Volvo XC90 SUV

islander71

We bought our 2.5T in November and have only used 93 octane.

schuhc

Where do you live that you have 93? I'm in Chicago and the only time I remember seeing 93 is in Colorado (well....and Europe). Is that something for California (smog laws) and high altitudes?

jb_shin

CA, in fact, I think only sells 91 in most places.

volvomando

I am getting my T-6 today. Any reason why I have to use premium? I know Volvo recommends it, but is it a must?

habitat1

You're dropping $45k +/- on a vehicle and trying to save 15 cents a gallon on gas? You could have saved a few thousand with the 2.5 and gotten 20% better gas mileage to boot.

I'll let the technical experts here describe what low octane gas might or will do to the T6 engine in terms of knocking damage or performance. But please don't apply for a finance position with my company.

schuhc

It is my understanding that higher octane burns cleaner and (as habitat states above) the gas mileage is noticeably better. I would stick with the 91 as I would be worried about what a lower octane would do to the turbo after a few thousand miles.

The T6 will definitely get worse gas mileage than the 2.5 depending on how and where you drive it. My wife tends to drive hers mostly 'around town' and we're averaging about 14-15 with 5,500 miles on the engine. On trips down to Indianapolis I average around 17-18.

There are people on here that are much more knowledgeable than I am with respect to fuel and what it does to engines. However, I think that the extra $4.00-$6.00 you'll spend filling up the tank is worth it probably both in gas mileage and in engine problems that could potentially develop down the road with a lower octane gas.

1sttimevolvo1

You have touched on one of my pet-peeves.
It drives me batty that people will pay in excess of 40k for a car and want to nickel and dime fuel and maintenance costs. Using regular unleaded on average saves only about $200+ a year. What's more, the possibility of knock can (in the long term) cause some problems - not smart for those of us keeping our vehicles until they drop.

Most of the info out there regards to the "mythical" benefits of premium fuel is in the context of using premium fuel in cases where 87 is recommended - not the other way around.

zeen

Thanks for all the kind words guys. My dealer told me "use mid-grade" before I ever saw the manual. That's why I asked the question. You should have some people in your company Habitat who watch expenses. Most successful companies do.
In any event, thanks for all the advice.

habitat1

Trust me, I do. But they know the difference between penny wise and pound foolish.

P.S. You might also want to consider that the XC90 is a very heavy vehicle to be powered by a 2.9 liter engine. I suspect that under heavy stress (accelerating up hill, etc.) it would be more inclined to knock than a lightweight sedan if you went to low octane gas. I didn't mean to jump on you personally, but, like 1sttimevolvo, this is a bit of a pet peeve for me. By the time you do the analysis and figure how much you mileage drops when you drop octane in a turbocharged vehicle, I doubt the savings would amount to even $100 per year. I had a friend with an old Saab 900 Turbo back in the late 80's. We'd drive 150 miles each way to the shore almost every weekend and he'd get a consistent 27 mpg on premium and about 24 mpg on regular. It was a vehicle that could use either, but actually had different horsepower ratings as you dropped octane (10%-15% less as I recall).

If you want another idea to save money, raise your collision deductables to $1,000 or $2,000. That's a risk YOU control, it will save even more money and, perhaps, make you a more safety conscious driver in the process.

volvomax

it is best to use what the manual recommends.
The XC90 can burn lesser fuel, you'll just end up buying more of it due to worse gas mileage.
Not to mention reduced performance.

schuhc

Don't mind Habitat, he's actually got a lot of good recommendations if you look at past posts. Here are three reasons why he may be a bit ornery today.

-DC area residents always get crothchity about this time every four years.
-There may have been rain on the beltway or 50 this morning and that means he would have to deal with all those drivers that slow to a crawl.
-He actually admitted to having a friend that owned...well, ok ..I'll say it. A SAAB

zeen

Thanks schuhc. I started drafting a response but wisely decided not to send it.
In any event, I was just surprised after the dealer told me mid-grade and found the manual said premium. I am not worried about the extra cost. I may just not wash the car for the term of my lease to make up for the extra gas cost.
I do appreciate everyone's advice. Just got the car Tuesday and it's a pleasure to drive.

habitat1

You got me.

But the fourth reason is my wife put me on the South Beach diet and I'm in carbohydrate depravation. I may lose 105 lbs by the end of the week though (by taking my wife out hiking and leaving her there).

I'll try to cheer up!

Zeen, enjoy your T6. I was stuck behind one coming home today and they are good looking.

guyfr

http://www.detnews.com/2004/specialreport/0404/12/a09-119932.htm

Thanks to Chuckmd for pointing out this link.

zeen

Good luck with that weight loss idea. Actually I have a 2.5.

zeen

My new 2.5 came with an offer for a free half day driving course for XC90's at a track nearby. Has anyone on this board done this? Is it worthwhile? Fun?
Thanks

zeen

Very interesting. I wonder if the quote of the XC90 project manager means that XC90's, like most SUV's, are more prone to rollover or was he suggesting that the XC90 is especially more prone to rollover. I assume and hope it was the former.

guyfr

He probably meant that the XC is more prone to roll over when compared to a car. Thats obviously the case for all SUV's. But the XC, due to it's gyroscopic system is virtually impossible to roll-over unless you start sliding sideway at high speed and hit something like a curb. If you want to see the roll over resistance on video, just upload the large (44M) pdf brochure from the Volvo site. One of the video imbedded in the brochure is quite impressive.

Guy

volvomax

According to NHTSA the XC90 is less prone to rollover's than almost any other SUV.
The Swedes are just crazy about structural integrity.

islander71

In Tennessee. Our choices are 87, 89 and 93. I have lived in NY and FL in the past and I remember Sunoco having 94 octane.

guyfr

I was told an interesting story today from a XC70 owner whose a mecanical engineer doing some design work for us. He hit a moose at 60-70 mph (that's a big animal, for those of you not familiar with canadian moose, think of a big horse)and himself and his passenger, while shaked, did not have any injury.

The policeman on site told them that in most other cars they would be dead. He explained that what usually happen is that the moose flattens the front of the roof, which collapse on the front row passengers and break their neck.

It make sense for the swedish to design their cars for such occurence as it seems to happen quite often over there.

Guy

zeen

Impressive, but what happened to the moose? I understood that Volvos were designed to minimize the injury to pedestrians if they are struck. I was wondering if that applies to moose as well.

stever

Over 120 moose were killed in the Anchorage area from last summer through February of this year. Hundreds more in the rest of the state. Usually the damage to the car is to the hood and windshield though. Lots get salvaged for meat for the food banks.

link (Wolf Song of Alaska)

Steve, Host

volvomando

Sorry to bring up a pet peeve. My question regarding use of regular fuel came from my ignorance on the issue. While I wouuld like to save $200 a year if I can, despite dropping $45K on the car, I clearly wouuld not do it if it had long term negative consequences.

Thanks to all those who chipped in with the technical details.

volvomax

Yes Volvo has the World famous "Moose Avoidance Test" Which the Mercedes A-Class famously failed a few years ago.

Also, this is why Volvo front ends are flat instead of pointed.
The engineers say that it keeps the mooses legs under the creature and helps prevent the animal from being catapulted into the windshield/roof of the vehicle.

nmukhtar

Did anyone tries volvo phone service. I believel that service is provided by AT&T. I am planning to buy XC90 but volvo doesn't offer blue tooth technology like others. BMW, LEXUS even Lincoln offers bluetooth. Having a integratged phone in car is becoming my requirement. According to the volvo sales person, I can go to any AT&T shop and they can somewhow integrate xc90 with their phone service. Does anyone have any info or real life experience with volvo phone.
Thanks,
nasir

volvomax

doesn't have a built in phone available.

You'll have to install your own phone.
Then you can use any service provider you care to.

mmmm8

Went to the Volvo Drive for Life class over the weekend. I would recommend anyone to go if possible. With some introduction of Volvo passive and active safety features, people divided into three groups for three tracks. First track is for braking pratice. Speed up in straight line, and slam on the brake to feel the ABS how it works. Then, speed up, slam on the brake, but turn into a curve to prove you still have control under the ABS.
Second track is for Moose course to learn the anti-rollover ability of the XC. Straight line speed up, swirl to the other lane and then swirl back to the orignal lane without braking. Then go through a salom to learn the DSTC.
Finally, the third track lets you put everything together into practice.
Actually, the tracks are the same as the XC90 introduction drive event last year.
But this time as an owner, go through the course give you more confidence on the vehicle. When I was waiting my turn to go through the track, I saw the other car on the track, the tires were sqeeching, the car looked like it was going to roll over went around the curve, but it didn't. And when I tried it, I didn't feel much rolling inside the car.
I know I made a right choice and definitely happy about it.
PS: After the event, someone ask about the project manager about the V8 version, and he said he drove the earlier test hand-made version in Sweden. And that would be whole lot different than the production one.

zeen

That definitely sounds like it's worth it, mmmm. Thanks for that advice. Sounds like fun too. And the good thing is that it won't be in my vehicle so I can wear out Volvo's vehicle.

lev_berkovich

I have looked the details of this program on the Web.
Should not it to be offered to every XC90 buyer?

Another question to the Volvomax.

volvomax

it is included with every XC90 purchase.
However, there are only a few tracks around the country where you can participate.

mmmm8

Zeen, you are right. It is not your volvo and you can drive like hell and still won't filps. But it is better to get there early though. My wife and I took the morning session and got there an hour early. (We paid for one person) Watch some volvo commercial, kind of cute. And we got the group that go through the sequence as 1)brake exercise; 2)roll exercise; 3)driving track. The sequence kind of made sense. And also, at the end of the driving track. The instructors let us go for some extra laps since we still had time left. Typically 2 to 3 people per car. There were misture of T6 and 2.5T. And I believed all of them were AWD. Approimately 16 cars total. Silver, Ruby Red, Blue.
We did learn something out of the course. At the beginning, my wife didn't have confidence doing a panic stop. After several run, she performed much better than me. As for some of the posting which said there are no real life scenario to do an emergency swirl. I totally disagree. My wife and I had run into several times that some trashes/objects got kick up by the other car and throw into our direction. Cars are swirling to avoid it. Not only you need to avoid that trash, but also others cars. Now I am confident that my volvo won't flip. As the instructor points out sometimes there is traffic behind you, you just cannot do a stop.

dmb2004

Do you get to go to the program if you leased rather than purchased an xc90

mmmm8

I believe so. I registered through their web site:volvoownerexperience.com
All you need is the vehicle VIN. But you can only use once. After that, you have to pay.

dmb2004

Thanks mmmm8. I'll try it and take the drive up to Lime Rock.

mmmm8

You're welcomed. Be there early, smoke the tires, and flip the car

sdjsoup

I attended the Southern Calif class back at the end of February. It was a blast!!!!

A lot of fun - I think I had a constant grin on my face for the entire 3 1/2 hours. It was a small group - just 9 of us (plus one or two ride alongs).

It's really amazing to be able to accelerate to almost 50 mph and slam on the brakes, turn the wheel and not have any loss of control - the car goes where you want it to (in this case into a 90 degree gradual turn), and the tires stay on the ground - no fish tailing or spinning. During the exercises, the instructors kept saying "turn the wheel harder - make wider turns, etc..." They truly seemed to have complete confidence that the truck would not roll. BTW - All the instructors were great - upbeat - helpful - knew what they were doing.

If you're anywhere close to one of these locations, you should really try to make it to a class. I already love my XC90, but this experience definitely gave me a greater appreciation of what the safety systems were all about and how the truck can perform if the situation arises.

Jan

banktrain

I bought the T6. Great look and plenty of room. I also have a 1988 240DL wagon with over 200k that still runs and looks good. There is something about these Volvos that just makes driving feel good.
Before I bought the XC90, I tested th Lexus RX330. I found the RX330 very nice, but too small, too glitzy, not as muscular as the XC90.
 I told the Lexus salesman I was also looking at the XC90. He said (direct quote), "Volvo starts with safety and builds the car around that. That's why they all sort of look alike. Lexus starts with the car, and adds the safety later."
D'oh!
I bought the XC90 later in the day!

zeen

The salesman at my dealer told my wife that they built an XC90 without the engine and crashed it. They then designed the engines to fit in the space left after the crash. She was quite impressed with that and when we looked at other vehicles she asked other salespeople if their vehicles were designed that way. When they shrugged their shoulders, she insisted we get the XC90. So we now have a nice 2.5T and are enjoying it very much.

lev_berkovich

Isn't it funny? I feel myself as the least cheerful of all the "cheerleaders".

Enjoy your cars!!!

schuhc

Wrong section...That discussion was on "Problems and Solutions"

Problem - Lev is a cheerleader
Solution - Have more people Cheerlead

gambiaman

Is there a list of tracks where the Drive for Life is given. Daytona I hope? I live on the Space Coast in Florida.
Thanks

lev_berkovich

Yes, Daytona is there.
Here is a link to the official web site

http://www.volvoownerexperience.com

shadowchaser

I have used ONLY regular gas..the lowest octane available for 15000 miles since I bought the car last year. Never a problem, never a knock....the engine is fine. I think you are wasting LOTS of money to put anything other than regular in.

lev_berkovich

Try using premium and you will see that you will get the same cost per mile, because of the much better mileage.
My experience is that what you gain in the mileage overcomes the price difference, and you have a much stronger performance as an additional benefit.

gambiaman

I stopped by my local Volvo dealer today to look at XC90's. They had about 7 XC90's and they all had the 18" tire option. I was hoping to get 17" tires but that might be very difficult unless it is special ordered. Any pro/con's with either option? Has anyone yet replaced their tires and if so costs of replacement? I have Michelin Cross Terrians on my RX and love them but apparently that is not a replacement option on the Volvo. By the way I asked if they were discounting the XC90's and they said yes 3-4%.

habitat1

One of our neighbors purchased an XC90 last fall with the 18" tire option and they had difficulty in snow (not sure of the tires). The dealership replaced them with 17" wheels and "real" SUV tires and their experience improved, but is still poor compared to their previous SUV (Landcruiser). As best I can tell, Volvo has designed and marketed the XC90 as primarily an on-road SUV with limited snow capabilities. Whiach is probably fine for most buyers, but not our neighbors who own a ski house.

Regarding discounting, the 3-4% quote is an insult. I went to the dealership Saturday equiped with the knowledge that Vovlo currently has an $1,800 incentive for versitility equiped XC90's. The question is, how much below invoice you could get one for? I was quoted $800, believe $1,200 is possible and seem to have read where someone got $1,500 below invoice. Any of these figures is at least 10% below MSRP.

I'm holding off on an SUV until the 2005 models come out, but an XC90 at $1,000+ under invoice is tempting.

adp3

getting the XC90 at or near invoice is even better than the pricing I got by buying direct from the factory. It would surprise me if that is the price for the 2.5. Not a surprise if that is the price for the T6.

Lev: I, too, am getting the red. My logic? We have a Grand Caravan. Bought one of the first in the Bay Area and we liked the Forest Green. Now, every other dang Grand Caravan is green. Time to find a color that is in the minority, and the red fits. Plus, I like it.

My advice to the rest of you: buy the silver or the Crystal Green as that is the color everyone likes the most

;-)

Zeen: I, too, did the driving course. Definitely do it. Go to that website and register. Volvo is rolling it out slowly to all owners as they can't handle all the owners at once.

I took the May 8 course and drove the T6 (AWD), the 2.5 AWD and the 2.5 FWD. There is a big difference between teh T6 and the 2.5, but a major compoenent of that may have been that the 2.5 does not come equipped wth sepped sensitive steering. I have heard that alot of the feel for the car comes from that option. C ombine that with the heavier weight and stronger low mph torque from the T6 and you get different vehicles.

Still, I did not change my 2.5 order into a T6.

I, too, am getting the non-tinted glass. I bet me and mmm will be the only ones like that in the Bay Area.

mmmm8

>>My advice to the rest of you: buy the silver or the Crystal Green as that is the color everyone likes the most
For those of you would be XC90 owner, repeat after adp3 and me: Red is evil, red will get you traffic tickets, forget about the red, get the silver, and crystal green, ... :->
>>I, too, am getting the non-tinted glass. I bet me and mmm will be the only ones like that in the Bay Area.
You bet! Excellent choice.

lev_berkovich

"the 2.5 does not come equipped with sepped sensitive steering"

You can (and I have) order the speed sensitive steering on 2.5 through the OSD. I have liked it on T6 and did not mind to pay extra $195 for it.
So, I am going to have the speed sensitive steering on 2.5T

"getting the XC90 at or near invoice is even better than the pricing I got by buying direct from the factory"

OSD base price for the AWD 2.5T is 33,640 and the local invoice (by Edmunds) is 34,264 = $600 in the favor of OSD + 2 round trip tickets + cost of the rental car in Europe ($200 per day for the decent size SUV).

As I said before, the OSD is a very good companion for the European trip and vise versa.

We are going to Europe every 3-4 years anyway, and replacing cars every 5-6 years. So, for the second time (first was in 2000) we combine two exciting events to maximize the savings.