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Comments
The Quest may be tuned more like a truck - where the torque numbers tend to be higher, but if you look at car-like torque numbers for almost any brand, you will notice horsepower and torque are pretty close (things like Corvettes and Vipers excluded). Trucks and big SUVs are tuned for more torque typically.
Because the engine in the Freestyle is shared with the 500, there are likely economies of scale (and gas mileage) in tuning them somewhat similarly. That may be why the lowest gear (pulley) ratio on the Freestyle is >6:1. The low gear (pulley) ratio multiplies engine torque. I believe most 4 speed automatics are ~4:1 for the lowest gear. So the Freestyle apparently trades engine torque for gear ratio.
The 3.5L engine will have various levels of tune, but if the torque and horsepower numbers are similar, I would not worry too much. If there is a 6-speed automatic in the works for the 3.5, you can bet (my guess) the lowest gear will have a >4:1 ratio.
Yes Ford and GM teamed up to develop a 6 speed automatic which can be used in FWD and AWD applications up to 300TQ capacity. A lesser version will also be available for smaller application. Ford put the money, GM Is doing most of the engineering.
And then independently, Ford is also working on a new line of 6 speed automatics for RWD/4x4 applications.
Sorry for the prelude rant. Geeezzz crappy salesmen skills.
OK here goes, I think Ford did a wonderful job with seat roominess, & height layout of the Freestyle. The interior materials are better than the past Ford models (except the F-150), but not on par with say Honda & Toyota.
I love the CVT setup, and loved it when I test drove a Murano, shifts are transparent. Road manners seem very good, in what little time I had to with it.
Right now my only real complaint is there seems to be more engine & road noise than I was expecting, as I had my mind preset for Volvo, Toyota, or Honda quietest. And I don’t recall seeing any engine compartment insulation. Too much road noise is a bit of a pet peeve with me, especially when were talking about a $30k purchase.
By comparison the 5.7 Durango I test-drove last week, seemed almost limo quiet compared to the Freestyle. I will definitely do another test-drive of both back-to-back, with another passenger along side to confirm. One of the downsides of the Durango over the Freestyle is MPG, like almost half (ouch ouch), and ease of entry. Yes I know these two vehicles are not in the same class, but their street prices are very comparable (at least right now). And the beside the Pacifica, the Pilot is also in direct competition with the Freestyle, and the Pilot were pretty darn quiet.
Do the steering wheel controls light up at night??
I like the trip-odometer on the steering wheel instead of the dash.
"Peak horsepower and peak torque are frequently quoted as estimation of a vehichle's power. However in reading performance testing data I've seen many instances where this is highly misleading. The Porsche 911 Turbo (with some super special so and so package) produces less peak torque, less peak horsepower, and weighs more than a Dodge Viper. However, the 911 was quicker to 60, and quicker in the 1/4 mile. The reason for this was that while the Viper had higher peak horsepower and torque, the 911 spent more of its RPM band at higher torque and power levels without having a sharp peak (flatter power and torque curves)." (Eric Thies).
Steve, Host
It's called power beneath the curve...or...the entire "area" below the HP or torque curve SHOULD be considered when looking at the overall performance. In the Porsche/Viper instance, the Porsche most likely had more overall area below the HP and torque curves than the Viper. The only way to (sometimes) counter-act that is to have an ultra high revving engine. People only look at the peak HP number and think they have a winner.
Even worse, most people don't even look at the torque number.
That's most likely why the CVT does so well with so little. It gets the most out of the HP/torque provided. Instead of relying on a fixed gear ratio, it can generate whatever ratio it wants for maximum efficiency.
A bit over 200 miles and our first tank of gas. I actually "hoorahed" when it was $25 for full tank of REGULAR UNLEADED. (Been buying premium to the tune of 50+ twice a week!) It has been great so far. Keep likin' it more and more.
Had someone peering in it at a parking lot today then they came in the shop and asked me all about it. Pretty neat.
A note to Ford: Please change the locks to open all doors when the drivers door is opened. Having the hardest time getting use to the jailed in approach. Our displaced car also had auto lock but you could be set free by opening the drivers side, pushing the button or pulling the handle twice....but atleast you could get out. Also, I load the car from the passenger side - keep finding the door locked, cussing, and walk back around to unlock - hands full of junk - and then going back around....Minor I know but arghhh!
Also, still need to set the key fob to Drive 1, etc. but some of the programming instructions in the manual are pretty funny, turn 8 times in 5 seconds, blah, blah - huh? I should try in the morning after coffee not at night!
And...during our demo the rear seat console lid flipped back when folding seats to make the surface almost flat. Even the book mentions this. However, I can't figure out how to flip the lid back - is it possible they switched out consoles? (Future note: It would also make a neat tray for the back if it was designed for it.)
Speaking of consoles, inside the front console on the underside of the lid - what is that designed for? Everything I put in it falls out.
We are really enjoying this car!
Odie
It sometimes takes a good tug. Make sure you have the lid, and not the lower part of the console. Good luck!
That being said, all doors are unlocked when: 1) the unlock button on the key fob is pressed twice, 2) the unlock switch on the driver's armrest pressed once, 3) the code is entered on keypad on the driver's door, followed by another button which number I forgot.
Anotherwagon, I may have misinterpreted your comment, but on Fords, just pulling on the door handle from the inside from any seat position should unlock and open the door. In the second row (I don't sit back there much), you may need to pull up on the door button before you pull the handle. NOTE: this assumes that the child-proof lock switches on the second row doors are not in the activated position.
Try it out. Any excuse to go into the garage and sit in the Freestyle again is worth it.
Was at the Honda dealer again couldn't get comfy behind the wheel. Lots of cheap hard plastic in it as well.
Lumber support seemed to to much for my back. Perhaps its the winter coat I was wearing. But I'm going to get myself something comfy.
Freestyle got "voted" best of 3 cars this am by the bus stop kids. Pretty funny - they rated the freestyle first, then our suburban THEN the Disco - too hard to get in too ranked it last.
The Freestyle was "the coolest" - 13 & 15 yr olds-
Let us know how it goes tonight.
Less wind noise, less engine noise. Because of that, I'd say that actual ROAD noise is more noticeable in the Freestyle. But I think that's primarily because of the reduction in the other two types of noise. The actual road noise (by itself) is probably about the same as the Taurus, or could be reduced somewhat. But with the relative absence of wind and engine noise, you can hear more of the road.
Overall, quite quiet.
Noise - Compared to my current car, the Freestyle is quiet as mentioned above. You do hear some noise though. I am still adjusting but it is louder accelerating (but no power problems). Don't really notice it at all on the hwy more prominent driving around local. I do kind of like the little hum the engine (??) does - it sounds a little like my mom's old 850.
But at the school yesterday a very loud car went by and I looked up and it was a Pilot - either something was wrong or they are pretty loud too!
You really don't notice any noise at all....if the radio is turned way up!
I know what you mean, we had to wait 8 weeks and every problem I would read would bother me. The couple of things I would say are every single model that has a forum on this site has reports of problems. Every model car we looked at had a poster that had issues.
Secondly, and someone reminded me of this, is that not all problems posted are legit.
We have not had any problems at all with our car. If we did, I have all the confidence in our dealer to make it right - be sure you are comfortable with your dealership. We did not use the one closest to our home.
I would agree w/the difference in FWD/AWD - We originally tested a FWD and is was pretty quiet. Never drove the AWD until ours got here, and it is louder but we wanted the AWD.
Haven't noticed noise on the Pirelli's will listen in over the weekend and see if it bothers me.
Wait patiently....
What color did you order?
Good Luck!
If you were to tell me that there's a difference in noise between FWD and AWD, I'd have to go with AWD being noisier. That would only make sense, I think. But I tested the AWD and FWD so far apart that I really couldn't say one way or the other for certain.
I'd definitely describe the noise that I do hear as "road noise", and it may well be the tires. But I couldn't say if a different tire would be any quieter or not.
One thing you should notice is the extra "surrounds" around the doors that help keep wind and road noise out. It's quite substantial IMO, and looks a lot more effective than what I see on most cars.
What kind of gas mileage are you getting in the LTD AWD? I'm averaging about 19 mpg, I'd say. That's a mixture of highway miles (some of that stop and go) and city miles.
If I could ever get a chance to run a few hundred miles on the freeway without a lot of stop and go, I'd probably average 22 or 23. Mainly because I like to drive FAST in those conditions.
I haven't had the chance to get the mpg up yet. Just filled up the first time. I will see how it changed today since my husband drove it to work - his is a much longer commute than mine. Yeah, I like the fast highway approach too.
Another thing I noticed about noise - I have the Disco today and that thing is LOUD compared, never noticed it too much before but after a couple of days in the Freebie, well...tire noise, road noise, engine noise, brakes squeaking noise, whew - compared to that the Freestyle is quiet!
The rear seems to operate in three different modes:
1) Automatic . . by setting the colder/warmer button up front
2) Controlled by the rear control setting. You can get to this by hitting the REAR button a few times. That cycles the REAR between OFF, Automatic, and "controlled by the rear".
3) OFF . . . the quietest setting.
Note: if you set the rear controls to OFF, then "controlled by rear" is the equivalent of OFF.
That is soooo important! I wouldn't use the dealership closest to my home because they've been pretty useless with my cars (an Explorer with torque converter and rear-end issues; an Expedition with brake problems, etc), yet they've been great about my husband's F-150. So, you pays your money and you takes your chances, but at least do some research about your dealership, I guess.
RE: noise. That is so subjective--depends on your roads, what you drove before, and some people like to hear lotsa noise and some people don't want to hear anything. The Freestyle makes different sounds than my Expedition, Explorer, and Tauruses did (and let's not even discuss my Escort), but unless I put in a DB meter, I could't tell you about noise levels (other than the Escort--eegads!). The tranny has a little more "whine" at times than I was used to, but I don't even hear it now. Some of the reviews have complained about "tire slap," but then again, lots of reviews have complained about power, and that subject has probably been done to death. Someone said on a post that there was no sound-deadening stuff in the engine compartment. What is that stuff on the underside of the hood? I thought that was to deaden sound?
Yes, it helps, but doesn't totally isolate the noise just controls it a bit. It's also there to help with moisture issues on the exposed side of the hood. If you notice, much older vehicles have faded/peeling paint on the hoods. This is caused by bad insulation on the underside section of the hood, or simply put, the vehicle is probably over 15 years old. Anything prior, might be the consensation/humidity caused by lack of proper underside hood insulation.
Ah-ha. Makes sense. I thought peeling paint was just a problem with the '88-'89 Fords! Cars have come such a long way--I can't remember the last time I saw a car with rust on it (unless they are really old). And when you read the maintenance schedules--there is hardly anything to do. Of course, being a computer technician would help...
We've had our Black LTD AWD since November and put 5,000 Km on it. Over that last while our mileage has been between 22.6 and 23.7 mpg (mostly highway driving). I am sure it would be better if I kept the speed down a bit.
The Freestyle has a very solid feel and is very quiet. When you push it hard during acceleration and the RPM's are high you do hear the engine - but I have found that in my other vehicles too. I am amazed at the instant acceleration with the CVT (no hunting for gears)...it just goes!
There is some tire noise from the Pirelli's particularly at lower speeds but it is not that intrusive. I have had Pirelli's on my other vehicles and the P6's might be a bit noisier but at highway speeds you really don't hear them. I agree that the doors are very well sealed so there is very little wind noise on the highway.
This is one great vehicle!
There are also some paints which are more prone that other's, to start flaking and peeling. I remember Mazda's from the 80's also had that as an issue. Although the whole car-paint industry has advanced since then.
There are some colors from some manufacturer's that I know to avoid. But in general a decent paint job should last around 8-10 taking in "worst case senarios". Then again, there's a small number of people that would keep their vehicle that long.
Are those Imperial miles to the gallon, Branty?
Steve, Host
This is a great forum, makes me feel "closer" to my vehicle since it is so far away!!!!!
Anotherwagon, don't you know all the in's and out's of Z plans? Or SJ Freebie? Hate to bug ANT for everything!
Steve, Host
The height of the Freestyle is far better on backs, and easier for young kids to climb into than a d1. The rear door opening is much bigger too. Yeah the Free sits lower but its still higher than most cars on the road.
Spent some time looking/poking/proding the interior and I think its really well put together. Shale & Black ok. I need a change from tan.
Softer plastics than the pilot. Silver frost is my favorite. Gone off redfire.
Looked under the hood of a 500 parked next to it. pretty clean set up. Only odd part was the exhaust manifold that could do with a coating as its rusty (?cast iron?) and out of place with the rest of the car. They put much nicer looking seats in that car. Perhaps that will be something they do in the Mercury version.
Next stop is to test drive both Pilot and Freestyle back to back with family.
BTW. Unlike first visit, they are dealing. Cars now coming in weekly.
Hello! Wow! Some wierd coincidences here!
We just got our Grey/Black AWD LTD a week ago. We ordered it right after TGiving. All dates were right on target from the original estimates.
One thing - check in w/your dealer frequently. They should be able to get updates for you and once you get a build date then keep getting updates to make sure they are still on schedule.
RE - Disco. We have a 01 SE7 - we are still trying to sell it because the trade in values are sooooo awful. If yours is paid for and you can stand the aggravation keep it until your new car comes in and then sell it privately...but that is off topic. Anyway, between the two - my kids LOVE the Freestyle. Both boys - 6 & 12. The 6 year old can get in & out by himself and I'm not worried about the big drop down and him slipping or something. His favorite place in the Freebie is in the way back. So, he can flip the seat down & up w/a little muscle. He can just barely crawl in to the Disco. The 12 year old also likes the Freestyle better. He would try to ride in the back of the Disco and his knees were all bunched up. Way more room in the Freebie. Loading/unloading will be so much better for you and them!
Gas mileage - don't even need to say anything here but even w/the AWD we are saving $$. Plus, regular vs. Premium - BIG Difference!!
Then, mtn - my last "oil change" on the Disco was $300 - just an oil change. That was it for us. Ours is not paid for so to pay that kind of regular mtn costs plus a car payment - ouch!
As far as right hght - I am not really feeling any lower from a driving position. What is a little wierd at first is the lower cieling hght. It isn't bad - just different. One thing I liked about the Freestyle is that it wasn't low to the ground. Sometimes I would drive my mom's V 850 wgn and feel like I was itsy bitsy down there! I don't feel that way in the Freestyle.
I will warn you it is funny trying to get use to the control...the homelink is in a diff place, the radio controls switched, the window buttons on the LH side and they aren't backwards like the Disco. Door locks works a little different to get out. Little things but keep reaching in the wrong place. But the 2nd row windows go all the way down on the Freebie and the cupholders aren't in front of the heater vents. (Lots of little things - I'm getting use to it!)
(I do wish the glove box was lit and that the rear w/s wiper would work automatically in reverse like the Disco but just figured out that the steering wheel controls aren't lit on it and they are on the Freestyle)
Loading - doors open so much wider and there is so much more room to put "stuff" it is no comparisons.
But, after all that, I know what you mean about missing it. But I am slowly getting over it! Maybe lumber2 will let us drive his when we feel the need
Z Plan - We also ordered Z plan. At order time, they gave a Z plan price and it went up a little bit once the car came in. From the itemized list a few of the small items went up so the price went up. Our Z plan price was $29872.65 - we got everything but the DVD. Retail on it $33850.
Military - yep, us too! (USMC - you?) Yes, they do take the $500 military after the Z plan price. Just make sure they remember to do it.
$750 Z plan - yep, that too. My Dad retired from FORD in ATL. But the thing is it has to still be in effect when you take delivery of your car. There is some system they key in your vin and it tells them what to take off. We had one from the Inet that expired before our car came in. Tried to get the dealer to honor it and they said it was a FORD thing, emailed them to renew it but never hear back, hubby called FORD and they said it was a dealer thing, so ??
From my understanding you should also be able to take any additional rebates on the car that are being offered at that time. But, none on the LTD yet here. We also got the FMC low rate financing - our credit union couldn't match the rate.
Warranty - if you are thinking of getting it get a quote from www.fordwarrantys.com - take it to your dealer and they should match it. Ours was much higher but they did match. (Took all the printouts with me!)
Whew - hope that helps, let us know if you have more questions. Happy stlylin'!
After you fill up, what's your "miles to E" read? Mine reads 360 miles now. I believe that this uses the last 500 miles of mpg for an estimate. Granted, it depends on just "how full" you fill it up.