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Comments
Yeah, do at least a drain and fill at 30K. Also drain and fill the brake and power steering fluid.
Let me start by saying that Cypress Coast Nissan in Seaside CA gave us a horrible deal and this was comfirmed by a Subaru American Credit associate when I inguired about a possible payoff of my loan. The only satisfaction I recieved from this particular dealer is that they talked us into an extended warrenty for this problematic vehicle.
We have had oil seals replaced twice, the master cylinders were recalled and replaced, the paint had a defect and my car has been in the shop for a week now with serious engine problems that no-one seems to be able to diagnose. We were told today that after reassembling the engine that it still wont run and that it would be at least a week before we will get it back!
This car, that I spend a tremendous amount of my hard earned money on every month, broke down on me un an unsafe location and Subaru and their chosen towing agency left me on the side of the road for 3 1/2 hours in over 90 degree heat. On top of all of this, we were on hold with Subaru customer service to get a rental car and no one would take our call! I am now without a car to drive (and have been for 7 days) and no one who can tell me whats wrong with my car!
I don't want this car anymore. I don't trust it and I certainly don't want to make anymore payments on a car that continually breaks down. What happens when my extended warrenty wears out?
If anyone has any suggestions I would really appreciate it!
Here at Edmunds we have a rep from Subaru of America, her name is Patti Mickel, aka Subaru Team. You can see her post just above (#2). If you want to contact her directly, she may be able to offer some assistance, as she is in customer relations. I know Patti checks these board as often as she can, and she may even try to contact you. She's great, and I know she'll do everything in her power to help you. In the meantime, try to keep your chin up.
Bob
IdahoDoug
I'm sure we can help and, once again, I'm sorry you are having problems.
Patti
Over the weekend, I replaced the plugs, and the fuel and air filters. The problem persisted. I took the car back to the dealer this am and they have diagnosed it as a bad coil. They also want to replace the plugs because "When the coil goes it takes the plugs with it" Has any one ever heard of a bad coil taking out brand neww (Less than 100 miles) plugs?
I am also being told that when the coil went, it took out not only the plugs but the plug wires. And that the wires are not a warranty item. I can understand that the plugs are not covered, but the wires aren't either? If it was a bad coil that caused the problem with the wires... Are the wires covered under the 3/30?
The service department also mentioned my paying a "diagnostic fee" which when I questioned it, was suddenly dropped by "The boss"
If I had my car I would look in the booklet and see what is and isn't covered but it is at the dealer. I'll have to do some reading on this.
John
I hope this resolves it for you!
Patti
I am also being told that when the coil went, it took out not only the plugs but the plug wires. And that the wires are not a warranty item. I can understand that the plugs are not covered, but the wires aren't either? If it was a bad coil that caused the problem with the wires... Are the wires covered under the 3/30?
The service department also mentioned my paying a "diagnostic fee" which when I questioned it, was suddenly dropped by "The boss"
If I had my car I would look in the booklet and see what is and isn't covered but it is at the dealer. I'll have to do some reading on this.
John
OK, I order my tires for the new wheels today and I just want to confirm the lug torque. Actually, how many pounds is it? The guys at Costco had it listed @ 72lbs. I would be inclined to take it as true, since it was read off of a chart... but after their database yielded a plus one recommendation for tires as 215/55/16 and 215/60/16 is nowhere to be found, I'll feel better that I'd checked with y'all.
TIA
-Dave
so, what's a good number 58 -> 72lbs?
-Dave
Wires tend to be a "wear item", but you can try to argue, if it's a wear item....why isn't there a maintenance interval for the wires?
Tan: FWIW, Miatas are notorious for needing new wires at about 30k. The aftermarket makes a fortune selling thicker-than-stock plug wires.
-juice
Next, Patti saves the day...again. When I called the dealer back and mentioned what Patti had posted to me, Things got done, quickly. A mechanic stayed overtime so that I could pick the car up that night. The entire repair was covered under warranty and the car runs wonderfully.
The only hitch in the process was when I politely asked to see the plugs they removed (Bosch Platinum 2's with less than 50 miles on them) I was first told over the phone that the service tech might have thrown them away but they would look. When I got there to pick up the car I was told that the parts dept. had already bagged them for return to S.O.A. which conjured up the last scene from raiders of the lost ark with the ark being tucked away in a wearhouse.
Oh well, I lose my nice expensive plugs, but I have my car back and running well.
Once again, S.O.A. having a rep here at Edmunds has been a very good thing. Patti, you showed that Subaru corporate cares about its customers and wants to get things resolved. Thank you very much.
John
-juice
"What top men"...
"TOP MEN!"
-mike
If you happen to see this, I took my car back to dealer on Monday and again they could not duplicate my stalling problem. I drove with technician that day and also could not get the problem to occur. They called the tech line yesterday and Subaru advised using mid-grade Exxon and pouring in a bottle of BG product called 44K. As I was leaving the dealership yesterday the bucking, shakes and hesitation started again so I turned around and went back. Had the tecnician drive it and finally he experienced all the fun. He suggested we proceed with the Subaru reccomendation and go from there.
I filled up with the Exxon this moring and will pour in the 44K today at noon time. Fingers are crossed.........
A darkened parts dept, ominous music, row after row of dusty shelves and bins, and my poor platinum 2's being wheeled in by an old man and then left on a shelf.
Maybe I ought to call in Mulder and Sculley to investigate..... They've had to deal with this type of thing before.
John
A darkened parts dept, ominous music, row after row of dusty shelves and bins, and my poor platinum 2's being wheeled in by an old man and then left on a shelf.
Maybe I ought to call in Mulder and Sculley to investigate..... They've had to deal with this type of thing before.
John
my old Camry....every 60,000 miles I used to replace the spark plug wires, when I replaced the spark plugs. Many times it probably wasn't needed....but it was piece of mind for me.
Back to the dealer.
Paul, any luck on your issue?
And if I'm still double posting does anyone know why? It's not intentional.
Jim
I had a V6 Camry that had a similar problem. When the engine was cold, the car would stall when I hit the excellerator from a dead stop. If the car was moving and I tried to excellerate quickly, the engine would stumble. I took it to the dealer, who experienced the same problem. They spent 3 full days diagnosing it and then gave it back to me without charging for the work. The mechanics gave up in frustration when they couldn't pinpoint the problem. Since the car was way out of warranty, they were not under any obligation to continue investigating.
jimmyp1 is right, the reason you are double posting is that you are clicking your browser's refresh button after submitting a post. The refresh button re-submits the post.
Ty
The new models got a new bearing design, I believe. I'm sure that Imprezas did, FWIW.
-juice
Wonder if after the new plugs, coil, etc. that you need to do a ECM reset?
-Brian
maybe if you changed your handle to "ReRun" it might stop ;D j/k
Like Jim said, you could be doing the refresh thing.
-Dave
-Colin
Thanks.
John
I'm sorry about the problem.
Thanks!
Patti
Don
What about getting lifetime brakes from one of those aftermarket shops that offers them? Just a thought.
Lemon Laws can be invoked when a dealer fails to fix the same problem repeatedly. In MD it's 4 times, except for brake failure, which only takes once.
Call 800SUBARU3 and politely ask them to open up a case number. Go back to the dealer and ask them to document and fix all the issues you mentioned. Then, come back here once you have the case number, and I'll put you in touch with our SoA rep, Patti, who can put pressure on the dealers.
They can lose a franchise for being that lazy.
-juice
Ed
I have sent a message to your Representative and the manager for your area of the country. I'm sure you will hear from them the moment they have an action plan lined up.
I'm sorry.
Patti
You will be happy to know that it is not the fault of your driving habits or the car. I talked to a couple Subie mechanics, and they said the problem comes from your dealer or shop over-torquing your lug nuts (usually during tire rotation or having winters put on) and this will cause the rotors to warp if you do a lot of heavy breaking, esp. on a warm day. The lug nuts should always be tightened to 65 ft.-lbs. of torque (plus or minus 7 lbs.) Some garages and dealers have been known to torque as high as 90-95 lbs., which will definitely stress your rotors and cause warpage over time.
If they have little tiny grooves in them, I'd tend to just leave them and install new pads and let the pads break into the tiny grooves. If they are warped, I'd put on brand new ones.That way you know who to blame if something goes wrong too quickly. The difference in price between taking off old ones and turning them and taking off old ones and installing new ones (which may in fact be slightly turned anyway as part of the price), can't be a whole lot and may give a lot more satisfiaction for only an extra $50.
Blaming the dealer for over-torquing is a rather facile deflection of what could be another problem entirely. The idea that Subaru dealers are blindly bending rotors day after day because trained gorillas are unable to grasp the concept, stretches my own credulity. I feel the answer lies elsewhere and may be a combination of driver habits, types of pad material and possibly even slightly too undersized rotors.
A rotor can warp easily if, say, you have just finished a downhill run and hit a small puddle or creek run-off, etc. Also from towing, oversized loads, etc.
There's not a lot of slack these days in rotor design IMO.
Personally, I feel this a defect in the design due to cost-saving.
To give you an idea, I had a V6 Camry, that I regularly would drive like a sports car. I replaced the rear pads for the first time at 80K miles and the front at 110K miles.
Unless you are powersliding and street racing the car, or modifying the car extensively, for brake pads to wear out, or for rotors to warp at only 20K miles sounds like a poor manufacturer design.
The BMW board has been complaining extensively about breaks and transmission wearing out / failures being blaimed by BMW and their dealers on the way they are driven. Jeez, I thought this car was a sports sedan!!!
As for what constitutes 'chronic', I'll give you my two cents...I'd say around 8%-10% complaint rate, so 8 to 10 out of 100 similar cars warping rotors prematurely (industry standard for similar weight and HP cars).
I have no idea of failure rate on Subaru rotors, so this may not apply.
You may remember above somewhere that my original dealer had recently done the alignment and called it 'within spec'. Hardly. The steering wheel had to be turned 2 degrees or more off center to the right to go straight. Letting go of the wheel immediately made it drift left. And it also developed a mysterious slight wobble like effect at highway speeds through the steering wheel. And I only originally brought it in because it was just ever so slightly drifting left, but steering straight for the past 20,000 miles. Why is it so hard to get an alignment 'correct'?
Anyway, I'm happy now. No vibration or wobble, steers straight, doesn't pull. Pure bliss. Well, ok, pure bliss would be a dark blue Blitzen, but I digress....
-Brian
Bob
And if anyone needs the alignment specs for 2000-02 Legacy/Outback, including the SUS, I have a nice color printed copy showing all the measurements and what they mean. I believe the alignment system was a Hunter brand.
-Brian
Don
Not starting in the sun -- I suspect that the sun and the starting problem are not, in fact, related but coincidental, since engine heat would create lots more heat than sunlight. So the car should fail to start with a hot engine if heat were the sole issue. Make sense?
There's gotta be a leak in the exhaust somewhere, maybe throwing off the O2 sensor (and making the engine run rich, hence the mileage). Sounds like a tough one to resolve, hopefully the dealer can get their best tech on this case.
-juice
Perhaps a hot sunny day could be effecting the fuel line?