Mercedes-Benz E-Class Sedans

livetodrive

My 2001 E430 4Matic came with P235/45 ZR 17 tires.

cce182

Brochure says all E430's come with 235/45R17 W94 Tires. Only variation is in manufacturer of the tires. Just like US mfgrs, MB buy the tires based on availability and price! No rocket science here, and this IS a production car! Mine (a 2000 E430 4matic) came with Goodyear Eagle F1 235/45R17's.

A footnote in "Wheels and Tires" specifications in the brochure also tells us that: "W rated and Z rated tires are optimized for performance and may provide slightly reduced comfort, increased tire noise and substantially reduced treatwear compared to the standard all-season tires. Please consider these factors when selecting an E430 or E55."

There it is, folks! I read this and bought the E430 anyway. The F1's have an aggressive tread design, great in the rain, stink in snow, and are also very noisy! No surprises here based on the caveat in the brochure. What DID surprise me is how quiet my snow tires (Blizzak -01's) are compared to the F1's. I bought these snow tires in a panic after the first snowfall. The F1's are really bad in the snow and 4matic is insufficient to overcome this. But, again, the warning was in the brochure. Can't tell yet on F1 tread wear - - I have only 13k miles on the car.

Many of the questions I see on this board can be answered by reading the brochure and/or owners manual.

albell

Does anyone know what the proposed changes, if any, are for the '02 E?

mbdriver

vs4 -
I bought the MB warranty from Lisa in April. It was $1680 for 4yrs/50K mile (extension to 8yrs/100K miles). I'd heard then that the MB MSRP was about to go up -- perhaps instead, MB kept the same warranty MSRP but changed the coverage to 3yrs. Suggest you check with your own dealer. If they quote $2650 MSRP for 3yrs/50K mikes, then MB has indeed changed the warranty and Lisa is still offering you a good deal.

Tires - Several months ago I upgraded to 17" MB Style "E" wheels and Yoko AVS dB tire. Both are fabulous - ride, handling, low tire noise. Haven't driven in winter yet, and Yokos are rated well for tire wear.

CD Changer - My MB salesman gave me an installed price of $619 for the CD changer a month AFTER I took delivery. There should be some wiggle room there!

macbest - I have last year's Map # 8 and would be happy to trade you for your # 7. Check my profile and e-mail me if you're interested.

maroon95

Is the new C-class C320 worth the money?

Or should I get the BMW 3-series instead?

May I inquire your opinions?

abyoung

I'm looking at the C320/E320 and learned from the dealer that the C-class is just re-designed. Any idea when the E-class will be re-designed? I'm thinking that the just-out C320 may have some bugs to ring out, while the current E320 may be obsoleted soon.

I'm leaning toward the roomier E320, but want to balance buying a soon-to-be obsoleted (old) design with buying a fresh (new) design, albiet one with potential bugs. How good is Mercedes-Benz at getting it right the first time?

-Andy

dcman2

MB is evidently offering a 2K incentive to dealerships on 2001 E-series. This is an unadvertised incentive. Most dealers may not tell you unless you ask. I picked up an E320 for 2.5K under invoice three weeks ago. This was partly possible as I picked up one from their inventory. The color was not my first choice. But taking the first choice would have meant paying a premium and waiting longer. If you have to order one though, that changes the equation. Hope that helps!!!

steven36

We just bought our second E-320 ($1,500 below invoice). Compared with our '98 model it seems tighter on corners and the stereo is much improved. The saleman said that the '02 model will be pretty much the same. Major modifications (as yet undisclosed) scheduled for the '03 model year.

nvc

I am considering purchasing a 1998 or a 1999 E320 and 2 very good low mileage vehicles are currently available to me. I am trying to figure out the key differences between the two. I notice that traction control is an option in 1999 and not in 1998 (according to edmunds.com). This is confusing because it it also lists traction control as standard since 1996. Also, is there a difference between traction control and stability program.

Any other differences I should be aware of?

Thanks....

varig

Andy: As I mentioned in a previous posting, there was an 1 page article in I believe Road & Track (issue???) that featured a photograph and some details about the E320 redesign. It is scheduled to debut in Europe Spring of 2002 with introduction to North America later that Fall. The 4 lamp headlight configuration was still there but it does look updated. The article also mentioned that the interior would be upgraded and more refined. Additionally a new braking system will be introduced. The article seemed to indicate that this will be superior to the current braking system. I too wonder if I should go with a 2001/2002 model or just wait. With a complex piece of engineering like a car, you always run the risk of malfunctions and less than optimal reliability and that risk may be higher in the model's "maiden" year. But then, someone has buy the first one ;-) One would hope that MB places enough pride in their product to have minimal problems, but then it is eventually built by humans. But to be truthful, I place the emphasis on a car's reliability, safety, and functionality, not on which model year it happens to be. I squeeze every mile out of a car before I replace it so I know that it will long be obsolete before I buy another. Just because a car is not the "current" design model does not make it less attractive. Look at well maintained "vintage" cars. Who has not seen one driven down the road or in a parking lot and not taken a moment to admire it. But in the end, you must be comfortable with your own decision. I wish you luck.

kcsupratt

I got my car yesterday and so far i have been very happy. The car has less body roll and it still maintains the smooth ride. I hope later this week i can post new pictures of my car.
The car had been lowered but not too much. I now can take turns at a higher speed without falling into the passengers seat.

compuser38

Just picked up my '01 E320 - Desert Silver/Java interior (I posted my lease rate in an earlier message). The carpet looks great but very light and it looks like it will get dirty very quickly. What is the best carpet cleaner and maintenance cleaning method? I wouldn't mind cleaning them weekly/monthly. I'm thinking of putting Scotch Guard on the mats. Any thoughts? TIA.

aaron33

It's been a few weeks since my last post(1743)regarding thumping noises coming from back deck, suspected broken speakers or deck was loose. "WNIEL" #1752 & "44264" #1766 seem to agree on culprit of headrests bouncing from "at rest" position. I have driven with them in up position and thumping noise still persists. Leads me to believe headrests not source. Has ANYONE else experienced this problem? I guess if not I'll just have to turn the radio up.....

tomsky

I found that the java mats were impossible to keep clean. Finally giving up, I replaced them by black all-season mats for the front. Frt the back where I seldom have passengers, I've kept the original mats.

Jack

varig

an E320 4Matic. Beautiful automobile. I did notice something regarding the braking that I would like to ask other E320 drivers about I was traveling at @ 40-45 mph and braked for a traffic light. Right before the car stopped, I detected a slight "thump" from the car. It happened more than once, however I could not reproduce it at very low speed. After I returned home I realized that I should have looked in the trunk to see if something had been placed in it. Needless to say, I will have to take it out again, but just wondering if any of you have noticed something similar. Thanks.

wbreaux

I know this has been discussed in the past, but does Tele Aid automatically renew after 1 year or does an owner have to affirmatively order it somehow? The credit card company is taking it of the bill and I won't pay it even if it is called for in the fine print, but I just want to know.

cce182

Don't worry. They want your renewal fee so they will be sending you mail if you haven't already gotten one.

Check my post #1793. Many subjects covered there, but in particular, you might be interested in thoughts re: extended warranties and why I renewed Tele-Aid even tho' many owners do not.

livetodrive

Kenyee and 44264, thanks for your input. I do have a TDMA phone, and the dealer confirmed it has a monochrome display.

shepherd5

I am helping a friend sell his car. A '97 E420 with 90k miles. Options include: moonroof, AMG suspension and body kit, fully upgraded stereo (at least $3K invested). Car is always maintained @ MBZ dealership and just had the 90k service done today. Can anyone tell me what I would be able to sell this car for? I live in Orange County, CA. Edmunds TMV priced it between $31-35K. Any thoughts?

pat

Someone here might be able to give you some thoughts, but you also might want to drop by a discussion called "Real-World Trade-In Values" over on our Smart Shopper board and ask there as well.

Good luck.

Pat
Host
Sedans and Women's Auto Center Message Boards

drew_

Just a reminder that the MB chat is on tonight (6-7pm Pacific/9-10 pm Eastern). Hope to see you there!
http://www.edmunds.com/chat/mercedeschat.html


Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards

taison

Can I ask you where you got the work done? How much was the labor?

Thanks

landinggear

The main reason I think the V-8160 is superior to the Timeport is size. The V-8160 is about HALF the size of the Timeport. I just put mine up against my neighbor's.

By the way, the V-8160 is so small it can fit inside the coin pocket inside the right hip pocket on a pair of Levis!

landinggear

I love my E-320 which is not even a month old but I need more lumbar support in the seat. Any suggestions?

akuma1

When is the 2002 coming out? We're not in a rush to get a car but we also don't want to wait too long. People have been saying that MB quality is going downhill does this apply to 2001 models and presumably more to 2002 models?

rexconde1

The 8160 is also going to be discontinued VERY soon - - think late summer

Robert

jawanda

On Edmund's info page, it claims 18.5 gallons, and my owner's manual claims 21.1 gallons. My instrument panel info is consistant with the 18.5 number, but others have had a faulty sensor, so what's the scoop? I've only filled up once,(car is one week old), so I'm not sure.

-AJ

bigrobnh

Well, to each his own. I feel that these phones get to the point where they're inconvenient to use. The StarTac/Timeport form factor seems to be a good compromise to me.

As far as the MB Timeport phone goes, there are definitely pros and cons. I dislike the color display. It is completely unreadable outdoors. It also seems to be a cheaper plastic construction than my former StarTac.

This is more than made up for when you start using it in the car. The integration with the systems is fantastic. The audio quality is excellent on both ends of the connection. The signal strength seems to be much improved over the standard phone. I have a spot on the way home where I used to get dropped all the time. Now I have a moment of distortion but calls continue to work. I'm very pleased with it. It is a very well thought out package.

Later,
BigRob.

kcsupratt

I had it installed in Central New Jersey. I am not sure how much the labor was. I think it is about $50/hr and it took about 6 hours.

I am not really sure of the numbers except for the total price.

jures

Does anyone have any experience with dunlop sp sport 5000 tires? tire rack rates them high, but i would like to get comments from e class owners. i will be putting them on amg 17" wheels on a 2000 e320 4 matic. thanks roger

rablake

landinggear: Had the same problem and solved the lack of lumbar support with a Heated, Leather covered, hand-pump-air-bag pillow from Griot's $99.95 800.345.5789. Hope this helps.
Richard

rablake

Jawanda: Your numbers are the same as mine. My dealer claims the 18.5 gallons does not include the 2.6 gallon reserve. Adding the two gets the true capacity of 21.1. This guy is only about even odds on accuracy though so maybe someone else here knows for a certainty. Having 1/8th tank in reserve seems a bit much. On the plus side, my fuel guage and mpg computer are extremely accurate.
Richard

cce182

When you have a question, consult the owners manual.

Page 300 of the 2000 "E-Class Operators Manual" states:

Fuel Capacity approx 21.1 US Gal (80.0 Liters)
including a reserve of 2.6 US Gal (10.0 Liters)

It seems logical to interpret the meaning of this is that the total capacity of the tank is 21.1 gallons, comprised of 18.5 gallons of fuel and 2.6 gallons of reserve.

The manual, on Page 222, shows how this works under "Fuel reserve and fuel-cap placement warning" Seems straightforward.

If you like doing engineering experiments, and don't want to rely on dealers, service managers, or contributors to this board (such as me!) a suggested experiment might go something like this.

Next time you refuel your car, do the following.

1. When you've stopped at the pump, before shutting off the engine, scroll the multifunction display (below the speedometer) to the Trip Computer.

2. Scroll trip computer display to "Tank Content" and note the fuel in the tank.

3. Stop the engine, get out of the car, and fill the tank, noting the total amount of fuel you put in.

4. The sum of what it said you had in it before you filled it and what you put in ought to come close to 21.1 gallons (this is a reasonable check of the "extreme accuracy" of this system).

5. Get back into and start the car, go to the Tank Content screen again and see if it now shows 21.1 gallons. If it is seriously off (say, more than a gallon or two), you may have a fuel sender or fuel gauge problem which you can get your dealer to repair under the warranty (I had to do this - when new my car was "extremely accurate". After a couple of months, it wouldn't show more than 18-19 gallons even when completely full).

6. Now, drive the car around without additional fillups until the fuel light just comes on, then note the the tank content on the display. It ought to say 2.6 gallons - - your reserve. At this point, you will have used 18.5 gallons of fuel! Q.E.D.!

7. Go to the nearest filling station, fill the tank, and check the amount you added. It ought to be close to 18.5 gallons.

Simple, no??

If you REALLY want to check the gauge, run the car until it's almost empty, take an assistant with you to the filling station, and while one of you puts in a gallon at a time, the other should watch the tank capacity increase gallon by gallon, noting what ought to be in the tank against what the capacity indicator is reading. Be sure to let the system settle for a minute or so between the addition of each gallon. If you're doing this at busy time, wear earplugs and don't stand between you and the car waiting behind you. First, he may yell at you, - second, he may start leaning on his horn, - - finally, he may try to push your car out of the service bay. If he gets out of the car to assault you, it's helpful if the assistant you chose for this experiment is bigger than the guy behind you. Engineering experiments are serious business!!!

Further thought. It seems less important what percentage of remaining fuel trips the reserve light than how much farther you can go before you run out of gas. The tank content screen also displays miles to empty based on your current gas mileage. Around town, maybe you can run the car until there are just fumes in the tank. In the desert, you may want to fill before the light even comes on. Whatever the reserve is, even with COMAND, there's no guarantee that the reserve will get you to the next filling station. The car simply can't think of everything - it's only human!

Final note - - don't forget to pay for the fuel required to do these experiments!

jawanda

cce182- I guess me earlier short post didn't make the problem exactly clear, so I'll elaborate. According to Edmund's Specs & Safety page, the sedan has a 21.1 gallon capacity, and the wagon has an 18.5 gallon capacity. The owner's manual says 21.1 capacity for all models. My fuel light goes on with approx 2.6 gallons, as expected, and when I go to the pump, the car will take approx. 15.9 gallons, and the trip computer display 18.5 gallons.

Simple, no??

So again, my question is, is Edmund's correct that the wagon has a smaller fuel tank, or do I have the fuel sensor problem like some others? Without knowing which of the two numbers is correct, it's not that straightforward. The way to verify this on my own is to run out of gas and fill up from there. This may not even be so bad, what with tele-aid and free roadside assistance :-)

jason64

jawanda, I think cce182 answered your question under Point #5, there is a discrepancy between what your computer tells you and the actual pumped volume. The problem is likely to be the fuel sensing unit. I have the same problem and it was replaced at the dealer under warranty. My service advisor tells me it's a common problem for the E class and the source is at the silver coated sensing unit which gets tarnish during the transport, resulting in inaccurate reading. Hope this helps.

jawanda

Do you have the wagon or sedan?

I'm inclined to think it's the sensor as well, based on the owner's manual, but I'd like to know for certain if there is anyone with a wagon who has a 21 gallon tank. I don't want to waste my time taking the car in for service if I only have an 18.5 gal tank with no problem.

-AJ

jason64

I have the 01 sedan, and mine holds 21.1 gallon as the manual specifies. I understand you have the wagon. I wouldn't think the manufacturer would put a smaller tank in a wagon, knowing they all like to use common parts, even when it comes to wagons. If anything, they probably would put a larger tank on wagons. I think your case is a typical "sensor senses wrong level of fuel in the tank" problem. Ask your advisor, he is likely to tell you yours is not the only one with that problem.

sshowitt

Until July 1, Cosco will take $50.00 off the purchase price of 4 Michelin tires. Their price includes mounting, H/S balancing, free rotation every 6k miles, new stems, free flat repair and road hazard insurance. The price for 4 Michelin 215/55R16 MXV4plus is 129.00 per tire plus sales tax less the $50.00 on the total. In Mass with 5% sales tax it comes out to just about $500.00. This is a better deal than tire rack. If anyone is in need of tires, now is the time to take the plunge. They order the tires and have them within a week.

prevostxlv

I looked at the MB Europe site and they list the Saloon (E Sedan) fuel tank as 80 liters and the Estate fuel tank at 70/10 liters. If you convert the liters (3.875 liters per gallon) you get 21.1 and 18.5/2.6. MB definitely uses the same tank in each car (same frame) but I bet that the computers are programmed differently (i.e. why one has 21.1 vs 18.5). I would have to sway to the owner of the wagon. It is reading correctly. Don't ask why they are programmed differently but I think that is the problem. We are currently looking at a 2001/2002 4 matic wagon but none have a full tank.

prevostxlv

Sorry, it is 3.785 not 3.875. So I can't type very well....

jawanda

Thanks prevostxlv, I tried checking a couple of other MB sites worldwide, but I didn't come across the one you found. It's a strange way of doing things, but if you are correct, I'll see if they can calibrate my computer the same way as the sedan. I may have to do a running the tank dry experiment...

-AJ

rablake

jawanda: My '01 E320 wagon's fuel guage reacts exactly as you describe in post 1885. So we either have identically inaccurate readings off a 21.1 gallon tank, or we have 18.5 gallon tanks and good readings. I get down to "1 gallon left", the tank will take about 17.5 gallons and then report having a total of 18.5 onboard. 21.1 is a number my wagon knows nothing about. Will report when serviced if adjustments were possible or required. Simple.
Richard

1cajun

Request advice on replacing a burned out bulb in dash instrument cluster of '97, E-420. Thought this would be a "piece of cake" until I tried to gain access to rear of the instrument cluster or a way to pull the cluster out. Could find no obvious screws, clips, etc. Probably a simple solution, but one that escapes me. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

gdtobme

I've a '00 E320 and i'm not scientific in my methods but here's what I noticed: my gas gauge says 1/3 left. I would expect to fill up with 14 gallons but it's always about 2-3 gallons less than what I would expect, i.e, 11 gallons. When it's full, it says 21 gallons but the gauge quickly drops down during the next mile of driving. I think it says 21 gallons full but then switches to 18 gallons to adjust for the 2+ gallons reserve. Oh hell, I've given up on this damn fuel gauge. I already had it replaced ... give me a martini and I'll be happy. As long as the car runs.

Speaking of that, my lamp indicator malfunction message comes up intermittently. Who cares, its only a damm brake light or reverse light or turn signal that will cause someone behind me to rear end me. give me another martini and I'll forget about the damage.

albell

I have a '00 wagon. The gas tank is 18.5 gallon capacity. While the fuel gauage is sometimes erractic, it never fills to more than 18.5 gallons.

prevostxlv

I just got off the phone with my mb salesman and he said he checked two 2001 wagons both read 18.5 and they do have 21.1 gallon tanks. You must remember that the e wagon and the e sedan are one in the same when concerning the under carriage (look at MB's World site in english, of course, and you will see the 70/10 split for the estate car. Same dimensions and same tank size. Also, look at the original sales pieces and window sticker.

jawanda

Interesting, so according to post #1897, the salesman sees a full tank reading 18.5 gal and concludes that it has a 21.1 gallon tank?

I found the mercedes bend worldwide site with all the data, and if you check these two:

(Take out the space before the e, I couldn't post without it for some reason.)

sedan:
www.mercedes-benz.com/ e/cars/e-class/e320.htm

wagon:
www.mercedes-benz.com/ e/cars/e-class-t/e320.htm

The claim is a tank of 80/10 for sedan and 70/9 for the wagon. It's looking a lot like the wagon does indeed have a smaller tank.

Richard - If you find out otherwise, let me know. I have to take my car in for service anyway, so I'll try to find out as well.

-AJ

jason64

My FSS came up with an error message "lamp defective - check lamps" a few times when I drove at night with the lights turned on. My dealer found the culprit was at both the license plate lights and side markers - both were operating properly when I took the car in. I was told that these bulbs were turning "dark" indicating that they weren't making good electrical contact for a complete circuit, causing the FSS to think there is a defective lamp. It's been one month since they replaced the bulbs and no problem so far.

cce182

Hey all.

I just noticed something that had escaped my attention until now. My E-Class Operators manual makes no reference whatever to Wagon features. It appears to be a Sedan-only manual! Ergo, it is possible that the fuel capacities of the wagon and sedan can be different without M-B manual inconsistencies!

Question: If you have an E-320 Wagon, did you get a Wagon-specific operator's manual? Or, do you get an additional wagon supplement to the regular operator's manual? If so, what is the published fuel capacity in the back of this manual. If it's 70/9 liters (18.5/2.4 gallons), then the sedan/wagon fuel capacity discrepancies here are understood.

I checked the brochure for 2000 and fuel capacities are not listed at all in the specifications.

Of course, gas-gauge sender problems can still afflict either model since I'd wager that these components are made by the same vendor.

Conclusion: The sedan/wagon fuel capacities could be different AND you could be having problems with the fuel-tank level sender.

prevostxlv

First, he didn't assume anything, he knows the tech. details of each car and clearly stated that the cars do have the same tank. Also, I commend you on looking at the world site but information can be dangerous. Look how the lines are broken out. The wagon states tank capacity at 70(l), incl.(stands for include) approx reserve of 9 (l) == 79 (l). The sedan has tank capacity of 80 (l). The next line has "including approx reserve of 10 (l). So, according to your reasoning, all of the E sedan owners have a reserve of 10 (l) so we read 21.1 but really we have a 23.7 gal tank. I feel cheated. Where do I go to get my car computer fixed.... Only kidding. The way things are written by the marketing dept leads one to conclude the wrong information. Incl. stands for include which means "to add something" and including means "it is already taken into effect". There must be an issue in the translation of German into English. The only real issue is the computer is set to read 18.5 vs 21.1 -- who knows why (I hope the engineer who did it has a good explanation - he is causing a big issue over here... hahaha!). I hope this helps.