Also keep in mind that at least 50% of winter driving is about the driver, maybe 25% about the tires, and 25% about the car. Something like that, at least that's my rough assessment of predicting how you'll do in winter driving in any car.
I agree totally Mr Shiftright except the stock RX-8 tires are not a good thing to have on the car in cold weather. It's difficult to overcome having "skis" on the wheels with skill ;-). We're using Nokian WR tires in winter with excellant results. We also bought wheels (AR I think), in the 17" size. Tires are stock size except in 17".
No Disagreement with either of you. I remember driving V8 powered RWD, no trac control junkers with skinny, no tread tires in the winter while in my youth. Never had a problem.
Not saying I'm a skilled winter driver....just that the rules of physics regarding winter driving don't change.
Just did a few checks on my MPG since the "M" flash. getting 18.6 mpg city! This was in mostly full automatic mode on the AT. (a few ventures into the faux-shift mode - come on - it's fun!!) I was getting around 15/16 mpg, so I am happy I am near what it says it should get. No worse then my old car! So, the next check will be the HWY MPG. Need a nice long trip - hmm....Disney World!!! wheeee!!!
HI, Folks, I have been reading this excellent forum for almost a year now - for two months before buying my RX8 and ever since. Some overall comments - mine is a Nordic Green AT loaded with everything but the expensive Navigator option - we use a Garmin iQue GPS/PDA instead. Now have 7,500 happy miles on ours. Problems ? Like many others, it stalled out once in the early days from moving it a short distance. Mazda Road Assistance picked it up within an hour and installed the new hotter plugs - No more problem. Mileage ? First 4,000 miles we were getting 15-16 in town, and 19-20 highway. Got the M flash at 4,000 miles - now getting 18-19 in town, 21-23 highway - AND better acceleration. Air conditioning ? Hated the poor air conditioning - had to wait for the amplifier for three months. Had the amp installed - NO more problem - cabin cools in less than 5 minutes and maintains temp with fan at only speed two - great ! Snow tires ? Was not about the risk my baby on the roads of Connecticut without snow tires. Had our dealer install Blizzak LM-22's, 18" - NO problem. I still do not drive on icy roads - but any other winter conditions have been a snap. Dealer service - Modern Motors of Thomaston, CT is the best in the world - we have had eight Mazdas from them this past 18 years - superb to deal with and fantastic service. Overall impression - a wonderful car. I waited 45 years to own a sports car - had planned to buy one way back then but got a wife instead - she has lasted a lot better than the Volvo P1800 would have. Now I am having the time of my life in my RX8 - driving from Canada to the Outer Banks has been a total joy. So - jump right in - get one - you will never regret it !!
Forgot to mention one item. At about 6,500 miles the car stopped dead and was belching black smoke - scared to think what was wrong - had just returned from a 1,600 mile road trip. Car was flat bedded to the dealer and this was the result. I had added too MUCH oil. The dipstick is hard to read - as a result I kept adding oil every gas tank fill up. Turns out I had added 1 1/2 quarts too much - it flooded the air filter - and the computer shut things down. The moral of this story is simple - the RX8 does use oil as a normal part of operation - but not that much. Learn to read the dip stick properly - check it every 400-500 miles and add only if the level is nearing the low level mark on the stick. Lesson learned - no more problems.
is due to the design of the rotary engine. Rotary engine, by design, injects a little bit of oil into the combustion chamber to lubricate the seals for lubrication and build compression in the engine. on average it consumes about 1 qt every 3000 miles, the harder you rev the more oil it consumes.
just keep an eye on the oil level and you should be fine
The "seals" that hold in the burning fuel/air must be lubricated.
In a piston engine we're talking about the rings, and the lubrication is done by "splashing" oil in the crankcase onto the cylinder walls. The oil rings remove most, but not all of it. Most piston engines end up using about 1 l per 5000 km or so (close to an American quart). You often don't notice this due to fuel getting into the oil and bringing the level up a bit.
In a rotary engine the seals are not exposed to the "crankcase" - they are inside the rotor housing (the oil pan is below the rotor housings). To lubricate the seals (apex seals, corner seals, and side seals) oil from the oilpan is injected into the intake stream. Because this method is a bit "iffy" (there is uncertainty about how much gets to the seals and when), a little more oil must be used than would otherwise be necessary. Hence, the rotary uses a little more oil than a piston engine - perhaps up to 1.5 times as much.
If you see the level going down, consider yourself lucky. It means you are not getting a lot of fuel in the oil (another trait of rotary engines). In my 3rd gen RX-7 the oil level doesn't drop, due to fuel dillution keeping the fluid level up.
You should see the level get low enough to add a quart about 2/3 of the way to change time. This is discussed in your owners manual.
Good review. "M" reflash of the ECU seems to be "the ticket" for better MPG and, what feels to me by seat of the pants, more power and grunt.
I've had my RX8 for a little over a year, and can say in all fairness, it is the best sports car I've owned. That includes a couple of highly regarded BMWs. Regardless of the different ways to do a comparison...be it build quality, high quality materials, performance, ride, handling, acceleration, etc, there's really nothing that comes close at the price.
Just came back from my dealership to get an oil change.
I ran into the GM there (who was the SM when I bought my car). He asked how things were going with the RX8. Of course, I said things were great.
Then he says, "you in a hurry?". I ask why and he asks me to step into his office. We get some coffee and sit down. He asks me if I'm curious about the '05s? "Sure!" Well, not much new except the color changes we've all heard about (yellow is no longer and is replaced by some sort of cream color, by the look of the swatch he shows me).
More interesting was what he told me about the '06s. He'd just returned from the Hirshima factory for some sort of dealer meeting.
From our conversation, apparently Mazda is upping HP to about 330 and introducing a convertible for '06.
While curiosity was getting the better of me as to how they were going to up HP (turbo? supercharger? additional rotor? new ECU?), but by this time I was beginning to get worried about a conference call that I HAD to be on.
BTW, I did find out that there are no plans for an RX7. It would be slicing the RX model line-up too thin.
I knew that the current iteration of the RENESIS was capable of 300 HP because Mazda had already tested one of those.
What surprised me was the 330 HP figure the guy told me about. That leads me to believe there may be some sort of forced induction involved, too. That is, unless they have some sort of plan for a 3 rotor RENESIS, which they already produced in Japan. It would take some sort of "trickery" with the ECU if they went that route.
Either way they go, the '06 will be some sort of screamer given its already sterling handling.
I may be trading sooner than I originally thought. My original intent was to keep my RX8 until the magical 100K mile mark. Now, 100 extra HP may make me change my mind.
GGUY - cool news! But I gotta ask - this was all for you manual users correct?...Because it was the extra HP that the auto tranny couldn't handle, that forced the numbers down - correct?.....300+hp would be pretty niffty, of course mpg would change.
Speaking of mpg - another update on my AT. 13 gallons over 244.8 miles = 18.83 mpg.....makes me happy! :-) get the "M" flash folks!
First the comment on the auto trans: The renesis engine is capable of generating about 250 HP in normal asperation mode. It does this just short of 9000 RPM with the six port intake valve switching system employed in the "high power" version. This output was reduced due to emissions - hence the current quoted value of 238 HP. Many suspect it's really just under 220 HP.
The auto trans. that Mazda had on hand to use with the car can't take -high RPM-, not high power. If you limit the RPM to 7500 or so you get the lower power figure the auto version has. A slight improvement in torque at lower RPM was possible by changing to a four intake port design - this was desirable for a 4 speed transmission so was used on the auto version. This version of engine was also used for a "lower cost" 5 speed manual transmission version (not imported to North America). The four port intake degraded the high RPM output so the six port was kept for the "high power" manual 6 speed transmission version.
I have heard some "insider" information indicating there are plans for a 5 speed auto transmission and a paddle shifting type 6 speed semi-auto in the 2006 model year. The new auto may be capable of seeing 9000 RPM, so hold onto your seats! Last I heard there are no final decisions yet on what will go into the car. I suspect a new transmission would be needed if the 300+ HP figure is correct, as the current unit is rumoured to be a bit weak.
So the above post and what I've heard may mesh and give us a very desirable car. Expect it to increase in cost $5-$10 thousand over "base" (what we have now). Those paddle shifting semi-autos are not inexpensive to manufacture!
For the marketers, also expect fancier livery in the car to go with the higher price. Hints on what this may entail can be seen in the Japanese accessory brochure (accessable on the Mazda Japan website).
I recently test drove a base 6-speed RX-8 and was impressed with the car. The suspension really soaked the bumps up around town. But when we took it on the I15 the ride was awful. It was bucking up and down over the quick dips in the concrete (something my current car does not.) And the tires were sending a lot of road noise into the cabin. For those that spend a lot of time on interstates how is the ride?
I can only divulge what the GM at my dealer is telling me from his visit to Hiroshima.
Usually, the dealer's aren't to forthcoming with information regarding future models as they want you to buy the latest/greatest models. That's why I was a bit surprised when he told me to wait for the '06.
I didn't have any questions about the automatic (sorry cheezeboy), so I can't comment on what Pathstar has posted.
I did have questions on pricing. The GM said price increases for '06 would be "marginal", but he wouldn't give me dollar figures. Totally loaded @ $35K MSRP would be palatable. The GM said I was well within the ballpark with my "guesstimate". As you approach that $40K mark, I would think things would get "dicy" for the RX8, however. I would hope that's the case. The last RX7 was discontinued partly because the price had creeped too far up. I would hope Mazda had learned their lesson. This is a "hotly" contested and competitive market segment too.
2-door version isn't in the plans as the RX8 has been successful with the 4-door coupe iteration. Convertible is in the plans, however. That would be very unique....a 4-door convertible.
As far as ride quality on the highway, I like it....a lot. It's not going to ride like an Accord, Camry or Buick, but for a sports car, I think the ride is exemplary.
Pathstar - thanks for the info!!....more hp is always welcome in any transmission! Can you explain how the whole paddle shifting tranny works?(or send me to a website!) It's interesting that it will hold the gear up till just past the "beep" and then shift for me - as well as up shift if I stomp the pedal. Just curious! :-)
Dunbar - I've taken two long interstate trip here in South Florida. No problems here, however, the interior noise is louder than the lux-o-boat I used to drive, but that is expected. Way more quiet than my old Jeep!! The ride was lots of fun, but I guess it all depends on what else you drive. Did your test car have the Sports Package? Because that will make a difference as well.
My guess is it would be a year from this coming Sept. I don't know of any auto shows this time of year and I doubt Mazda would show one 6 months before it was released at their dealers as not to cannabalize their current model sales.
Maybe some trade rag buz sometime in March/April/May of '05?
I'd say a good bet would be it's still a year away from hitting showrooms.
Well, the original concept car that became the RX-8 had a true paddle shifting system. The shift lever on the console had three positions, auto (so it does the shifting by itself), manual (you have to shift with the paddles - touch one for up and the other for down a gear - and the paddles looked the same as the current auto RX-8), and reverse. At least that's what I inferred by looking at the thing.
To describe how it works, first lets dispel any notion of the current RX-8 auto cars - they are "normal" automatic transmission cars with the paddles just forcing the shift. Otherwise they are standard torque converter, self protected automatics (they will shift to protect the transmission if they have to).
A "true" paddle shifting transmission is the type used in formula 1 and some top level European cars (BMW for example). It is a true "gear type" - not sun/planet gear gearbox and has no torque converter. It has a clutch. The system operates the clutch for you. When you select the next gear (either up or down) it engages the clutch and shifts, then releases the clutch - very fast. When you let the RPMs drop too low it engages the clutch (so as not to stall the engine). Very different from what we are accustomed to.
I'm told there is a "learning curve" for drivers new to it - steep for F1 cars, not too bad for a BMW (as befits a $100K+ car ;-).
A formula 1 car will drop into "rest mode" if you let the RPMs drop below 4000 or so (depending on the maker). You then have to stop, press a button twice to go to "start mode", rev the engine and release the start button, keeping the RPMs above 4000 as the tires spin and grip, but keeping the engine below 17,000 RPM. BTW, did I mention the engine puts out 700+ HP and the thing reacts faster than you can think! I'm told it's entertaining in the wet - in the pits!
There actually are advantages to having a low torque rotary engine ;-).
I wish I'd had more time with the GM at the dealership, but I didn't have much time to "pick his brain".
One can only speculate....early development had the RENESIS at 300 HP without using any sort of forced induction. So, if that 330 HP number is real AND they use the current rotary as basis, you can realistically expect that they'd have to at least use some sort of low pressure turbo to achieve those numbers. Factory reps in the past have mentioned that the current RENESIS lends itself well for supercharging, too. Again, speculation, but if you read between the lines, it would be possible to have an electric motor actually drive the supercharger as opposed to using the rotary to do it. 3 rotors could be a possibility, but that would be costly, unless Mazda has already depreciated most of the tooling for such a rotary (which is a definite possibility since they already have a 3 rotor in Japan). The downside is I don't think that motor is nearly as compact or has the weight advantages of the current RENESIS.
Personally, I already think the RX8 blows the 350Z/G35C out of the water, but with an increase in HP that big, I don't know of anyone that would want a 350Z/G35C for anything more than the brand they are associated with.
I agree, pricing is key. You move the RX8 into the $40K realm, and all of a sudden you butt up against a 400 HP C6 Covette. One would think Mazda learned their lesson with the previous RX7 in that regard.
Anyway, the future looks very bright for our beloved RX8s.
pathstar - thanks for the info!! I know the paddles are purely a "fun" factor and not a true system, but I didn't know the details as to how it all works. So your info sent me to my new favorite website: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/ !!!....now my tiny brain hurts!! :-)
ok...gotta go find out how the Enzo works!...heehee
This is the RX-8 Mazdaspeed Version II. Unlike the first Mazdaspeed RX-8 that only included body and suspension mods, this one actually ups the engine.
I don't think a Cold Air Intake, Sports Exhaust and Cat, Grounding Kit, and special spark plugs are enough to bump horsepower to 300, even with a special ECU to manage it all, but it should be a bump nonetheless. From the Japanese 250PS to 270 maybe? Add that to a lightweight flywheel, thicker stabilizer bars, and 4-way adjustable shocks, that's a good package for 3,650,000 Yen (about $33,200).
The production is limited to 180 cars in Japan, in Strato Blue Mica only. Who knows if something similar will ever be sold here.
I don't think a Cold Air Intake, Sports Exhaust and Cat...
There are tuners in the Bay Area that I know that can bump up 60+hp to a 255hp 3rd gen RX-7 by Cold Air Intake, Downpipe, Exhaust, remapped ECU, etc. The cost typically runs about $100 per hp. I know of one who is looking into the RX-8. So, they(Cold Intake, etc) might be enough...
So, for a 60+ hp bump, owner's were willing to shell out $6000????
BTW - I would imagine that gaining 60+ hp in a turbo motor would be easier than the same bump in a NA motor; especially one that breathes as well as a stock Renesis.
I should have broken down the costs: About 55% are parts and the other 45% labor. Parts are pretty standard. You need to pay good $$$ for labor to get the parts matched and installed correctly. I have heard horror stories on wrongly matched and/or poorly installed parts which leads to poor reliability. One could save $$ by going to a lower hourly rate shop.
As for the stock renesis on the RX8, I don't know yet. Like I said, this tuner is starting to look into it. Might or might not get the same bump on equivalent parts for the same dollar amount. I'll post once I know something.
Yes, the extra HP on the 3rd gen RX-7 is had by freeing up the exhaust, but it's because this allows higher boost to "occur" (usually ups it from 10 PSI peak to 12 or so). It's often uncontrolled as well, therefore the well known ease of destroying engines in the 3rd gen.
I would be surprised if the Mazdaspeed car has more than 20 HP over the current unit.
How do you get more HP without increasing engine size?
1. You increase the amount of air/fuel mixture in the engine - by improved breathing intake and exhaust if possible, or by forced induction. The current RX-8 has a pretty good intake, and the only real restriction in the exhaust is the cat. - at RPMs up to about 8500. If you increase either of the above you must ensure the mixture is corrected as necessary. You will often see a slight drop in low RPM torque and an increase in high RPM power (above 7000 RPM), as that's where the flow restriction begins to have an effect (at higher RPM more gas is flowing).
2. You increase the RPM. More power pulses per minute means more HP. Difficult to imagine on an engine already rated to 9000 RPM, but I suppose still possible.
3. Air/fuel ratio is the key to getting maximum power from any engine, and this is often compromised by emissions requirements. So in that case, you could increase power by adjusting the air/fuel for optimum power. This would be illegal for a street car, of course. BTW, this is usually why you see an "improvement" in power when you try aftermarket "high flow" intakes and exhausts. They change the air/fuel ratio just enough to get closer to optimum power. What we've seen is with some of the RX-8s out there it causes them to run too lean - which results in slight pinging - which triggers the excellant detonation prevention system into operation. The RX-8 has a much better system than the 3rd gen had. If your car "dies" at certain RPMs under WOT that's probably what's happening. The system will react mildly to limited pinging, but if you persist or enter an extreme pinging condition, it will "shut you down" for up to 15 sec.
I've had my brand new RX-8 now for about 3 weeks. It's Nordic Green, Touring package 6sp M. I thought originally I wanted the red, but seeing the green at the dealer convinced me. Like the red, the paint seems to show different colors in different lighting and sparkles beautifully in bright sun. So far I really love the car - the way it drives and the comfort and value. It handles like a slot car and has plenty of power for me. Gas mileage is pretty low (well below the EPA sticker) but I was prepared for that, and hopefully it will improve with breakin in. The car is still quite new. In a mix of suburban stop and go and highway, the two tanks of gas I've used so far have been about 15 and 16 mpg. Just looking at the gas guage and trip odometer this morning, this tank looks to be about the same (at which point it will have about 600-700 total miles on it)
This is the first sports car I've owned since my beloved (and at the same time hated - British cars are like that) '75 Triumph TR-7. The RX-8 handles the curves with the same flat, tight confidence my TR-7 did with twice the power.
I've only seen one other one on the road so far (here in Connecticut).
A nice touch - my dealer says free car washes as long as you own the car - just stop in anytime you like. A nice touch. Unfortunately, they are 45 minutes drive.
on the new ride! for low gas mileage, check with your dealer service dept for the latest ECU reflash (the (in?)famous 'M flash'). Should give you better fuel economy and (some have noted) better power!
Noticed in the local news paper today that a dealor near me is doing a special lease rate for 24months at 249 a month with 12K miles... now I've been searching for a car for over a year now and due to some ... well i'll just leave it as circumstances... I'm forced to hold off on the car I really want (04 TL or BMW330)... anyways one of our cars just died and its time to get another... and since I'm the only one who can semi afford one right now the RX8 is looking like something I might enjoy. the lease is for an Auto with the sport package; though I'd like to learn how to drive stick and get it as a manual, but since the car is only going to be mine for about 7 months the other benificiary maintains that it needs to be an automatic...does anyone know if this is good price ect... I plan on making my decision at weeks end so please if anyone could email me (cjsg35@hotmail.com) and let me know how they liked theres and if they dont mind give me a heads up to what i can respectively argue the lease prices out to i'd greatly apriciate it.
what happens after 7 months? someone else taking the payments over?
anyway, i saw that same deal in my paper (been in there for a while now, actually) and it does involve quite a bit of money down (don't remember how much exactly, but I believe it was at least $3K). Just didn't know if you realized that, so i wanted to point it out. Frankly, if I were in your situation, and only needed a temporary car for 7 months, I'd use all that cash you'd be putting down on the RX8 and buy a used economy car, drive it for 7 months, and then resell it when you are ready to get the car you are really shooting for. If you are nice to it and get a decent deal to begin with, it might cost you next to nothing in the end.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
"...though I'd like to learn how to drive stick and get it as a manual, but since the car is only going to be mine for about 7 months the other benificiary maintains that it needs to be an automatic..."
The key phrase there is "other benificiary". I'm guessing that his wife will be receiving the RX-8 due to the other car going off lease. He also said he was "holding off" on what he really wanted (04 TL or BMW330).
but that's where i'm getting confused. if its his wife, the payments would be theirs to take care of no matter what. so putting money towards a 28K car like the RX8 is only making it that much harder for him to get his "dream car." I just don't follow the reasoning where something near $30K is a temporary car on the way to getting something $35-$45K.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Hey, everyone. I've been so busy I haven't been able to visit for a couple weeks. The 330HP rumor for the '06 RX-8 is fun to think about, but I'd be surprised to actually see it. That is such a jump over the current numbers. I would expect a minor HP increase like the Miata Mazdaspeed, but nothing so drastic. A convertible version would keep the interest in the RX-8, and that seems to be the trend that a lot of manufacturers are following rather than drastically changing the engine, so that is foreseeable. With price, emission standards and mpg issues, I think it would be tough to raise the HP output that much. The cost would definitely reach close to a base C6.
On the other hand, Chrysler has three engines for their 300C (not including the SRT-8). Maybe Mazda could have the 330HP at around $35K-$36K base (reaching $39K loaded), then up the HP in its current 6MT rotary to 250HP at the same price as now, followed by the 210HP originally stated for the auto. Pathstar could tell us what kind of engine (and what turbo/supercharge) would be most likely if the 330 HP was to exist. Mazda could have a convertible for the 250 and 330 models, and have a market for each version. That way the same thing which hurt the RX-7 won't happen again while still luring the people who will pay for more power. If the 330HP Mazdaspeed RX-8 does happen, I see it doing well as long as it stays under the $40K mark.
GGuy - jeeze...you're thinking about selling your baby so soon?!?....the horror!....don't say that too loud or your RX8 will hear.....if it doesn't start tomorrow morning, you only have yourself to blame!!..LOL!!.....
sorry quoted the paper wrong (or the things changed) but anyways its still 24 months but its now 299 with nothing but the first months payment dew at signing... (there sign and drive thing ) anyways is that good? its for a auto with sport package.... I' haven't done research into the whole payment averages off the boards... well after 7 months my fathers takin the car and I'm gonna lease an 04 well by that time 05 TL (whole reason where doing it this way is because his lease on his malibue is up in rouphly 7 months so he'll need a car then) oh yea never get a malibue speaking from experience.. he got wrangled into a 5 year lease for 350 a month... yea don't ask me how but it sucks... so he'll take the RX8 and I'll get the TL... well thank you for the help
well, if he's happy taking the RX8 and won't go over those 12K miles a year, I think its a nice deal. I certainly wouldn't mind having my options reopened in 2 years and only have spent $299 a month up to that point to drive something like the RX8.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Naw....there has to be a big "trigger" for me to sell my RX8. One of these things has to happen...
1. the '06 RX8 really will have a ~100HP upgrade (in which case, I'll buy another 330HP RX8 in '06) 2. the '06 RX8 doesn't have a huge price increase 3. the C6 Corvette turns out to be one if the better Corvette iterations (no major reliability or build quality issues)
Outside of those points, I'll keep my RX8 until I hit 100K miles (which should be sometime around the 2009-2010 model year).
And, yes, I still love my RX8 after over a year of ownership. There really isn't anything else I can see on the market (or anything I've heard coming down the pike except for the above) that would cause me to look elsewhere than the RX8.
That's the way I feel about my vehicle too. Except for those vehicles which are considered "supercars", there just isn't anything out there or in the making that would make me want to get rid of it.
I can see where someone would consider another roadster over an S2000 (except when you go into the $XX,XXX more dollars categories). Same with the RX8. I can't see spending a lot more money to get the same (or maybe a little better) performance, features, build, comfort, etc that the RX8 offers.
If there's a big jump in performance for a little more money, now you've got my attetion.
We'll see what Mazda brings to the '06 RX8 table. If it's only going to be a small power bump, I won't bother with it. If however, it is anywhere near what they're talking about, I'd have to give it a serious look.
The only other place I might go with my next sports car purchase would be to the C6 Corvette. The C5 didn't "grab me" enough to make the higher dollar investment over the RX8.
this question is more aimed toward Rich(audia8q) than anyone else, but does anyone know when the '05s should start showing up at the dealerships, specifically here on the east coast??
Comments
Although, I don't drive mine much in the winter, by all reports, with snow tires all around, it does quite well, however.
In extreme conditions, stay home.
Not saying I'm a skilled winter driver....just that the rules of physics regarding winter driving don't change.
Let us know how the highway MPG tallies.
I have been reading this excellent forum for almost a year now - for two months before buying my RX8 and ever since. Some overall comments - mine is a Nordic Green AT loaded with everything but the expensive Navigator option - we use a Garmin iQue GPS/PDA instead. Now have 7,500 happy miles on ours. Problems ? Like many others, it stalled out once in the early days from moving it a short distance. Mazda Road Assistance picked it up within an hour and installed the new hotter plugs - No more problem.
Mileage ? First 4,000 miles we were getting 15-16 in town, and 19-20 highway. Got the M flash at 4,000 miles - now getting 18-19 in town, 21-23 highway - AND better acceleration. Air conditioning ? Hated the poor air conditioning - had to wait for the amplifier for three months. Had the amp installed - NO more problem - cabin cools in less than 5 minutes and maintains temp with fan at only speed two - great !
Snow tires ? Was not about the risk my baby on the roads of Connecticut without snow tires. Had our dealer install Blizzak LM-22's, 18" - NO problem. I still do not drive on icy roads - but any other winter conditions have been a snap.
Dealer service - Modern Motors of Thomaston, CT is the best in the world - we have had eight Mazdas from them this past 18 years - superb to deal with and fantastic service.
Overall impression - a wonderful car. I waited 45 years to own a sports car - had planned to buy one way back then but got a wife instead - she has lasted a lot better than the Volvo P1800 would have. Now I am having the time of my life in my RX8 - driving from Canada to the Outer Banks has been a total joy.
So - jump right in - get one - you will never regret it !!
Cheers ~
Ojisan Bob
Forgot to mention one item. At about 6,500 miles the car stopped dead and was belching black smoke - scared to think what was wrong - had just returned from a 1,600 mile road trip. Car was flat bedded to the dealer and this was the result. I had added too MUCH oil. The dipstick is hard to read - as a result I kept adding oil every gas tank fill up. Turns out I had added 1 1/2 quarts too much - it flooded the air filter - and the computer shut things down. The moral of this story is simple - the RX8 does use oil as a normal part of operation - but not that much. Learn to read the dip stick properly - check it every 400-500 miles and add only if the level is nearing the low level mark on the stick. Lesson learned - no more problems.
Cheers ~
Ojisan Bob
just keep an eye on the oil level and you should be fine
In a piston engine we're talking about the rings, and the lubrication is done by "splashing" oil in the crankcase onto the cylinder walls. The oil rings remove most, but not all of it. Most piston engines end up using about 1 l per 5000 km or so (close to an American quart). You often don't notice this due to fuel getting into the oil and bringing the level up a bit.
In a rotary engine the seals are not exposed to the "crankcase" - they are inside the rotor housing (the oil pan is below the rotor housings). To lubricate the seals (apex seals, corner seals, and side seals) oil from the oilpan is injected into the intake stream. Because this method is a bit "iffy" (there is uncertainty about how much gets to the seals and when), a little more oil must be used than would otherwise be necessary. Hence, the rotary uses a little more oil than a piston engine - perhaps up to 1.5 times as much.
If you see the level going down, consider yourself lucky. It means you are not getting a lot of fuel in the oil (another trait of rotary engines). In my 3rd gen RX-7 the oil level doesn't drop, due to fuel dillution keeping the fluid level up.
You should see the level get low enough to add a quart about 2/3 of the way to change time. This is discussed in your owners manual.
I've had my RX8 for a little over a year, and can say in all fairness, it is the best sports car I've owned. That includes a couple of highly regarded BMWs. Regardless of the different ways to do a comparison...be it build quality, high quality materials, performance, ride, handling, acceleration, etc, there's really nothing that comes close at the price.
Welcome to the club!
I ran into the GM there (who was the SM when I bought my car). He asked how things were going with the RX8. Of course, I said things were great.
Then he says, "you in a hurry?". I ask why and he asks me to step into his office. We get some coffee and sit down. He asks me if I'm curious about the '05s? "Sure!" Well, not much new except the color changes we've all heard about (yellow is no longer and is replaced by some sort of cream color, by the look of the swatch he shows me).
More interesting was what he told me about the '06s. He'd just returned from the Hirshima factory for some sort of dealer meeting.
From our conversation, apparently Mazda is upping HP to about 330 and introducing a convertible for '06.
While curiosity was getting the better of me as to how they were going to up HP (turbo? supercharger? additional rotor? new ECU?), but by this time I was beginning to get worried about a conference call that I HAD to be on.
BTW, I did find out that there are no plans for an RX7. It would be slicing the RX model line-up too thin.
I'll see if I can find out more.
What surprised me was the 330 HP figure the guy told me about. That leads me to believe there may be some sort of forced induction involved, too. That is, unless they have some sort of plan for a 3 rotor RENESIS, which they already produced in Japan. It would take some sort of "trickery" with the ECU if they went that route.
Either way they go, the '06 will be some sort of screamer given its already sterling handling.
I may be trading sooner than I originally thought. My original intent was to keep my RX8 until the magical 100K mile mark. Now, 100 extra HP may make me change my mind.
Can you ask whether they'll be coming out with a two-door, fixed-roof coupe?
Speaking of mpg - another update on my AT. 13 gallons over 244.8 miles = 18.83 mpg.....makes me happy! :-) get the "M" flash folks!
The renesis engine is capable of generating about 250 HP in normal asperation mode. It does this just short of 9000 RPM with the six port intake valve switching system employed in the "high power" version. This output was reduced due to emissions - hence the current quoted value of 238 HP. Many suspect it's really just under 220 HP.
The auto trans. that Mazda had on hand to use with the car can't take -high RPM-, not high power. If you limit the RPM to 7500 or so you get the lower power figure the auto version has. A slight improvement in torque at lower RPM was possible by changing to a four intake port design - this was desirable for a 4 speed transmission so was used on the auto version. This version of engine was also used for a "lower cost" 5 speed manual transmission version (not imported to North America). The four port intake degraded the high RPM output so the six port was kept for the "high power" manual 6 speed transmission version.
I have heard some "insider" information indicating there are plans for a 5 speed auto transmission and a paddle shifting type 6 speed semi-auto in the 2006 model year. The new auto may be capable of seeing 9000 RPM, so hold onto your seats! Last I heard there are no final decisions yet on what will go into the car. I suspect a new transmission would be needed if the 300+ HP figure is correct, as the current unit is rumoured to be a bit weak.
So the above post and what I've heard may mesh and give us a very desirable car. Expect it to increase in cost $5-$10 thousand over "base" (what we have now). Those paddle shifting semi-autos are not inexpensive to manufacture!
For the marketers, also expect fancier livery in the car to go with the higher price. Hints on what this may entail can be seen in the Japanese accessory brochure (accessable on the Mazda Japan website).
Usually, the dealer's aren't to forthcoming with information regarding future models as they want you to buy the latest/greatest models. That's why I was a bit surprised when he told me to wait for the '06.
I didn't have any questions about the automatic (sorry cheezeboy), so I can't comment on what Pathstar has posted.
I did have questions on pricing. The GM said price increases for '06 would be "marginal", but he wouldn't give me dollar figures. Totally loaded @ $35K MSRP would be palatable. The GM said I was well within the ballpark with my "guesstimate". As you approach that $40K mark, I would think things would get "dicy" for the RX8, however. I would hope that's the case. The last RX7 was discontinued partly because the price had creeped too far up. I would hope Mazda had learned their lesson. This is a "hotly" contested and competitive market segment too.
2-door version isn't in the plans as the RX8 has been successful with the 4-door coupe iteration. Convertible is in the plans, however. That would be very unique....a 4-door convertible.
As far as ride quality on the highway, I like it....a lot. It's not going to ride like an Accord, Camry or Buick, but for a sports car, I think the ride is exemplary.
Dunbar - I've taken two long interstate trip here in South Florida. No problems here, however, the interior noise is louder than the lux-o-boat I used to drive, but that is expected. Way more quiet than my old Jeep!! The ride was lots of fun, but I guess it all depends on what else you drive. Did your test car have the Sports Package? Because that will make a difference as well.
My guess is it would be a year from this coming Sept. I don't know of any auto shows this time of year and I doubt Mazda would show one 6 months before it was released at their dealers as not to cannabalize their current model sales.
Maybe some trade rag buz sometime in March/April/May of '05?
I'd say a good bet would be it's still a year away from hitting showrooms.
Who knows.
To describe how it works, first lets dispel any notion of the current RX-8 auto cars - they are "normal" automatic transmission cars with the paddles just forcing the shift. Otherwise they are standard torque converter, self protected automatics (they will shift to protect the transmission if they have to).
A "true" paddle shifting transmission is the type used in formula 1 and some top level European cars (BMW for example). It is a true "gear type" - not sun/planet gear gearbox and has no torque converter. It has a clutch. The system operates the clutch for you. When you select the next gear (either up or down) it engages the clutch and shifts, then releases the clutch - very fast. When you let the RPMs drop too low it engages the clutch (so as not to stall the engine). Very different from what we are accustomed to.
I'm told there is a "learning curve" for drivers new to it - steep for F1 cars, not too bad for a BMW (as befits a $100K+ car ;-).
A formula 1 car will drop into "rest mode" if you let the RPMs drop below 4000 or so (depending on the maker). You then have to stop, press a button twice to go to "start mode", rev the engine and release the start button, keeping the RPMs above 4000 as the tires spin and grip, but keeping the engine below 17,000 RPM. BTW, did I mention the engine puts out 700+ HP and the thing reacts faster than you can think! I'm told it's entertaining in the wet - in the pits!
There actually are advantages to having a low torque rotary engine ;-).
(Though if it starts approaching $40K, then the $44K 400HP C6 starts looking more attractive.)
Any word from the dealer on how Mazda plans to achieve this HP increase? Larger rotors, three rotors, turbo, supercharger?
One can only speculate....early development had the RENESIS at 300 HP without using any sort of forced induction. So, if that 330 HP number is real AND they use the current rotary as basis, you can realistically expect that they'd have to at least use some sort of low pressure turbo to achieve those numbers. Factory reps in the past have mentioned that the current RENESIS lends itself well for supercharging, too. Again, speculation, but if you read between the lines, it would be possible to have an electric motor actually drive the supercharger as opposed to using the rotary to do it. 3 rotors could be a possibility, but that would be costly, unless Mazda has already depreciated most of the tooling for such a rotary (which is a definite possibility since they already have a 3 rotor in Japan). The downside is I don't think that motor is nearly as compact or has the weight advantages of the current RENESIS.
Personally, I already think the RX8 blows the 350Z/G35C out of the water, but with an increase in HP that big, I don't know of anyone that would want a 350Z/G35C for anything more than the brand they are associated with.
I agree, pricing is key. You move the RX8 into the $40K realm, and all of a sudden you butt up against a 400 HP C6 Covette. One would think Mazda learned their lesson with the previous RX7 in that regard.
Anyway, the future looks very bright for our beloved RX8s.
ok...gotta go find out how the Enzo works!...heehee
http://www.mazda.co.jp/customize/rx-8msv/
This is the RX-8 Mazdaspeed Version II. Unlike the first Mazdaspeed RX-8 that only included body and suspension mods, this one actually ups the engine.
I don't think a Cold Air Intake, Sports Exhaust and Cat, Grounding Kit, and special spark plugs are enough to bump horsepower to 300, even with a special ECU to manage it all, but it should be a bump nonetheless. From the Japanese 250PS to 270 maybe? Add that to a lightweight flywheel, thicker stabilizer bars, and 4-way adjustable shocks, that's a good package for 3,650,000 Yen (about $33,200).
The production is limited to 180 cars in Japan, in Strato Blue Mica only. Who knows if something similar will ever be sold here.
Mike
There are tuners in the Bay Area that I know that can bump up 60+hp to a 255hp 3rd gen RX-7 by Cold Air Intake, Downpipe, Exhaust, remapped ECU, etc. The cost typically runs about $100 per hp. I know of one who is looking into the RX-8. So, they(Cold Intake, etc) might be enough...
So, for a 60+ hp bump, owner's were willing to shell out $6000????
BTW - I would imagine that gaining 60+ hp in a turbo motor would be easier than the same bump in a NA motor; especially one that breathes as well as a stock Renesis.
About 55% are parts and the other 45% labor. Parts are pretty standard. You need to pay good $$$ for labor to get the parts matched and installed correctly. I have heard horror stories on wrongly matched and/or poorly installed parts which leads to poor reliability. One could save $$ by going to a lower hourly rate shop.
As for the stock renesis on the RX8, I don't know yet. Like I said, this tuner is starting to look into it. Might or might not get the same bump on equivalent parts for the same dollar amount. I'll post once I know something.
I would be surprised if the Mazdaspeed car has more than 20 HP over the current unit.
How do you get more HP without increasing engine size?
1. You increase the amount of air/fuel mixture in the engine - by improved breathing intake and exhaust if possible, or by forced induction. The current RX-8 has a pretty good intake, and the only real restriction in the exhaust is the cat. - at RPMs up to about 8500. If you increase either of the above you must ensure the mixture is corrected as necessary. You will often see a slight drop in low RPM torque and an increase in high RPM power (above 7000 RPM), as that's where the flow restriction begins to have an effect (at higher RPM more gas is flowing).
2. You increase the RPM. More power pulses per minute means more HP. Difficult to imagine on an engine already rated to 9000 RPM, but I suppose still possible.
3. Air/fuel ratio is the key to getting maximum power from any engine, and this is often compromised by emissions requirements. So in that case, you could increase power by adjusting the air/fuel for optimum power. This would be illegal for a street car, of course. BTW, this is usually why you see an "improvement" in power when you try aftermarket "high flow" intakes and exhausts. They change the air/fuel ratio just enough to get closer to optimum power. What we've seen is with some of the RX-8s out there it causes them to run too lean - which results in slight pinging - which triggers the excellant detonation prevention system into operation. The RX-8 has a much better system than the 3rd gen had. If your car "dies" at certain RPMs under WOT that's probably what's happening. The system will react mildly to limited pinging, but if you persist or enter an extreme pinging condition, it will "shut you down" for up to 15 sec.
Accordingly to a couple of US magazines, the JDM Mazdaspeed(version I) is rated around 255hp(or +20 over).
gotenks243 was talking about version II.
I've had my brand new RX-8 now for about 3 weeks. It's Nordic Green, Touring package 6sp M. I thought originally I wanted the red, but seeing the green at the dealer convinced me. Like the red, the paint seems to show different colors in different lighting and sparkles beautifully in bright sun. So far I really love the car - the way it drives and the comfort and value. It handles like a slot car and has plenty of power for me. Gas mileage is pretty low (well below the EPA sticker) but I was prepared for that, and hopefully it will improve with breakin in. The car is still quite new. In a mix of suburban stop and go and highway, the two tanks of gas I've used so far have been about 15 and 16 mpg. Just looking at the gas guage and trip odometer this morning, this tank looks to be about the same (at which point it will have about 600-700 total miles on it)
This is the first sports car I've owned since my beloved (and at the same time hated - British cars are like that) '75 Triumph TR-7. The RX-8 handles the curves with the same flat, tight confidence my TR-7 did with twice the power.
I've only seen one other one on the road so far (here in Connecticut).
A nice touch - my dealer says free car washes as long as you own the car - just stop in anytime you like. A nice touch. Unfortunately, they are 45 minutes drive.
anyway, i saw that same deal in my paper (been in there for a while now, actually) and it does involve quite a bit of money down (don't remember how much exactly, but I believe it was at least $3K). Just didn't know if you realized that, so i wanted to point it out. Frankly, if I were in your situation, and only needed a temporary car for 7 months, I'd use all that cash you'd be putting down on the RX8 and buy a used economy car, drive it for 7 months, and then resell it when you are ready to get the car you are really shooting for. If you are nice to it and get a decent deal to begin with, it might cost you next to nothing in the end.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
The key phrase there is "other benificiary". I'm guessing that his wife will be receiving the RX-8 due to the other car going off lease. He also said he was "holding off" on what he really wanted (04 TL or BMW330).
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
On the other hand, Chrysler has three engines for their 300C (not including the SRT-8). Maybe Mazda could have the 330HP at around $35K-$36K base (reaching $39K loaded), then up the HP in its current 6MT rotary to 250HP at the same price as now, followed by the 210HP originally stated for the auto. Pathstar could tell us what kind of engine (and what turbo/supercharge) would be most likely if the 330 HP was to exist. Mazda could have a convertible for the 250 and 330 models, and have a market for each version. That way the same thing which hurt the RX-7 won't happen again while still luring the people who will pay for more power. If the 330HP Mazdaspeed RX-8 does happen, I see it doing well as long as it stays under the $40K mark.
however, the KBB fact is nice to know.... :-)
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
1. the '06 RX8 really will have a ~100HP upgrade (in which case, I'll buy another 330HP RX8 in '06)
2. the '06 RX8 doesn't have a huge price increase
3. the C6 Corvette turns out to be one if the better Corvette iterations (no major reliability or build quality issues)
Outside of those points, I'll keep my RX8 until I hit 100K miles (which should be sometime around the 2009-2010 model year).
And, yes, I still love my RX8 after over a year of ownership. There really isn't anything else I can see on the market (or anything I've heard coming down the pike except for the above) that would cause me to look elsewhere than the RX8.
If there's a big jump in performance for a little more money, now you've got my attetion.
We'll see what Mazda brings to the '06 RX8 table. If it's only going to be a small power bump, I won't bother with it. If however, it is anywhere near what they're talking about, I'd have to give it a serious look.
The only other place I might go with my next sports car purchase would be to the C6 Corvette. The C5 didn't "grab me" enough to make the higher dollar investment over the RX8.
thanks