Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

driver100

bwia said:

driver100 said:

Actually, the S Class I like the least is about a 2010 model like one of my neighbors has. I have only ever seen him in it, and he is probably 5 ft 8. What he needs this giant car for I don't know. His house is nice but is about 60 years old, I have never seen his car go out or go into the garage, and I doubt if it would fit anyway.

Hey Driver, aren't you a tad judgmental? The man has BIG car because he can afford it and an older home because of its charm and coziness. Be a good neighbor and offer to help him clean his garage so he can park his car inside.

Nah, My rule is you should buy a car that fits in your garage (whether you use it as a garage or for storage). An E Class might fit, but I think he needs a C Class. Size of the car doesn't necessarily make it more or less affordable. he could buy a Maserati for all I care...at least it would fit in his garage. btw...I said the house is 60 years old because garages weren't made very large at the time....not putting down the house which is actually quite nice.


Incidentally, there is a brand new house, with twin garages, and for some reason they made the garage doors and I suppose the garage very narrow, and they never park there F-150 or their Lexus in the garage, because I am sure they would never be able to get the car/truck door open. Not sure why they built their garage....maybe it is for storage too. There are a few houses in the neighborhood built in the 60s, and the garage is a 90 degree turn from the driveway....I never see those people use their garage...I don't think they could get in or out - doesn't seem to be enough room or radius to turn in or out.

Maybe I am judgemental, I think I am talking more from an architectural point of view. When my wife and I walk up the street we just notice these things. Even if I helped the first guy clean up his garage his car wouldn't fit inside.

We have some friends who have a large two car garage with enough space to be a 3 car garage. They are hoarders and every square inch of space has old junk in it. They have had up to 3 cars at any one time, but they have never put a car in their garage.

I think some people don't equate a garage as being a place to put a car. If that is being judgemental that's fine, I think it is an observation.

stickguy

I won't buy a car that doesn't fit in my garage. Total non-starter.

only exception would be if it was a PU that was a spare vehicle. that could stay outside. The "real" cars go inside.

abacomike

stickguy said:

I won't buy a car that doesn't fit in my garage. Total non-starter. only exception would be if it was a PU that was a spare vehicle. that could stay outside. The "real" cars go inside.

I have another way of looking at buying cars:

I won't buy a car that won't allow me comfortable seating for my "love handles"!  

oldfarmer50

A sad ending...

I got the Mustang itch real bad so I went back to the dealer where I test drove a stick equipped 5.0 last November. I'm a reluctant standard shift driver and wasn't impressed with the exhaust sound so I let the search languish. Until this week.

Saw online that they had one with auto trans and in a color I could live with. On Thursday I went for a test drive with an older (than me) associate who was a fountain of knowledge on Mustangs current and past. Without having to shift I found the car much more pleasant to drive, liked the handling and thought the exhaust sound was ok this time. In short, I wanted to buy. Only down side was it came equipped with premium wheels that I thought were ugly.

Today I went back to make an offer. Decided to make an out the door take it or leave it offer and to ask them to replace the premium wheels with the more attractive standard wheel package. The credit for the wheel swap should have covered the doc fee and registration.

The first disappointment came when the salesman said he couldn't do a wheel swap because "Ford won't let us" not a good start.

The car stickered for $34,870. I asked for $2k off sticker and $9k trade for my Eclipse. The $155 credit for the wheels to go for paperwork. With tax this translated to my car and $25,780 out the door. I estimated this to be $300-$500 over invoice with a holdback of $1040 and $500 cash back to the dealer. Definitely doable even if I was a bit rich in my trade request.

The salesman countered that he could do the $2k off sticker but the best he could offer for my trade was $7,300. After some back and forth with what I think was an offer to "split the difference" (not sure what difference he was splitting by this time) I concluded that we were nearly $2,000 apart with neither one of us willing to budge.

Choking back tears I shook his hand and left.

I can only hope that they were blowing smoke and will call me in a week or if Ford comes up with some trunk money as the 2016s start arriving. I'm not holding my breath.

imidazol97

I love that color. I like the wheels but I don't LOVE the wheels.
I would not kick it out of my garage.

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

A sad ending...



The car stickered for $34,870. I asked for $2k off sticker and $9k trade for my Eclipse. The $155 credit for the wheels to go for paperwork. With tax this translated to my car and $25,780 out the door. I estimated this to be $300-$500 over invoice with a holdback of $1040 and $500 cash back to the dealer. Definitely doable even if I was a bit rich in my trade request.

The salesman countered that he could do the $2k off sticker but the best he could offer for my trade was $7,300. After some back and forth with what I think was an offer to "split the difference" (not sure what difference he was splitting by this time) I concluded that we were nearly $2,000 apart with neither one of us willing to budge.

Choking back tears I shook his hand and left.

I can only hope that they were blowing smoke and will call me in a week or if Ford comes up with some trunk money as the 2016s start arriving. I'm not holding my breath.

Great looking mustang OF. Just my opinion, but I checked an automatic Eclipse with 100k miles and came up with numbers that were much lower for the Eclipse.

I don't know much about your 2008 but I got these numbers on an automatic.


Trade-In -$5412
Private Party $6616
Dealer Retail $7,972
That $9000 price just seems high to me, but what do I know.

I think if you really like the Mustang, you may be sorry if you lose it for $2000, which is probably an OK price.
Then again, you have waited this long, and once the 2016s come out, any remaining stock will get discounted, and you may get closer to your price.

stickguy

well, I would bet there are plenty of 15s around. A month from now, they are really going to be getting desperate. Those wheels don't bother me, but also not sure what the standard ones are.

the eclipse is going to be a problem. would be much easier if you could unload it yourself, because I really don't think you will ever get "real money" (not a shell game over-allowance) what you want out of it on a trade.

too late on a 15, but if you really want "what you want", just special order a 2016 to get it perfect. no settling on anything. Then deal with the Eclipse at the time (trade or dump). hey, this seems like a special retirement present (roughly) to yourself, so might as well do it right, and keep it forever. Using that logic, a couple K on a splurge purchase isn't going to matter in the long run.

I like that color too. one of my favorites.

oldfarmer50

Premium wheels vs standard wheels:

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

A sad ending...



The car stickered for $34,870. I asked for $2k off sticker and $9k trade for my Eclipse. The $155 credit for the wheels to go for paperwork. With tax this translated to my car and $25,780 out the door. I estimated this to be $300-$500 over invoice with a holdback of $1040 and $500 cash back to the dealer. Definitely doable even if I was a bit rich in my trade request.

The salesman countered that he could do the $2k off sticker but the best he could offer for my trade was $7,300. After some back and forth with what I think was an offer to "split the difference" (not sure what difference he was splitting by this time) I concluded that we were nearly $2,000 apart with neither one of us willing to budge.

Choking back tears I shook his hand and left.

I can only hope that they were blowing smoke and will call me in a week or if Ford comes up with some trunk money as the 2016s start arriving. I'm not holding my breath.

Great looking mustang OF. Just my opinion, but I checked an automatic Eclipse with 100k miles and came up with numbers that were much lower for the Eclipse.

I don't know much about your 2008 but I got these numbers on an automatic.


Trade-In -$5412
Private Party $6616
Dealer Retail $7,972
That $9000 price just seems high to me, but what do I know.

I think if you really like the Mustang, you may be sorry if you lose it for $2000, which is probably an OK price.
Then again, you have waited this long, and once the 2016s come out, any remaining stock will get discounted, and you may get closer to your price.





Trade values of an Eclipse with 45k miles ranges from $8500 on Edmunds and KBB to around $10,000 on NADA. I suspect the dealer was just going to send it to the auction and valued it's auction price. I think most dealers shy away from putting anything that old on their lot regardless of milage. Shame, the car is a cream puff. I figured since I would give the Ford $500 rebate to the dealer it would all even out. Guess not. My absolute limit was $26k and my car out the door. Not much wiggle room on my end.

stickguy

I actually like the 5 spokes better. But to each his own!

I am guessing that (like I found out with my Volvo) the market offers are going to be less than that books say on a Mitsubishi.

Might want to put it back on Craig's and see what happens. Never know.

oldfarmer50

stickguy said:

I actually like the 5 spokes better. But to each his own!

I am guessing that (like I found out with my Volvo) the market offers are going to be less than that books say on a Mitsubishi.

Might want to put it back on Craig's and see what happens. Never know.

In the end a car is only worth what someone is willing to pay. I remember when I bought it someone told me thst Mitsus had poor resale value but back then I didn't care.

Live and learn.

Who knows, maybe I'll keep it forever or just save more money to buy a 2016. It's all good.

nyccarguy

@oldfarmer50 - first off, GREAT job posting the pictures of the 2 wheels on top of one another. Second, great job standing your ground and walking out. It is still the middle of July and you never know what might happen in the next 2 weeks. Friday 7/31. The 2016s will be rolling in, in August most people up here in the Northeast aren't thinking RWD, V8, Mustang. On the flip side, your Eclipse is going to keep depreciating. Check true car and see how your offer for the Mustang stacks up. @qbrozen bought a Mustang GT at the right time & was able to get good money for it at trade in time. Don't get discouraged!

nyccarguy

Back to our C-Class discussion. I think I don't like the Baby S Class look on the C-Class because I'm not such a fan of the current S-Class styling.

abacomike

nyccarguy said:

Back to our C-Class discussion. I think I don't like the Baby S Class look on the C-Class because I'm not such a fan of the current S-Class styling.

We all have different tastes and preferences, Bradd.  The new C Class has an S Class resemblance as will the new 2017 E Class when it debuts in April or May of 2016.  

The exterior design sign of the S Class Sedan is by no means my idea of a gorgeous vehicle, however the interior of that S Class is truly gorgeous and functional.  I guess if you sit in the driver's seat you don't realize how blasé the exterior is, but it's like sitting in a refined and exquisite cockpit made in heaven.  The materials and workmanship are exhilarating.

I don't believe in spending $100,000 on a car that depreciates percentage-wise at a faster rate than an E Class.  Even if it held its value better, it's way too costly, IMHO.

driver100

abacomike said:

nyccarguy said:

Back to our C-Class discussion. I think I don't like the Baby S Class look on the C-Class because I'm not such a fan of the current S-Class styling.

We all have different tastes and preferences, Bradd.  The new C Class has an S Class resemblance as will the new 2017 E Class when it debuts in April or May of 2016.  

The exterior design sign of the S Class Sedan is by no means my idea of a gorgeous vehicle, however the interior of that S Class is truly gorgeous and functional.  I guess if you sit in the driver's seat you don't realize how blasé the exterior is, but it's like sitting in a refined and exquisite cockpit made in heaven.  The materials and workmanship are exhilarating.

I don't believe in spending $100,000 on a car that depreciates percentage-wise at a faster rate than an E Class.  Even if it held its value better, it's way too costly, IMHO.




Interior does look beautiful: (and note-built in GPS)


Exterior...not so much:



I'm not a fan of Audis but I think the A8 looks better than an S Class...IMHO


I like the S Class interior more:


Maybe a car with Audi exterior and Mercedes interior...too bad can't order that!

ab348

The S-class interior in a parchment or light gray leather with the "silvered" wood trim looks absolutely stunning. I could move in and live there.

ab348

oldfarmer50 said:

Premium wheels vs standard wheels:

I think the standard wheel looks like the one you would pay extra for, and I prefer it also. Ford is really off-base IMO with its wheel options for the Mustang. Many are in black finishes and all of those look awful IMO. Next year they are offering a carbon fiber wheel option also in black.

roadburner

I decided that I'm still going to test drive a Mustang GT with the Performance Pack; perhaps the driving experience will overcome my ambivalence about the exterior/interior styling and design.

robr2

ab348 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

Premium wheels vs standard wheels:

I think the standard wheel looks like the one you would pay extra for, and I prefer it also. Ford is really off-base IMO with its wheel options for the Mustang. Many are in black finishes and all of those look awful IMO. Next year they are offering a carbon fiber wheel option also in black.

Black is what the kids want today..

ab348

robr2 said:

Black is what the kids want today..

Yes, and kids today, like kids of every generation, are mostly clueless when it comes to style.

robr2

ab348 said:

robr2 said:

Black is what the kids want today..

Yes, and kids today, like kids of every generation, are mostly clueless when it comes to style.

Just like we were back then...

isellhondas

Sorry to say this but a 100,000 mile Eclipse is not an easy car to sell. Dealer network is almost non existant and although they are good cars, people just walk by them on the lot. Most stores would wholesale it or take it to the auction and hope for the best. I would try to sell it yourself for sure!

stickguy

black wheels do have an advantage. I washed the Jetta today for the first time, and had to wipe my finger on the black wheel to see if it was dirty. Since my finger came back black, I decided the answer was Yes.

Like the look on the white car. Nice contrast. But I don't like it on a dark color car.

oldfarmer50

roadburner said:

I decided that I'm still going to test drive a Mustang GT with the Performance Pack; perhaps the driving experience will overcome my ambivalence about the exterior/interior styling and design.

If you can spring for the Premium trim try to look at the Ceramic interior in leather. Like it much better than the black leather or the ceramic in cloth.

oldfarmer50

isellhondas said:

Sorry to say this but a 100,000 mile Eclipse is not an easy car to sell. Dealer network is almost non existant and although they are good cars, people just walk by them on the lot. Most stores would wholesale it or take it to the auction and hope for the best. I would try to sell it yourself for sure!

Mine only has 45k miles. There are 2 dealerships within 10 miles of me. Even though I know that the condition is good because of my obsessive care, I'm guessing the dealer has heard enough puffery from buyers to not believe me. I agree that he just would wholesale it. I did see an Eclipse at the Chrysler dealer last year. It was a 2006 with about 95k miles with blown clear coat for about 9 grand so at least one dealer thought they were great. I almost wish mine did have 100k miles so I could give it to my kid or not even bother trading.

Just got an amusing form email from the salesman saying to come on down because they could get me top dollar for my trade. These must go out automatically or else the sales guy is trying to be funny.

ab348

oldfarmer50 said:

If you can spring for the Premium trim try to look at the Ceramic interior in leather. Like it much better than the black leather or the ceramic in cloth.

I agree, that is the best choice IMO, but can be hard to find. Virtually all of the Mustangs in dealer inventory here have black inside, either in leather or burlap.

nelsonf

oldfarmer50 said:

Premium wheels vs standard wheels:

I actually like both wheels, but the top ones would be easier to clean.

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

isellhondas said:

Sorry to say this but a 100,000 mile Eclipse is not an easy car to sell. Dealer network is almost non existant and although they are good cars, people just walk by them on the lot. Most stores would wholesale it or take it to the auction and hope for the best. I would try to sell it yourself for sure!

Mine only has 45k miles. There are 2 dealerships within 10 miles of me. Even though I know that the condition is good because of my obsessive care, I'm guessing the dealer has heard enough puffery from buyers to not believe me. I agree that he just would wholesale it. .

Just got an amusing form email from the salesman saying to come on down because they could get me top dollar for my trade. These must go out automatically or else the sales guy is trying to be funny.

That is funny....and what does "Top Dollar" mean anyway...more words.........

Did you try Auto Nation or one of those places that just buy cars. Cash for Cars etc or one of those.

Like a few have said, they will be discounting once the 16s are out.

I missed which wheels are the premium and which are standard....though, I have seen lots of pictures posted here. I like them both almost the same, but I prefer the one with more spokes but I wouldn't pay extra for them.

robr2

This evening I saw a BMW i8 on I95 north of Boston. He was stuck behind another vehicle doing about 60. As soon as that car moved over, he accelerated and was gone in a few seconds.

Browsed at a Fiat dealership. The 500L must be one of the ugliest vehicles I have ever seen. The 500X is a pretty neat option in the subcompact SUV market.

graphicguy

robr2 said:

ab348 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

Premium wheels vs standard wheels:

I think the standard wheel looks like the one you would pay extra for, and I prefer it also. Ford is really off-base IMO with its wheel options for the Mustang. Many are in black finishes and all of those look awful IMO. Next year they are offering a carbon fiber wheel option also in black.

Black is what the kids want today..

Every time I see wheels in black, I think they are very, very, very, very dirty. I was just in Chicago on business and in one of the parking lots of one of the business complexes I visited there was an M3 and M4 parked next to each other. Both had darkened or black wheels. Looked terrible on such nice cars.

That's just like the fad of the "chrome" shade of paint that was popular a couple of years ago. Came and went quickly. A used dealer not far from me had a chromed BRZ on their lot a few months ago. He couldn't sell it. Sat there for at least 3 months. Out of curiousity I stopped by to ask about it. The sales manager said if I wanted it to make an offer immediately because it was headed to auction. No thanks!

Mercedes dealer near my home has a flat silver car. I only pass it. Not sure if it's new or used, but I think it's an SLS. Been sitting there at least 90 days. Flat paint is another fad that seems to have come and gone.....hard sell once you try to trade it.

houdini1

A friend of mine just bought a new IS 250. Nice car, white, black leather with red accents. What ruins it for me is the black wheels. They always remind me of someone driving a car on 4 of those temporary spare tires. They also make the wheels look smaller to my eye and out of proportion, etc. Can't stand them. Disclaimer: Just giving my opinion, hopefully no one with black wheels will feel bullied !!

stickguy

hey, I just bought a car with black wheels. Now I feel sad! J/K.

I mentioned before that I like them on the white car. Breaks up the blah factor of the white, and just IMO look sharp. These do have chrome spokes though (hard to describe that) to help the look. Mostly the inner parts black.

ab348

stickguy said:

hey, I just bought a car with black wheels. Now I feel sad! J/K.

I mentioned before that I like them on the white car. Breaks up the blah factor of the white, and just IMO look sharp. These do have chrome spokes though (hard to describe that) to help the look. Mostly the inner parts black.

^^^ Those aren't what I would consider black wheels. A friend has those on her Jetta and they look good.

stickguy

yeah, that was what I was getting at. More like black accents. the totally black ones, I don't think I have ever seen a set of those on a car that I liked.

carnaught

houdini1 said:

A friend of mine just bought a new IS 250. Nice car, white, black leather with red accents. What ruins it for me is the black wheels. They always remind me of someone driving a car on 4 of those temporary spare tires. They also make the wheels look smaller to my eye and out of proportion, etc. Can't stand them. Disclaimer: Just giving my opinion, hopefully no one with black wheels will feel bullied !!

Argh.....once a bully, always a bully .

driver100

Hope no one here owns a 500 L, but I have to agree with you rob.


500X is ok if you like that sort of thing:




I like Jeeps for some reason, and if I was looking for a car in the $30k range, I would check out one of these. I even like it with the black wheels, and this one is the Trailhawk version which I would choose, even though I have never gone off road in my life. (I would probably get it in white, though I like the red)
It looks nice and "mean".

houdini1

stickguy said:

hey, I just bought a car with black wheels. Now I feel sad! J/K.

I mentioned before that I like them on the white car. Breaks up the blah factor of the white, and just IMO look sharp. These do have chrome spokes though (hard to describe that) to help the look. Mostly the inner parts black.

I have seen those before and they don't look bad at all. Different from all black. These kind of make sense because where the wheels actually get dirty, it would be hard to tell.

houdini1

carnaught said:

houdini1 said:

A friend of mine just bought a new IS 250. Nice car, white, black leather with red accents. What ruins it for me is the black wheels. They always remind me of someone driving a car on 4 of those temporary spare tires. They also make the wheels look smaller to my eye and out of proportion, etc. Can't stand them. Disclaimer: Just giving my opinion, hopefully no one with black wheels will feel bullied !!

Argh.....once a bully, always a bully .

Glad to see you back and smiling carnaught !! Hope you are loving that new RC. Is it an "F" or just the regular RC?
By the way, I took a good look at the RC, and I will tell you that the grill looks good on that particular Lexus model. The one that really disappointed me was the 2016 ES 350. I should have been more specific in my earlier post.

driver100

I posted that Jeep "with the black wheels" before I read all the posts about black wheels. Generally, I agree, quite often black wheels do look like winter wheels, but never say never. I have seen cars that look great with black wheels.
The black wheels on the Jetta (which aren't really black wheels...just lots of black background) accent the color of the car.
My wheels tend to look black too from a distance.

carnaught

"Glad to see you back and smiling carnaught !! Hope you are loving that new RC. Is it an "F" or just the regular RC?"

F-Sport. Yeah, having fun with it. Thanks.

driver100

carnaught said:

"Glad to see you back and smiling carnaught !! Hope you are loving that new RC. Is it an "F" or just the regular RC?"

F-Sport. Yeah, having fun with it. Thanks.



Carnaught....does the F-Sport have black wheels?

houdini1

driver100 said:

I posted that Jeep "with the black wheels" before I read all the posts about black wheels. Generally, I agree, quite often black wheels do look like winter wheels, but never say never. I have seen cars that look great with black wheels.
The black wheels on the Jetta (which aren't really black wheels...just lots of black background) accent the color of the car.
My wheels tend to look black too from a distance.

Somehow, the black wheels look more appropriate on the Jeep.

stickguy

I passed an RC Lexus today (I am getting all confused with the alpha names. for a while, I thought the discussion was about the SUV. RX maybe?). Anyway, the sporty 2 door coupe. In a dark gray. Looked very sharp. The grille even blended in a bit. Don't think it was the F model, but could have been.

I assume this is basically a 2 door version of the IS?

carnaught

driver100 said:

carnaught said:

"Glad to see you back and smiling carnaught !! Hope you are loving that new RC. Is it an "F" or just the regular RC?"

F-Sport. Yeah, having fun with it. Thanks.



Carnaught....does the F-Sport have black wheels?



Nope, never cared for all black wheels on any car. I'll post links to my car's exact twin.

carnaught

These pics show the atomic silver and the playa interior I've got.

oldfarmer50

carnaught said:

These pics show the atomic silver and the playa interior I've got.

Wow! With a car that looks that good from back and side who cares what the front looks like. That is a great interior as well.

driver100

carnaught said:

These pics show the atomic silver and the playa interior I've got.

Gorgeous! I haven't seen that model before. I looks great inside and out. I really like the centre of the dash, with the GPS up high, and the contrasting interior - comes out really nice with the tan and black accents. Talking about wheels they are spectacular.

Absolutely beautiful.........

I think you got the last laugh..............

28firefighter

carnaught said:

These pics show the atomic silver and the playa interior I've got.

That is one beautiful car, inside and out. I really love the interior color. 

carnaught

As someone correctly pointed out, the car is selling slowly, and that helped me get a great deal on my lease. Also, they aren't extremely commonplace.

Appreciate the comments!

houdini1

carnaught said:

As someone correctly pointed out, the car is selling slowly, and that helped me get a great deal on my lease. Also, they aren't extremely commonplace.

Appreciate the comments!

Gorgeous, my favorite color. Doesn't it have something like 470 hp ?