Honda Civic: Future Models

civic_cx_92civic_cx_92 Member Posts: 87
Anyone know if we get the 3 door or 5 door Civic hatchbacks in USA?

Honda of USA does not have email.



  • oops13oops13 Member Posts: 16
    I belive it is in 2002 the 3 dr hatchback will be back, but only in the SI model. The new CAR & DRIVER has an article on it.
  • civic_cx_92civic_cx_92 Member Posts: 87
    Thanks oops13!

    Based on the three-door Civic Type R body style shown at the 2001 Geneva Motor Show, the Civic Si Hatchback will arrive in U.S. showrooms early next year. It will be the only three-door Civic sold in this country.

    A new 160-horsepower, 2.0-liter DOHC four-cylinder engine, called the i-VTEC, produces 130 pounds-feet of torque.

    A close-ratio five-speed-manual transmission has the shifter mounted high, rally style, on the center of the dash. Elliott said the Si will have a 0-to-60-mph time in the mid-7-second range and will be more driver friendly at the same time.

    Three-door Civic models all will be built at the Honda of UK plant in Swindon, England

    I'm buying it! damn, it looks like my '92.

  • pocahontaspocahontas Member Posts: 802
    Hi Everyone- Want to discuss the new 2002 Honda Civic Si? Please join us in our new Hatchbacks Message Board discussion: Honda Civic Si (2002).

    image Thanks for your participation. ;-)



    Hatchbacks/Station Wagons Message Board

  • civic_cx_92civic_cx_92 Member Posts: 87
    Scheduled to go on-sale November 15.

    new 2.4-liter, 16-valve, dual overhead cam 4-cylinder i-VTEC engine to produce 160-horsepower and 162 lb.-ft. of torque.

    estimated 22/26 mph city/hwy.
  • ingo2ingo2 Member Posts: 1
    Anyone know when the Honda Civic Hybrid (50 mpg...) will hit dealerships?
  • britton2britton2 Member Posts: 305
    I believe it will be at the dealerships in April or May
  • jokerluvjokerluv Member Posts: 4
  • wheelz4wheelz4 Member Posts: 569
    Apparently Honda is mulling over creating a youth brand a la Scion. What they really need is new product. They need an entry level model to slot in below the Civic and compete with Scion (US) and the Echo hatchback (Canada) as well as the various Hyundais/Kias etc. The Jazz/Fit (please call it the Jazz here) would do incredibly well. Don't even think about bringing over the sedan(City?) version......the 5 door hatch is all we need. Next up, augment the Civic line with the 5 door hatch in Si(SiR) trim with some decent wheels/rubber (16" min) and price it to compete with the P5, Matrix, Vibe etc. Replace the slow selling 3 door Si(SiR) with the Civic Type R (200 hp, 17" wheels 'n tires).....the one you should have brought us in the first place. Next up, a sport crossover van/wagon to slot in between the Civic 5 door hatch and the Odyssey mini(maxi)van.
    A redesigned Stream (whatever happened to the Latitude) which reportedly is being based on the Jazz platform) would do nicely for those of us who need occasional multi-passenger capability (6- passengers......4 adults, 2 kids) and a flexible interior for whom the 4 seater Element is too limiting but for whom the porky Odyssey is too excessive. I don't think much is wrong with the upper end of Honda's lineup, although the CR-V would be better served with larger wheels and tires and a tailgate arrangement similar to the Element.
  • sanfrandansanfrandan Member Posts: 20
    Do you suppose there are any lurkers from Honda who read these messages for cheap market research?

    Here and elsewhere, I've seen ideas I generally agree with from consumers on the Edmunds site. I don't think we're some island of peculiar observations and outlying tastes.

    Why _doesn't_ Honda sell the Latitude in the U.S.? Why don't they market a 5 door Civic hatch? What nutball focus group told them a 4-seater Element was a good idea? Why, oh why do they market a 2 door HX, but not a 4 door?

    By the way, Wheelz4 - I'm not a big-wheel fetishist, but otherwise, you're right on.
  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    Probably the same group that told Nissan to market a 4-seater version of the Maxima. And to add insult to injury, they also told Nissan to stick in a full-length rear console to prevent rear passengers from going from one side to the other. Can't you just see the stupidity of that idea? People buy a 4-door sedan for practicality and utility. So Nissan goes and makes a version that forces one passenger to enter/exit into traffic!
  • bigkahunaflbigkahunafl Member Posts: 128
    Honda did a great job with the Element! I have a Civic, but am going to add the Element to the garage. If the Element had been available when I bought my Civic, I would not even be here reading these posts. Don't get me wrong, I like my Civic. But the 4 seat Element is exactly what I need. Apparently it's meeting a lot of others needs too since they are going to easily beat the first year sales projections. Honda did misjudge who would be buying it, but I'm glad they designed it for the youth. The stereo is great! 270 watts with a sub-woofer. Why can't Honda offer better stereos in the Civic? That is one of my disappointments with my Civic. Might seem minor to some, but when you spend nearly 1 1/2 hours in a car a day, tunes are important.
  • sanfrandansanfrandan Member Posts: 20
    BigKahunafl -

    The Element IS a cool ride, I don't dispute it. Would adding a middle seat in the 2nd row ruin your appreciation for the vehicle? I have two kids, but with friends, or mother-in-laws, or what have you, I have a fifth person in the car every single week. An Element is 4" wider than the Civic, so it seems the middle passenger could theoretically be more comfortable than the poor sap in a Civic. Instead, the fifth person is in the cargo hold, the roof rack, or someone's lap.

    I couldn't agree with you more about stereos. What demographic group doesn't want a decent stereo? C'mon - even a fifty year old grew up in the rockin' 60's. (Flame bait warning:) If anything, an oldster would NEED a louder stereo, what with the hearing loss and all.

    I will rate the presence of an MP3 playing stereo and decent sound quality highly in my next car purchase. My d[arn] Civic can't even play burned .wav CDs without fluttering and sounding like junk.

    Regarding the Maxima - if you are willing to go without the possibility of a 5th person, I think that central console isn't too bad. If you had teenagers, maybe. In any case, the rear console is an option, so if you want a 5 passenger Maxima, or a slide-your-butt-to-the-passenger-door Maxima, you can have one.

    To raise again a nagging question - why the blazes doesn't Honda sell a 4-door HX? Families don't want better gas mileage?

    Now I'm all bent out of shape. Have a good weekend, and whack an auto exec upside the head for me if you see one.

  • synpthesissynpthesis Member Posts: 28
    needs to look beyond the Buick crowd/generation currently snapping up the Accords in dealerships across NA. A very competent car is ok but what's to come after? There's a compelling demand out there for the Mazda3/Lancer/Sentra size with adequate engine response. Why must we always have to pay for space which we only use occasionally?
  • gregoryc1gregoryc1 Member Posts: 764
    Honda should offer a station wagon in their Civic line of vehicles.
  • snarkssnarks Member Posts: 207
    Doesn't a CRV with FWD fit the role of a station wagon vehicle in Honda's Civic line? It also has a dual role of small SUV with AWD.
  • pkommapkomma Member Posts: 3
    Bring back the CRX! Great little cars.
  • dudkadudka Member Posts: 451
    The new Si drives just like, if not better than the 89 CRX I remember. Very peppy, roomy, and comfortable. It is larger than CRX was, but it is still small enough to fit into many parking spots.

    When the Insight first came out, my first impression was that this what CRX would looked like had Honda continued making it. I still think that Hatchback is a better design (volume wise) that fast back that CRX was.
  • gregoryc1gregoryc1 Member Posts: 764
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    I tend to agree that CR-V is a civic station wagon. It shares so many components with the Civic. Although, HR-V is probably closer to being a Civic Wagon, it is not sold here just like real Civic wagon. Did anyone catch a glimpse of Euro accord wagon at geneva auto show? Do you think we will ever get TSX wagon?
  • crv16crv16 Member Posts: 205
    It is too "high" to be a station wagon. A lower to the ground station wagon will handle better, be more aerodynamic and therefore get much better fuel economy.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    A lowered CR-V will not get significantly better gas mileage. So, is Civic Wagon with jacked suspension an SUV? Follow the logic you present that CR-V is not Civic station wagon because it is high off the ground. That would mean that Civic Wagon (4WD or FWD) with a lift kit i snot a wagon anymore.

    The CR-V shares about 80% of components with the Civic. So, if anyone is looking for a Civic Wagon, get FWD CR-V and lower it.
  • crv16crv16 Member Posts: 205
    A SUV differs from a station wagon in two ways: Body height and ground clearance. The body of a CR-V is taller than a potential Civic wagon. This is the space from the floor of the CR-V to the ceiling.

    This taller body is also higher off the ground than a potential Civic wagon.

    Both of these items result in decreased aerodynamic efficiency, therefore decreased fuel economy. The fwd CR-V gets 26 mpg highway, compared to 38 for the Civic. A squared-off Civic would get similar mileage as a sedan. Compare MPG figures for the Jetta Sedan/Wagon - The Jetta wagon actually gets better fuel economy than the sedan - 32 vs. 31.

    I want a Honda wagon that gets mileage in the high 30's.

    You can't "lower" a CR-V and have it keep its comfortable ride and handling.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    Before the was a CR-V, there was a 4 WD Civic Wagon, that had a high ceiling to roof distance and was slightly higher off the ground. In fact, CR-V's AWD system was lifted from "Civic Wagon 4WD" and placed in a modified body to make a CR-V. Civic Wagon 4WD was CR-V's grandfather.

    The reason CR-V gets worse MPG's than Civic is not only because it is high off the ground, but mainly because it is heavier and has a much larger engine. The 7th generation civic has 1.7 liter, while USDM 2nd generation CR-V has 2.4, and the rest of the world enjoys a CR-V with a 2.0 similar to Civic Si, which gets about 30 mpg in the Civic Si.
  • crv16crv16 Member Posts: 205
    - 1.8 and 2.0L i-Vtec motors (130hp & 150hp)
    - 5 speed automatic transmission
    - 6 speed manual transmission (with 6th gear being a really tall overdrive gear, so you're turning about 3,000 rpm at 80mph, instead of the current 3,800 rpm at 80mph)
    - One more inch of headroom and rear seat legroom.
    - Increased sound deadening
    - Sedan, Coupe and Matrix-like 4 dr hatch/wagon, with an awd option.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    Are you willing to pay for all those? It will sureley bring the sticker price of a Civic EX 4 dr to about $20K if not more.
  • markg4markg4 Member Posts: 44
    the only things i've heard are it will be a coupe and have 180hp. as far as pricing, it will have to compete with the mazda 3 and the new toyota corolla xrs and scion so it has to come in under $20k. i know my next vehicle will be a toss up between these 3-4 options.
  • crv16crv16 Member Posts: 205
    - The cost moving from a 1.7 to a 1.8/2.0 motor would be negligible. Same parts, just a little bigger.

    - 5 speed auto trans / 6 speed manual would add some cost - maybe a couple hundred dollars. But I like to think that Honda buyers are smarter than most, and could see that there would be a payoff with increased fuel economy. Honda Thailand offers a Civic with this exact combination (2.0L/5spd AT). I believe they are using the Accord auto trans, so it might be no more expensive to have a shared transmission between Accord & Civic than to make two different ones. Cost comes down when quantity goes up.

    - Increased headroom - again negligible cost increase.

    - Sound deadening - this might actually cost something - like a under hood mat, firewall mat, wheel well insulating, thicker glass. This could add a few hundred dollars.

    Honda is already selling more Civics than any than any other small car, with minimum incentives. People have shown a willingness to pay extra for quality and refinement. I think Honda would do well to build upon the levels of refinement that already exist, to keep it at the top of the small car heap.

    I believe that Honda could add the above mentioned features for no more than a $500 increase over the current model.
  • dragontegzdragontegz Member Posts: 1
    Why is it that America only gets the sedan and the coupe versions of the Civic? (with the exception of the Si)

    In other parts of the world, Honda does have the 3-door and the 5-door hatch versions of the Civic. Especially with the recent revival of hatch/wagon demand in the US, why haven't the execs of Honda USA introduced the already existing versions of Civic in the US to compete with the likes of Mazda3, VW Golf, and Toyota Matrix/Pontiac Vibe twins?
  • lexi4lifelexi4life Member Posts: 181
    Umm, sorry but I already created a discussion on that called «2006 Acura EL/Honda Civic»
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    Probably because the Si hatchback is not selling as fast as they would have liked.
    Although there is a resurgance of hatchbacks, it is a drop in the bucket compared to SUV and sedan sales. It will cost Honda more money to certify all those variations that they possibly stand a chance to sell.
  • alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    Through June calendar year to date, Honda actually wasnt selling more Civics than any other small car, as the Corolla had a 5000 unit lead. Corolla sales include Matrix, and Civic sales include sedan, coupe, and hybrid. Toyota is not using significant incentives on the Corolla. In fact, Id bet Honda is subsidizing the Civic more heavily through its factory to dealer (not customer) incentives. Its also interesting that despite the increased safety focus of the Accord, the Civic marches into 2005 with ABS still unavailable on anything but the EX, and side curtains STILL not available on any model.

  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    Civic marches into 2005 with ABS still unavailable on anything but the EX

    4 disk ABS is standard on the Si with EBD-Electronic Brakeforce Distribution.

    If ABS is so important to someone, they will choose the EX/Si and if cost is important they will choose LX/DX/VP. It is that simple, and since most people can't put price on safety, they won't balk at $800 more for the EX which will include content worth almost $2000 if it were sold as individual options.

    I wish we had a switch, similar to air bag switch, to de-activate ABS, as at times it becomes a little too intrusive.
  • carguy58carguy58 Member Posts: 2,303
    I think next year when a brand new Civic come out they will put ABS as a standard option all across the Civic model line. Just do it for the 05 model year and then having the Civic change bodystyles I guess Honda thought its wasn't worthed to put ABS on 05 Civic's.
  • glockaxisglockaxis Member Posts: 4
    since the new civic is rumored to get a few upgrades including more hp, do you think we'll see some awesome deals on 05 civics?
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    since the new civic is rumored to get a few upgrades including more hp, do you think we'll see some awesome deals on 05 civics?

    Yes you will, if you have patience and willing to wait until the new civic is on the market. When the new Accord came out, brand new older Accord LX was selling for around $12K with some negotiations.
    Don't expect rebates though. Honda knows that rebates hurt resale, but a dealer incentive is usually offered at the end of the model year.
  • alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    With EX Civic coupes at 18K currently, theres no way an Si coupe would go for 16-17K. And why would Honda totally destroy the RSX's sales by offering the same engine in the Civic at a lower price?


  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    I'm really pleased with the Civic overall, but I'm curious as to why Honda doesn't offer the 2 door coupe in a performance model? I don't care for the looks of the Si model, and there's really no reason Honda couldn't make a high performance version of the 2 door coupe. Could you imagine how much fun this car would be to drive with the RSX's 200 hp 2 liter engine? They can't honestly think this car wouldn't sell, unless they priced it too high. I could see this car selling like hot cakes at around the $16K-$17K price range. 127 hp just isn't enough for performance minded drivers.


    The 200 Hp higher perfomance Civic coupe is available, under the RSX Type S badge. RSX is the Civic with Acura badges. So, if you were not out there buying the $25K RSX, why would Honda executives think you will buy the $22K Civic?


    The Si has always been a hatchback, except for a freak accident in 1999 and 2000 when they stuffed an EX chassis with a 160 hp engine. This was not a real Si, it was just an EX with higher output engine.


    Incidentally, the current Si sells for $16K-$17K. Looks can be deceiving, what really counts is the inside. The EP3 platform is much stiffer and more efficient than EM (I think current coupe is EM) platform. Sticking a 200 Hp engine in an under performing platform may result in a faster 1/4 mile car, but will also drive the true handling enthusiasts away with its flexible body and under performing suspension. Also, you may end up dropping the subframe after 10,000 miles because the chassis may not be capable of handling 200 Hp. You can always brace the chassis, but that will increase the weight, which will negate any perfomance gains from the 200 Hp mill.


    Currently, the stock Si is a much better handler and performer than stock Ex. Si's handling is on par with Cooper S, which is by far the best handling front wheel drive car out there. But at $25K for a similarly equipped Cooper S, Si is a much wiser financial decision.


    Rumors are, that the 2006 Civic will have 180 Hp and will be a coupe. I just hope they don't call it Si, and never offer automatic transmission in it.
  • alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    like a sporty Prius. I vote "hell no".


  • bottgersbottgers Member Posts: 2,030
    If people are actually paying $18K for Civics, then the buying public is a lot dumber than I gave them credit for. They can be had for 15-ish with just a little shopping around and bargining. The RSX may be a rebadged Civic, but it doesn't look like a Civic. I like the looks of the Civic coupe's smooth lines. The RSX doesn't have them.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    The RSX may be a rebadged Civic, but it doesn't look like a Civic.


    Like I said earlier, looks are only skin deep. If it walks like a duck, if it talks like a duck, chances are it is a duck. RSX is a Civic. If you can't see that past the 3% difference, then I can't help you.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    I hope that it gets a Double Wishbone suspension back.
  • glycinemaxglycinemax Member Posts: 74
    Sounds like we may finally get the 5dr civic state-side. But alas, no diesel yet. Is it too much of a leap to expect produced to lead to sold?


    "the next generation global Civic lineup will include 2-, 3-, 4- and 5-door models. It will be produced in ALL six of Honda's regional operations." -Takeo Fukui


    ...and some more remarks made today by Mr. Fukui...


    "Based on Honda's industry leading "Safety for Everyone" initiative, the next generation 2006 Civic will set new standards for safety performance in the compact class. The new Civic, being introduced this fall, will feature anti-lock brakes, side curtain airbags, driver and passenger side airbags with Occupant Position Detection System (OPDS) technology and pedestrian safety features as standard equipment on all U.S. Civic models. In addition, the new Civic will utilize Honda's Advanced Compatibility Engineering (ACE) body structure for improved occupant protection and compatibility with larger vehicles in a collision, the first application of this technology in a compact-class vehicle."


    "Further, the 2006 Civic will be powered by the newest and most advanced generation of Honda's i-VTEC engine technology to achieve even higher fuel economy and lower emissions. And a new Civic Hybrid will feature enhancements to Honda's IMA hybrid technology to achieve significantly higher fuel economy and performance. The natural gas Civic GX, powered by the cleanest internal combustion engine in the world, will continue to be made in Ohio."
  • raychuang00raychuang00 Member Posts: 541
    ....It appears that Honda will likely offer much improved VTEC engines for the Civic model this coming fall.


    I can guess for the US market we will have a two-door coupe and three-door hatchback in regular and high performance versions, a four-door sedan and a five-door hatchback in lower power LX and higher power EX forms.


    I think The LX model will get an improved SOHC VTEC motor of higher displacement (1.8 liters?) and possibly direct fuel injection, with the power output up to 125-130 bhp (SAE). The EX model will get a DOHC i-VTEC motor of 1.8-liter displacement with DI, probably with power output of around 145-150 bhp (SAE). The sporting models will get a new sport-tuned DOHC i-VTEC motor of 2.0-liter displacement with DI and possibly stratified combustion, with power output in the 200 bhp (SAE) range.


    However, the new Civic Type-R 2.4-liter DOHC i-VTEC engine won't make it to the US market; that engine will instead be installed on the Acura RSX, with the new uprate RSX using a new close-ratio manual transmission.
  • glycinemaxglycinemax Member Posts: 74
    After re-reading the press release it seems that the Civic will be built at all six global locations and the global Civic line-up will include 2,3,4, and 5 dr models but not necessarily all models at all locations. Bummer! This does not rule out a 5dr for U.S. but it does not convey that one is slated for Fall arrival either. Maybe the fifth gen. 06 Golf GL TDI 4dr will be a much more reliable car than the current 4th gen..
  • callmedrfillcallmedrfill Member Posts: 729

      You can put warp drive in the engine! Two tings: Americans HATE 5-doors (and hatcbacks in general), and God don't like UGLY!


      If it's gonna look like the early pics indicate, sales will drop, as they have for the Ugly Accord, which has a better interior, more power, better handling and economy, and a hybrid model over the Camry. But is quite the ugly stepsister! As a matter of fact, Camry sales are rising!


      I think the current CIvic looks great drives pretty nice too!. The Scion tC interior blows it away. Mazda 3 too. But I would massage the current style, just make it faster, interior more bling-bling, and more efficient.


      Looks like Honda will blow it's wad on this one. Too bad.



  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Member Posts: 2,798
    You can put warp drive in the engine! Two tings: Americans HATE 5-doors (and hatcbacks in general), and God don't like UGLY!


    I have to agree that Americans do hate practicality. We would rather have an eye candy than functional, be it car, home, or anything else. It has to do with the way we are raised. Starting from nursery school, and cute kid gets all the attention, and not so cute but gifted one is left behind. This is why plastic surgeouns are almost always paid more than more intricate brain or transplant surgeons. We, as Americans, are shallow and vain.

    Thank god for immigrants who keep us balanced.


    end of rant :-)
  • callmedrfillcallmedrfill Member Posts: 729
    Don't get me started!


      The point is there are a LOT of GREAT cars out there, but NOT a lot of GREAT AND ATTRACTIVE cars out there. A LOVE the current Civic coupes looks! There are other cars out there with more upscale interiors, that are better handlers, have better warranties, and much more power. But the Civic has balance.


      Looks like balance has been lost. It started with the fishy Si, and now it has engulfed the line.


      And I miss the CRX!



  • carguy58carguy58 Member Posts: 2,303
    "If it's gonna look like the early pics indicate, sales will drop, as they have for the Ugly Accord, which has a better interior, more power, better handling and economy, and a hybrid model over the Camry. But is quite the ugly stepsister! As a matter of fact, Camry sales are rising!"


      "I think the current CIvic looks great drives pretty nice too!. But I would massage the current style, just make it faster, interior more bling-bling, and more efficient."


      "Looks like Honda will blow it's wad on this one. Too bad."


    I hope Honda doesn't blow this 06 Civic redesign. They blew it with the current Accord Sedan.


    Honda needs to put a better interior plastics in the 06 Civic than they used in the 01-05 Civic. And yes, please make the 06 Civic sportier looking on the outside than the 01-05 model.


    In my opinion Honda can ill afford to lose any more younger buyers. They have lost alot of younger buyers to Mazda in the past couple of years as well as Toyota's Scion Brand and to Subie a little bit as well.


    Has anybody seen the commercial for the 05 Special Edition Civic? I like that commercial.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    They have lost alot of younger buyers to Mazda in the past couple of years as well as Toyota's Scion Brand and to Subie a little bit as well.


    Before you suggest that, do you know the average age of a typical Mazda/Scion/Subie buyer? Without it, we will be using assumptions as facts. Accords sales have slipped but it has competition from within the family (Acura TSX, the Japanese/European Accord), and that can easily account for a minor drop from all time high sales of the Accord.


    As for Civic, things have been brighter than ever for the car even in a generation (2001+) that many have bashed it for (warranted or unwarranted). It can only get better. For appeal, automakers have to create an appeal for people who actually buy the cars, not think about them.
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