with MSRP of $38,345, $725 Acquisition fee, $750 loyalty rebate, and $3,624 first month (including $2500 down, $725 acq. fee and 399 first month payment), I get monthly payments of $412 (pretax and excluding license and reg), when I use 0.0013 for money factor and 0.6 residual factor for 10,000 miles per year.

Here is my calculations: Net Cap Cost = 38345 (MSRP) + 725 (acq. fee) - 2500 (down payment) - 725 (acq. fee paid upfront) - 750 (rebate) = 35095

The dealer that I'm negotiating with tells me his money factor is 0.0017 for X1 because they are in red. I guess they want me to think that they are selling at loss. (I got a price about $800 above Edmunds.com invoice price, and $300 above the dealers invoice price - Their invoice price was $500 more than Edmunds.com apparently due to advertising fee).

So, anyways, I walked away, saying that the market rate is 0.0013, and if they can't afford it, I won't take the deal.

Now, the dealer has called me again, offering to cut from the price to account for the higher money factor. (They need to cut at least $1200 to match the difference).

What do you think about it? Should I go for it? or this is just another gimmick of a dishonest dealer, and I better avoid them altogether?

Hi sepi. I personally don't see why the dealer insists upon marking up your vehicle's money factor to the point that they are willing to sell you the vehicle below invoice minus incentives. I personally prefer to do deals as straight forward as possible with the buy rate money factor and whatever real selling price I can negotiate.

Having said that, if you have shopped around and this combination of a higher money factor and an abnormally low selling price results in the lowest monthly payment for the vehicle that you want then I personally don't see any reason not to go for it.

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In fact they didn't offer me $1200 discount, but just $200, plus a bmw rebate that I was already eligible for, and had taken it into account myself elsewhere.

I just heard back from the dealer (via email, so didn't have chance to discuss and ask). I told him I was looking for a basic X1 8 speed automatic, rear wheel drive, base color and interior (no extra charge), possibly with sun roof and heated front seats, (but not a must, to keep cost down), $1000 out of pocket, everything else rolled in. With those extras, on Edmunds it has a Total invoice Price $30,825 and an MSRP of $33,445 He told me that he found two matching cars and the monthly would be around $600!!!! I had an X3 three years ago and paid less a month. Can somebody help me do the math? Are there any incentives? I am not a returning customer, as we had a Jetta for the last three years, and what are the numbers for April? My wife would like to come in around $350/month, and looking at last months without incentives (didn't see if there were any) I can tell that I will probably not be able to get there, but anything close would be good. Any help would be greatly appreciated!! Hugo

Thanks Jason, I am using webcalcsolutions auto lease calculator and am not sure if I am doing this right and maybe you or somebody else can help me here: I priced out the car I want on Edmunds with an MSRP - $32,195.00 calculated at $1000 above invoice price (29,685) so $30,685.00 -$1000 out of pocket -$500 lease cash you mentioned

and ended up with this monthly: $375.84 I am trying to get to the monthly having rolled everything asides the out of pocket into the monthly (tax, etc) Am I doing it the right way, or am I missing something? The BMW advertisement mentions acquisition fee ($725) and destination fee. Edmunds only accounts for destination fee. Looking at this calculator, I see that I have not filled in the following: Tags/plates title fee registration fee acquisition fee

How do I get this and do I need it to get to the right amount?

I was also looking into a Tiguan, and after pricing it all out on Edmunds, the dealer told me that I have to pay for first aid kit and floor mats, which added another $1000 that I didn't account for. Is this something BMW will do as well and do I have to get this. Sorry, for the long question and being somewhat uneducated about this. I try to be prepared going into negotiations and they will always find a way to come up with something I didn't calculate, which throws off all calculations I have done, and am not sure wether I can contest it. Thanks again

If you live in a place with enough competition (e.g., at least 3 BMW dealership within 100 miles distance), you should be able to get the invoice price with no markup on the MF or the acquisition fee. I personally won't pay more than $500 above the invoice under any circumstances. (I got an X1 this Saturday for $100 below invoice and no markup).

And if in-stock X1s don't have the options you'd like, or if the dealer that has the one with your desired options is not willing to give you an acceptable price, remember that you can always order your car from another dealer. It just takes 6-8 weeks.

Also use the Multiple Security Deposit program, where you put in security deposit equal to 7 monthly payment (rounded up to $50), and that reduces your MF by 0.00049. (Google for BMW Multiple Security Deposit program if you don't know what that is).

Also, depending on where you leave there may be about $200-$400 training and ad fees charged by the dealer. That's normal. Plus title and registration and 1st month payment, you will be looking at around $1000 drive off (plus ~$3000 security deposit). Put zero down. You're payment for the car you initially asked about (MSRP $33,445), should be around $400 including tax if you can get the invoice price.

Remember to always negotiate the price, and not the monthly payment. Make sure it is clear that you want to lease and you're asking the buy rate money factor and BMW's acquisition fee with no mark up.

That's some good information. Googled and seems like that program is not legal for dealers in NYC. Any chance you (or anybody else for that matter) might be able to give me a quick help on trying to work numbers myself? If I know the MF and residual, the tax %, MSRP and invoice price of the car I want to buy, what else do I need to put into my calculations and where do I find out about these? To explain: Edmunds includes destination fee what about acquisition fee, title, plates & registration in order to figure out what I have to pay upon signing.

The math is actually pretty simple, and you need to learn it well before going to the dealership, if you want to get a good deal. There are many websites that teach the details of how to do the calculations. Edmunds.com has the following page:

I personally have never depended on online calculators. The math is simple enough to do it using a calculator and a piece of paper.

Here is a short version of what is described in details in the above link:

What you need to know in order to calculate your monthly payments:

1- MSRP (Say $31,695) 2- Residual Factor for your desired annual mileage. Multiply this with MSRP to get residual value. Based on what Jason said above for 10K miles on X1, April RF is 0.59. So for the above MSRP, the residual value is $18,700. 3- Money Factor. The buy rate money factor offered by BMWFS is the one Jason mentioned above. Dealers usually say 129 instead of 0.00129. They are allowed to mark up the MF by 40 base points and keep a cut. Since you live in NYC, you should have no problem getting the buy rate money factor. 4- Acquisition Fee: $725 is what is asked by BMWFS. Dealers are allowed to increase it to $925. 5- Negotiated Price: Start $500 below invoice, get you first best offer from one dealer, and try to get counter offers from other dealers over the phone. Keep your "ordering" option open so they don't pressure you on what they have in stock. Make sure they don't mark up MF or Acq fee to compensate for their discounts (ask them if they do over the phone). Note that you have to add about $500 on what Edmunds.com says as invoice price to account for training and MACO fees. 6- See what rebates you can get. Jason mentioned $500 incentive for 2013 cars (I guess they are trying to clear their inventories for 2014 models). 7- Decide how much down payment you want to pay. People usually pay $0 down, since if you total your car, you lose your money.

Ok, here to calculations:

Capitalized Cost = Negotiated Price + Acquisition fee Example (assuming you negotiated 30695) = 30695+725 = 31420

Net Capitalized Cost = Cap Cost - Rebates - Down Payment Example = 30695 - 500 - 0 = 30920

Depreciation = Net Cap Cost - Residual Example = 30920 - 18700 = 12220

Monthly Depreciation = Depreciation/36 Example = 12220/36 = 339

Monthly rent = (Residual + Net Cap Cost) * Money Factor Example = (30920 + 18700)*0.00129 = 49620*0.00129 = 64

Monthly Payments Before Tax = Monthly Depreciation + Monthly rent Example = 339+64 = 403

## Comments

13Can someone please post the latest numbers for money factor and residual value for 10,000, 12,000, and 15,000 miles 36 month lease of xDrive 28i X1?

I appreciate your help.

1175Thanks

11713You probably mean:

"The residual will stay at [57%] for 15,000 miles but there will be an $1800 charge for an additional 4,000 miles at $.15 per mile"

right?

13So, I'm trying to practive my calculations before going to the dealer today, but something doesn't add up. For the lease special offered at:

http://www.bmwusa.com/standard/content/Vehicles/2013/X1/xDrive28i/

with MSRP of $38,345, $725 Acquisition fee, $750 loyalty rebate, and $3,624 first month (including $2500 down, $725 acq. fee and 399 first month payment), I get monthly payments of $412 (pretax and excluding license and reg), when I use 0.0013 for money factor and 0.6 residual factor for 10,000 miles per year.

Here is my calculations:

Net Cap Cost = 38345 (MSRP) + 725 (acq. fee) - 2500 (down payment) - 725 (acq. fee paid upfront) - 750 (rebate) = 35095

Month depreciation = (35095-23007)/36 = 336

Interest = (35095+23007)*.0013 = 76

Total = 336+76 = 412

Am I missing something? why do I get $412 and not $399? Does this lease special come with lower money factor maybe?

Thanks much

551175Thanks

11713The dealer that I'm negotiating with tells me his money factor is 0.0017 for X1 because they are in red. I guess they want me to think that they are selling at loss. (I got a price about $800 above Edmunds.com invoice price, and $300 above the dealers invoice price - Their invoice price was $500 more than Edmunds.com apparently due to advertising fee).

So, anyways, I walked away, saying that the market rate is 0.0013, and if they can't afford it, I won't take the deal.

Now, the dealer has called me again, offering to cut from the price to account for the higher money factor. (They need to cut at least $1200 to match the difference).

What do you think about it? Should I go for it? or this is just another gimmick of a dishonest dealer, and I better avoid them altogether?

Thanks,

sepi

38,515Having said that, if you have shopped around and this combination of a higher money factor and an abnormally low selling price results in the lowest monthly payment for the vehicle that you want then I personally don't see any reason not to go for it.

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13In fact they didn't offer me $1200 discount, but just $200, plus a bmw rebate that I was already eligible for, and had taken it into account myself elsewhere.

So, I passed on their offer.

Thanks,

Sepi

68Can you please advise MF and Residual for X1 10k 36 months for April?

Are there any incentives or cash backs this month?

I am looking at this car:

http://www.edmunds.com/bmw/x1/2013/options.html?sub=suv

Thanks,

Hugo

68With those extras, on Edmunds it has a

Total invoice Price $30,825

and an MSRP of $33,445

He told me that he found two matching cars and the monthly would be around $600!!!!

I had an X3 three years ago and paid less a month. Can somebody help me do the math?

Are there any incentives? I am not a returning customer, as we had a Jetta for the last three years, and what are the numbers for April?

My wife would like to come in around $350/month, and looking at last months without incentives (didn't see if there were any) I can tell that I will probably not be able to get there, but anything close would be good.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

Hugo

11768I am using webcalcsolutions auto lease calculator and am not sure if I am doing this right and maybe you or somebody else can help me here:

I priced out the car I want on Edmunds with an

MSRP - $32,195.00

calculated at $1000 above invoice price (29,685)

so $30,685.00

-$1000 out of pocket

-$500 lease cash you mentioned

and ended up with this monthly:

$375.84

I am trying to get to the monthly having rolled everything asides the out of pocket into the monthly (tax, etc)

Am I doing it the right way, or am I missing something?

The BMW advertisement mentions acquisition fee ($725) and destination fee. Edmunds only accounts for destination fee. Looking at this calculator, I see that I have not filled in the following:

Tags/plates

title fee

registration fee

acquisition fee

How do I get this and do I need it to get to the right amount?

I was also looking into a Tiguan, and after pricing it all out on Edmunds, the dealer told me that I have to pay for first aid kit and floor mats, which added another $1000 that I didn't account for. Is this something BMW will do as well and do I have to get this. Sorry, for the long question and being somewhat uneducated about this. I try to be prepared going into negotiations and they will always find a way to come up with something I didn't calculate, which throws off all calculations I have done, and am not sure wether I can contest it.

Thanks again

68MSRP $31695

aprox. selling price $30695

$1000 out of pocket

$450/month

is this a fair deal?

11768I am in Brooklyn, NY (kings county), so I think it's 8.875, correct?

11713If you live in a place with enough competition (e.g., at least 3 BMW dealership within 100 miles distance), you should be able to get the invoice price with no markup on the MF or the acquisition fee. I personally won't pay more than $500 above the invoice under any circumstances. (I got an X1 this Saturday for $100 below invoice and no markup).

And if in-stock X1s don't have the options you'd like, or if the dealer that has the one with your desired options is not willing to give you an acceptable price, remember that you can always order your car from another dealer. It just takes 6-8 weeks.

Also use the Multiple Security Deposit program, where you put in security deposit equal to 7 monthly payment (rounded up to $50), and that reduces your MF by 0.00049. (Google for BMW Multiple Security Deposit program if you don't know what that is).

Also, depending on where you leave there may be about $200-$400 training and ad fees charged by the dealer. That's normal. Plus title and registration and 1st month payment, you will be looking at around $1000 drive off (plus ~$3000 security deposit). Put zero down. You're payment for the car you initially asked about (MSRP $33,445), should be around $400 including tax if you can get the invoice price.

Remember to always negotiate the price, and not the monthly payment. Make sure it is clear that you want to lease and you're asking the buy rate money factor and BMW's acquisition fee with no mark up.

Sepi

1368That's some good information. Googled and seems like that program is not legal for dealers in NYC.

Any chance you (or anybody else for that matter) might be able to give me a quick help on trying to work numbers myself?

If I know the MF and residual, the tax %, MSRP and invoice price of the car I want to buy, what else do I need to put into my calculations and where do I find out about these?

To explain: Edmunds includes destination fee

what about acquisition fee, title, plates & registration in order to figure out what I have to pay upon signing.

13http://www.edmunds.com/car-leasing/calculate-your-own-lease-payment.html

I personally have never depended on online calculators. The math is simple enough to do it using a calculator and a piece of paper.

Here is a short version of what is described in details in the above link:

What you need to know in order to calculate your monthly payments:

1- MSRP (Say $31,695)

2- Residual Factor for your desired annual mileage. Multiply this with MSRP to get residual value. Based on what Jason said above for 10K miles on X1, April RF is 0.59. So for the above MSRP, the residual value is $18,700.

3- Money Factor. The buy rate money factor offered by BMWFS is the one Jason mentioned above. Dealers usually say 129 instead of 0.00129. They are allowed to mark up the MF by 40 base points and keep a cut. Since you live in NYC, you should have no problem getting the buy rate money factor.

4- Acquisition Fee: $725 is what is asked by BMWFS. Dealers are allowed to increase it to $925.

5- Negotiated Price: Start $500 below invoice, get you first best offer from one dealer, and try to get counter offers from other dealers over the phone. Keep your "ordering" option open so they don't pressure you on what they have in stock. Make sure they don't mark up MF or Acq fee to compensate for their discounts (ask them if they do over the phone). Note that you have to add about $500 on what Edmunds.com says as invoice price to account for training and MACO fees.

6- See what rebates you can get. Jason mentioned $500 incentive for 2013 cars (I guess they are trying to clear their inventories for 2014 models).

7- Decide how much down payment you want to pay. People usually pay $0 down, since if you total your car, you lose your money.

Ok, here to calculations:

Capitalized Cost = Negotiated Price + Acquisition fee

Example (assuming you negotiated 30695) = 30695+725 = 31420

Net Capitalized Cost = Cap Cost - Rebates - Down Payment

Example = 30695 - 500 - 0 = 30920

Depreciation = Net Cap Cost - Residual

Example = 30920 - 18700 = 12220

Monthly Depreciation = Depreciation/36

Example = 12220/36 = 339

Monthly rent = (Residual + Net Cap Cost) * Money Factor

Example = (30920 + 18700)*0.00129 = 49620*0.00129 = 64

Monthly Payments Before Tax = Monthly Depreciation + Monthly rent

Example = 339+64 = 403

Monthly tax = Tax rate * Monthly payments

Example = 403*0.08875 = 36

Monthly payments after tax = 403+36 = 439

To drive off, you have to pay first month payment + Title + Registration + some other small fees and taxes that should not exceed $100.

That's it. Simple

6813The ballpark is around $400 for X1 in CA. It should be pretty similar in NY.

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17