Mazda MPV

maltb

I pushed up the purchase of the my Protege, since I didn't want a Focus platform Protege.

Why? The new platform can only be better than two already great platforms and the Protege will continue to be made in Japan even though it shares the design with Ford/Volvo. It's the same way the Mazda6 is being built: same design but produced in multiple plants. I think this arrangement is even better for QC as the various assembly plants can compare notes to find problems quickly. As scott eluded to, the accord is done this way and has been proven effective.

Unlike all the doomsayers, I see positive things in shared platforms as long as input is heard from each partner. With the co-engine development that took place for the 6, it appears to be beneficial.

Maybe this is the wrong forum for this, but I think the MPV shows how the partnership can be beneficial. The duratech is a better motor than any v-6 Mazda had and it they saved a bundle on engine development. Now if they could only stop the round trip shipment....

audia8q

Your dealer is correct... The S-plan prices were changed in the early spring...the S-plan price on an MPV is apx $10-60 below invoice.

Maltb....I second your thoughts on the platform sharing...The Focus platform is actually world class. With all the non-platform related issues with the Focus everyone has lost sight about how good the platform really is.

pjd58

First, I respect your Mazda expertise, it's second to none on TH. As I stated earlier, I want my Mazda's with Japanese parts and made in Japan. I love the notion my Protege is totally Japanese, except 3% fabric and some plastic. Every car I have owned, has come off a Japanese assembly line and everyone has been flawless. My Wife's MPV is the closest you can come to a Japanese van. My Wife's experience with her 95 626 was a disaster and best friends B2000 was a rolling time bomb.

The Focus platform is proven, so is the Protege. Why change? For Mazda to associate their cars with Focus name..... IMO, a mistake. My image of the Ford Focus is unreliable(very unreliable car), Mexican product.

In the past, Mazda didn't have a clue on how to market a car. Mazda's marketing dept was the laughing stock of the industry. Mazda has made great strides on Marketing.....maybe Ford has helped them in this area.

A partnership can be rewarding for all, if everyone is on the same page.
I'm done before the TH Gods get on my case:)

Pjd58

maltb

don't miss my point: The future Pro will be made in Japan with mostly japanese content including the MAZDA designed 2.3 built at a Ford plant in Japan.

pjd58

I was aware the 03 Pro was coming from Japan...Thx. Just lets keep that part content 97%plus. My point, which I should have made clearer in #3849, Mazda and the Focus name shouldn't mix(marketing). Although, the general car buying public probably will never know their Protege will have a Focus Platform.

Pjd58

basurf

man my dealer can be lame...took the van in today so they could put on the rear bumper step plate and the cool mirror with temp/compass

had to stay in over night because they couldn't get the mirror done...wife was a little irritated because I had them put a "toy" on the van that she will never use and they had to take the hood off and take the dash out and all sorts of stuff to put it in...oh well should be out tomorrow heheh

rutger3

Yes the Duratec is a solid dependable engine which is all good. However,let's not lose sight that Mazda 'cheaped out' when deciding to put this small engine in a large vehicle like the MPV. The only reason this was done was to save the time and money of designing a more appropriate engine for the job,or even choosing a more viable existing one.This little 6 cylinder has to work mighty hard to pull all that weight and it can be heard and seen by watching the tachometer. Mazda should have used a larger engine with more torque to begin with,which of course is what they did for 2002.Yes, we have had 20k miles without a hitch and that is important;but when it comes time to resell this vehicle that small engine may cost us.

maltb

I knew there was a resale link coming.

The 2.5 was used to avoid paying tarrifs in Japan for V-6 models sold there. The stupid thing Mazda did was to assume that American drivers would settle for what would work in the rest of the world.

bean3422

I actually read it in the most recent Mazda 6 article here on Edmunds. They actually use the word "may" spawn the next MPV.

I am taking a "wait and see" attitude concerning the Mazda 6. All of the Asian and European Mazda 6 cars are being built in Japan. I wish there was a comparable publication like Consumer Reports to see if they fair any better than the US built counterparts in reliability. Of course, my next purchase will hopefully be an RX-8 (which will be built in Japan!)My Protege should last until I pay off the MPV, and with the MPV payment gone, (and hopefully the price gouging on the RX-8), I should be able to afford it!

By the way, I also read that the plans had changed regarding the Protege. (I also bought my Protege early to avoid the Focus platform.) I have no idea where I read it, but I read that now Mazda will be designing the Protege platform, and possibly Ford will use that platform for the next Focus, rather than the other way around. This is the same thing they did with the last two generations of Ford Escorts, and the Protege based Escorts got some of the best reliability marks of any Ford product. They stopped using the Protege platform with the Focus, and suddenly they have poor reliability and have set a Government record for the most recalls ever. I had to laugh when I saw that headline.

pjd58

way to go! Another smart buyer with a MPV and Protege in the same garage:) I agree, let's wait and see how the 6 holds up. I would stay away from the first year U.S. production. Even the current generation MPV had a few issues, although very minor, in the first year(Da lean, pulling at high speeds etc.) As a rule, I stay away from first year production. Our 01 MPV (11/00 production) has been flawless.

Mazda should be very proud of the design of the 6, it's one the nicest looking cars period. Let's hope it will be as reliable as the current MPV and Protege, I'm skeptical. I hope Mazda(Ford) proves me wrong!

Pjd58

rutger3

maltb: could you please elaborate on your tariff comment and on Mazda's thinking when it came to putting the 2.5 in the van? How did they avoid the tariffs if the 2.5 is also a 6 cylinder?Are the tariffs based on engine displacement?How are they avoiding those tariffs now with the new engine? This is quite interesting.

mcadrecha

My dealer in the Bay area of California said that the first oil change should be around 2000 miles, then at 5000, and then at 5000 mile intervals after that.

So, that is what we are doing. My 02 is at 4920 so the oil change is coming soon.

Also, someone on this town hall (Javadoc I think) said changing the tranny fluid at this point is also a good idea. I may do that as well at the 5K service.

kduah

Thinking of buying 2002 Mazda MPV but worried about the dependability of the minivan's 3.0L Duratec engine from Ford. Any information on the dependability/reliability of this engine? Thanks.

maltb

but I heard that there were different taxes for a displacement over 2.5L

javadoc

Malt is right about the tarrifs. Basically, cars are taxed based on engine displacement, which is a big reason you haven't really seen tons of Japanese produced vehicles with engines over this size. There's a big jump in taxes when the displacement breaches 2500CCs.


Here's some tasty links:

http://www.env.go.jp/en/org/aret/ch3.html Look at Part 3.

http://www.japanvehicles.com/newcars/domes.htm

basurf

anyone have the auto-dim mirror with ext temp and compass?

I am looking for details on the operation...just got it back from the shop and I know it isn't 120 degrees F outside.

sd1228

I know that the temp sensor is mounted near
the front bumper for Toyota Corollas.
Same should be true for MPV
May be it is too close to the radiator and hence
showing higher temp.
I had read somewhere that sometimes when Toyotas
(in this case corolla's) are taken thro' drive thro
car washes (at gas stations etc.) they tend to
show incorrect temp for some time as the sensor
mounted at front of the car sometimes get sprayed with
high pressure and high velocity water jet.

I don't know if there is a way to calibrate the temperature
reader. But you can call nearest auto part store (autozone etc)
as they sell and install these type of mirrors as well.

basurf

Yeah, I have no idea where this one mounts. It just came from the dealer...you would have thought they would have calibrated it. I wouldn't mind some docs on how to operate it. I can see there are LEDs for cal which probably means calibrate so it would just be a matter of figuring out the buttons. It runs about 7-8 degrees too hot.

audia8q

Because of some MPV-LX shortages I took some MPV's with the optional GFX package, which is something I don't normally stock for inventory.

I would like to hear from MPV buyers...what is your thoughts on the GFX package and the chrome strip that is on the GFX lower molding. Our salespeople seem to like it, especially the front view. What do y'all think??

Rich

kkcymru

For me, the GFX package is the one package I would not accept on the Mazda, even if it were free. I think it detracts from the clean look of the van. Obviously, a lot of people feel otherwise and are willing to pay extra for the package. There are probably a lot more who don't care either way. If your salespeople like it there's a good chance that a lot of customers will too. You don't have to please everyone to sell a car; you just have to please one customer enough to part with her/his money.

Now my question for you. Why am I having so much trouble finding a Coastal Blue ES in my area? Did Mazda decide to the distribution of MPV colors or did the dealers? Someone decided to play it safe and the local dealers seem to have tons of "shimmering sand" and "sunlight silver" MPVs, but "coastal blues" are in short supply. Even the ones that show up in the Mazda vehicle locator (when it's working) are gone when I call. I would have bought a van two weeks ago if my local dealers would have had what I was looking for. I think the dealers are losing out on potential sales by playing it too safe.

beachnut

Rich - I didn't think GFX was available to US dealers, or is it? Don't let javadoc know! FWIW, I like the GFX package well enough to buy it (if I were buying), but I'm not fond of the chrome strip. IMO, the GFX package looks best when it's monochrome, or all one color - the strip throws it off somehow.

pjd58

I like the GFX package, but Moms and Dads on a budget might pass it by. I find the Security Pkg & 4 seasons more useful. The GFX wasn't even on our radar screen when we purchased our MPV.

Pjd58

wxwiz

My wife and I recently test drove the Mazda MPV. She had two test drives on two different MPVs. She noticed a hesitation ( a few seconds) while attempting to accelerate from a crusing speed of about 30 to 40 mph (not sure of exact speed). I also noticed it in my testdrive. Is this something just normal for the MPV. I suspect it has something to do with the way the automatic transmission is geared. Finally, she said the Honda Odessey did not do this. Anyones comments would be appreciated. Maybe both of us are just too used to driving manuals for the past 25years.

evaddave

Rich,

Our MPV has the GFX package, and I think it helps add a little of the "zoom zoom" attitude to the van. I'm not sure if it's because the van is black that the silver stripe (painted plastic, unfortunately--not chrome) really stands out... I dunno. Judge for yourself: Here's a link to pictures we took when Maxine was brand new.

Brainteaser for javadoc: Notice the decoration on the front door of the house. What's missing from the picture?

Anyway, I've seen the GFX package on other colors, but never really paid much attention to it. However, I don't think it works as well on other colors as it does on black.

-Dave

!wons :rewsna resaetniarb

alexv1n

2002 MPV has an intelligent transmission that learns as you drive. If the van is new, it may not have learnt all the gear shifting properly. This also happens when you disconnect the battery.

There are a couple of repair notices on the hard shifting. Here is an excerpt from one of it: "The ATX has "adaptive learning" and will not shift properly until the vehicle has been driven at least 10-15 miles. Disconnecting the battery cable will cause the ATX to have 2-3 shift shock until it "learns" the driving pattern and has had time for clutch packs to properly seat".

Here are the details:

http://www.mpvclub.com/index.php?action=showprb;PrbID=59

http://www.mpvclub.com/index.php?action=showprb;PrbID=60

I hope this helps.

javadoc

Thx, Beach... Yes, I really like the GFX package and that option is on my list of 'wants' for my next van. When do the '03s hit showrooms?

/j

tbcreative

I know many of you have patiently explained the whole 0% thing here, but my wife and I are seriously considering getting an MPV because of the new incentives and after seeing Subearu's Midnight Blue Mica beauty, and we're confused by the following:

Get 0.0% APR for 48 months and make no monthly payments until January 2003 on Protegé5, 626, Millenia, Miata and MPV.*

0.0% APR FINANCING FOR 60 MONTHS AT $16.66 PER MONTH, FOR 48 MONTHS AT $20.83 PER MONTH, FOR 24 MONTHS AT $41.66 PER MONTH PER $1,000 FINANCED WITH 10% DOWN. NOT ALL BUYERS WILL QUALIFY.

What the heck is that $ PER MONTH charge for on 0%?!

I know it was explained before, but I wasn't paying attention, and I don't have time to search for it right now. Would someone care to explain it to me again?

Oh, and I second javadoc's question, which is the same question I asked last month, when do the '03s hit the dealers?

Thanks! -TB

pjd58

When I purchased my Protege last Sept, I took the 0 for 48(No Deferred). The total amount financed divided by 48 is my monthly payment. As a long as I pay my monthly payment on time, I pay no interest or late fee. Great deal! No extra fees or hidden charges. I'm not sure, I believe the fees are for the deferred payments. Deferred payments almost always don't waive the interest, just the principle amt.

Rich in CT, can you shed a little light on this matter for TB?

FYI, Mazda American Credit(I don't believe Mazda owns this company)are great to deal with. My payments are taken directly from my bank acct each month and I can check my balance on line 24/7.

Pjd58

subearu

An easy example of how to interpret the text is this; lets say your ES costs $25,000. Take the number of thousands (25 in this case) and multiply it by the $ amount for the time period desired:

60 months payment: 25 * $16.66 = $416.50

48 months payment: 25 * $20.83 = $520.75

24 months payment: 25 * $41.66 = $1,041.50

I thought I heard that the '03's would be in dealers around September.

-Brian

subearu

Just ordered the rear bumper step pad, cargo net, hood deflector, and front/rear mud guards from http://mazdastuff.com. All of it was in stock and in transit for delivery Monday or Tuesday!

-Brian

wxwiz

Thanks for the info. My wife is kind of skeptical that a piece of metal can learn. Does anyone remember seeing anything more about this transmission at the Mazda WEB site or in any brochures so that I can show her the more info. Appreciate the efforts. As a side comment, it is interesting that some people have problems finding sand and silver while others cannot find coastal blue or sage greeen. Here in the DC area it seems all you can find is silver and sand and midnight blue.

.

audia8q

everyone for your input on the GFX...

Beachnut...yes, the GFX is avail to all US dealers

kkcymru....so far this year in my stores the Coastal has been "the color"....Many Mazda dealers in certain markets are hurting for inventory, big time. I normally stock 20-25 MPV's and I have 1 right now and can not get them replaced for 3-4 weeks...I have been ordering apx 50% in coastal...silver is our second most popular color....it's great they are selling very well but I can't keep them in stock and can't replace them fast enough.

javadoc....late October is the schedule for 2003's at this point.

evaddave...thanks for posting your picture so everyone can see the GFX package.

dbs2001

The payments shown are just to cover each $1,000 financed; i.e.

16.66 x 60 mon = $999.60
20.83 x 48 mon = $999.84

As mentioned, just multiply the per month payment by the total financed (in thousands) to see what your total payment per month would be:

$15,500 financed would be 15.5 x 16.66 = $258.23 per month for 60 months.

Dennis

njdad

My wife and I are sold on the MPV (Silver ES with roof rack and 4 seasons package) and I want to take advantage of the 0% financing that is available now. My question is: what price is considered a good deal when I'm negotiating? Should I expect to get invoice or Edmunds TMV price or anything else like below-invoice? I live in northern NJ. Any insights would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

PS - This message board is truly a great resource. You have really sold me on the MPV (I was also considering the Sienna).

audia8q

it all depends on the availability of the ES you want...as I mentioned earlier, some dealers are running very short on inventory....if the one you want is in short supply, expect to pay a bit more.....I just pulled the MPV inventory of one of the largest mazda dealers in norther nj...they normally stock 40-50 MPV's and they only have 11 in stock right now.

reformers

After over-researching which MV to purchase, we've settled in on an MPV-ES. Now--what to pay (in Baltimore, MD), where to buy it, and HOW to go about buying it. In reading this board, invoice + 1% to 2% appears to be a good deal. What about the $2000 cash-back option? How does that work? Is it--invoice + 1-2% minus $2000? If that math is correct, looks like we're talking little under $25K for the ES equipped w/ 4 seasons, roof rack. That sound right? Anyone know how long the $2k incentive slated to last?

Can anyone recommend a dealer in the Balt/DC area?

I'm planning on sending out email to a bunch of dealers telling them what we want, asking for their best price. Good strategy?
Thanks. I'll admit--we're real neophytes at this (since we only buy a car every 10 years or so, thanks to Honda and Subaru.)

stever

I only buy one every decade or so too, Reformers, and did a blast fax method back in '99. I'd try the blast email technique today, although some around the boards pooh-pooh the idea. Here's some links:

Blast Fax Car Buying

Low Down, Low Payments!

Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards

beachnut

Rich, I'm just curious - are the GFX's that you're ordering '02s or '03s?

audia8q

2002's at this point.

I don't expect mazda to accept orders 2003 until september....from there its usually 6 weeks.

Blast fax....I know more dealers who toss those in the trash than those who respond. So you could very well be getting prices but not the best prices or the best dealer, the quality dealers don't need to "bid" on a car sale.

otish

We have a 2000 ES with the GFX package in red (may I say again the best color!) that I think looks great. I have to say that without the GFX package the van doesn't look as zoom, zoom (as someone else noted). Now we aren't usually the type to buy vehicles with lots of extra body cladding (think Pontiac) but do like this van's looks a lot. We have had it since Jan. 2000 with very little complaint.

Okay, I am going to complain a little bit though - I just had it for a short trip and was in the summer heat with many times 5-7 people in the van and it was very slow to cool off. I don't know that I ever thought it was slow to cool off before but it was irritating this past week. The van is also getting noisier and the transmission is irritating at times. (I have used the word irritating several times and never really thought I would do that about my van!) There were several times that the power issue came up for me also. Maybe I am just trying to talk myself into a new one! Oh, on the interstate when we got to cruising it was great and cooled off just fine - it is just around town that I had problems.
'

kkcymru

The Mazda vehicle locator is up, and I've been able to find a couple coastal blue ES's not too far from home.

A lot of the recent ES's (last digits of VIN higher than 325000) have come with carbon fiber dash and beige/black leather. Have you seen this combination and how does it look?

Has anyone else seen it?

[On a previous topic, judging from other posts, it looks like I'm part of a small minority that doesn't like the GFX package, at least on this board.]

subearu

on our '02 ES. IMO, maybe it's the midnight blue mica on ours that makes us prefer to not have the GFX package. YMMV, ;-)

However, we will be adding the mud guards next week.

-Brian

pjd58

Your van looks very sharp! I like the GFX only on certain colors......White, Red(00&01) and Silver. IMO, the GFX stands out in lighter colors.

Pjd58

javadoc

I think a midnight blue MPV would look awesome with or w/out GFX. Now, if only it came w/a beige interior, then I'd get one in that color.

/j

subearu

Yes, I agree beige would be nice (I have beige in my Outback), but don't let the grey interior stop you! ;-)

Next to Midnight Blue Mica, we liked the Pure White, which of course comes in beige interior. But, moonroofs are very scarce on MPV's over here, so, we took the only color with one!

-Brian

pierac

Seems the only ES's with a moon roof in Phoenix are White. I like the sands mica much better. Since we are postponing our move to Memphis, we are planning some test drives tomorrow to test the local dealers on pricing. I like your color though. Enjoy, I hope I get to soon.

tbcreative

Pjd58 and Subearu, thanks for your help, but I'm still a little confused. Why is there a charge with 0% financing? Doesn't 0% mean 0%?! The monthly payment you worked out is more than my monthly payment was on my Jimmy at 3.9% for 60 months, which cost a bit more at dealer invoice. I remember when my dad bought a LeBaron for my mom in '89 with 0% from Chrysler, and that was actually 0% with no charges.

I'm even more confused. Would you guys mind explaining the logic behind this further, because it doesn't seem like a great deal as it stands.

Thanks! -TB

javadoc

The way I read the 0% for 60mths is there is no charge, as long as you aren't late. $16.66 per $1000 is going to cost you just under $1000 per $1000 you borrow, so there's no other charges... except if you make a payment late, which is totally understandable. $16.66/thous is a lower payment for 60mths than I'm paying for 72mths. The $16.66 is the monthly payment and not the additional charges.

Howerver, maybe I'm missing where you see any other charges, TBcreative.

pjd58

Why don't you stop by and talk to the finance mgr at your local Maxda dealer. I assure you when Mazda says 0% for 60, they mean it. Java is correct, as long as you pay your monthly payments timely, there is no problem. I borrowed $9,800 for my Protege, and my payment is $204 for 48 months. Not everyone qualifies for 0%, it depends on your beacon score.

You can also try calling Mazda American Credit, 1-800-945-6000. This number is for existing Mazda accts, but maybe someone can explain their financing.

Pjd58

subearu

This might make it easier - $25,000 financed for 60 months:

1) 25 * $16.66 = $416.50
2) $25,000 / 60 = $416.67

Example 1 is using the math in the ads. Example 2 is just taking the finance amount and dividing it by the number of months.

There's going to be slight rounding, as you can see in the examples above, but it's still 0%.

-Brian