Gotta love living in college town where all these "wonderful" ideas like a living wage and no salt on the roads prevail:) While we've only had light snow so far this winter, I can say that my LS doesn't handle wet weather as well as my FWD Intrigue did. BUT, it sure is a heck of alot more fun to drive when the weather is dry.
bluemalibu0, nice color and equipment combo on your CTS. Not a bad price with 0 down and 15K annually either. I really like my LS, but when it is time to replace it in a few years, the CTS will be a top contender. Who knows, maybe even a V series:)
did anyone else see the cts-v raffle in the back of the new motor trend? tickets are $100 with only 2000 to be sold. i'm tempted even though i'm a poor college student.
You can't expect a RWD sport sedan with good HP and 17" wheels to perform well in snow/slush with all-season (read, summer)sport radials. I've found that with the Blizzaks on, the snow handling on my '03 lux sport is extremely good, comparable or better than most FWD vehicles I've owned, with none of the FWD tendency to plow straight ahead in corners. Not as good as AWD, granted, but you would definitely notice a difference with the snowboots on. Also, judicious use of the "Winter" setting on the auto trans does a good job of handling slippery hills. Of course, when the coeff of friction drops near zero, doesn't matter what you're driving. Bottom line, even if it's a lease, it's probably worth throwing on some cheap 16" steelies and a set of good snowtires if you're planning on staying in upstate NY or even Toledo.
Not just the racing -V either. Check the link for the full story. They'll have a full marketing presence at each race. Guess I have to get the Speed Channel hooked up.
The CTS-V for sure is a hot car. I was wondering if Cadillac plans anything between the normal CTS and the CTS-V. A V8 with around 300 hp for $40k would be nice. I am new to the CTS so am not sure if that has been discussed already. Does anyone know if GM plans anything like that?
I read something a while back about a "Tim Allen CTS" which has a turbo charged engine, and puts out 350 HP. I'm not sure how serious they are about taking something like that to market.
Cadillac did preview at SEMA last year just such a vehicle. The car was called the CTS Sport and it came with a turbo version of the 3.6L V6 at about 300 HP or so. It also had many of the suspension mods and trim pieces of the CTS-V. There wasn't any committment to build this thing, but it is a likely "in-between" car to further broaden the CTS line and it probably wouldn't be difficult to make.
Reality check: Just turned 27K after 16 months on my '03 CTS and doing fine. At that rate I'll go over the 54K miles I bought on my 36 month lease. Performing well in our Chicago-area cold and snowy winter.
I notice that the used fuel reported by the car's computer readout is usually about one gallon less than what the gas pump says, so it's repoted MPG is probably off, too, but I haven't bothered to check lately.
I don't know about a V8 non V CTS, but we'll likely see power upgrades from the 3.6 as time goes by. A supercharged version of that engine would be neat.
Went in last night to see what I might replace the Impala with, but nothing I could afford would 'fit'. Neither the Infinity G35 or Lexus ES 330 give me the room I need to be comfy. The Cadillac CTS might do, but might not. Obviously a SRX is too pricey for a big station wagon. Don't want a SUV. And the new Bonnie with the Northstar was tight with a sunroof. Nice paint job on the display one.
I did really like the Lexus 430, but $60k is too rich for my blood.
Looks like I'll be unloading the wife's '93 Blazer for a Honda Pilot for now, and keeping the Impala till the redesigned one shows up.
For 2004, Pontiac is ditching the cladded SSEi model along with it's supercharged 3800 and replacing it with the GXP. It will have the 275 hp Northstar V8 and a much cleaner appearance. From the pics I've seen, they did a good job with both the interior and the exterior. While Cadillac will likely get more powerful versions, I don't think the Northstar will be exclusive to the division anymore.
I think its a mistake not to keep the Northstar a Cadillac exclusive . Looks like the bean counters won and will cheapen the Cadillac marque Cimmiron II here we come
So far the Northstar will remain exclusive to the Cadillac line, with the Bonneville being the exception. GM will introduce a redesigned version of the Northstar in a couple of years that will surpass the current version in power and efficiency, so look for the updated version to be exclusive to Caddys.
...since a low-end (4.0L) version of the Northstar was rebadged as the "Aurora V-8" back in '94 for the 1995 Aurora (I own a '98... heck of an engine, heck of a nice car).
I know sharing parts keeps manufacturing costs down . I also think it takes away from the leading edge models . Unless they think we would buy a Cadillac because of the badge and not the content and its execution . We know some will buy for label only. Not me
IMO it doesn't hurt a manufacturer to share amongst its' divisions if they execute correctly. The CTS 3.2 is benefiting from a re-engineered Opel engine. The -V can claim the title "4 Door Vette". The XLR and 'Vettes share many parts. I can't think of a manufacturer that doesn't practice some sharing and, like it or not, we'll probably see more and more of it.
I think the practice hurts when the sharing is done to expedite bringing product to market or strictly for cost reasons. They usually wind up doing a poor job of integration in those circumstances.
They had one of those Bonnies at the San Francisco Auto Show. It was up on a pedestal and no one could get close to it. Hood was down (heck the engine bay might have empty). The doors were open and from what I could see the interior did look sharp. Not as busy as previous years.
I'm Caddy all the way, but I don't think it is bad for them to share the Northstar. Remember, the top shelf Bonnie is getting the 275 hp version which is used in the SLS(now out of production) and the base Deville. With VVT, Northstars in new Caddies are pumping out 315 hp and will probably do more. I've said for years the hign end Bonnie(and also the Park Avenue Ultra) need a smooth running DOHC V8 in place of the supercharged 3800. I don't consider it Cimmaron like at all. Think of it this way, you can get a Toyota Tundra with the i-Force DOHC V8 for 20 something. Thats the same basic engine(tuned a for more low end torque) that a $60K LS430 sedan has under it's hood.
I have been considering a CTS for a while, but drove a SRX today. sweet car. I like it much more than the CTS due to more headroom and more rear seat legroom. Thinking about doing the sign and drive deal.
Your on a roll with new rides. First the Lexus and now possibly an SRX. I've only seen 2 SRXs on the road so far and I really like them. I love the LED taillights. This is one thing that I've said the CTS should have.
I have to say I really miss a OHC engine. I was spoiled with the Intrigue's motor. The 3.6L VVT V6 is noticeably stronger off the line than the Intrigue. The lower 1st gear in the 5 speed auto helps and so does the 3.73 gearing vs the 3.29 in the Intrigue. The SRX felt almost identical to the CTS I drove last Summer. I was expecting it to feel sluggish but it defintely wasn't. There is a constant flow of power with less peakiness than the shortstar. It doesn't have the big hit at 3500 rpms though. It does have the wonderful cammy sound that the shortstar had but even more so. I was really impressed with it. We are trying to figure how to extricate myself from the Impala. Will keep you guys updated.
Also CTSs are available for lease at $399 with 0 down, period!
Is the $399 a month 36 or 48 months? Last fall when I bought the LS I was considering a CTS lease, but the best they were doing was $399 a month for 48 months with $999 down and only 10K a year. I will need more like 15K a year on mileage. I also prefer to not lease longer than 36 months. The SRX is a nice looking SUV. I'm frankly surprised that I haven't seen more on the roads as all of the reviews I've read have been very favorable(more so than the early CTS reviews were) and the look doesn't seem as "in your face" as the CTS. On the other hand, CTSs have become quite common on the roads.
You are driving a Lincoln so you can get an additional $1500 discount.(conquest cash)
I looked at the cap cost and I think a better deal can be negotiated than what GM is using in the $399 CTS example. They are effectively taking off about 2,XXX off the MSRP, which I think can be negotiated down further.
I am not too worried about leasing for 48 months because GM has offered early lease termination deals consistently since 2001.
The SRX that i am looking at is $469 a month but I think I can knock another $2500 off of that then add it back in to have them take the Impala off of my hands.
I've read about and been told by a dealer about the early lease buyout by GMAC. I'm about half way through a 36 month lease on a 2003 CTS Sport (27K and loving every minute), but I'm curious about what an early buyout involves. Anyone have person experience with it, or knowledge about the deal?
Are you talking about buying out the lease early or using the GMAC early lease termination deal? I did the early lease termination in June 2001. If you buy another GM car through GMAC then it is a piece of cake.
I was going to buy out my GMAC lease and give them $2200 to take my Intrigue off of my hands, but they told me this termination deal was coming and that I should wait.
I Had about 9 months left at the time and you pay them a percentage to get out of it.
I was way over my mileage and it would have been cheaper for me to pay them $2200 then than about $4000 later. Plus I would have had to buy new tires, etc.
I took the early lease termination. They give me $500 and I bought a Impala through GMAC. To say I was very happy to get out from under the Intrigue lease was an understatement
I went to replace the cabin air filter on my 2003 CTS (luxury package) and could not find it. I followed the instruction in my owners manual. I am not sure there is a cabin air filter on the 03 CTS. Has anybody on this board replaced their cabin air filter and if so, where is it located?
The filter is under the grill on the passenger side behind the battery and just in front of the windshield. If you need more information e-mail me at msumner@worldnet.att.net. I replaced mine a couple of months ago and have the factory manuals.
I drove a base V6 2WD. Was REALLY surprised how well it moved.
I did notice that it had the slower steering of the '04 CTSs not the heavier/quicker steering of the '03s. I much preferred the SRX to the CTS because I felt like I was gaining headroom and a lot more rear seat room. However it is still a fairly narrow vehicle and think 3 adults in back would be sitting pretty close to each other.
I went by my dealer's other location today and they have a black base SRX V6. So that may be mine soon.
My seat of the pants feeling is that if the CTS does 0-60 in 6.7-6.8 secs then the SRX does it in 7.5secs or less, probably less.
It felt much stronger across the rev band and especially off idle than my Intrigue whose 0-60 time was 7.7-7.8 secs.
I also felt like I could accelerate and it would hold a gear without downshifting. If i wanted to pass somebody I could give it a little more and it would immediately drop a gear. It also has the manual shift deal with +- gate that the CTS doesn't.
Can't see how anybody would need the V8 unless they got AWD. (extra weight)
For me, the SRX is the answer to my problem with CTS's lack of interior room.
Big improvement. There was a grey one and a cashmere one with the body color bezel parked next to a cashmere with the grey bezel and there was no comparison. The body color one was much cleaner looking and did not attract attention to itself. I like it.
A like the CTS alot and it will certainly be a contender in a few years, but for now I'm pretty happy with my LS. Keep us posted on what you decide to do in regard to an SRX lease/purchase.
I went to play the OnStar Hotbutton game today at my Cadillac dealer. I'm looking to buy a CTS in about a year. My wife just got a new Jeep in September so I have to be patient.
Anyway, I walked into the showroom and there was only one CTS in view. A lot of STS, an SRX, an XLR, and a bunch of Devilles. The CTS looked like a V, which surprised me, although I saw a V on the road in downtown DC last week.
It turned out to be a Lux Package, but had aftermarket appearance additions. The mesh grill was $895. The rest did nothing for me, so I don't remember the prices. It had a rear spoiler, larger chromed wheels, and chrome tips on the exhaust. The grill looked great, but it the rest was too bling-bling for me.
I didn't win the game. Decided not to test drive, since that would make my yearning too hard to resist. I'll come back after the 2005s come if there are any deals.
I looked at a few on the lot, but they all had solid interior colors, not body color bezel. I've never seen it in a picture or in person.
Though I respect every Magazines editorial Freedom I took issue with C&D March 2004 Issue refusal to include CTS in their latest review of top $30 K near luxo sedans. It was saying essentially Caddy is not yet on the map while all evidence indicates otherwise
Why do New York and Rhode Island have a separate deal, that is $30 less per month? And then Texas has a separate offer too? I see terminology like "residual value" for the other 47 states, but terms like "48th payment" under NY/RI?
It's the same principle and payment terms as a lease but you own the vehicle. It seems NYC decided to sue the mfrs for unpaid tickets on certain leased vehicles because technically the mfr (Ford, GM, etc.) was the registered owner of the vehicle. To prevent this they started offering a lower monthly payment with a large balloon payment at the end of the term (the same amount as the residual value). I guess technically they 'buy it back' from you at the end of the term for the amount of the last payment. End result is basically the same but your name is on the title. Thank the lawyers for this one.
C&D is biased against domestics, and GM especially. I went ahead and cancelled my subscription after they wrote a fairly glowing review of the new GTO in print, only to absolutely destroy it on C&D TV. I am now subscribing to MotorTrend.
At 35k, a 5M CTS would have been solid competition in this group. Acceleration a bit better than mid pack (despite the bigger size), more utility, better drivetrain and handling than most, better economy than most. Maybe a 3rd place finish if all you look at is performance? Once you consider usability & versatility, the only car to compare is the TL, and unfortunately with FWD the CTS would handily destroy it on the track.
(They've also dissed Ford in the past. In 1999, they had a $25k sport sedan shootout. My SVT Contour came in third, after the A4 and 3-series. Despite beating and sometimes killing those two cars in EVERY performance category. Their complaints? Small back seat (which was no smaller than the 3 series when you looked at their chart) and too much "growl" as they put it. "Not a shuttle to ballet class". Puh-leaze... these guys make a point of drooling over sultry sounding engines, but when Detroit puts one out, they are defamed for it, despite this being the SPORT sedan competition. And of course, the A and 3 were thousands more than the $23,4xx SVT.)
GMAC (and I believe Chase Manhattan--there may be others) discontinued leasing in these states due to vicarious liability laws. Similiar to what akirby was saying about parking tickets, the bigger problem was with auto accidents.
The lessee of the vehicle would be in an auto accident and if they a) carried no insurance or b) not enough insurance, the injured party could sue not only the driver but also the lessor as they were technically "owners" of the vehicles. Once the injured party found this out, well you can figure it out--it's live for free time at the expense of the deep pockets. These types of laws may exist in other states, but NY and RI have the most punitive versions. The laws themselves are pretty outmoded and have been modified or repealed in almost every other state--if it wasn't repealed, it was changed to prevent this kind of thing from becoming a problem.
I also know that most lease companies that have not yet stopped leasing in those states have added fees to their leases to provide a form of insurance against the inevitable lawsuit.
I think the CTS was omitted primarily because of the 3.2L V6 engine the manual version of the 2003-04 CTS is paired with. It's an engine that's been tested before, and offers nothing new to the comparison equation. Rather than have it finish midpack, C&D or Cadillac probably elected to wait until later this year when the 3.6L V6 gets a manual transmission.
I inquired about trading my CTS in for a CTS V . Of course, the V was priced at sticker. In one years time I was offered 10K (30%)less than what I actually paid for my CTS which also calculates to 19K (55%) off the MSRP. One years time ! This is steep depreciation even for a Cadillac .
Feb 2002. CTS takes fourth place out of 7 cars. Quote: "Make no mistake, this is the best Cadillac ever. Get past the styling that, to some, has been carved from a bar of soap, and underneath lies a first-rate effort to bring Cadillac into the 21st century. The target is BMW. It is still wide of that mark. A bull's-eye, perhaps, on a 10-year-old 7-series sedan, but not against a current 3- or 5-series from Munich."
Does anyone agree with that? That the 3.2 CTS is only an equal to a 10 year old BMW?
Remember that you also have a manual transmission car. I was offered $13885 off MSRP on my car as a trade. I thought that maybe you had a better dealer who appreciated a manual trans as a trade. I still have not even had my license plate bezel moisture problem solved. The latest from the service advisor is "Cadillac says that some moisture inside the clear portion is acceptable".... I asked about the newer ones that are starting to show up on CTSs here now and the advisor said that Cadillac wouldn't even consider it as a replacement. I haven't really had the time to pursue the matter but will shortly as the weather gets warmer.
Comments
bluemalibu0, nice color and equipment combo on your CTS. Not a bad price with 0 down and 15K annually either. I really like my LS, but when it is time to replace it in a few years, the CTS will be a top contender. Who knows, maybe even a V series:)
http://www.world-challenge.com/news/04press17.html
I notice that the used fuel reported by the car's computer readout is usually about one gallon less than what the gas pump says, so it's repoted MPG is probably off, too, but I haven't bothered to check lately.
I did really like the Lexus 430, but $60k is too rich for my blood.
Looks like I'll be unloading the wife's '93 Blazer for a Honda Pilot for now, and keeping the Impala till the redesigned one shows up.
--Robert
I think the practice hurts when the sharing is done to expedite bringing product to market or strictly for cost reasons. They usually wind up doing a poor job of integration in those circumstances.
They had one of those Bonnies at the San Francisco Auto Show. It was up on a pedestal and no one could get close to it. Hood was down (heck the engine bay might have empty). The doors were open and from what I could see the interior did look sharp. Not as busy as previous years.
Thinking about doing the sign and drive deal.
I was spoiled with the Intrigue's motor.
The 3.6L VVT V6 is noticeably stronger off the line than the Intrigue.
The lower 1st gear in the 5 speed auto helps and so does the 3.73 gearing vs the 3.29 in the Intrigue.
The SRX felt almost identical to the CTS I drove last Summer.
I was expecting it to feel sluggish but it defintely wasn't.
There is a constant flow of power with less peakiness than the shortstar. It doesn't have the big hit at 3500 rpms though.
It does have the wonderful cammy sound that the shortstar had but even more so.
I was really impressed with it.
We are trying to figure how to extricate myself from the Impala.
Will keep you guys updated.
Also CTSs are available for lease at $399 with 0 down, period!
http://www.gm.com/automotive/vehicle_shopping/currentoffers/signd- rive.html
You are driving a Lincoln so you can get an additional $1500 discount.(conquest cash)
I looked at the cap cost and I think a better deal can be negotiated than what GM is using in the $399 CTS example. They are effectively taking off about 2,XXX off the MSRP, which I think can be negotiated down further.
I am not too worried about leasing for 48 months because GM has offered early lease termination deals consistently since 2001.
The SRX that i am looking at is $469 a month but I think I can knock another $2500 off of that then add it back in to have them take the Impala off of my hands.
I did the early lease termination in June 2001.
If you buy another GM car through GMAC then it is a piece of cake.
I was going to buy out my GMAC lease and give them $2200 to take my Intrigue off of my hands,
but they told me this termination deal was coming and that I should wait.
I Had about 9 months left at the time and you pay them a percentage to get out of it.
I was way over my mileage and it would have been cheaper for me to pay them $2200 then than about $4000 later. Plus I would have had to buy new tires, etc.
I took the early lease termination. They give me $500 and I bought a Impala through GMAC.
To say I was very happy to get out from under the Intrigue lease was an understatement
Was REALLY surprised how well it moved.
I did notice that it had the slower steering of the '04 CTSs not the heavier/quicker steering of the '03s.
I much preferred the SRX to the CTS because I felt like I was gaining headroom and a lot more rear seat room.
However it is still a fairly narrow vehicle and think 3 adults in back would be sitting pretty close to each other.
I went by my dealer's other location today and they have a black base SRX V6.
So that may be mine soon.
My seat of the pants feeling is that if the
CTS does 0-60 in 6.7-6.8 secs then the SRX does it in 7.5secs or less, probably less.
It felt much stronger across the rev band and especially off idle than my Intrigue whose 0-60 time was 7.7-7.8 secs.
I also felt like I could accelerate and it would hold a gear without downshifting. If i wanted to pass somebody I could give it a little more and it would immediately drop a gear.
It also has the manual shift deal with +- gate that the CTS doesn't.
Can't see how anybody would need the V8 unless they got AWD. (extra weight)
For me, the SRX is the answer to my problem with CTS's lack of interior room.
The body color one was much cleaner looking and did not attract attention to itself.
I like it.
Anyway, I walked into the showroom and there was only one CTS in view. A lot of STS, an SRX, an XLR, and a bunch of Devilles. The CTS looked like a V, which surprised me, although I saw a V on the road in downtown DC last week.
It turned out to be a Lux Package, but had aftermarket appearance additions. The mesh grill was $895. The rest did nothing for me, so I don't remember the prices. It had a rear spoiler, larger chromed wheels, and chrome tips on the exhaust. The grill looked great, but it the rest was too bling-bling for me.
I didn't win the game. Decided not to test drive, since that would make my yearning too hard to resist. I'll come back after the 2005s come if there are any deals.
I looked at a few on the lot, but they all had solid interior colors, not body color bezel. I've never seen it in a picture or in person.
It was saying essentially Caddy is not yet on the map while all evidence indicates otherwise
Brian
And later regards exclusion of the prior year X-type Jag as being, "... in the company of bigger guns such as BMW's 330i and the Cadillac CTS."
... all implies they can't get a manual CTS for around $35K.
The vehicles they tested ran from $28,485 to $38,130. Can you get a CTS stick in that range?
At 35k, a 5M CTS would have been solid competition in this group. Acceleration a bit better than mid pack (despite the bigger size), more utility, better drivetrain and handling than most, better economy than most. Maybe a 3rd place finish if all you look at is performance? Once you consider usability & versatility, the only car to compare is the TL, and unfortunately with FWD the CTS would handily destroy it on the track.
(They've also dissed Ford in the past. In 1999, they had a $25k sport sedan shootout. My SVT Contour came in third, after the A4 and 3-series. Despite beating and sometimes killing those two cars in EVERY performance category. Their complaints? Small back seat (which was no smaller than the 3 series when you looked at their chart) and too much "growl" as they put it. "Not a shuttle to ballet class". Puh-leaze... these guys make a point of drooling over sultry sounding engines, but when Detroit puts one out, they are defamed for it, despite this being the SPORT sedan competition. And of course, the A and 3 were thousands more than the $23,4xx SVT.)
The lessee of the vehicle would be in an auto accident and if they a) carried no insurance or b) not enough insurance, the injured party could sue not only the driver but also the lessor as they were technically "owners" of the vehicles. Once the injured party found this out, well you can figure it out--it's live for free time at the expense of the deep pockets. These types of laws may exist in other states, but NY and RI have the most punitive versions. The laws themselves are pretty outmoded and have been modified or repealed in almost every other state--if it wasn't repealed, it was changed to prevent this kind of thing from becoming a problem.
I also know that most lease companies that have not yet stopped leasing in those states have added fees to their leases to provide a form of insurance against the inevitable lawsuit.
M
They are pretty popular.
I called a Cadillac dealer about 70 miles away and he told me I was upside down $4300 on my lexus and $5500 on my Impala.
My local Cadillac dealer says I am $2500 upside down on the Impala. A $3,000 difference!!!!
Guess who is going to get my business
Does anyone agree with that? That the 3.2 CTS is only an equal to a 10 year old BMW?
I still have not even had my license plate bezel moisture problem solved. The latest from the service advisor is "Cadillac says that some moisture inside the clear portion is acceptable".... I asked about the newer ones that are starting to show up on CTSs here now and the advisor said that Cadillac wouldn't even consider it as a replacement. I haven't really had the time to pursue the matter but will shortly as the weather gets warmer.
I guess they offer 19K and put it on the lot at 26K.