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Land Rover Freelander



  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    First off, you should not type in all caps. That is considered shouting. I checked on MSN carpoint and the Hyundai does not offer either of those options in the US market. The Freelander had to meet a price point of under $30,000 to be viable in this market. To add Power seats and ATC (which are not available in any other market) would have priced it too close to the Discovery (Base model $33,895). Where the Freelander is superior to vehicles like the Santa Fe, is in areas that are hard to see. But the Freelander does add features as standard such as ABS,4 wheel electronic traction control and Hill descent control. The Santa Fe does not offer these as standard, and 4 wheel traction control (Hyundai has FW traction control) and HDC are not offered at all.
  • agh15agh15 Posts: 90
    When i said that i was talking about these features being available as standard or optional features on both the freelander and the santa fe. About the cap letters i like writing in cap letters ok. Oh and the hyundai comes with auto dimming rear view mirror (as a option)too
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    But power seats and Auto temp control are not available on the Santa Fe in the U.S., standard or optional. I'd rather have 4 wheel traction control than a self-dimming mirror myself.
  • bobcatbobbobcatbob Posts: 187
    I do believe one can purchase an auto-dimming mirror as an after market accessory, probably for less than a dealer would charge. Of course, in the time I have owned my car, I'll say that flipping the little lever under my current mirror has never been a pain in the butt. Sheesh, if that is the biggest niggling point, what does that say about priorities.

    My main concern is safety and stability.


    It will be interesting to see how the price points of the Freelander overlap with that of the Jeep Liberty. A loaded Liberty is about 27.8K and a loaded Freelander will be approx 32K....Interesting to see if they get crossed shopped by a lot of people besides myself.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    Pricing is targeted at under 26,000 for the S model, under 29,000 for the HS, and under 32,000 for the HSE.
  • bobcatbobbobcatbob Posts: 187
    Exactly my point with regard to pricing. It'll be interesting to say the least.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I'm sure that the Liberty will be one of the many vehicles the Freelander will be cross-shopped with. It will be interesting to see how the equipt. levels vary by price point with the Liberty. I'm sure each vehicle will have it's advantages over others in the market. We realize that we are a niche market company, and will not have to sell anywhere near as many vehicles as Jeep will. I'm sure DC is targeting 100,000 vehicle sales of the Liberty.
  • bobcatbobbobcatbob Posts: 187
    Chuck, sit down buddy, you're not going to believe this....

    DC isn't targeting 100,000 Liberty sales... DC isn't targeting 125, 000 or 150,000 for that matter... They are targeting 250,000 as the sales figure for Liberty's...Yes, you heard it right 250,000. Plans are already underway to add a third shift to the brand new TNAP assembly line in January of 2002. This is all from DC themselves.

    It doesn't matter that the old Cherokee sold a Max of 150,000 per year, DC believes that this vechicle so superior, it will out sell the Tribute, Escape, CR-V and Freelander. Heck, they are basically betting it'll sell as well as the full sozed Grand Cherokee.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I wish them luck, but that is going to be a very hard number to hit. That would be more than Land Rover's worldwide sales for all models.
  • bobcatbobbobcatbob Posts: 187
    Yes, well, I didn't say DC's target was a sane number....I think once the immediate hysteria dies down, you'll see these wind up on lots for a while. Also, give the vehicle one major recall and the target will not be met.

    Any word of safety features in the Freelander? I think that will wind up being the major factor in my choice.
  • ankleroomankleroom Posts: 13
    Ankle room and kneeroom are two of the overlooked ergonomics features in SUV design. But some of us like to have room to move around. After trying on a whole lot of SUVs at the L.A. auto show, I found the little-on-the-outside Honda CR-V to be the most comfy (manual windows helped). While the Tribute/Escape came in second.

    The center-stack areas of these vehicles are so modest that you can easily scoot from the driver’s seat to the passenger’s seat. Very nice. The CR-V was as comfy as my Honda Civic, which is cavernous inside.

    Unfortunately, the Freelander display model was locked up, so I could not climb inside. But the pictures offered by this forum (thank you) show an elaborate center stack (the area where the console meets the dash).

    Can someone report on how the Freelander fits? Is there room for one’s right foot to roam? Does one’s left knee bang into the area for the power-window switches?


    P.S. The Jeep Liberty might be a dandy vehicle, but it sure is goofy looking. The Freelander may be a bit plain, but the designers kept it masculine and functional looking. Studly, but without being a poseur (read Xterra).
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    Dual Airbags, Traction Control, ABS, Side intrusion bars, Front Seat belt pretensioners, 3 point belts for all passengers. Side airbags are not available for 2003. These are standard for all models.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I'm 6'2", over 300lbs. I have no problem with room in this vehicle (I also have size 14 feet).
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    After seeing first pre-production NAS spec Freelander, had the following impressions. On the interior, cloth for S model is a very attractive, durable looking and feeling material. Dash and interior was very attractive charcoal with light gray headliner. Materials used seemed first rate. Besides the 2 door mounted cupholders in front, there were 2 under a trapdoor in the top of the dash, and 2 in the fold down armrest in the rear seat. Rear seat was 60/40 split with latch release on rear of seat back (only accessable from rear cargo area). The SE had two-tone grey leather seats with the charcoal dash,carpet and door panels. The HSE was for the southern US, Had very rich looking Tan seats with charcoal dash, carpet and door casings. The interior looks much nicer than the Eurospec vehicles we have had here up til now.
  • ankleroomankleroom Posts: 13

    Thanks for the good news.

    How would you say the knee and ankle roominess compares with other SUVs you have been in?

    Do you find other SUVs cramped, or am I alone on this one?

    This may be a small issue with some people, but for me at least, if I don't have a place to put my limbs, I just can't be comfortable.

    Any ideas about the expected dependability for this pseudo-first-year car? How about expected mileage?

    Thanks again,
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    Seems to be ok, better than the Discovery. Seems to be about the same as my wife's Forester. I would imagine mileage to be in the 19-25 MPG range. The engine has been used for several years in the Rover 75, and the basic vehicle design has been in service for about a year in Europe with the same engine-transmission package. The last few months have seen an improvement in the product we are receiving, so that bodes well for future reliability.
  • agh15agh15 Posts: 90
    do you know when land rover na will show us pictures and the specs of the na spec freelander. oh and i really appreciate the info you have given us on the freeelander
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    Other than info on the LRNA website, it will probably be another 2-3 months for brochures to be available.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    The Freelander will be available to order on the net, see article below

  • bobcatbobbobcatbob Posts: 187
    Well, it is interesting to say the least. I am guessing that those which are ordered in July and August will be among the fist to be produced for the NA left hand drive market.

    20,000 as a goal for the US market huh? Those will sell out by January.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I think January is a bit optomistic, we only have 140 retailers. Freelander should help them close to double their annual sales. With the addition of Freelander the US will become the largest market for Land Rover products worldwide. We are already the largest market for Discovery and Range Rover.
  • elfieelfie Posts: 47
    So, we spec out the car online, the request gets sent to a dealer and then what? Does this mean all the pricing and stuff is already a done deal or will we still have to work out the details with the dealer?

    Since the car is being ordered, will Fords A plan or X plan be applicable or will none of the plans be applied to Land Rover?

    Are the colors LR will use for the Freelander the same colors LR uses for Discovery and Range Rovers? I am hoping I can look at existing cars to see which color I like the best.

    Tincup, thank you for the information on the cup holders, it makes me feel better knowing they are not just on the door.

    I really appreciate you spending the time to come here and answer our questions and provide details as they are released. It is nice to know LR employees have such loyalty.


  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I haven't heard the details, but I'm sure pricing will be done by the retailer. A or X plan are available on Land Rover products, but they are voluntary to the retailers. They do not have to honor the plans if they feel the vehicle is in short supply. Colors that are common to other 2000-2001 Land Rover products are Chawton White, White Gold, Epsom Green, Java Black, Rutland Red, Oxford Blue, Bonatti Grey, and Oslo Blue.
  • bobcatbobbobcatbob Posts: 187

    Configure a vehicle and then go to a dealer to find out how much it'll cost...What a revolutionary concept in....possibly gouging a customer.

    Over on the CR-V Board they are discussing the CR-V versus the Freelander. Chuck, you ought to go check that out.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I certainly can understand your suspicions, but I invite you to one of our retailers. We promote standards of sales ethics we call "The Land Rover Way". Although our retailer's do not sell at invoice, they all have to treat customers fairly and with respect. This has led to our retail sales experience consistently being at the top of the J.D. Powers surveys for satisfaction with the buying process.
  • gpvsgpvs Posts: 214
    The experience was great. 4 years ago, I bought a disco and i love the way they treat you. They took me to their test rock to give you the ins and outs of the truck, then when i was talking to the salesguy, he had the computer on his desk to do all the paper work that normally a finance guy would do. I don't know whether they do that at all LR Centers but that was great, i only dealt with one person. Plus, when i came back to pick up my truck, they had it inside the showroom and then drove it out for a kodak moment with my new baby that they send you as a calendar form. Not to mention a big LR can at the back of my disco full of LR goodies. I'm not sure if they do this to all centers but the one i got my disco from (LR of Rockville), that's how they do it.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    That is the way all Centre's are supposed to handle the customer. I'm glad you had a positive experience.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    Land Rover Freelander Preliminary North American Specifications

    Land Rover Freelander


    Welded steel monocoque body.
    Two longitudinal box-section rails located by integral crossmembers and box-section outriggers mounted to side sills.
    Front and rear subframes.
    Zinc-coated (galvanized) steel body panels.


    Type: 24-valve DOHC V6 with Variable Induction System (VIS).
    Construction: Cast aluminum-alloy cylinder heads and block.
    Wet cast-iron cylinder liners.
    Displacement: 2.5 liters (152 cu. in./2497 cc).
    Bore x stroke: 3.15 in. x 3.27 in. (80 mm x 83 mm).
    Compression ratio: 10.5:1
    Horsepower @ rpm: 175 @ 6,250 rpm
    Torque @ rpm: 177 lb-ft @ 4,000 rpm
    Engine management: Siemens 2000
    Fuel management: Sequential fuel injection.
    Ignition: Direct ignition.
    Alternator output: 120 amp.
    Fuel requirements: Regular unleaded 87 octane minimum.
    Fuel tank capacity: 15.6 U.S. gallons (59 liters).


    Front: Independent. MacPherson struts, lower arms, coil springs, anti-sway bar.
    Rear: Independent. MacPherson struts, trapezoidal links, coil springs.
    Steering type: Power-assisted rack-and-pinion.
    Turns lock-to-lock: 3.2
    Turning circle: 38.0 ft. (11.6 m).


    Drive system: All-wheel drive with center viscous coupling
    and four-wheel Electronic Traction Control (4ETC).

    Transmission: Jatco five-speed Steptronic automatic with intermediate reduction drive and locking torque converter.

    Gear ratios: First 3.47:1
    Second 1.95:1
    Third 1.25:1
    Fourth 0.85:1
    Fifth 0.69:1
    Reverse 2.71:1
    Final-drive ratio: 3.66:1


    Power-assisted front disc and rear drum brakes.
    10.9-inch (277-mm) front disc/10.0-inch (254-mm) rear drum.
    Dual hydraulic circuit with front/rear split.
    Four-channel, all-terrain Anti-lock Braking System (ABS).
    Electronic Brake Distribution (EBD).
    Hill Descent Control (HDC).
    Parking brake operates on rear drums.


    16-inch aluminum alloy wheels.
    215/65R-16 radial tires.
    Full-size, exterior-mounted spare tire fitted to aluminum alloy wheel.


    Overall length: 175.0 in. (4447 mm)
    Overall width: 71.1 in. (1805 mm)
    Overall height: 69.2 in. (1757 mm) including roof rails
    Wheelbase: 101.0 in. (2557 mm)
    Track front/rear: 60.4/60.8 in. (1534/1545 mm)
    Loading height: 25.1 in. (638 mm)
    Rear opening height: 41.5 in. (1055 mm)
    Rear opening width: 42.8 in. (1086 mm)


    Seating capacity: Five.
    Head room, front/rear: 38.4/38.9 in. (977/988 mm)
    Leg room, front/rear: 41.8/36.8 in. (1062/934 mm)
    Shoulder room, front/rear: 55.9/53.1 in. (1420/1350 mm)
    Usable luggage capacity: 19.1 cu. ft. (0.54 m3) estimate
    With rear seat folded: 46.6 cu. ft. (1.32 m3) estimate
    Under-floor storage locker: 0.6 cu. ft. (0.02 m3)


    Ground clearance:
    Under front suspension: 7.2 in. (186 mm)
    Under rear suspension: 8.4 in. (214 mm)
    Under frame: 8.7 in. (220 mm)
    Angle of approach: 30.5 degrees
    Angle of departure: 33.9 degrees
    Ramp breakover angle: 22 degrees (excluded angle)


    Curb weight: 3,444 - 3,585 lb. (1562 - 1626 kg)
    Gross Vehicle Weight Rating: 4,541 lb. (2060 kg)
    Maximum payload: 1,488 - 1,599 lb. (675 - 725 kg)

    Maximum trailer weights:
    Trailers without brakes: 1,650 lb. (750 kg)
    Trailers with brakes: 4,410 lb. (2000 kg)
  • agh15agh15 Posts: 90
    when you saw the na spec pre production freelander did the exterior look the same or were their any changes for na market.
  • agh15agh15 Posts: 90
    is ultrasonic park distance control going to be standard on hse and did it have wood or the metal trim inside
  • ankleroomankleroom Posts: 13
    Okay folks,

    The Freelander sounds almost too good to be true. So, what are the negatives?

    It seems like almost every significant deficiency has a mitigating factor:

    A mite pricier than the other small-utes and mini-utes; but also offers a lot for the money.
    Less dependable than Honda and Toyota, but improving.
    Less safe than Mercedes and BMW utes, but those are bigger and more expensive and look like minivans..
    Less road-worthy than the Mazda Tribute and the luxury utes (or maybe not), but awesome off-road.
    No audio controls on the steering wheel (easily fixed aftermarket)

    Not the most powerful SUV engine on the market.
    It would look better with some kind of composite lower body cladding on the sides.
    Maybe the front suspension could be reworked (without lower arms?) to allow more ground clearance.
    38-foot turning circle could be better.
    38.4 inches of headroom ain’t much, especially if you’re wearing a cowboy hat.
    Center stack inhibits pass through from driver’s side to passenger’s side.
    Not available in yellow.
    Cannot be rinsed out with a water hose.
    No convertible top.
    No side airbags.
    Steering-column-mounted shifter not available, but it does have a mighty cool shifter.
    Diesel not available in U.S.A.
    No sensor to tell you when you are about to back up over a bike or something.
    It is kind-of a first-year model, so there may be bugs to work out.

    What else is wrong with the Freelander? Please be petty and idiosyncratic and list every missing feature that a non-luxury ute should have, or that you wish it had. Do you see any actual or potential design flaws?

  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    The exterior for the NA spec vehicles is the same as has been pictured on the web site. There is no ultrasonic parking aid available. The HSE I saw did not have wood or metal trim.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    In regards to your post, which I find interesting, I do have a few comments. I think the safety issue will have to wait until the Freelander has undergone testing in US trim, but the BMW and Mercedes are very safe and a good target for any manufacturer to shhot for. I also believe side airbags should be available. The SE and HSE do have steering mounted audio controls. Yellow will probably be available in the future as will a convertible top for the rear if we get the the 2 door version. The stalk mounted shifter and lack of a center console are design hallmarks of Mini-vans more than SUVs. One of Land Rovers (along with most European Cars) design hallmarks is a console mounted parking brake, which is a very important feature for off-road driving. The one feature I wish it had was rear disc brakes.
  • agh15agh15 Posts: 90
    car and driver magazine along with the land rover Australia website both show that freelander can be equipped with this feature.
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,788
    A few questions:

    • I know the Freelander does surprisingly well without a low range. However, I can't help but think it would do even better if it had a low range. Do you think we will ever see a low range offered, even as an option, down the road?

    • There have been some rumors that the next Range Rover will have IFS/IRS. That it will essentially have a "beefed up" version of the BMW X-5's suspension. Also rumored, the next RR may also not have a low range. Any truth to these rumors?

  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    The Freelander will probably not get low range, it has been sold in Europe since 97 without it. I haven't heard that much about the New RR yet, but I can't imagine it coming without Low Range.
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,788
    the Freelander will get a manual tranny option?

  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I doubt it, the 5 speed automatic with manual shift will meet most of our customers needs. For the few sales with a manual, it would not be cost effective to go through the EPA certification process.
  • I just read through the entire board. Thanks for the all of the inside scoop, Chuck. I've been interested in the Freelander since I first saw one a few years ago when I was in London... (sorry, just had to mention that).

    I have two questions:

    1) Is the sales experience very different between LR Centers and mere dealerships? I live near Pittsburgh and there is only a dealership in the area (Ascot Imports). Is it worth traveling to DC or Akron, OH?

    2) Will there be Freelanders in the show rooms when on-line ordering becomes available? I would really like to sit in one, maybe even take a drive before buying.

    Cheers, John.
  • gpvsgpvs Posts: 214
    I know this question is for tincup4 but i had a friend who also bought a Disco, but he purchased his at a dealership that also sells other brands and he told me his experience was different from what i got. Although, he also received the LR goodies in the back of his Disco upon pickup.
  • smichsmich Posts: 31
    I have been following the info about this vehicle and await it's debut in December, but what kind of gas mileage do you get with Free lander?
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    If you go to a shared facility, you may have a different experience. Ask for a Land Rover sales guide if possible. I doubt if there will be Freelanders in retailers before Nov.-Dec., but I'm sure you will not be obligated to purchase before seeing or test driving the vehicle.
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,788
    Why did Land Rover decide not to offer a low range in the Freelander? Even though it has "lower" low gear ratios, and hill descent control, IMHO, neither of these features are a substitute for a good set of ultra-low gears for tough going.

  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I'm sure it had to do with looking at the intended usage, development cost, and space considerations along with BMW's influence. Due to economies of scale and the fact that Land Rover has lacked funds or corporate support under Rover Group-BMW to develop their own engine-trans combination for this vehicle (the Engine is from the Rover 75)it was cost prohibitive to include it. Land Rover sold less than 200,000 vehicles worldwide last year, and until Ford bought them, did not have their own separate corporate identity, officers, or budgets. Everything was under Rover Group and BMW (which focused on the Cars) control.
    I have driven the Freelander off-road, and while the lack of low range entails different technique, it handles most obstacles the Range Rover and Discovery do.
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,788
    with Ford's deep pockets, the Freelander will at some point offer a low range.

    Land Rover's image is so tied into being able to conquer "any and all" terrain, that by not offering a low range, in the eyes of many, means it's nothing more than an expensive "cute-ute." It may be the best off-road cute-ute there is—but still just a cute-ute, none the less...

  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,788
    As you probably know, shortly after the Freelander arrive on these shores, a new Forester will debut. Rumors abound of more power, larger, etc. All of us over in the Subaru forums have been pleading for Subaru to offer the dual-range tranny (again) that is used in other markets, and for more towing capacity. It will be very interesting to see how these two will compare.

  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I have read those posts also, and it will be interesting to see what comes of them. Although Patty is very good at passing along everyone's input, the people posting on Edmunds represent a very small total of buyers or potential buyers. Any product decisions will be based on a cost-effectiveness basis, so if they won't feel they will see an appropriate increase in sales or feel that without a feature they will lose a significant number of sales, a lot of those suggested changes will probably not appear.
  • bobcatbobbobcatbob Posts: 187
    I was doing some thinking last night and it seems another competitor to the Freelander will also be the Volvo XC 70 and Audi All-Road.. In Europe, the Freelander is called a wagon, same as the others. And, realistically compared to the Disco and RR, the Freelander does look like a tall wagon, just like the CR-V.

    Granted, though, the Freelander may be a bit more off-road capable than the Audi or Volvo and cost a good bit less than both, I think the three will be cross shopped a lot.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    You could be right, many people who look at SUV's would be better served buying AWD wagons.
  • bobcatbobbobcatbob Posts: 187
    The Freelander isn't really a wagon because of its one huge drawback, small cargo space.

    I don't know, it'll require me sitting in one and feeling good about the vehicle and the money I spend. After getting treated like crap at a Jeep dealer last weekend, the game is wide open and customer service will play a huge part in my decision.
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