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Comments
Yes, it is everybody's prerogative to assign his or her own fun-to-drive quotient to a car, but don't say it "performs" better. Performance can only be demonstrated by cold, hard numbers.
Driving impression was pretty much in line with the reviews out there. Very strong acceleration and great handling even without the sport pkg. I took the freeway ramp at twice the posted limit and the car held beautifully. Steering is precise and perfectly weighted.
On to the acceleration test... I was going to do three runs. After a few minutes, I finally figured out how to use the meter and attached it to the windshield. First run-6.54s and second run-6.33. One the first launch, I brake-torqued it. On the second run, I just moved my feet from the brake and stomped on it. Both time, I left the VDC on. On my third try, the G-Tech meter came off the suction cup and dropped when I launched. That was when I saw a cop coming around the corner. As I was running out of time, (this was during lunch time) I drove car back to the dealer.
Overall, I really think Infiniti has a real winner here. It definitely seems faster than the BMW 330 I tried a few days ago. (I didn't measure the BMW 330) Handling is very close. The BMW I drove had the sport pkg and the G35 did not. It will be a very good comparison when my sport pkg car comes in. I suspect the more aggressive wheel and tire package on the BMW will ultimately prove stickier on the skid pad. A quick tire upgrade will even that out.
Also, I don't know why but it just seems easier to drive the G35 fast. It's almost effortless to make it go where you want it. Maybe I am just not used to German cars. (I have always driven Toyota/Honda/American products.)
BUT IF YOU LIKE SHOW AND GO GET THE FULL AERO PKG IT LOOKS VERY, VERY, COOL AND YOUR G35 WILL LOOK DIFFERENT FROM MOST OTHERS. GETTING TIRED NOW YOU KNOW A FULL DAY OF DRIVING THE BEST SPORTS SEDANS IN AMERICA. YES SALES PEOPLE ENJOY LIFE ALSO. COME TO INFINITI AN MAKE A FRIEND.
Regards,
DL
When driving "EASY" under 40mph first and second gears change at around 1800- 1900 RPM'S, when your foot is a bit more firm same gears will change around 2200 RPM's and you will be at approx 40 mph. If you like to cruise at low speeds I do not think that this car is for you and perhaps you may be better off with the I35 instead. This car wants and expects to be driven aggresively. When you don't it lets you know.
I wouldn't call it lurching, but it is not as smooth as you may be used to. While in automatic it does change gears smoothly but it really reacts nicely when you shift yourself.( I took my 19 year old for a spin yesterday and I think I freaked him out a bit, if the white colour of his skin was any indication).
I am really surprised by the response in manual mode, I have driven other cars with this feature and they were more gimmiky than usefull. The G however, comes very close to a stick shift and the shifting is just about instantaneous. This really surprised me as with the Acura TL there was a delay before the gear kicked in.
As far as sensitive brakes go, someone else posted this. It is only a sign of the newness of the car. When I test drove it, first comment I made was that I will have to get used to the sharpness of the brakes. This went away after two days of driving and I have to say that the brakes are very smooth , stopping footage is excellent and they are no longer sensitive. Zero grinding and Zero noise from them.
Hope I have been able to clarify things, if you have more questions, let me know.
Gabman
I must say, the fact that I only got $900.00 off MSRP will never bother me as the attention and the smiles it has brought to my face was well worth the extra few bucks.
All of you that are sitting on the fence waiting for price to drop, don't be to surprised if the price lands up rising instead of falling. This can happen you know.
Can the Salesmen on this board confirm or deny, you guys know best about trade in values.
BTW People rave about BMW's high resale, maybe this is true in long term ownership but on the short term, my current 2001 330Ci is only worth $29-31k and I paid $41,215 + tax.
This is NOT a good resale value in my book.
As I never intend to keep the car after my 36 months are up, the higher the buy back (residual)the lower my monthly payments. If you change you cars often you may want to look at leasing. If there is a fluctuation in the value of the car after 3 years it is Infiniti's problem and not yours. The only downside to leasing is you always have a monthly payment to make, but if you change your car often this is the way to go. If on the other hand you keep your car for longer than 5 years then it pays to buy.
Another problem I have with leasing is I'm very fond of modifying my cars both mechanically and esthetically. My understanding of leased cars is that you can't do things like that, unless you somehow have it put in the lease agreement before hand. I guess I just don't like the idea that it's not really my car to do with as I see fit. I can only see the attraction of leasing for those who MUST change their car every 3 or 4 years, aren't into tinkering with their vehicles, and don't care about the higher overall cost.
As far as resale value on the BMW I agree with Alan. I sold my 330I and if I hadn't found a BMW die hard that just had to have my car I would have lost my [non-permissible content removed]. I paid $40,190 and 3 months later the dealer offered to take it off my hands for $35K. Also these certified cars the dealers sell kills the individual who is trying to sell. They are the only ones that get premium money for a used car and the price they get for a used car should not be used to determine resale value as they offer extended warranty, and financing.
As for modding leases, go ahead. I've never heard of a dealership giving people guff over a car with useful mods (better suspension, tinting, muffler, etc). If you chop the car and slap on some silly-putty junk airdam and cut the springs that may be a different story. Also, at the end of a lease you can always sell the car rather than return it. Often you can make money this way. The only bad part of a lease is getting away from the car should you hate it...like my situation with my Jetta 1.8T! I want a G35, but getting rid of the Jetta will cost me a good grand or two right now, plus the down on a G35. Argh. Shoulda waited.
Over the past decade or so leasors have been getting creamed on their wrong guesses on future wholesale. They set the residual at say .60 and find the car is only worth .45 wholesale at lease expiration. In this case the car actually depreciated far faster than the leasor thought it would. Leasor can't sell car to anyone for .60. They sell it for .45, eat the difference, and lose money.
The used car market will eventually define what the real future value of the car is after 3 or 4 years. Depreciation is something you experience when you go to buy a used car or sell your now used car to 3rd party or back to a dealer (new or used).
So the silver G35 that I want would cost $34,330.
A comparably equipped 325i should cost around $37,000; a comparably equipped 330i would be over
$41,000. The 330i does have an edge over G35 on
the tire size, but that can be easily corrected on the G. To me, the choice is obvious, unless of course you want the BMW name.
My choice was originally between the 330i, the G35 and the X-type. But after looking at and pricing out the X-type, I ruled it out. The X-type just seems out classed by the other two in performance. It doesn't use any of the aluminum suspension components like the other two. It's no where as nimble and responsive as the others. Weight-transfer rebound time takes forever (tried to do an emergency avoidance move. takes forever for the car to come back.) It also lack the punch of the G35 engine. The interior just has too many Ford bits in it.
The 330i drives much nicer then the Jag but small and pricey. And as I mentioned on my last post, it just doesn't seen as easy to drive. The steering is overly heavy at low speed. Handling seems to be about the same as the G35 but rides roughly.
The bank, otoh, assumes only 8%/yr. depreciation. This is why you can end up "upside down" on the loan so easily.
RE: leasing. The only way I've found that leasing makes sense is if the interest rate you're receiving on the cash you will pay the lease with each month is gaining at least as much as the money factor the lease is costing ... that way the lease is essentially getting paid without costing interest.
Notice, I'm assuming you already have the money in the bank. Because a car depreciates, no car is a reasonable financial deal if you have to truly borrow money to lease or buy.
This is why I try to buy only 2 or 3 year old vehicles, hold them for 4 or 5. That way, I get a 'new' car, with a full warranty (certified) for at least 1/4 or 1/3 less than the original owner paid. The car then depreciates an additional 50% in the next five years that I own it, but by making "payments" to a high-interest account I'm ready to pay cash on the next car.
As long as I keep my job it works great.
Take care.
Joe W.
I had been concerned about the small footwell, but found that it was not a problem while driving.
Road noise was higher than I remembered, but wind noise was minimal..
Didn't have any problem with the shifts while cruising at 30-40 mph.
Only one nagging question left (since I was able to explain what the card holder was for) :-)
What is that small pocket by the passenger's left leg? I've been trying to imagine some device that could be stored there, and no luck so far. Lozenge shaped filler panel above triangular shaped opening. Any clues? Maybe that's where the thong goes.
O.K. - two questions - since I'll get my car next week, what are proper break-in procedures? I've never bought a new car, only used. Can't wait. All I've ever heard is to vary speed and RPM.
Thanks
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20020309/bs_nm/bizfood_dc_1
Of course, the comments come from securities analysts -- and they were so right about Enron weren't they?
As for leasing, what's your opinion of the G35 lease deals? Would you consider them about average or something else? I ran through the calculator on the site yesterday to compare to my own credit union financing. I also read that the Texas legislature repealed the property tax requirement on auto leases, but left it up to each county to decide -- big surprise, most of the counties are still collecting it.
Scott
The software engineers rolled in some changes last night, and some things changed that were not supposed to. AFAIK, no one can see anything but the last 20 posts in any given discussion.
The problem is being addressed, I assure you.
And no, at the moment there is no estimated get well time.
We are sorry.
Pat
Host
Sedans Message Board
I didn't suggest that people should deprive themselves. The point is to do the smart thing, not necessarily the cheapest thing. It just so happens they are one in the same when it comes to buying a car. Of course, for those that can't afford to buy a G35, then leasing might be the only way to provide themselves with some short term gratification.
Truthfully, it seems there are several things that didn't get flipped -- like my pet peeve, the gas tank should be on the driver's side. But, oh well.
Scott
In a more controlled environment, chances are that a auto G35 may match or even beat the manual 330 in 0-60.
Gabman is probably right in that it is the result of engineering cost cutting. Unfortunately, the "compartment" is totally useless, it results in a very asymmetrical appearance to the center stack area, and creates an impression that it is not a very well thought out car (even the small details count). Hey, what about them prop rods! lol
The problem for me is I need flexibility when it comes to cars. I want to get rid of my car when I want not when the leasing company wants. I always end up buying out my lease early which basically means I pay every payment due and give them back the car.
Lately I've been keeping my cars around 20 months and then trading them in. My current car, the 330CI is almost 20 months old now and I still love it so I will keep it till the end of this year and probably trade it in for something new.
Getting back to the G35 . . . I don't mind 'ok' resale value it's just that the Infiniti's seem to have really bad resale value. Much worse then most other cars out there.
Also consider that if you buy a car, with $0 down for simplicity, you also end up financing the tax. After 3 years of a 5 year loan, in which the payments will be higher than the lease rate, even considering tax, you will owe approx the same amount as the residual of the lease.
With my BMWs, after about 1.5 years, I would advise my dealer I was interested in getting a new one. He would find someone to buy my car, and I would get a new one, often for very little difference in monthly payments.
Lastly, after a 3 year lease, you have the option of re-leasing, although not generally worth it, as the payments don't change much; or leasing a new one. If you buy on a 5 year loan, your car is likely out of warranty, or close to it, and its value is approx.25% of new, obviously depends on the car.
In my opinion, leasing is, over time, more expensive than buying, but the flexibility is worth it, and I get to drive a new car whenever I want one. If the G35 is a hit, I gain some equity, and the dealer has a premium used car to sell, in a year or 2. If it is a turkey, and depreciates terribly, then Infiniti takes the hit.
Just some thoughts from someone who has tried both options since 1961. I suspect many of you weren't even born when I started driving my first car, a 1951 Studebaker.
The Q is a great car, I had one in'91 but it never took off as competition to the Lexus as it was intended to. You know the Lexus went up against the Benz and the Q was left to go up against Jag and we all know the rest.
If the G turns out to be the winner that it should be the resale issue may correct itself,but like alot of things in life it is still a crap shoot.
He is a car writer based out of California, Not your ordinary reviewer I may add, he knows what he is talking about. He gave me some great advise, I suggest you look back for it, now that I think about it , it was probably Friday or Saturday as I only picked up my car last Thursday.
Do me a favor, if you find the post # let me know as I need it for someone else. Thanks
There is also a protrusion on the right that looks like an open compartment or nook that is to be used for storing your thong (since it is no good for anything else anyone can think of).
Also, don't forget about those prop rods for the hood - big issue on this board. Seems a lot of people want to show their friends the engine cover, but don't want to see an unsightly prop rod! ;-)
hopefully will hold its value well. Rear drive
sport sedans are becoming an rarity, which is
such a shame given how much more fun they are
to drive than their FWD counterparts.
Pros:
- Very strong off the line, reminiscent of a
540i I testdrove a few days earlier. Lots of
lazy, muscular torque. Nice engine note as well.
- Very quite and composed over irregular roads.
This was with the standard suspension, bumps
were soaked up beautifully while
- Very stable on turns (didn't push it hard,
but didn't doubt that it would stick).
- Salespeople are very courteous, and it is nice
to be treated this way after dealing with
their peers at German makes that shall remain
nameless.
Cons:
- Didn't seem quite as eager at higher speeds.
- VDC is too trigger happy and seems to engage
at the slightest excuse. That's not fun. I think
it is overly conservative and will encourage
people to disable it.
- Interior is not becoming of a luxury car. The
area between the front seats has storage wells
with really cheap looking felt lining.
- The navigation system plastic casing does not
seem to be of high quality. It also chews up
additional storage space above the glovebox.
- Rear seatroom is just adequate, I don't think
it has a lot more legroom than a 3-series.
Does anyone know of any comprehensive roadtest
for this car? All I've seen so far are previews.
-juice
10. Miata. (reference point)
7. Lexus IS300. Fun!
6. Cadillac CTS & BMW 330. Above average.
5. Lincoln LS & BMW 540. Average.
4.5. Infiniti G35 & MB320. Commuter car feel.
1. SUV. (another reference point)
The G35 steering is pathetic. No weight, no feedback. Plus the car simply is no fun to rotate. Conversely the top three cars have very good to decent steering feel and are fun to rotate. Long wheelbase definitely affects this.
Without a doubt the Lexus is the best driver's car (sweet shifter and clutch and enough power for me) but I can't get one because the back seat is too small. The BMW's are overpriced and have crappy reliability. The Caddy needs another 25 hp, is funky looking and the tranny and clutch feel (like the BMW 330 but not the 540) is average.
Damn! I guess I will have to wait for the CTSi with the 3.6l V6 or the upgraded 2003 Lincoln LS (if Lincoln improves the handling). Hmmm, what about the Mazda RX-8? Is it gonna have enough rear seat room? Damn!
It is interesting that no one else seems to have bought the car, and that the raves come from some obvious dealers (e.g. infin1/Leo God bless America, my friend Ernie, and others).
Others have posted about test drives, but no one admits to buying. That is really interesting considering all the posts about how this car is so great and will be snapped up by customers all over the place and it will sell for MSRP all day long. Now we hear about the discounts getting steeper - so soon!
I am anxious to hear from more who have bought the car and to see the real reviews in C&D and R&T.
I even recall a trade of a 95 Maxima SE (loaded) - got about $19K with 56k miles. Salesman's friend was overheard by my wife asking what the salesman paid for it, and telling him he just got one just like it for $13K. The guy was livid, but the deal was done. Moral of the story - work them hard and you will save substantial money.