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What is it about human nature that causes most people to want to leave at same time? Agree about waiting. Have done this all of my life - church services, school, work/office, ball games, car races, movies, etc. Glad that not too many people think the way I do.
Now, there are always people (priviledged?) that feel that they are above queing up and waiting in right lane. They drive in middle or left lane (interstate going north is 3 lanes) and in last one tenth of mile (500+ feet), they dart toward the right and force and intimidate their way into the right lane. Sometimes they get surprised and have to go on to next interchange, because cop is sitting right there and watching for this intimidation. Folks in right lane defend their positions by driving bumper to bumper. But, there are enough benevolent, loving souls in right lane who let these priviledged drivers in. They don't want any trouble I guess. I have many times seen these priviledged drivers force their way in "exactly" at the physical start of the curving ramp to the west at the very last instant. If they would not be let in, they would be forced into the grass.
Perhaps it depends on where in the country you are, but to me it all has to do with generally accepted practices. If it's understood that you should merge asap, then do it asap while traffic is still moving.
I think a lot of these problems could be solved by better and more explicit signs (ie, like you said "Use all lanes until lane actually ends"). To me the sign "Merge Ahead" is ambiguous. Are they telling you to merge ahead? Or simply informing you that there is a merge ahead? A LOT of problems on the streets could be settled with better signs.
So she was twice wrong - wrong for pulling into the left lane in the first place after the construction, and wrong for blocking traffic.
Not having them shot, of course. Just their tires
I'm not sure what he does when someone wanting to go faster comes up on his rear.
Those driving in left lane "and" holding up traffic always seem to be in a trance or a daze. There are also some of these road blockers who look indignant at you when you finally get to pass them (legally on the right on a 3-lane). They are thinking, "Why, I'm going the speed limit, and oh my gosh, you have audacity to go 5 over?".
And a couple of years ago, my company hired a small bus (like an airport rental car shuttle) to take us to a summer outing at a restaurant. The driver rode in the left lane of the 4-lane highway the whole way, about 40-50 miles, maybe going about 55-60 mph. And he didn't wear his seat belt. Some professional!
As for the 2 different merge examples noted above, it could be that the person earlier noted that tried to enforce the "no zippering" religion was confused between the 2. I agree that, when it's not a merge but an exit that is backed up, no zippering can work (unless it's a 2 lane exit followed by a merge). In that case, those that try to cut in at the end are totally inconsiderate and should be blocked. Eventually, (as noted) someone will let them in (as well as those that goof honestly)...fine, but only after a "penalty wait". This is far better than filling all the lanes with exiting traffic and then zippering, because it allows normal traffic to flow without hurting exiters whose flow is limited by the single lane anyway.
As for the merge, I agree...there's no issue of impeding normal flow, since it's all normal flow. And in fact, it's better use of the roadway, which is otherwise empty and wasted.
What I have observed is after passing the "lane ends, merge left" sign, drivers immediately transfer to the Left lane ASAP while others wait until they get to the end and the friendly nature of other drivers let them in. And why not? They are still in line only further forward and if they don't save a lot of time, the rest of us don't lose a lot either.
Traffic on I-90 and I-5 is so heavy, all lanes are needed for just getting there and the High Occupancy Lane can be a parking lot as well. Thus, LLC are bumper to bumper and nobody cares.
The advantage of being a LLC is the road is much smoother and quieter w/o any 18 wheelers on it. So, when I get stuck behind a LLC, I don't resent him because he is usually going over the speed limit anyway.
The inattentive Betty Boop with a cell 'phone, lipstick, eye shadow, & mirror is the one who brakes too late & crashes the vehicle in front.
WTH is "LLC"?
xrunner2, the unspeakable is Left Lane Camper. We've kind of beaten it to death here. Poor newbies just have to live without the right to rant about 'em
Another thing that peeves me... There are several intersections that I know of, that have 2 left turn lanes, then immediately after the left turn, the two lanes merge into one. I don't know how many times, I pull up, and some guy about 3 cars back, decides to jump in the next turning lane nearly taking off my bumper. Then when the light turns green, he waits for all the cars in the other lane to clear, before he completes the turn. What the heck? If you were going to do that, why didn't he just stay in that lane, and let me make my turn, and merge correctly.
What I usually see is "People switch into the middle lane from the right lane up to 2 miles in advance".
I think that is pre mature merging into one lane and not zippering.
My experience in Multnomah County is similar to yours, however, I can't say I've seen "zippering" as I understand it. :confuse:
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Also, when I lived in Northern Virginia outside of DC, drivers would do this where the Spout Run Parkway merged into the inbound George Washington Parkway during morning rush hour. IIRC, there was always a cop posted at that spot to enforce this.
I think that zippering is time consuming at the bottleneck. If you had 1 lane of traffic 1 mile long, and 2 lanes of traffic one-half mile long, which situation would get the cars through in the shortest possible time? Think it would be "1" lane. With one lane, you don't have to waste the jockeying moves and time it wastes in merging. In theory this would work, but in practice probably not. Human nature is to try to be first and not wait in line, so folks will always want to use the empty lane.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Cheers!
Paul
Then next thing you know, the right lane is empty, and anybody that pulls into the right lane gets blocked, by a guy that decides to drive on the line... Then after a few miles, everybody realises that the right lane actually isn't closed. Look in the rearview mirror, and you see gridlock, with an empty right lane.
In fact, many times I witness the gridlock form, because people that normally would've been driving 10 under the limit in the right lane, are now in the left lanes going 10 under the limit... Happened to me on my way to work today.
As for your question about efficiency... Zippering is still efficient. It is, because with zippering, you only have one choking point. The way it is supposed to work, is the you match speeds with each other, and nobody has to slow down.
If people merge in way in advance, you get multiple clumps of choking points. You have one guy that hits his brakes, to wait for an opening. Then a group of cars gets stuck behind this guy. The guy in the middle probably only wants to let one car in, and will force the other guy to wait for someone else to let him in, causing further delay.
If you think that a 3 lane highway, with only 2 active lanes is more efficient than a 3 lane highway with 3 active lanes, than think about this:
How far back would you suggest people form 2 lines? I mentioned a freeway in Portland that was 4 lanes, chokes down to 2, then back out to 4. Are you suggesting it's more efficient to just use the left 2 lanes of the freeway, and leave the right 2 lanes open, because it's eventually going to end anyways? Then when it goes back out to 4 lanes, still leave the right 2 lanes open, because they will disappear outside the city limits anyway?
You may as well plug one of your nostrils than, because your two nostrils connect to a single tube, before they get to your lungs. (You only have one throat). But you'll notice a restriction if you plug one nostril huh?
If the zipper can occur with minimal slowdown, then it's all good. But if it brings traffic to stop and go, wouldn't it have made more sense for everyone to merge beforehand while traffic was still moving quickly?
Having seen the "ho-hum-de-dumBs on my way to Pullman a couple of months ago we labeled them "Palouse Pilots" in their pickups. :mad:
"Hay! Why hurry? The wheat's growing. The sun's shinning and I'm meeting the boys for lunch in Colfax"
Most of the time, the HOV lanes will move at 30-40 miles an hour faster than the other traffic. If the regular freeway traffic is going 25 and the HOV is going 55, it can cause a little problem when someone jumps in front of you at such a slow speed.
Mark
Two days ago, I was in a lane that was becoming a carpool lane (heavily patrolled for violators lately), so I had to get out. I had turned onto that lane from a cross-street; it was the rightmost lane. Looked over my shoulder, saw a 5-series two car lengths back, waited to make sure it was maintaining that position, flipped my turn signal... and then I hear a roar and the BMW moves up so its nose is aligned with my rear axle. I accelerate, it matches... though neither of us had much space in front of us. Well, finally I see an opening and cut him off. At no point was I going slower than him. So I dunno... now that I know the roads I'll be sure not to put myself in that position to begin with, but his move was just out of spite.
Then yesterday at the same spot a Camry with a couple riding in the front changes into my lane as they're passing me... but the driver makes the change when his car's rear bumper is level with my front wheels (no signal, of course). He was facing and talking to his passenger the whole time. By now I know to keep an opening when I see a driver talking to someone, so I just made a sudden change into the next lane. I was lucky though, there weren't many gaps like that in the traffic. One of these days I'll have nowhere to go.
The only way we will ever see this thing of beauty if there were roads exclusively for 18-wheelers. Others who would get it right are NASCAR or IRL drivers. In the general population, there are just too many jerks and inconsiderate drivers.
If you were on 26, it might have been a good thing they slowed you down - notorious as 'easy pickins' for WSP, although that usually applies to peak travel times for WSU students.
There are a couple of good eateries in Colfax, though
Cheers!
Paul
A little while later with his right turn signal still going on he approaches a slower moving car in the right lane. The right turn signal goes off and the left one turns on and stays on after he merges left. Guess what a short time later when he can merge back into the right lane the left turn signal goes off and the right turn signal goes on. Yes you guess it after he merges back into the right lane that turn signal stays on.
Finally we get to the end of the street where all traffic has to turn and being in the right lane he turns right and finally his turn signal is turned off (most likely by the automatic cancelling system in the steering wheel).
A short while later he signals to merge left and the signal stays on. Just how clueless is this guy?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Exactly. This is the way that all merges are designed to work. Any time you see bottlenecking at freeway entrances it is precisely because drivers are unwilling to allow the design of the roadway to work and instead feel an odd entitlement to their position on the roadway. Apparently, it will make one helluva lot of difference if there is one more vehicle in front. :confuse: Being a naive driver with solid understanding of the roadway, I always find myself being the focal point of impatient drivers who feel like I am being rude by allowing a merger to actually merge in front of me without forcing any slow down to the flow of traffic. Oddly enough, this always happens when I am in Columbus, Ohio. Maybe it is a local phenomenon....
I think gambit mentioned just after the post to which I am replying that it would work only if the vehicles could do it without slowing down. The vehicles are perfectly capable of doing it.... it is the drivers that are the problem. It takes a little foresight and a willingness to maintain safe distances between vehicles. Regardless of traveling speed, the merging process is a flawless maneuver until somebody slams on the brakes.... then dominos and chaos ensues. Drivers in the merging lane must slow down, some force their way into the next lane; drivers in the right lane (lane that is the subject of the merging lane) seek escape and dart into the next lane. Hello traffic jam, who was the [non-permissible content removed] that caused you? :P
Harkening back to Ohio, I would think these "big city" drivers would be experts on merging, but they are the exact opposite.... the "me firsts" that all end up dead last. :sick:
Is it possible that turn signal indicator is clicking in the car but the light is not coming on? Don't know. Usually, if one bulb is burned out the clicking is usually faster.
Ancient history. Wonder how many drivers know how to signal with their left hand (in US).
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
About 99% of the time, the left 2 lanes are slow/stopped, because people keep trying to merge in at random locations, and people try to be "nice", by getting in the farthest left lane, to let the guy in the right lane in. The guy in the middle lane in his quest to be "nice", will come to a complete stop, and wait for someone in the farthest left lane to let him in, so the guy in the right lane can take his spot in line, etc, etc, etc.
Usually when I stay in the right lane until the actual choke point, I find that all the cars in all 3 lanes are actually moving at a decent pace where the choke point is. But where everyone else is trying to get in willy-nilly, is logjammed.
I mean how hard is it to see the hi beam indicator on the dash? Not to mention that I-95 in Virginia has enough traffic at night/early morning where you can't really use your hi beams.
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/transportation/234759_get01.html
Cheers!
Paul
I quote the link:
For legal beagles, the applicable law is RCW 46.61.100. Subsection 4 says, "It is a traffic infraction to drive continuously in the left lane of a multilane roadway when it impedes the flow of other traffic."
The trooper quoted in the article apparently doesn't read the wording correctly either.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
My state's Rules of the Road apparently allows a driver to drive in left lane of interstate highway as long as there is no vehicle directly behind. There are also a number of other circumstances named where it is allowable to drive in left lane. It states:
"Effective January 2004, when driving on an interstate highway or full access controlled highway, a person may not drive in the left lane, except passing another vehicle. Exceptions include when no other vehicle is directly behind the vehicle being driven in the left lane, when traffic conditions/congestion make in impractical to drive in the right lane, when weather conditions make it necessary to use the left lane, when there is an obstruction or hazard in the right lane, or when the driver is changing lanes to yield to emergency or construction vehicles."
Persons driving in left lane in situations where right and or center and right lanes are clear, have to move over if another vehicle approaches them in the left lane and gets directly behind them. Law and common sense. Maybe most importantly, it is the courteous thing to do.
If I am driving on 2-lane interstate in left lane, and passing 18-wheelers and slower vehicles that are in right lane, I will usually get into right lane asap if I see a vehicle coming up fast behind me that wants to get by. This is courtesy and my state's law. As soon as they are past, I get back into left lane again and continue passing slower right lane traffic.
Every once in a while?! You must be the lucky one. I have begun to wonder if I missed the sign on my commute that says "Turn signals prohibited." They are a rarity if not coming from my car.... usually just on the way home though. In the morning, most folks use them. :confuse: Must be a very tiring day at work!
One thing I try to do if the offender is in the lane to my left is move my left mirror so that it sends the beam back to the annoying one so that they get the hint. It's never worked, but it's good for venting
I think the airplane landing lights mounted facing rearward are the only solution--day or night.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050802/ap_on_re_us/classic_car_safety
I agree with this. I very rarely just slip by a car using a 1 or 2 mile speed differential. I much prefer to complete the pass asap. Even if we are the only two cars as far as the eye can see, you never know if something will pop up on the road (or in your case, one of the drivers ends up being a moron).
On one of the first nice Sundays of spring, someone made a left turn in front of an oncoming 1955 Packard convertible, with rather unpleasant results for the Packard.