn) to recline the sets is ridiculous. Why did VW not use a simple lever as is used in other cars? The interior of the Jetta is generally very attractive, but it most certainly does not have excellent ergonomics.
When I tried the back seat I found there was not enough room to slide my legs into the car until the salesman moved the front seat forward. I do not have the need to carry passengers in the back very often, but I think it is embarrassing to have to move the front seats forward to make the rear seats usable. The Jetta really should be about a foot longer, with most of this additional space going to the rear passengers. It would be nice if the car were also a little wider.
There is almost no storage space in this car. The glove box is small. There are no other drawers or shelves on the dashboard or on the ceiling to store sunglasses or a garage door opener. While most other cars have enough storage space under the center armrest to hold compact discs and other items, the space under the Jetta's armrest is tiny and will not hold even one CD. The pockets on the backs of the front seats are not very deep and so cannot be used to hold a Thomas Guide. The interior looks good, but it is simply not very well thought out or practical.
I also think it is ridiculous that a 2001 model year car that costs this much does not come with a factory-installed compact disc player. You have to pay extra to have someone at the dealership install one, or have to take care of this yourself.
I have found the opinions of owners and those looking to buy a car very helpful, and am adding my comments in the hope that they are useful to someone else. If you own a Jetta and are happy with it, then I am happy for you. But I think this car is not as neat as it originally seemed to be, and it just is not for me.
-Jim
As for this rear sat complaint I read of in magazines, I must laugh. Hard. Unless one is transporting water buffalo, I don't see how the Jetta's backseat is the least bit cramped. Especially for a compact car in the class of the Sentra and Civic.
Your complaints about room and storage space lead me to believe you're a midsize kinda guy. Look at Accords, Camrys or better still, wait a month for the amazing new 02 Altima (a car leaps and bounds ahead of the Camcords).
I agree with your opinions on the JETTA, and I highly
believe that this car is OVER-RATED, OVER-HYPED and OVER-
PRICED...
You can look a a previous opinion of mine (#1957).
Also, the 2001 CONSUMER REPORT'S magazine DOES NOT recommend
this car, siting reliability problems. As you said, for
a car this expensive, the interior ergonomics are a
LAUGHABLE....the dash looks like it was designed by
a JUNIOR designer in training. Certainly no experienced
designer could create this this kind of MESS!! Anyone
who says that the climate control knobs are well-positioned
is a person who has never experienced such interior
masterpiece designs such as Honda Accord.
I believe that there is someone on this talk forum who
works for VOLKSWAGEN, and is trying to hype this
car....beware!!
I bought one of these a couple of years ago. My wife liked it so much, she bought an identical model, the only difference being the color. We both like driving them. Gunning around town, or 100 MPH on rural interstates in Tennessee and Arkansas, the Jetta is fun to drive. It's comfortable enough for front-seat passengers up to about six feet to drive for 12-14 hours at a stretch. Not a good car to sleep in, but if that's what you're looking for, why aren't you at the Winnebago dealership?
For the right buyer, the Jetta is a good choice, but if near-perfect fit and finish and complete freedom from any maintenance problems are a high priority for you, choose Toyota or Honda.
I just spent $261 replacing a broken window regulator, because the electric window wouldn't roll up. VW is aware, from all of the complaints their dealerships are reporting, that this part breaks too often (my car only had 36,000 miles on it and it's barely two years old).
If you like the way the Jetta drives, you just put up with this kind of problem, because the only cars that provide the kind of driving fun the Jetta does, those cars cost ten thousand dollars more. The 4-cylinder 2.0 engine with the 5-speed provides adequate acceleration for a sedan. I get about 28-29 MPG in a mix of highway and city driving with the air-conditioning on all the time (I live in Central Texas. Today's high, again: 100+).
Four adults can travel in the Jetta comfortably enough for two or three hours at least, even if they're big people. It's not designed to accomodate large families or sports teams.
I'm wondering what gas mileage numbers you are all getting with the 1.8T. My WE already has 850 miles on it (yikes!) and I am still very happy with it - except for the very low gas mileage.
I am averaging 18.8 MPG in town, and just under 21 on the highway. My overall average is 19.7 MPG (the most I can squeeze out of a tank is 260 miles/13 gallons.
This is Houston (flat) - and I am only using the a/c about 10% of the time, and driving "moderately" (not going over 4000 RPM very often). I am very disappointed that I am not even getting close to 25mpg on the highway, and am well <20mpg in the city. I'd appreciate numbers from other WE or 1.8T owners. Is my WE sucking gas or will mileage improve over time? It is truly scary that my '88 mustang 5.0 got far better mileage (26mpg) on the highway with a/c than the Jetta is getting without a/c - and the mustang even had leaky fuel injectors!!!
Thanks!
- tommy
I don't drive the turbo, so I can't answer your mileage question.
>> Take a 1.8T for a spin with a 5 speed. <<
Sorry, I don't drive cars with 4-cylinder engines, turbo or not. I like my cars to fly down the freeway at 2000 RPM or thereabouts, not 3500. I drove a GLS VR6 and a couple of weeks later a GLX.
>> No direct competitor to the Jetta (Civic, Sentra, Altima) can touch it on the open road. <<
Well, I wouldn't call a Civic a competitor. And for the price of the cars I drove you could get something like an Accord or Galant. Agreed, these cars don't drive the same, but the people I took along when test driving them said that the Jetta was nice but the Accord had a much better interior design and felt more luxurious to them. I felt they were both rather boring, but that's my opinion.
>> As for this rear sat complaint I read of in magazines, I must laugh. Hard. <<
I laughed hard, too, when I tried to sit in the back of the Jetta and had to stop because there wasn't any room for my legs between the seats, and at that exact moment the salesman was telling my how "spacious" the Jetta is.
If there is enough space for you, that's great. But this is one of the top complaints about the Jetta no matter where you look. I'm certainly not alone in suggesting that this car really needs more interior space, especially for the rear passengers.
>> Your complaints about room and storage space lead me to believe you're a midsize kinda guy. <<
Yes, I expect more room with a larger car, but any size car if well designed should offer the owner more storage space than the Jetta offers. Many people have a garage door open in their car, and some CDs, and a Thomas Guide, etc. The armrest space is the smallest I've seen in any car, and I think the glove box is the smallest I've seen, too. Again, lack of storage space is one of the most frequently heard complaints, so I'm not alone in thinking that VW could have done a better job here.
Thank you for your comments.
On velour, I have beige and have little trouble, I do run one of those lint tape brushes on it once a week. Beige was better choice with a blond wife, hot climate etc. It is a lint attractor no doubt, but I am impressed with this car.
INKY
I