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Comments
That being said I will certainly try and live by the high standards demanded by Edmunds from here on.
Regarding tire pressure-I have never considered "over inflating"my tires,but after reading some of the postings I am going to try 35 psi and see if there is any gain in gas mileage.
As far as the Edmunds review of the Echo go they sure seem at varience with most reviewers.I have never driven an Echo and don't car for the looks,but from the comments in here by owners,if gas mileage and price are at the top of someones list-the ECHO seems like the way to go.
The comedian Gallagher has a skit about this.
Regarding tire pressure, I am going to stay with what Toyota suggests and that is 32psi. I already average over 40mpg city/highway so why mess with success.
I found the review to be even handed and fair. The reviewer did not like the Echo, but it had to do with looks and the fact that he felt it was not right for his generation (20 somethings). He complimented Toyota on the Echo's quality and the quality of the interior.
My wife has joined the crowd of freeway-flying college professors here in LA, having picked up some classes to teach at a second college. She's looking at 60mi a day, and since our '94 Grand Voyager AWD get 17MPG around town and also towing the folding travel trailer, we decided that we needed to get her a small high mileage car.
As an electronics person I was attracted by the Honda and Toyota hybrid cars but several day's research on the net revealed that the Honda is in short supply, has an unsettled battery history, and the 5-speed version is impossible to find now that the CVT version is out. The Prius is out as it is ONLY "automatic" transmission (actually innovative planetary gear system, but no clutch and gear shift). The wife wanted to get back to a manual transmission as she worked so hard to perfect her shifting years ago; I, in a past incarnation, drove heavy-haul semi's so I love a stick shift also.
I happened across this message board and have read all the messages on the current list, and based mostly on your comments we bought a 2001 Echo 4D 5-sp a week and a half ago. We love It!
I discovered that the available option packages vary by geographical location. On Toyota.com the "built your own" program bases what is available on your Zip Code. We could only get A/C, rear window defogger, and power steering, or that plus Package #1 and the 3-in-1 stereo w/6 speakers. No cold weather package (so no electric heating booster), no Package #2 or #3. What's on the dealers' lots follows this. Plugging in Zip codes for colder areas (midwest, north, east) showed different preferred option packages. I suppose we could have visited my wife's parents in Indiana and found a more fully loaded one there...
I hate car salespersons based on past experience that most know little mechanically about what they sell. ("Will it tow a houseboat?" "Oh Yes! especially this nice red one here!" "Does it have the towing package on it?" " I don't know, but the CD player is great!"). So, I went thru AAA, was sent to a dealer a few towns to the east, and had a pleasent time. Echo's are $300 over dealer invoice, no hassling.
I miss having a tach, oil pressure guage, or even a temp guage, but when I was in High School my father bought a brand new '64 Chevy with a 327 and IT had only a fuel guage, with a hot and cold light, oil light, and battery light. However, I'm ordering the shop manuals from Toyotaguys and will build a small electronic tach and guage panel, about 1"x3", to keep me informed. A little more programming of the microprocessor should also show MPG/fuel used from totaled fuel injector open time.
Yes, you can shift without using the clutch while moving, but you will probably wear out the syncro clutches a little faster. When I drove heavy haul Diesel's I always shifted 5X4's and 13-speed transmissions without the clutch, but I also used only two fingers on the shifter and just put enough pressure on the stick to "feel the gears meshing"; when the gear speeds matched, the stick just fell into the slot. The Cummins engine was used only in the 1700-2100RPM range so gears didn't turn nearly as fast as in the Echo, where 1 finger on the shifter works without the clutch when I fall back into old habits. I never twisted a driveshaft or otherwise damaged the drivetrain, something easily done with a "grabby" clutch in a big rig.
The only other draw back to the Echo is that there is no flat level area on the dashboard for 18lb Lewis (the "cat" in "techncat") to ride. He loves to watch what is going on or just sleep spread out across the dash. At least we have put a litter box for him in the trunk and by folding down the 40% of the rear seat he can access it.
Wind suseptability: I had a '68 Beatle and a '72 VW Van. There were times in the Van when I had the steering wheel almost a full turn into the wind and still couldn't quite stay in the lane. So far the Echo hasn't hinted at having any problem.
My mom had her hip replaced a couple of months ago and she loves riding in either the front or rear seats of the Echo. No problem getting in or out.
Sorry for the long post, just a lot to convey.
I have not ordered a car from them merely used their site to price cars so perhaps it is an option that you have to special order from the factory.
Lewis was a kitten we found as a stray in a park, trying to live off the food in the trash cans. He grew into a large Maine [non-permissible content removed] sort of cat and for the last 10 years has ridden in my work truck with me to the mountain top (8000'+) microwave sites I maintain, where he spends about 1/2 hr checking out the local sights, then returns to sleep within sight of me. He also goes on vacation trips with us and our folding travel trailer, as far as Newfoundland.
The power windows, from the illustrations in the owner's manual, are add-on humps to the inside of the doors. Probably a gear motor with an output shaft that couples to the existing window crank shaft. Don't think I would want it because it looks to take up valuable knee room next to the door, but as I haven't seen the thing in the flesh, I may be all wet. But I would like power/wireless door locks.
Thanks
Dealer told me that only 5% of the Echo's manufactured have power windows, so it is very hard to get. Don't know if he was just putting me off or what, because I told him I really wanted them, but he said they were not generally available. The owners manual definitely refers to them and even shows photos. I've already ordered a VIP RS3200 security system which will add keyless entry. Plan to install it myself. Will probably tint the windows and add a bra as well. When I need new tires, I'll probably get custom alloys and wider tires. No complaints so far. Just dislike the small tires. Love the pep in the 5-speed, love the gas mileage, (I have a 65 mile one-way commute), love the looks, and love that it's a Toyota for a price that's right! Glad I got the sport molding, because I think it really looks sharp compared to without.
Cheers!
Babyboomers remember when Kennedy was shot. Same echo of emotions today. Rumors about gas prices doubling sent many to fill up locally. Glad my car is an Echo.
I had half a tank in Major Tom, but I still went out to fill up. I first went out at around 2pm yesterday, but ended up coming back due to the lines. It was crazy. I ended up filling up at the Quik Trip down the street for $1.55 a gallon at around 7:30pm when the lunacy had died down. There were people at every pump, but there weren't the lines waiting to fill up.
I took the Escort down to QuikTrip at about 10pm and the comparison between 2pm and 10pm was just amazing. It was like two different places. Plenty of open pumps.
I drove by QT today and their prices never changed. They were $1.55 before the terror, $1.55 during the terror, and $1.55 one day after the terror.
Hats off to the QT corporation for not price gouging.
For a new driver, the lack of any reference points re: front or back might make it hard for him to park until he gets used to the parameters.
Othewise, the Echo is very user friendly and visibility is excellent!
I guess Edmunds doesn't know how to adjust their mirrors. Perhaps they adjust their mirrors like I used to.
I used to adjust my side mirrors so that I could see behind my car. I did not adjust them so much for close quarters. This was and is wrong.
The inside mirror is for seeing behind you. The side mirrors should be adjusted so that when objects leave the field of view in the rearview mirror, they show up in the field of view of one of the side mirrors. When they leave the field of view of one of the side mirrors, they should be in your line of sight without mirrors.
There are blind spots with the Echo, but they are not as large as Edmunds makes them out to be when your mirrors are properly adjusted.
I think the center mounted speedo will make it easier on a new driver. A new driver does not have to worry about adjusting the steering wheel in an effort to get an unobstructed view of the speedo.
But personally, I say get your father to learn to drive first and then buy the car. This way he can pick out the car that he is happiest with and meets all his requirements and driving style.
Let us know how it goes.
That said, IF I AM in a car with a center rear view mirror I feel blind if I do not adjust it correctly. The inside mirror is close enough to the driver's eyes that when I get in after my wife drives, I end up looking at the rear seat; she sees the dome light after I have driven it. The outside mirrors are not nearly so problematic, with neither side requiring adjustment normally.
A side note: the spot mirrors allow the passenger to second-guess the driver and aid in "back seat driving!"
I mentioned the scratched tint to the delaership who took the car back into the shop and found the drivers door panel was slightly bowed. This pushed the rubber strip on the inside on the window against the tint,causing extra wear and scratches. Something to consider if you are having the same problem. I see many more Echo's
than I did in April 00 when I picked it up. The car continues to turn heads and draw comment.
I was doing good on keeping the mileage fairly down until I played Amtrak for my roommate. I took her to St. Louis, dropped her off, drove home, went back to St. Louis and picked her up, and then drove us home. This added like 1200 miles on my Echo in the space of about three days.
But I thoroughly enjoyed every minute and every mile of the experience. Most of which was spent at 80mph plus.
I can see having them check the car over if your warranty is about to expire, then they have to pay for the repairs and that is a good idea. And after the warranty expires their lifetime shock, strut, and muffler program is a good value. (any of these items installed by Toyota is replaced free of charge for the life of the car) But when I saw the receipts my neighbor had for his Camry where they changed the oil, sparkplugs and air filters for $300 (and inspected the car) THAT was a rippoff.
All done by myself. A little over $ 50 so far. Is TOYOTA going to honor the guarantee considering I do all the maintenance? Yes, just in case I've kept all my receipts (oil, filters and tire rotation) and if push comes to shove, there's my mechanic who will provide me with more receipts, if necessary.