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Honda Civic: Future Models
civic_cx_92
Member Posts: 87
in Honda
Anyone know if we get the 3 door or 5 door Civic hatchbacks in USA?
Honda of USA does not have email.
CX
Honda of USA does not have email.
CX
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Based on the three-door Civic Type R body style shown at the 2001 Geneva Motor Show, the Civic Si Hatchback will arrive in U.S. showrooms early next year. It will be the only three-door Civic sold in this country.
A new 160-horsepower, 2.0-liter DOHC four-cylinder engine, called the i-VTEC, produces 130 pounds-feet of torque.
A close-ratio five-speed-manual transmission has the shifter mounted high, rally style, on the center of the dash. Elliott said the Si will have a 0-to-60-mph time in the mid-7-second range and will be more driver friendly at the same time.
Three-door Civic models all will be built at the Honda of UK plant in Swindon, England
I'm buying it! damn, it looks like my '92.
CX
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Hatchbacks/Station Wagons Message Board
new 2.4-liter, 16-valve, dual overhead cam 4-cylinder i-VTEC engine to produce 160-horsepower and 162 lb.-ft. of torque.
estimated 22/26 mph city/hwy.
http://www.hondabeat.com/news/crv02.cfm
A redesigned Stream (whatever happened to the Latitude) which reportedly is being based on the Jazz platform) would do nicely for those of us who need occasional multi-passenger capability (6- passengers......4 adults, 2 kids) and a flexible interior for whom the 4 seater Element is too limiting but for whom the porky Odyssey is too excessive. I don't think much is wrong with the upper end of Honda's lineup, although the CR-V would be better served with larger wheels and tires and a tailgate arrangement similar to the Element.
Here and elsewhere, I've seen ideas I generally agree with from consumers on the Edmunds site. I don't think we're some island of peculiar observations and outlying tastes.
Why _doesn't_ Honda sell the Latitude in the U.S.? Why don't they market a 5 door Civic hatch? What nutball focus group told them a 4-seater Element was a good idea? Why, oh why do they market a 2 door HX, but not a 4 door?
By the way, Wheelz4 - I'm not a big-wheel fetishist, but otherwise, you're right on.
The Element IS a cool ride, I don't dispute it. Would adding a middle seat in the 2nd row ruin your appreciation for the vehicle? I have two kids, but with friends, or mother-in-laws, or what have you, I have a fifth person in the car every single week. An Element is 4" wider than the Civic, so it seems the middle passenger could theoretically be more comfortable than the poor sap in a Civic. Instead, the fifth person is in the cargo hold, the roof rack, or someone's lap.
I couldn't agree with you more about stereos. What demographic group doesn't want a decent stereo? C'mon - even a fifty year old grew up in the rockin' 60's. (Flame bait warning:) If anything, an oldster would NEED a louder stereo, what with the hearing loss and all.
I will rate the presence of an MP3 playing stereo and decent sound quality highly in my next car purchase. My d[arn] Civic can't even play burned .wav CDs without fluttering and sounding like junk.
Regarding the Maxima - if you are willing to go without the possibility of a 5th person, I think that central console isn't too bad. If you had teenagers, maybe. In any case, the rear console is an option, so if you want a 5 passenger Maxima, or a slide-your-butt-to-the-passenger-door Maxima, you can have one.
To raise again a nagging question - why the blazes doesn't Honda sell a 4-door HX? Families don't want better gas mileage?
Now I'm all bent out of shape. Have a good weekend, and whack an auto exec upside the head for me if you see one.
SanFranDan
When the Insight first came out, my first impression was that this what CRX would looked like had Honda continued making it. I still think that Hatchback is a better design (volume wise) that fast back that CRX was.
The CR-V shares about 80% of components with the Civic. So, if anyone is looking for a Civic Wagon, get FWD CR-V and lower it.
This taller body is also higher off the ground than a potential Civic wagon.
Both of these items result in decreased aerodynamic efficiency, therefore decreased fuel economy. The fwd CR-V gets 26 mpg highway, compared to 38 for the Civic. A squared-off Civic would get similar mileage as a sedan. Compare MPG figures for the Jetta Sedan/Wagon - The Jetta wagon actually gets better fuel economy than the sedan - 32 vs. 31.
I want a Honda wagon that gets mileage in the high 30's.
You can't "lower" a CR-V and have it keep its comfortable ride and handling.
The reason CR-V gets worse MPG's than Civic is not only because it is high off the ground, but mainly because it is heavier and has a much larger engine. The 7th generation civic has 1.7 liter, while USDM 2nd generation CR-V has 2.4, and the rest of the world enjoys a CR-V with a 2.0 similar to Civic Si, which gets about 30 mpg in the Civic Si.
- 5 speed automatic transmission
- 6 speed manual transmission (with 6th gear being a really tall overdrive gear, so you're turning about 3,000 rpm at 80mph, instead of the current 3,800 rpm at 80mph)
- One more inch of headroom and rear seat legroom.
- Increased sound deadening
- Sedan, Coupe and Matrix-like 4 dr hatch/wagon, with an awd option.
- 5 speed auto trans / 6 speed manual would add some cost - maybe a couple hundred dollars. But I like to think that Honda buyers are smarter than most, and could see that there would be a payoff with increased fuel economy. Honda Thailand offers a Civic with this exact combination (2.0L/5spd AT). I believe they are using the Accord auto trans, so it might be no more expensive to have a shared transmission between Accord & Civic than to make two different ones. Cost comes down when quantity goes up.
- Increased headroom - again negligible cost increase.
- Sound deadening - this might actually cost something - like a under hood mat, firewall mat, wheel well insulating, thicker glass. This could add a few hundred dollars.
Honda is already selling more Civics than any than any other small car, with minimum incentives. People have shown a willingness to pay extra for quality and refinement. I think Honda would do well to build upon the levels of refinement that already exist, to keep it at the top of the small car heap.
I believe that Honda could add the above mentioned features for no more than a $500 increase over the current model.
In other parts of the world, Honda does have the 3-door and the 5-door hatch versions of the Civic. Especially with the recent revival of hatch/wagon demand in the US, why haven't the execs of Honda USA introduced the already existing versions of Civic in the US to compete with the likes of Mazda3, VW Golf, and Toyota Matrix/Pontiac Vibe twins?
Although there is a resurgance of hatchbacks, it is a drop in the bucket compared to SUV and sedan sales. It will cost Honda more money to certify all those variations that they possibly stand a chance to sell.
~alpha
4 disk ABS is standard on the Si with EBD-Electronic Brakeforce Distribution.
If ABS is so important to someone, they will choose the EX/Si and if cost is important they will choose LX/DX/VP. It is that simple, and since most people can't put price on safety, they won't balk at $800 more for the EX which will include content worth almost $2000 if it were sold as individual options.
I wish we had a switch, similar to air bag switch, to de-activate ABS, as at times it becomes a little too intrusive.
Yes you will, if you have patience and willing to wait until the new civic is on the market. When the new Accord came out, brand new older Accord LX was selling for around $12K with some negotiations.
Don't expect rebates though. Honda knows that rebates hurt resale, but a dealer incentive is usually offered at the end of the model year.
~alpha
The 200 Hp higher perfomance Civic coupe is available, under the RSX Type S badge. RSX is the Civic with Acura badges. So, if you were not out there buying the $25K RSX, why would Honda executives think you will buy the $22K Civic?
The Si has always been a hatchback, except for a freak accident in 1999 and 2000 when they stuffed an EX chassis with a 160 hp engine. This was not a real Si, it was just an EX with higher output engine.
Incidentally, the current Si sells for $16K-$17K. Looks can be deceiving, what really counts is the inside. The EP3 platform is much stiffer and more efficient than EM (I think current coupe is EM) platform. Sticking a 200 Hp engine in an under performing platform may result in a faster 1/4 mile car, but will also drive the true handling enthusiasts away with its flexible body and under performing suspension. Also, you may end up dropping the subframe after 10,000 miles because the chassis may not be capable of handling 200 Hp. You can always brace the chassis, but that will increase the weight, which will negate any perfomance gains from the 200 Hp mill.
Currently, the stock Si is a much better handler and performer than stock Ex. Si's handling is on par with Cooper S, which is by far the best handling front wheel drive car out there. But at $25K for a similarly equipped Cooper S, Si is a much wiser financial decision.
Rumors are, that the 2006 Civic will have 180 Hp and will be a coupe. I just hope they don't call it Si, and never offer automatic transmission in it.
~alpha
Like I said earlier, looks are only skin deep. If it walks like a duck, if it talks like a duck, chances are it is a duck. RSX is a Civic. If you can't see that past the 3% difference, then I can't help you.
"the next generation global Civic lineup will include 2-, 3-, 4- and 5-door models. It will be produced in ALL six of Honda's regional operations." -Takeo Fukui http://www.hondanews.com/CatID1000?mid=2005011134388&mime=asc
...and some more remarks made today by Mr. Fukui...
"Based on Honda's industry leading "Safety for Everyone" initiative, the next generation 2006 Civic will set new standards for safety performance in the compact class. The new Civic, being introduced this fall, will feature anti-lock brakes, side curtain airbags, driver and passenger side airbags with Occupant Position Detection System (OPDS) technology and pedestrian safety features as standard equipment on all U.S. Civic models. In addition, the new Civic will utilize Honda's Advanced Compatibility Engineering (ACE) body structure for improved occupant protection and compatibility with larger vehicles in a collision, the first application of this technology in a compact-class vehicle."
"Further, the 2006 Civic will be powered by the newest and most advanced generation of Honda's i-VTEC engine technology to achieve even higher fuel economy and lower emissions. And a new Civic Hybrid will feature enhancements to Honda's IMA hybrid technology to achieve significantly higher fuel economy and performance. The natural gas Civic GX, powered by the cleanest internal combustion engine in the world, will continue to be made in Ohio."
I can guess for the US market we will have a two-door coupe and three-door hatchback in regular and high performance versions, a four-door sedan and a five-door hatchback in lower power LX and higher power EX forms.
I think The LX model will get an improved SOHC VTEC motor of higher displacement (1.8 liters?) and possibly direct fuel injection, with the power output up to 125-130 bhp (SAE). The EX model will get a DOHC i-VTEC motor of 1.8-liter displacement with DI, probably with power output of around 145-150 bhp (SAE). The sporting models will get a new sport-tuned DOHC i-VTEC motor of 2.0-liter displacement with DI and possibly stratified combustion, with power output in the 200 bhp (SAE) range.
However, the new Civic Type-R 2.4-liter DOHC i-VTEC engine won't make it to the US market; that engine will instead be installed on the Acura RSX, with the new uprate RSX using a new close-ratio manual transmission.
You can put warp drive in the engine! Two tings: Americans HATE 5-doors (and hatcbacks in general), and God don't like UGLY!
If it's gonna look like the early pics indicate, sales will drop, as they have for the Ugly Accord, which has a better interior, more power, better handling and economy, and a hybrid model over the Camry. But is quite the ugly stepsister! As a matter of fact, Camry sales are rising!
I think the current CIvic looks great drives pretty nice too!. The Scion tC interior blows it away. Mazda 3 too. But I would massage the current style, just make it faster, interior more bling-bling, and more efficient.
Looks like Honda will blow it's wad on this one. Too bad.
DrFill
I have to agree that Americans do hate practicality. We would rather have an eye candy than functional, be it car, home, or anything else. It has to do with the way we are raised. Starting from nursery school, and cute kid gets all the attention, and not so cute but gifted one is left behind. This is why plastic surgeouns are almost always paid more than more intricate brain or transplant surgeons. We, as Americans, are shallow and vain.
Thank god for immigrants who keep us balanced.
end of rant :-)
The point is there are a LOT of GREAT cars out there, but NOT a lot of GREAT AND ATTRACTIVE cars out there. A LOVE the current Civic coupes looks! There are other cars out there with more upscale interiors, that are better handlers, have better warranties, and much more power. But the Civic has balance.
Looks like balance has been lost. It started with the fishy Si, and now it has engulfed the line.
And I miss the CRX!
DrFill
"I think the current CIvic looks great drives pretty nice too!. But I would massage the current style, just make it faster, interior more bling-bling, and more efficient."
"Looks like Honda will blow it's wad on this one. Too bad."
I hope Honda doesn't blow this 06 Civic redesign. They blew it with the current Accord Sedan.
Honda needs to put a better interior plastics in the 06 Civic than they used in the 01-05 Civic. And yes, please make the 06 Civic sportier looking on the outside than the 01-05 model.
In my opinion Honda can ill afford to lose any more younger buyers. They have lost alot of younger buyers to Mazda in the past couple of years as well as Toyota's Scion Brand and to Subie a little bit as well.
Has anybody seen the commercial for the 05 Special Edition Civic? I like that commercial.
Before you suggest that, do you know the average age of a typical Mazda/Scion/Subie buyer? Without it, we will be using assumptions as facts. Accords sales have slipped but it has competition from within the family (Acura TSX, the Japanese/European Accord), and that can easily account for a minor drop from all time high sales of the Accord.
As for Civic, things have been brighter than ever for the car even in a generation (2001+) that many have bashed it for (warranted or unwarranted). It can only get better. For appeal, automakers have to create an appeal for people who actually buy the cars, not think about them.