Toyota Tacoma vs. Ford Ranger, Part XII

plutonious

"Ranger engineers regularly meet with Ranger owners to see what their wants and needs are. That's how the FX4 was born."

Forgive me if I'm mistaken, but wasn't it you who who stated something to the effect of "Who cares if the Tacoma is the uncontested four-wheeling champion? Maybe 1 out of 100 people care about four-wheeling anyway."?

Why would Ford develop the FX4 if only 1% of the Ranger buying populace cares about four-wheeling performance? A much more likely reason is that Ford needs to build something that can compete with the Tacoma TRD. How they plan to do that without offering a locker I'll leave to you to ponder...

midnight_stang

It's not to solely compete with the Tacoma, the FX4 is the Ranger's model for the off-road guys. Go and look at the models out there, and let me know how many FX4's you find and how many regular Rangers you find. It's just another model offering for those interested.

I guess I differ from you because when I want to be in the outdoors, I want to see most everything on foot. Some of the most treasured backpacking areas are miles and miles away from any vehicle access. There is just something artificial about seeing the "great outdoors" with the A/C on and the radio playing, sipping bottled water out of your cupholder.

saddaddy

about the best places being away from trucks and the rest of certain amenities. I know that Ford isn't running away from the Tacoma, I hate to see 'em pull out of the compact. To tell you the truth, I think the stiff competition prolly helped Toyota stay on their toes. I really don't like the tundra. I'd buy a chevy b4 i bought Toyota's bigger truck, but I still think it is very very competitive.

To tbunder as well: Maybe the first post came out harsher than my intent, but its all good. To tell the truth, I wish Tacoma would step up in the same way. I seriously doubt they will, though, b/c that would make it too close to the Tundra. Currently, the tranny and other components on the Taco are a heck of alot stronger than they need to be. If a major step up in engine size occurs, that which was once overkill might become breakable. Might happen with the Ford, too. In a sense I have mixed feelings about whether or not I'd like to see that happen to my favorite compact truck. However, I'm anxious to see what Ford comes up with. I'm sure it will be interesting. L8r fellas.

tbunder

i would hope that if they do go with a V8, that they would also develop new drivetrain components. i doubt they use ranger stuff in F150's with the 4.6. c what i mean? however, the tundra and tacoma share a lot of drivetrain stuff. is that good? maybe for tacoma, not for tundra id think though. compact stuff on a claimed "full-size truck" seems wimpy to me. but toyota drivetrain isn't something that's known to be bulletproof around this country. you never see a toyota axle dropped into a rock crawler. however, ford 9"'ers are flocked after.

saddaddy

Compact stuff on a full size is wimpy - VERY. But it is good for the compact that gets it. Speaking only about the Taco tranny -- it is more than capable for the tundra. And I know for a fact that it is overkill for the taco. Thats good to know. As for the rest of the drivetrain, don't know any specifics. They were able to use some of the taco stuff for the tundra simply b/c they were strong enough. The bit about the rear end - I won't argue with, but they are still heavy duty enough and are used in the tundra. Once again, I am not speaking for the tundra, as I don't like 'em that much. I don't like to think of 'em as full-size either. However, the parts they share with the Taco seem to hold up OK. As far as I'm concerned that's great - but I'll never own a tundra so it all works out L8r man

tbunder

cool man. it seems that ford is one truck ahead of toyota, the tundra's parts dont even equal ranger's, and the F150's parts tower over the ranger's. ie. axles, driveshafts, t/c, differentials.

hehe. favre sux.

mjbwrtr

if toyota really does share that many parts on their different trucks...wouldnt it make sense to PASS THE SAVINGS on to its customers? *shudders* Good Lord, i hope they havent already done that and the prices are STILL this high!

tbunder

someone HAS seen the light and admits something. toyota boy or not, its not only just obvious to us ranger drivers after all that toyotas are overpriced.

saddaddy

Toyota must be doing something right if, they are that overpriced and still have such a strong following. No, sales numbers aren't as towering, but at least Toyota has an awesome record of quality. Not comparing Toyota to any other make, no one can say that, in general, Toyota doesn't make a quality product. I believe that if they did not have such a good reputation, they wouldn't able to keep their prices up so high. What do you guys think? Tbunder, don't slam me too hard for saying that cuz, after all, you were planning on getting a Toyota. And you really made me mad with that "Favre sux" comment. I'd rather you talk about my truck than my "dawg." J/k - he's my favorite player but he really did suck it up. L8r man. Oh and - I guess Ford is a truck ahead, simply because they have the super duties. That allows for alot more flexibility in the other products - it seems to me. Saw a post the other day on the ORR board where a TRD and FX4, OR 4x4 went wheeling together and the Ford guys admitted outright defeat. Locker tore em up it seems. Not sure though. Bye for real this time

mjbwrtr

i dont think favre sucked...i think he was on his game as usual...he isnt too great on turf anyway, and besides, a couple of those interceptions were tipped.

sc0rpi0

Ravens game was a disappointment. But I knew that already, Grbak ought to get fired.
But Raiders game...well, I'm sure everyone'll have different opinion. I think Raiders deserved to win, Pats sucked. Oh well, it just means Pats will get washed out a week later. If Raiders won, we'd have had a good game to watch next weekend, Raiders vs. Steelers, but now it'll be a boring massacre of Patriots.

saddaddy

I will like Favre no matter what. Six picks is pretty awful, though. As for the Raiders game - I think they should've won, too. Correct or not, that was a bad call, but anyone could argue all day about that one. Don't know if anyone can beat the Rams. They are kinda like the Yanks, only under a salary cap. L8r guys

eagle63

sorry man, as a Vikes fan there was nothing prettier than watching Favre throw 6 picks. (easily could have been 8 if not for a couple of dropped balls)

thehitcher

I have read some of the posts here in this topic and would like add in my opinion. I have owned two 4x4 Tacomas (TRD & SR5) since 1999 and can say that I am very pleased with both of them. I had Ford before and would never go back. Ford and Firestone once almost finished me off on the I390 highway.

Someone mentioned the Corolla in an earlier post. Too small!! Wife has one and in this neck of the woods everyone has big SUVs. It is a fast little car that is very reliable. The Corolla will be gone shortly and replaced with another Toyota.

Walmart. What is a Walmart? Mostly Saks Fifth Ave and Federated stores. Most comfortable in a Barneys NY shopping.

saddaddy

Glad to see someone else is here that can back up our Toyota superiority claims. I would probably definitely buy a Toyota product if looking for a compact truck or car: Taco or Camry. Other size classes would probably require me to looke elsewhere, however. I would have to say that the tire incident is what has turned me away from Ford, for the most part, as well. I still think they make decent quality stuff but, you know.

SOMEONE GET STUFF STIRRED BACK UP HERE!!!

By the way, does anyone here have any experience with handheld GPS units, specifically Garmin brand. I am in the market for one and need a little guidance. L8r

midnight_stang

It gets the job done. Too bad the military are the only ones with access to the pinpoint GPS systems.

tbunder

hitcher, for someone who is "most comfortable" in Barney's, a saks or fifth avenue, i find it amusing that you own a $13000 toyota for your wife to drive. boy they're rockets. hehe
also, btw, as far as corolla being replaced with something else, i doubt it. toyota just re-designed it. check out the '03 model, it is pretty sweet. but of course, it is way overpriced and anything that looks nice on it, is an option. besides, the new nissan se-r's will literally chew it up and spit it out with more options standard and a basically a race ready engine and chassis setup. no one holds a candle to nissan right now as far as bang for the buck, that includes lexus and acura.

as far as your "incident" with ford and firestone tires, how can you blame ford when it was founded that firestone was totally at fault with their faulty tires, and now they have recalled EVERY wilderness tire and atx tire? had you replaced your crappy oem firestones, (which ill admit ford should have used better stock tires) i doubt you would have had any problems. i got 65000 miles out of my wilderness tires on my '97 explorer sport, and they still had tread on them. only reason i replaced them was because they were paying the bill. ford re-imbursed me for the tires i replaced them with four months after i bought them. that's customer service at its best imo. they also paid for my ranger's new bfg's as well. im sorry, but no one can blame the explorer for all of the rollover accidents. i mean, come on, its a 4 door suv like every other one. its not abnormally large or heavy, has the same ride setup as most suvs 'cept the jeeps. i think the word scapegoat comes to mind in your little grudge against ford.

as for who wal-mart is; they are the worlds #1 retailer, with practically a $40 billion advantage over 2nd place earner (american), bankrupt kmart. im sure there's one rather close to you.

there, i think its time to bake. )

saddaddy

Ford is not to blame, but there is still that stuff in the back of my mind. Kinda like when you get sick after eating at a certain restaurant. Its stupid I know, and I can't justify my reasoning - but oh well. You guys better hope they don't slap some independent rear susp. on those new Rangers. Bet the wheelers wouldn't like that. J/k, of course.

tbunder

i actually don't have anything to say. but this- what about the independent susp. on the humvee? and the military uses this. could it not be true that it may actually work? but let's face it, not in a truck i doubt. guess i did, huh?

kbtoys

I don't think the corolla is that much compared to the other car in it's class. Price range is from $12000 - $17000 and the $17000 on is for leather and sunroof. Here is the MSRP for the ford focus I have found "MSRP Range: $12,415 - $17,705" to me it seems about the same a focus and I would much rather have a corolla than a focus. So I think corolla is going to sweep the market in compact, but hey I could be wrong.

sc0rpi0

How can I blame Ford for what happened? Easily.
Just like saddaddy said.....tires blowing up on the highway underneath Ford vehicles leave a thought in my head about Ford. Couple that with many recalls, and I don't think I'd be buying Ford for a long while.
Publically it may not have been Ford's fault. Who knows. What I remember is 2 guys saying "It is the other guy who is to blame".

thehitcher

I have the Garmin 12 Map GPS and it is reliable and fairly accurate. Then again I suppose others are just as good. One nice feature is that you can upload new maps of specific places in detail onto the unit.

That Corolla was 3K more more than the 13K. So you associate the type of vehicle a person owns with a retail store. Does the Highlander fully loaded fit your store profile? BTW I am buying it and not leasing it. Does that count more?

I can hope that some good comes from the Ford & Firestone episode. Ford does make a nice looking product, but the quality was always a bit fuzzy.

So how many here have had problem free Tacos or Rangers?

saddaddy

Well you saw how the hummer faired against the taco in that little comparo. The IRS sux. LOLOLOL - I know, I know. You can disregard that if you want to, Ford guys. I will say this. Hummers have little (if any) more articulation than our trucks, Rangers too. Back to the subject at hand, though. I know they won't put it on the Ranger. The independent setup is harder to lift and a lot more complicated. Thats why its ok on the Hummer, it needs no lift - stock 37s. No one in their right mind would want IRS on a truck.

tbunder

like i said, nothing competes with nissan right now. who wants a focus or corolla, when for the same price you can get a 175 horse factory prepped race car with 4 discs, 6-speed, and 0-60 times below 6 seconds? the corolla is nice, but there is no way it will outsell the focus. the svt focus is due out anytime, and a 3-door zx3 can be had for $11k and some change. no way a corolla with the same options and performance susp. can be had for that price. plus, you get stuff like a/c and cd player standard in zx3. im sure those are optional on corolla. now the zx5 is out, which will hurt the corolla even more. the focus isn't the world's best selling car for nothing. but personally, for the money, nissan kicks everyone's dairy aire. and honda's? most powerful civic available now is 127 horses. and its nearly 18K.

scorpio- if it was ford's fault, why did firestone recall every wilderness/atx tire that were on explorers and rangers themselves? i mean, at first they wouldn't, so ford did simply to make a statement to their customers that they did care about them. and then, after ford takes the brunt of the recall cost, firestone finally steps up to the plate and admits that their tires were crap and that they even knew it. and as far as the wilderness tires, some tacomas left with them on as oem equipment i know. you too, are simply scapegoating ford. i mean, if recalls is what you're arguing, if not for the tire incidents, what is there that is so overwhelming with the explorer and ranger regarding recalls?

sc0rpi0

Ok, let me repeat what I have said a while ago:
I don't judge a vehicle by just what publicity it gets. I also take into consideration other models made by the same company.
When I hear about 5 Escape recalls, it tells me something is wrong.
Allow me to be paranoid and cynical here for a second:
Ford sees that negotiations with Firestone arent going anywhere, nobody is going to admit the fault. So Ford picks up the tab. After all, they have to keep selling cars, and with the bad publicity they are getting, it's tough. So Ford makes the "We know we arent responsible, but we'll do it anyway because we love our customers" move. Then Ford simply makes a private deal with Firestone where Firestone will take the heat for the problem.
How's that for an explanation?

midnight_stang

The one Firestone manufacturing plant that produced the faulty tires has been completely shut down. Not just the one line of tires, the whole plant producing them. Why is that so, if it's the Explorer's fault?

The hummer, or HMMWV for military use is still alot tougher than any compact truck. It could probably run into a few trees and still drive home, where a Tacoma (or even Ranger) would be totaled. Just an example, as it's not a graceful giant, but a rock solid one.

tbunder

i think you must have it all figured out, were you the arbitrator? did you shut that firestone plant down yourself? you're killin me man with your nonsense.

sc0rpi0

I gave you a possible scenario, paranoid and cynical one. Regardless, my comment about taking a look at a company as a whole still stands. No comment on that?

tbunder

kind of comment do you want? i asked you a question which you didn't answer. besides the tire ordeal, what other recalls on the explorer or ranger merit such paranoia?

as an overall company, id say ford has got their crap together making vehicles. just go to iihs.com to check out how good their new explorer fares against toyotas suvs in the same class. the ford is a best buy, where the toyotas are only marginal. ford also has more vehicles with 4 and 5 star crash ratings from the gov't. their vehicles all basically have more powerful engines than toyotas, and they all sell more as well. what more can be said? there really is no comparison. even with all the payouts ford has had this year, they still sold more trucks than any other manufacturer. including gm. that's pretty awesome, and some awesome brand loyalty to boot. what's toyota got? a claimed full-size truck that needs helper springs if you want to tow something heavy, that shares its parts with their compact offering. and no abs standard. thats my opinion on the two. toyota's are nice, but as ive said before, overpriced, and not safe enough. and generally down on available horsepower and towing.

eagle63

"what's toyota got? a claimed full-size truck that needs helper springs if you want to tow something heavy, that shares its parts with their compact offering. and no abs standard. thats my opinion on the two. toyota's are nice, but as ive said before, overpriced, and not safe enough. and generally down on available horsepower and towing."

-then why were you shopping for a tacoma DC?? It's been obvious ever since you started posting here that you don't like toyota, which is fine, so I assume you made that story up....