Volvo XC90 SUV

i_yellow

I finally decided to make the plunge last week and order a 2.5T AWD through the TDS program for pick-up in Sweden. The dealer took my deposit and then called me later that day to say Volvo isn't accepting any more orders until Jan. 1st! I called the TDS line and got the following information:
- all 2003's have sold out
- 2004's will roll out in May or June
- Orders starting in January will likely be 2004's only
- changes for 2004 are TBD

I missed the boat on this one since I was planning to combine my spring vacation plans for Northern Italy with a TDS purchase! Does anyone have further information on this?

sleepless2

Ask your dealer. My dealer says that if you are on his list you keep your position or move up until you get the car you want. Example: You're number two. If it's not in the shipment and #1 gets his, you move to #1 and stay there until you get what you want. (Subsequent positions would move to #2 and so on). Dealer may be able to trade another dealer for what you want OR you wait for next shipment. So if you ordered Xenons but they don't come you can: 1) take the car as is or 2) order another one exactly as you wanted or 3) wait for next dealer's allocation and chance it or 4) see if dealer can trade for what you want.

Given the comments in Message #551, doesn't look like a reorder would be a good choice right now and that probably also means that dealers will hoard their allocations and not trade. Options seem to be limited at the moment. Unfortunately tried to nail our dealer down today regarding our "ordered vehicle" with xenons and the answer is not passing the smell test. They are supposed to call back but I'm thinking they did not order ours and just placed our name down for one of their standard allocations. If so, I'm going to be one very P.O.'d (and maybe gone) customer. This whole process has been WAY LESS than satisfactory.

tidester

Of course, you mean Plenty Outraged!

tidester, host

skyslimit

You won't believe this...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1871745828

Auction is over...

stickguy

just when you think you've seen it all, something comes along to top it.

To quote a famous TownHall-er, "people are stupid"

Can you imagine totalling this 2 days after you get it, and asking the insurance co. to kick in an extra 20K?

volvomax

Ordinarily wehn an order is placed, a vehicle RO number is created and the car is scheduled for the next available production slot.
Because of the limits on the XC90, dealers are given a set number of open slots, based on their size, and are given the opportunity to customize the cars within limits.
Certain options, like the xenons have not been available.The car can be held up until the option is available, or the option can be deleted and the car proceeds down the line.
Ordering practices vary, we have asked our customers for their order parameters and have done our best to meet them.
Because of this none of our cars will be available to trade to another dealer.
However, we can't promise options like xenon that weren't available when the orders were placed.
Our customers do have the option of moving down the list and re-ordering the car they want.
So far no one has done this.
As for X-plan, there isn't any. I have a very hard time imagining anyone recieving this discount given how hard it will be to get XC90's and the profit potential these vehicles represent.

et610

Could someone explain what the X-plan is? If it was posted here I missed it.
Thanks...

et610

Volvomax:

Can the lights be dealer installed after delivery.
If you take the car without the Xenons, is it possible to get them later when they are available?

stever

All the X-Plan discussions seem to be archived and none are too recent.

Ford's X-Plan is basically a perk for Ford suppliers that enables qualifed people to buy at a good price w/o a bunch of fees.

Now, will someone kindly fill in the details that I glossed over?

Steve, Host

sleepless2

Taken from a post on Swedespeed.com......

From the Horse's Mouth:

Dear Xxxxxx,

Thank you for contacting Ford Motor Company on 11/9/02. We appreciate
the time you have taken to write us.

The [B]Volvo XC90 will be eligible for the Ford Motor Company X-Plan
Program starting in December, with a delivery date of March or
April.[/B]
Unfortunately, they may not be available in all areas of the country.
Please visit and consult your local participating dealership to
determine local availability.

Please keep in mind, [B]this is a voluntary program for the dealership
and
all vehicles are at the dealer's discretion.[/B]

At Ford Motor Company, we consider the satisfaction of our customers as
one of our most important objectives. If you have any other inquiries
or concerns, please feel free to contact us and we will be happy to
address them.

Sincerely,
Xxxx
Ford Motor Company
Customer Relationship Center

-------------------------

eaton3000

Volvomax, thanks for info on how it all works logistically. At least I feel like I have a handle on it now.

ET610, regarding X plan, I'm an employee of one of Ford's service providers. As such, I'm given a passcode to a website that I can access which allows me to create a PIN. The PIN plus a business card are proof to Volvo dealer that I'm eligible for the special pricing under the plan. It is my understanding that my pricing is invoice plus 2% but I don't have anything in writing stating this, and I could be wrong. As these discussions point out, I may or may not be able to benefit from this for the XC 90. My dealer has led me to believe I will, but I believe things are so confusing now that it would be overly optimistic of me to count on that.

volvomax

The xenons cannot be dealer installed at this time.
I doubt they ever will, too much equipment.

As for X-plan, it looks as if Ford will make it available, although this doesn't mean that you will recieve the plan pricing.
There isn't a dealer that I know of that will accept the X-plan, ourselves included.
Even for an order, since the orders have to come out of our limited allocation. Sorry

et610

Thanks for the info on the X-plan. Some of us who are not eligible were wondering what it was.

It looks like if Xenons are important and you can't wait until April or May for a new vehicle,
you will have to go to the Acura dealer. Do you disagree?
Seems too bad that Volvo and the dealers will miss the good business. Nothing like a long delivery delay to throw cold water on a hot item. People tend to just get discouraged and go to their second choice. In this case the Acura is a fine car and many people will probably go this route. I know that I am thinking about this route. Too bad Volvo is blowing it.

volvomax

Some things are worth waiting for.
If xenons are more important than the RSC,and ROPS and the other features of the XC90, than go with the Acura.
It is my understanding that the MDX's are/have been on waitng lists too.

crikey

It looks like if Xenons are important and you can't wait until April or May for a new vehicle, you will have to go to the Acura dealer.

Unless you plan on buying a TL, CL or RL, this is a valid statement. However, if you plan on buying the Acura MDX, Xenon HID lights are not available, not even as an option.

wmquan

It looks like if Xenons are important and you can't wait until April or May for a new vehicle,
you will have to go to the Acura dealer.

Why would you have to go to the Acura dealer? You can't buy the MDX with factory xenons, bi-xenons or otherwise. There are aftermarket installs, but personally, I don't think they're as good as factory kits.

I'd wait for the XC90's with Xenons if you want Xenons. If you have to have xenons, the MB M-class has bi-xenons (and I think was the first SUV to get them).

eaton3000

ET 610 - here is why I'll wait for my Volvo vs. buying MDX. As background, I'm not a car expert but just a regular consumer. And I'm not even all that focused on safety, although I should be (two small children). So I don't feel a need to even get into an evaluation of will Volvo test out better than MDX safety wise.

I spent about two months looking into which SUV to get. This will be our family's first non-sedan. I'd narrowed my choices to MDX, Pilot, and Explorer. I know there are probably many more which I should have looked at but I tend to overanalyze so I needed to limit myself somehow.

A friend of mine showed me her MDX. Loved the exterior. Didn't like the interior. Both the second and third row seats seemed almost like those stadium seats you buy to put on bleachers. Plus the third row was right against the rear glass. I felt like I was spitting into the wind as about 80% of new car purchases in my town are MDX. So kept it in the running on the theory that maybe it was a trade off I'd have to make to get fantastic ride and good looking exterior.

Looked at Pilot too on theory it's MDX less $10K. Same issue with interior, liked exterior less.

Looked at Ford Explorer. I did like the exterior and the interior. Ride a bit trucky but not so bad. Could save a lotta money if I went that route.

Struggled for weeks. Give up interior comfort for sedan-like ride? Give up sedan-like ride for interior comfort? Could not commit.

Saw an article about XC 90 last Sunday. First I'd ever heard of it. Don't regularly read automotive press. Went to dealership, peeked in window, loved what I saw, scheduled test drive following Tuesday, loved how it rode, placed deposit immediately.

I don't know why, but it's important to me that everyone in my car be as comfortable as front seat passengers. And feel XC 90 interior exudes luxury where MDX does not. So I will wait until my car comes in. I don't think Volvo is playing games. I think it's genuinely difficult to estimate demand for a new vehicle in a saturated market during a recession. And they underestimated. Good for them for making such a quality product.

califjohn

I got to sit in the XC90! The dealerships around San Jose are now getting in their demos. I am told that by next week they will have both T6 and 2.5T versions to drive back to back. I have to say that I was impressed with the 90 at first glance. It does seem smaller from a distance but looks to be almost Explorer size when standing next to it. The soccer moms are going to love this one! I found the driving position to be a little uncomfortable for my personal taste. The available leg room did not allow me to fully extend my left leg and that surprised me. It may be I did not have the seat adjusted right as people were breathing down my neck to get their chance inside. Anyway, I will give it another chance next week on my "back to back" test drives. The dealer I spoke to is estimating a 6 month wait after deposit. Full MSRP of course! If the leg room still comes up short it is a deal breaker for me.

gold49

I've heard various reports about initial allotments scheduled for delivery over the next week. Not dealer demos, actual cars to be driven off the lot. I called 20+ dealers within 150 or so miles, and found several who had cars with delivery dates between next week and mid-December that were not "spoken for".

So, I put my deposit on one scheduled for delivery end of November. Does anyone know how confident I should be that I'll be driving this before 12/15????

conbug

I have a 2002 V70, so I am not in the market for a long time, but I did drive the XC90 (T6 and 2.5T) at El Toro last weekend. It was fun and the thing really handles much nicer than I thought it would. They let us drive it HARD and just asked that we obey the laws of physics (don't roll it). Funny thing though, the 2.5t felt just as strong as the T6. I would have thought you would feel a big difference between the two.

Just a personal opinion, but I really don't like the look of the "wood" in the interior. Especially the large top of the center console.

Take Care!

eaton3000

Sorry I missed seeing your e-mail earlier.

I'm in metrowest suburbs of Boston. Ordered from a Dedham dealer. You???

gcmomo

Where is all of the information regarding xenons coming from? My local dealer has not mentioned any major delays regarding my order. He has told me my XC90 will be here in late Jan. or early Feb. Thanks for any information regarding the xenons

dawgpak

I'm seriously considering placing an order this week for an XC90. I've been also looking at the 4Runner, X5, and Touareg (online). I almost bought the 4Runner (love everything but styling) until I saw and drove the XC90 yesterday! Very nice vehicle. Thought some of you would appreciate a list of links to reviews, news, general info, etc. to help you decide to buy an XC90 too!

http://www.dawgpak.com/xc90/

lenij

i've just test-driven the t6 xc90 yesterday (i already tested the 2.5t a week earlier). this time the t6 comes complete with premium package. how i wish volvo would make the wood steering wheel an option for the 2.5t. this one feels really exotic, but the leather-wrapped steering wheel on the 2.5t feels rough, with edges and angles! the ride on the t6 is also smooth, and the engine very responsive and quick.
however, i think the 2.5t is a better buy, thousands less than the t6 and more fuel efficient (imagine an average 22-24 mpg!)
i've already made my deposit for the 2.5t way back in august, and should have my vehicle ready for delivery by mid-december ("exactly to your specifications", as what my salesman was telling me).
i've read a lot about the bi-xenons. i know these are good for night driving, but won't be available until spring 2003. you will have to try your luck with the Silver Star halogens (you can get either the white or the blue light) and may have one compatible to the xc90 lights. you just research for it.
i've researched earlier for the acura mdx as my probable suv buy. however, you won't get delivery until 3 or 4 months later for the 2003 models (a $250 deposit is all they require). for the price of a t6 with premium package and versatility package will get you a high-end mdx with navigation and dvd entertainment system. there are mdx floor models available with some dealers, so do your research. although these are good vehicles, the functionality, safety features and roominess won't match with the xc90. the acura dashboard and controls, however, are well-thought of, and i think more user-friendly than the xc90. also, the wood trims looked and feel like genuine wood (the xc90 wood trims and panels looked fake and plasticky).
am looking forward to my xc90 next month. im already thinking of the licence plate as "MYX C90".
of note: the volvo online accessories link on message #396 cannot be accessed anymore. wonder what happened to that website.

crikey

Volvo XC90 Accessories

skyslimit

too bad it's not in english...

http://www.volvoxc90.se/

starrow68

"If the leg room still comes up short it is a deal breaker for me."

Try it again, at 6' 3" I drove both and took the seats all the way back and down and then to drive them had to bring it both up and forward to get comfortable. Not as much room as the Excursion but plenty of leg room from my perspective. That was also after checking in both how much front seat room there was when the middle seat was folded down on one of the static demo units.

dawgpak

Thanks for the link to the foreign interactive site! Even though I can't read it, the pictures are the best I've seen. BTW, is ".se" for Sweeden? I added the link to www.dawgpak.com/xc90/

foghorn48

Does Volvo recommend or require premium fuel for these drive trains? Thanks.

dawgpak

seems I read that 89 octane is recommended (read in these discussions or in a review). There is no mention in the xc90 brochure. However, this subject was discussed at length on the 4Runner board and the consensous is that using regular unleaded won't hurt the engine in any way, just sacrifices HP slightly. The HP/Torque/MPG numbers that they publish are using premium fuel. See 4Runner discussion for more info.

BTW, a "Touring" Volvo Semi-trailer loaded w/ 3 XC90's just showed up today at the San Luis Obispo dealer. They worked their way down the coast after being at the Alameda event.

They have 2 black, a gold, and a silver XC90 on display (2 T6's, 2 2.5T's). I want one!

dawgpak

I found the review where I read that premium fuel is required:

http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/new/reviews/full/index.cfm/id/23090.htm

See Road Test Ratings (Fuel Economy)

"Test T6 averaged 16.7 mpg in all-highway driving. No chance to measure yet with a 2.5T. Both engines require premium gas."

I realize the 4Runner discussions I referred to above may not apply to the Volvo engines, but they're informative to read.

dawgpak

Edmund's specifies premium fuel required:

http://www.edmunds.com/future/2003/volvo/xc90/awd4drsuv/specs.html

Car-data.com refers to using both regular and premium in their fuel economy tests:

"Initial estimates of fuel economy put average performance in the 23 mile per gallon range using either Premium or Regular unleaded fuel sources."

foghorn48

Thanks Dawgpak... I've been reading the stuff over on the 4runner board as well, but those engines are naturally aspirated. My experience has been that a great many turbo/supercharged engines require hi-octane. Since both of these Volvo engines have a turbo I wanted to get a clearer expectation of my potential fuel costs. In my mind premium fuel as a REQUIREMENT, not just a recommendation, would remove any vehicle from my list.

patrickg1

For what it's worth, my dealer placed my order October 10 for a T-6 with bi-xenons. According to him, the car is scheduled for delivery December 20 (we're in the Northwest) and there is no indication that it's coming without any of the accessories ordered. Apparently, this is confirmed by the Volvo rep who was there last Friday.

dawgpak

Found another Volvo XC90 discussion forum this evening:

http://www.volvospy.com/frameset.php?bn=volvospy_xc90

One of their posts included these pics from the Alameda event:

http://www.pbase.com/bergna/volvo_xc90

Another post of interest included this:

"Your wish for a 50/50 AWD may become reality.

An Austrian company makes a switchbox for VW Haldex AWD cars. This box makes it possible to set a 50/50 ratio or to let the electronics do the job in the normal way."

I've added this forum to my own XC90 page:

http://www.dawgpak.com/xc90/

If anyone is aware of any more links to XC90 related news/reviews/info/etc., please let me know.

dawgpak

Here's a picture to help put our fears to rest regarding the twisting the unibody frame:

http://www.pbase.com/image/6076682

Supposedly, the doors continued to open and shut while in this position.

durbanator

XC90 vs NEW Lexus RX 330
The new RX330 is due out April 03...it replaces the RX300 --- which I currently own and love it. I also owned a 850 Volvo in the mid 90s and loved that too...
RX330 is going after the MDX and now apparently the XC90. My question is...the RX 330 is going to have a 3.3L engine V6. Can the XC90 2.5 compete on the get go?

wwest

The RX is predominantly marketed/sold to those of the "softer" gender whose significant other doesn't care for the minivan "soccer mom" image. Therefore the VSC and Trac firmware is "composed" to not have a very aggressive nature and the initial coupling coefficient to the rear on first encountering slippage is only about 5% and has a really long "onset" time constant before it gets up to the maximum of 25% to the rear.

And the bottom line it it can be extremely unsafe in serious on-road wintertime conditions as it cannot accomodate snowchains on the rear, only on the front.

wwest

Where do I buy a switchbox to make the XC90 torque ratio 30/70 F/R, or even 50/50?

I promised myself I would NEVER own a FWD vehicle nor rent one in wintertime conditions.

Too unsafe.

crikey

Rumor has it that Haldex is working on or already has one. I think the first application would be on a VW? Again, this is just speculation.

dawgpak

new articles and images just posted:

http://www.dawgpak.com/xc90/

justanotherjoe

I have a '00 Volvo S80 T6, which I believe the XC T6 engine is identical/nearly identical to. The minimum octane recommended in the owner's manual is 87. There were some postings on the S80 board awhile back on octane requirements, in which opinion was that the turbo charged engines are subject to faster wear using lower octane fuels. I never saw any consensus in the postings on what was "required" (i.e. in the context of affecting warranty, etc.) The owners manual is the only place I'm aware of the S80 references fuel requirements(unlike some cars, where "use premium fuel only" is displayed on the tank cover or dashboard). Before I ran across the postings, I ran 85 octane for approx 2 years and the engine ran fine and I notice no perceptable difference in running 87.

dawgpak

sure like to get an official answer to foghorn's original question... is premium required or recommended?

thanks joe (justanother) for sharing your experience.

volvomax

According to the Owners Manual, fuel of 91 octane is recommended. Not required, just recommended.
In my C70 I only burn premium.
I wouldn't recommend regular unleaded, possible knock issues.
If your spending $40,000+ for a vehicle, you better off following the manufacturers guidelines.
On the plus side, oil changes are recommended every 7500 miles instead of 3000. That is for normal driving.

skyslimit

Prehaps in order for the XC90 to qualify as ULEV (T6) and ULEV2 (2.5T), it'd need to be run on 91 octane gas? Just guessing... I've been running 87 on my 2000 Toyota Solara SLE V6 (recommended 91) with no problems (already at 60k)

crikey

USA Today review of XC90

justanotherjoe

Dawgpak, I agree...an official answer would be nice (as in, from a warranty standpoint). It seems the warranty implication, if any, is the real question as to the distinction between "requirement" and "recommended" - otherwise, its a matter of performance (knocking/gas milage)and long term engine wear considerations. I lease my S80 - 7 months left(hence my interest in the XC90), and therefore have less concern over long term wear.

Volvomax, is that octane from your C70 Owners manual or an XC90 manual? To better clarify/correct my post #593 with regards to my '00 S80 Owner's Manual - which is not specific to the T6 engine (meaning it also covers the naturally aspirated 2.9 as well)..."Volvo engines are designed for optimal perfomance on unleaded premium gasoline with an octane rating AKI (Anti-Knock Index) of 91 or above. AKI is an average of the Research Octane Number, RON and the Motor Octane Number, MON (RON+MON/2). The minimum octane requirement is AKI 87 (RON 91)..." I realize now that I have no understanding of the difference between these acronyms relative to the octane postings on US gas pumps.

volvomax

justanotherjoe,
What you quoted is what is written in all Volvo owners manuals.
In english it means that Volvo engines are designed to run best on Prem. unleaded, whuch is 91 octane or better.
Reg unleaded is 87 octane or better
Mid level is 89 octane

troyy2k

I was at a Volvo dealership and the salesperson exlpained that they would not be accepting the X-plan on the XC90 for several months. Is this a corportate (Volvo/Ford) decision, or does it depend on each individual delearship??

volvomax

Participation is voluntary by the dealer
Ford/Volvo encourage plan participation, but they understand exempting a vehicle with very high demand.