Subaru Crew Problems & Solutions

paisan

I have an '88 XT6 with AT and I beat it very hard all the time. No tranny problems yet. The only subies I know of with chronic AT problems were the SVX because of the high powere 3.3l H6 engine.

-mike

locke2c

Manual transmissions are very fun and the AWD is great. The Subaru one isn't exactly known for its robustness, but it will do the job nicely as long as it's not subjected to abuse and driven with some sense of mechanical sympathy.

-Colin

hypov

Thanks for the link.
I was glued.
Took me more than 30 minutes (had to digest quite alot).

vincer2

Colin,
Great link. I was only going to scan it but I got entrenched and had to read all the details. I'll need to reread it in the morning.
Vince

seamus3

i didn't read through aall of the posts but i am going to add something on the pinging issue. i always thought that it was normal to hear that sound when i was accelerating semi-heavily and the RPM's were under 2500. i just thought it was the engine adding too much fuel and there being a misfire and thus the knocking sound. that is the only time i hear it, and when that does happen i just downshift and it goes away immedietly (i have a 96 legacy L MT).

sibbald

I have offered to post a problem my friend is having with his Outback. Hopefully someone may have an idea as to what the problem could be.

His vehicle is a 2000 Outback H4 auto with 40,000 kilometers (24,000 miles). He describes the stalling problem as follows "car in drive, warm, happens mostly when I take my foot off the gas at highway speed although happened once at very slow speed of 30 K on a flat stretch. Engine gives a couple of hesitations, then the AT temp light starts to flash. If it does stall completely of course all lights come on and stay on until I stop the car for a few minutes. The lights usually reset although a couple of times they haven't and it has taken a couple of shut off periods to reset them.

Happens mostly when the gas is down to less that 1/4 tank. Once the check engine light was on even after I unscrewed the re-tightened the gas cap. Once I filled up and secured the gas cap, the light went off. Even when the tank is almost empty, when I released the cap, there was no indication of pressure (swoosh). Gas cap looks O.K., rubber seal looks O.K. and I am screwing it on probably 10 clicks to be sure it's tight."

O.K., there is the problem in Fred's words, any ideas would be greatly appreciated. He did take it in for the recall regarding the CEL.

Thanks,

Tom

solarpower

Worried about possibility that I have a second dead oxygen sensor in a few months on a very low mileage car!

Love my manual trans Forester. At 4520 miles (March 2001) the Check Engine light (CEL) came on. It stayed on while I fooled with the gas tank cap, gas level within gas tank (filled it from half to full), etc. (Gas cap itself says that you have to tighten it well to prevent CEL. Manual says the same thing. It also says, in different places, to take it to the dealer immediately and to wait for a few trips to see if the light goes out on its own.)

Took it to dealer after a few days; they replaced oxygen sensor under warranty after checking the "misfire codes". The paperwork from the dealer said three codes were found, then later on there are these three strings, which might be the codes: C445171C, UFP22, B445001.

Just returned from a 2 week trip. Fired up the Subaru June 2001, and now the CEL is on again. Mileage is only 5850.

Have only ever put regular unleaded in it. Only from national chain dealers (Exxon, Mobil, etc).

A friend told me it that oxygen sensors are very robust and rarely go bad. If so, then is there anything that could be causing them to go bad (so they are a symptom and not the cause)?

Gas mileage on this car in 100% city driving is around 23mpg.

crashton6

My 2000 Forester has had 2 o2 sensors replaced & soon to have it's third. I got a recall notice from Subaru. They have a lot of bad sensors on cars out there. You should call Subaru. & see if you car is covered in the recall.

Chuck

p0926

Jeffrey- I've got an 01 Forester and had to replace the same Air/Fuel sensor twice (both within the 1st 6,000 miles). No problems since and I now have 18K miles. I know it's bothersome to keep going to the dealer but hang in there. FYI: unless the CEL is blinking constantly, there's nothing seriously wrong with your vehicle. Subaru designed the Forester's engine to meet the EPA's ULEV standards (which is a good thing). The downside is that the emissions system's sensors are very sensitive and simple things like not tightening the gas cap enough can trigger the CEL.

-Frank P.

stockton2

I have a 99 Forester L that I recently purchased. After having it for only one day the CEL came on and I was informed by the dealer that it was probably nothing- you know the old "probably just a gas cap" routine. After driving it through a couple of tanks I took it in and was told the problem [according to the computer] was an O2 sensor. Well that was replaced with the caveat by the tech. that "if it continues I will probably need to replace the ECM". Well a couple of weeks go by and there is the CEL again. Given the number of posts regarding this problem I think it is time for SOA to look at some kind of remedy. I have had cars of many different makes and have never encountered such a widespread problem that was not remedied by a recall. Could anyone give me their thoughts/suggestions. Especially Patty or someone from SOA. The replacement and then suggestion of a problem that just happens to occur a little later seems to indicate that this is something the tech. has seen over and over.Of course, with the price of ECM's the dealers are not about to complain. -stockton2

jimmyp1

I have a 1994 Legacy Turbo with the above referenced seatbelts. The driver's side belt recently quit moving all the way into it's final position after closing the door. It's close, an inch or two, but it's far enough out of whack that the seatbelt light blinks, then stays on. Occassionally the car will sense something's amiss and the seatbelt will start going back and forth, or trying to. The tool in the center compartment won't help. I can't budge it in either direction. Anybody had this problem? Any solutions? Or am I looking at the several hundred dollars for a new motor that the dealer has "threatened" me with? - jim

hciaffa

If you can mail me your e-mail address I have a Forester shop manual at home and I can fax you the picture showing the location of the front Diff plug. The differential is on the passengers side of the transaxel and there is a plug there but it face the the drivers side. To confusing to explain but a picture is ..... On other forums it used to be posted in 98 and 99 about the Tech draining and refilling the wrong components because the plugs were close to each other. My email is hciaffaglione@canberra.com

paisan

Take it to the dealer. Seatbelts IIRC are guaranteed for the life of the vehicle. Patti may know better.

-mike

hammersley

Sorry gang... we were up in the woods camping!

97 OB 5 spd - 64000 miles - no pinging, ever, since I've owned it (Feb Y2K) - using Exxon & Costco 87 octane in the Spokane, Washington area.

I had an 83 Accord years ago that after 100k miles, needed 92 octane if Chevron, 87 octane of any other flavor to keep pinging at bay, so different brands of fuel can make a big difference!

Here in Spokane, the fuel arrives by pipeline, and the brand-specific additives get added just before it goes in the tanker truck. Lot of different stations using the same raw product out of the pipe.

Disclaimer: I'm not a doctor, but I've played one on TV. (Reallly!)

Cheers!
Paul

pattim3

You should really give us a call at 1-800-SUBARU3. The C. S. Rep. will start a case file for you and contact the dealer to see what is going on. Something does not sound right. While I cannot take your case directly, please advise the Rep. you are speaking with to let me know when you call. I can review your case with them and try to keep track of what is happening.

Sorry about the problem.

Patti

pattim3

You've got me baited. When and where were did you play one on TV?

Patti

pattim3

Please bring your car to the dealer and call us. We always try to help with seatbelt concerns in some way. We are at 1-800-SUBARU3.

Thanks!

Patti

jres

On the topic of how robust O2 sensors are, it all depends on the car/manufacturer.

I had an 85 Dodge Shelby Charger that ate O2 sensors, I had that car for about 54K miles and had to replace the O2 sensor at least three times, maybe 4. The car I replaced the with was an 89 Nissan 240 which has north of 180K miles and has never had it's O2 sensor replaced.

hammersley

Many moons ago... about 1992 or 1993... I was working part-time for the local ambulance company that was my primary employ before I joined the Fire Department. Unsolved Mysteries production team rolled into town to film a segment on a local case involving a teenage boy found dying on the road. They needed folks to portray ambulance medics for the "arriving in the ER" scene. Rather than pull a real doc off his duties, they asked me if I would be willing to portray the MD (they said I looked the oldest ) The amazing part of it was they only gave us a rough idea of what they wanted from the scene... most all of the dialogue was ad-lib! And we did it in two takes! The hardest part was the kid's mom played herself... she had to take a kleenex break or two... tough lady, but sad case. Still unsolved today, too.

I have a tape of the show somewhere... but it's on a beta cassette and my beta machine is currently dead in the water... so watch for the reruns!

Cheers!
Dr. Paul

hciaffa

I know that the fuse/relay box to insert for front wheel drive in the Forester is in the engine compartment but which is the recommended fuse to insert in the socket. There are three extra fuses in the box. A 10, 15, 20 amp which is the recommended one to engage FWD. Thanks for any info

paisan

will work for the FWD fuse.

-mike

p0926

FYI: Subaru isn't the only manufacturer experiencing problems with the CEL. The last two times I was given a GM car as a rental, the CEL came on almost immediately. In the first instance, the rental agent said that the CEL comes on with almost half of their GM cars. Oh no! I just realized that GM now owns part of Subaru. Argh!

-Frank P.

paisan

a number of Isuzus have also been experiencing CEL lights as well. My Trooper has had it flickering the past 3K miles. I can't nail down the problem yet, and the dealer doesn't have any appts. til July 3. Go figure.

-mike

bluesubie

mike, are you going to Open Road or Flemington (or S.I.)? The bad thing about Flemington is they're a small operation. The good thing though is very personalized service.

Will things only get worse with OBD III? When is that supposed to come out?

Dennis

paisan

That was open road that told me it would be July 3rd. They only have 2 Isuzu techs there (mostly Honda is their bag) and one is on a 2 week vacation. I haven't called flemington, nor SI yet. I may just bring it to a place upstate cause I'm planning on leaving it at my place from June 29->Laborday, I'm actually putting the XT6 on a flatbed when I go up June 29 so that on my week of vacation I can have both the subie and the Trooper up there.

-mike

stockton2

stockton2:Patti thanks for the help.I will give you a little more background and will try to keep it short. As previously stated I had a problem with the O2 sensor that occurred in a strange way. The CEL came on and I went through the gas cap/keep driving to see if it corrects itself ritual. At the dealer[a supposed reputable one] I was told the diagnostic computer had given an O2 sensor problem. I was told I could keep driving and/or decide what I wanted to do. When I got in the car to leave it would barely run. It had ran fine for a week before that with the supposed same problem. I had the O2 sensor replaced only to have the CEL come on again after about a tank and a half. I will talk to a CSR at SOA as suggested and get in to the dealer ASAP to see what the computer says this time. The woman who traded in the car before I bought it had no problems at all. The fact that the problem seemed to get worse at the dealer and then to have the tech. note that if the problem continued after replacing the O2 sensor that I would need to replace the ECM seemed a little strange to me. Please gang give me your impressions. Thanks

ateixeira

Ask them to do a quick check of all the vaccum tubes. Any leak in the fuel systems will trigger a CEL, though they should be able to read the codes.

That's nothing, though. Our rental Pontiac Montana in Orlando had a Check AIRBAG light on! Yikes! They said not to worry, but it was not very reassuring to imagine an unwanted deployment.

FWIW, my '98 Forester with the Phase I never pings, despite me buying the cheapest 87 octane gas I can find. Even when I pulled a 700 lb trailer with two adults and 3 cubic yards of mulch there was no hint of pinging, though mine is a manual and I keep the revs up in the torque band (3000-4500rpm) when under load.

Folks on Miata.net recommend running to redline on occasion to prevent carbon deposits. I'm not sure if it works, but it's fun so I do it anyway.

Vince - any pics of the fumoto valve? Did you get the tube option for draining? Do you lose ground clearance?

-juice

bluesubie

The AZ Scooby guys have close-ups on their site:

http://www.scoobymods.com/mods/impreza/oildrainvalve.php

Dennis

kate5000

Hubby's Accord EX'97 has airbag on light for past few months already. Cannot wait to see spy pix of new Forester 2003, to decide whether to trade in the Accord for Forester 2003 or 2002.

ateixeira

I like it, but I need 3 of them so $78 plus shipping sounds steep.

Wonder if I could just buy a valve from a hardware store myself. Honestly, that looks more like an $8 part.

-juice

vincer2

Juice,
I bought the drain valve without the nipple. On my OB the oil pan is not close to the ground so there's plenty of room for either valve. There are also no obstructions to prevent the oil from draining directly into the pan without the hose.

I haven't installed the valve on my wife's Camry yet but I could have used it last week. A day after I changed the oil and filter the car was in the Toyota dealer for a state inspection. They decided on their own that the oil needed to be changed. One reason why I don't want a Toyota dealer to change the oil is they overfill the crankcase. Instead of using 3qts and 18 ozs, as specified in the owner's manual, they fill it with 4 qts. Draining off the excess oil with the Fumotovalve would have been easy. Instead I removed the plug and drained it all. Three oil changes in 15 miles makes for a clean crankcase.

Ground clearance with the Camry could be a concern because the oil pan is extremely low. Probably why they don't make one for the Camry with the nipple.

You're right about the valve being expensive but it does appear to be well made. An option would be to buy just one, try it out and then if you think its worth the money buy the additional ones.
Vince

ateixeira

Interesting idea.

Anyone know the size of the drain plug? 17mm?

-juice

locke2c

The head is 17mm, yes. I don't know what the thread size or pitch is though.

-Colin

vincer2

Juice,
You don't need to know the thread size for the Fumoto valve. You select it based on the model of your car.
Vince

pattim3

I'll look for it on reruns. My kids always watch it so I'll clue them in. Very cool story but I'm sorry it is still unsolved.

Patti

pattim3

I'll keep my eye out for your case. I'm sure it can be resolved pretty painlessly. Your dealer should provide you with a rental if they keep your car.

Patti

ateixeira

Vince - I know, I was just wondering if I could get a custom one from the hardware store. Guess I'd have to take my stock drain plug and compare.

Then again, that's a lot of work, and the idea is to save time, not create a project.

-juice

bluesubie

A juice valve? Hmmm.
Dennis

jcameron3

I have a 1999 Legacy L 30th Aniv. Wagon and am experiencing a sticky glue-like substance leaking out between the body and the side windows on the rear portion of the car. I took the car to a dealer and he stated that it was a problem with this model year and that Subaru had fixed the problem on new models. The fix they suggested was to simply clean it off if they could. They couldn't get all of it and it is still leaking out. I am wondering if this is happening with other cars and what others have done to fix the problem. I have seen some Subaru Team members monitoring this page before, and am wondering if they could tell me about this problem and whether this is something that the dealer should remedy? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Jeff

ateixeira

That sounds kind of bizarre. FWIW, you can use WD40 to clean the gunk off.

Does the window rattle or leak when it rains?

-juice

jcameron3

It doesn't seem to be rattling or leaking, yet, but I am wondering whether this will become a safety issue. I assume that this is not the only thing holding the window on, but is just a sealant. Right now it is more of a nuisance than a really bad problem, but the warranty period is almost up and I wanted to get it figured out before then.

kens

Hey gang, I've been doing some reading on gear oil and had some questions I hope some of you may have answers for.

- How often do you need to change manual tranny oil?

- The manual calls for a GL-5 oil, but if you go to the Cobb Tuning website, they recommend the Redline MT-90 which is a GL-4 (if I remember correctly). Will this cause problems?

- Anyone use Redline gear oils in their manual tranny? What did you use? How do you like it?

Ken

originalbitman

I'm waiting for 10k miles and then I am going to switch to the Redline MT90.

bit

francophile

The stuff that holds windows in place is pretty hard, it isn't likely to run when it gets hot - unless maybe you drive into a furnace ;-) Plus if it was the window glue I'm certain that Subaru would recall and fix it, because windows falling out of cars is not a Good Thing.

The stuff you describe sounds like something they may have sprayed on for sound deadening or seam sealing purposes. They want that kind of stuff to remain very flexible and gooey so it continues to work over many flexes and many years. In this case it may have been incorrectly mixed, or perhaps the wrong product was used, or perhaps the product has separated (the way oil-based paint separates in the can); whatever the reason it has liquified sufficiently to actually run, seeping through seams instead of stopping and sealing them. Icky, but not dangerous.

Cheers,
-wdb

ateixeira

Good question, Ken.

I put Mobil 1 synthetic gear oil in my Miata, and it's been fine. It's much easier to service than the Subie, though. The Mobil 1 stuff I got was 75w90 - I haven't seen a different kind, but that's what the Miata calls for.

-juice

bluesubie

Jeff - My was has a 99 OB Ltd wagon and hasn't had that problem.

Ken - Gear oil is a hot topic on the i-club. I think most people were using the MT-90 because the 75W90NS recommended by Redline caused grinding. You can search the NA Tech Forum and find a lot of posts. When contacted by an i-clubber about the issue, Redline suggested using a mix of 75W90NS and 75W140NS to help the grinding. I was about to try it but couldn't find the 140 in a local performance shop. I ended up meeting an Amsoil distributor at an i-club meet and bought their Standard synthetic gear oil. Cold weather shifts were much improved and I don't get any grinding at all.
Dennis

kens

Thanks for the responses, fellas.

Yeah, gear oil seems to be quite a popular topic at i-club. Everyone seems to have their own opinions.

The one question I still have is how often do you need to change gear oil?

Ken

ateixeira

I'd guess 60k, maybe even longer intervals.

My Miata was 8 years old, so I felt it was time. The owner had said he did the 30k service early, and he was not lying - the gear oil was clear and new.

On the other hand, the gear oil in the rear diffy was like veggie soup - nasty and well past its prime. So I guess that shop doesn't include a diffy fluid swap.

I'll probably do those at 60k on Sandy, but I'm not sure what the exact intervals are. Anyone have an owner's manual handy?

-juice

milehi

I bought a 2001 Outback automatic back in Nov. 2000. I love the car, especially in snow. My problem, when driving at speeds of 65 mph or greater, I hear a high pitch whining sound coming from ? dashboard, maybe?. Only happens when I have my foot on the gas, as soon as I take my foot off the noise goes away. My dealer's first thought was that it was coming from the roof rack crossbars, but if that were true you would still hear the noise when letting up on the gas. I have all the air vents closed. I was at a new owner orientation meeting they held and someone else mentioned the same thing, the dealer never could find the source of the noise for them. I have my car in now for a 7500 mile service and they're trying to locate the noise. I don't have a lot of faith they will find it. Has anyone heard of this problem before? I'm about to take a cross country trip and hearing this noise is going to drive me nuts.

ateixeira

Crank up the tunes! :-)

Maybe it's interference with the radio? My Escort had that real bad. Sounded like a little turbo spooling up every time I blipped the throttle.

Never really got it fixed, just turned up the tunes.

-juice