Ford Escape Hybrid

dw438

Van Bortel Ford, Victor NY just south of Rochester off the Thruway.

dw438

ny state: can get sales tax refund. see
new york state tax division memo on
amendments to alternative fuels credits and exemptions.
if purchased before february 28, 2005, purchaser can get sales tax refunded by filling out and filing certain forms with ny state tax ....

see tsb-m-04-(3.1)I dated September 20, 2004
from the ny state tax office

http://www.tax.state.ny.us/pdf/memos/Multitax/M04_3.1i_1.1s_2.1c.- pdf

daysailer

does a "celebrity" endorsement change the purchase equation? Does a hybrid somehow fit my needs better now? Does it cost me less? Is performance improved? Why should I, or anyone else, care? (I didn't buy a Hummer after Arnold's well publicized purchase either.)

ateixeira

Publicity like that does help, though. Didn't Kerry get one also?

-juice

sherpadude

All I can say - again here.... is that if I keep it under 65 - driving conservatively (no run and gun) I consistently get over 30 highway & consistently over 34 local (most local trips higher with some over 40mpg).

This weekend drove over 450 miles - highway mix between 60-70 and with about 50 of that local and averaged 30.4

if I keep it under 60 numbers get really good - over 33 typically - I have not had the chance to compare apples (crv's) to apples (escapes??) in terms of driving styles and speed mix.

hope this helps

misterme

That all depends where you heard him quoted.

When Kerry spoke in Detroit he owned several SUV's, 50's era cars and a minivan.
When he spoke at an environmental fund raiser he didn't own any.

When questioned about the conflict, Kerry claims his guzzlers belong to the wife & family, not to him.
(?)
Personally I belive most actors & celebrities know zero about anything outside of their working field.
But they do get rather emotional about various topics...even if facts are contrary.

Sylvia

Long-Term Test: 2005 Ford Escape Hybrid (Introduction)
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2005/ford/escape/100407869/roadtestart- icle.html?articleId=103704

sdctcher

Can anyone who is driving the Escape Hybrid give tips on getting a towing package installed. I ordered Class III hitch Part #5L8719D520AA ($196.00) from Fordaccessories as advertised for the 2005 Escape but after my dealer tried to install it (for another $230.00) it would not fit because of the obstruction of the rear auxiliary evaporator outlet and inlet lines from the air flow mode door actuator cooling tubes on the left and the muffler on the right. At first Ford was not able to help and after market sellers and manufacturers seem clueless. Now my dealer has ordered a Class II Part #3L8Z17D826BA for about another $100 and we will see if that fits.

I told Ford Corporate that if they advertise a 1,000 lb. towing capacity then there should be the means available to make that so.

stevedebi

Man, if you are towing, that is the wrong vehicle...

ateixeira

Then Ford shouldn't rate it for towing. I agree that if they do, they should sell the accessories to support their marketing claims.

-juice

xcel

Hi Ateixeira:

___If I remember correctly, the Escape HEV was only rated for 1,000 #’s? Eventually there will be a class I hitch made available if one isn’t on the market already. I would be very careful here as a Hybrid can rely heavily on the pack for acceleration and you definitely do not want to rely on the pack while accelerating when towing …

___I would also watch Etrailer.com as they not only have great prices, they have fast shipping. The Ranger’s and MDX’s Class III Hidden Hitches were of very HQ and fit like a glove. One cost just $99 and the other $110 after a coupon although I just looked both of them up and they are a bit higher then that now. Make sure you pick up a coupon first as it will save a few $’s if you do decide to go with them in the near future once Escape HEV availability is assured.

___Good Luck

___Wayne R. Gerdes

stevedebi

"Then Ford shouldn't rate it for towing. I agree that if they do, they should sell the accessories to support their marketing claims."

Agree, but towing is going to kill the MPG, not to mention put stress on the electrical and mechanical subsystems.

mschmal

Why would you let a dealer order a Class III hitch when the truck clearly states it will only handle a CLASS I?

Good luck with that.

Mark

xcel

Hi Mschmal:

___The reason I would place a Class III on any car or truck if you can find one for it is not to tow a 3,500 - 5,000 # trailer but because it is a HD hitch with a 2&#148; opening vs. the less robust Class I hitches w/ 1-1/4&#148; openings. If you use a large Cargo Carrier/Rack, carry bikes/ski&#146;s/snowboards with a hitch based unit, or actually tow a 1,000 # trailer, using the 2&#148; opening and robust HD construction of a Class III hitch will definitely be in your best interest. The difference in cost between the two classes is usually < $20.00 so there is really no reason to purchase and use a more flimsy Class I setup if a Class III is available.

___To add to this, most SUV and small trucks only have Class III&#146;s available to them. It is not the limit on towing and tongue weight but the HD construction that you are looking for.

___Good Luck

___Wayne R. Gerdes

gagrice

If you use a large Cargo Carrier/Rack, carry bikes/ski&#146;s/snowboards with a hitch based unit, or actually tow a 1,000 # trailer, using the 2&#148; opening and robust HD construction of a Class III hitch will definitely be in your best interest

I agree. Finding a bike rack for the smaller 1.25 inch receiver might be a problem. I use my bike carrier more than I haul my utility trailer. Many very handy carriers available for the 2 inch receiver.

ateixeira

Many people tow only occasionally, but still, they need it once in a while. The issue isn't mileage, it's the utility of an SUV, and why you might have gotten an Escape instead of a Prius in the first place.

I also have a bike rack that goes into the hitch. I use that quite often.

Ford's gotta address that, if it's rated to tow people like me fully expect to be able to get a hitch that fits. Duh!

2" receivers are more universal. I have a 1.25" on my Subaru and some of the hitch accessories only come in a 2" size.

-juice

nortsr1

Go to Etrailer.com...they have adapters that take the one and a quarter inch to a two inch an vice versa. I had a 1 i/4" on my Tracker, traded for an Escape, had a two inch hitch installed and simply bought the adapter to convert to the inch and a quarter for my cargo carrier.

ateixeira

Thanks for the tip.

-juice

hyescape

In My research of trying to purchase this hybrid I found that most dealers did not take orders at MSRP. As a matter of fact the dealers ordered the cars for themselves and then put their dealer mark up of $2000.00 to $6000.00 above MSRP. This really upsets me. I am writing to Ford to let them know what is happening. There are a few dealers who did let the public order a hybrid at MSRP. Wow MSRP! No room to deal and good luck trying to find one at this price. I have one on order and the dealer had two on their lot but would not sell it to me at the MSRP price. What a way to help the economy. Make it so the rich will buy and don't care if they pay up to $6000.00 over MSRP. This is sad

ateixeira

They might just be trying to start negotiations at that elevated price. I bet if you sat down and seriously wanted to buy one you could eliminate the markups.

Even if they don't right now, they won't last.

-juice

guest

No they still won't go to MSRP or below even when I offered cash out the door. They are trying to rip off the buyers with their dealer markups and that is just down right wrong. Ford doesn't offer much incentive and this will probly make me buy my new pickup from some other make. I will be getting my hybrid Escape but not a new pickup from them and I have always been a Ford man and so have my 4 brothers. As I see it by their tactics Ford will lose 3 new pickup sells due to this and this is just from my family alone. How many more I wonder?

ateixeira

Keep in mind dealers are independent, so it's not really Ford's fault. That's how the franchise program works.

Ford can survey owners and then adjust supply so dealers with better satisfaction get more desirable models to sell (like hybrids), but they really can't stop dealers from charging markups.

I bet dealers are tired of losing money on new cars sales, and they want to make some of it up on these hot in-demand models.

-juice

guest

Your right they are independent and they can set their prices at whatever. Ford does survey the dealers and feedbacks from buyers. The thing is this. If they want to make up in sales then the dealers who mostly survive from their maintenance/extended warranty, and return customers wont get them back. Is this really cost effective? They can make all they want on sells but if the customer doesn't come back they are screwed. High priced sells will only hurt them not help. As I have said. Do you think I will buy a Ford pickup from a dealer who sells at a high price with no bargining room. NOT! Will I recommend them? NOT Why else are we here at Edmunds? To find the car of choice at the cheapest price possible. High priced dealers are out the door and FORD can and should look at this. That is what I am saying. They don't control the dealer but they can make it hard on those outrageous rip offs if they want to have a larger turn around. Profit is one thing but rip off is another and that goes to the buyer that will pay their jacked up dealer costs. It's business yes! But then they would do fine even at MSRP on hybrids. Most people want to buy under invoice. I am one of them and then I would be more than happy to give them my return business and recommendations.

ateixeira

You are voting with your wallet, and when enough people do that they will drop prices and try to recover. I agree it's short-term thinking and not very wise.

-juice

jfordman9

dealer is ordering both parts wrong, I work for a dealer and currently there is no hitch available for the hybrid, The first hitch they ordered is a class II hitch not a class III hitch for standard 2005 Escapes, the second hitch you say they ordered fits 2001-2004 Escapes it definitely will not fit. The hitch for the 2005 Escapes did'nt come out until 6 months after the vehicle came out. since the hybird is low production this year I would'nt expect it until next year.

jfordman9

It depends on the region you live in. I work for a dealer in Kansas City where the Hybids are built, and there are none available in this area, they all went to the green states first, California, New York, Massachusetts. One dealer in my region got one and they had to pay sticker to get it therefore they have to get their markup as well. Besides MSRP is just as it states SUGGESTED retail price.

dw438

I was lucky enough to get my Escape Hybrid AT INVOICE. This in New York State, mind you.

UPSTATE New York. Dealer had TEN Escape Hybrids available back in October, result of a local fleet sale going belly-up. Not a bad deal by far, as dealers in downstate New York are doing the markup deal. FYI dealer is in Victor, NY. -- there's a clue that one can Google ....

gagrice

How are you liking you Escape so far? Have you checked the mileage? Do you think the dealer has any left? My partner is in Victor today buying Telephone equipment from Redcom. What a coincidence. He was interested in a hybrid. I'll try and track him down.

Kirstie_H

dw438, we encourage you to post the name of your dealer here - just not the salesperson. I'm sure other NY'ers would be interested to know.

 

kirstie_h

Roving Host & Future Vehicles Host

dw438

Van Bortel Ford, Victor, NY. South of Rochester just off I-90, the NYS Thruway.

Easy to get to. And worth the trip.

explorerx4

the zip code would help to see what they might still have in inventory. the manufacturer has a website that you can browse by zip code.

dw438

It's now official. Just in time for your tax planning ....

2005 Ford Escape Sport Utility Vehicle Certified for Clean-Fuel Deduction

   

IR-2004-147, Dec. 13, 2004

 

WASHINGTON &#151; The Internal Revenue Service has certified the model year 2005 Ford Escape as being eligible for the clean-burning fuel deduction. The certification means taxpayers who purchase this vehicle new may claim a tax deduction of $2,000 on Form 1040.

 

Federal tax law allows individuals to claim a deduction for the incremental cost of buying a motor vehicle that is propelled by a clean-burning fuel. By combining an electric motor with a gasoline-powered engine, these hybrid vehicles obtain greater fuel efficiency and produce fewer emissions than similar vehicles powered solely by conventional gasoline-powered engines.

 

Under the recently signed Working Families Tax Relief Act of 2004, the clean-burning fuel deduction is up to $2,000 for certified vehicles first put into service in 2004 and 2005. The deduction will be limited to $500 for vehicles placed in service in 2006 and no deduction will be allowed after that year.

 

The one-time deduction must be taken in the year the vehicle is originally used. The taxpayer must be the original owner. Individuals take this benefit as an adjustment to income on Form 1040. They do not have to itemize deductions on their tax returns to claim it.

 

The amount of the deduction for the 2005 Escape was set after the manufacturer, Ford Motor Company, documented for the IRS the incremental cost related to the vehicle&#146;s electric motor and related equipment.

 

The IRS has previously certified Toyota and Honda hybrid vehicles. The Toyota Prius was certified for model years 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004 and 2005. The Honda Insight was certified for model years 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003 and 2004 and the Honda Civic Hybrid for model years 2003 and 2004.

 

Related Item: Clean-Fuel Vehicle Deduction Available for Certain Models

 

Subscribe to IRS Newswire

lblair

Our local dealer has one opening (someone cancelled) for a Hybrid and we're off tomorrow to put down our deposit. We are paying MSRP and will have to wait 6 weeks. We lucked out because they are giving us a good trade-in for our total gas guzzler - a Land Rover Disco.(Shell gas bill for Sept was $250!) So I guess that would even out paying MSRP instead of invoice. They said they would even try and tweak the trade-in so we can work in the very expensive Audiophile system. Does anyone have this? Is it worth the extra $1,850? We tried to use X-Plan but they said not on Hybrid or T-Bird. They are waiving processing fees in lieu,plus a few other goodies, I hope..

Looking forward to good gas mileage..Just curious about the Audiophile.

Oh.. and does the Hybrid have an ashtray?? Dumb question, but would like to know. Some 2005's don't anymore.

LB

dw438

No Escape really had an ashtray. The ashtray in the older Escapes was a pop-in that took the place of one of the front cupholders. I took delivery of my Hybrid and it didn't even have a cigarette lighter (though has the outlet for one)

exalteddragon1

guys, I am new to this thread and I was hoping you guys could answer a question on the Hybrid...

 

I thought the Hybrid technology was at least in part licensed from Toyota, so Ford is paying royalties to Toyota for each Hybbrid sold, but now i read in freep.com that

 

"Ford expects to sell as many as 20,000 Escapes next year. Ford developed its system independently. The electric motor in the Escape Hybrid provides power at slow speeds and provides a boost for the gasoline engine when the SUV accelerates."

 

So which one is true? Is Ford independant or is it paying toyota?

stevewa

Bought an Escape Hybrid 4 weeks ago. Might be able to answer a question or two...also have a 2002 Prius so I have some additional hybrid knowledge.

 

1. Ford developed their system independently of Toyota (some report Volvo was involved, which would make sense as Volvo did a hybrid concept car in the 90s). When the lawyers got to looking at the systems the determined there was some overlap and could be patent infringement issues. Ford licensed some key patents from Toyota to prevent any legal problems down the road. So the answer is, Ford is independant _and_ they paid Toyota.

 

2. It should certainly be possible to drive in EV-only mode given the following conditions:

a) AC is not set to MAX or either Defroster setting

b) Engine (and more importantly catalytic converter) is warmed up sufficiently

c) Battery is sufficiently charged

d) Terrain is flat to downhill.

 

Under the right conditions I've been able to keep it in EV mode at speeds up to 40 mph (meaning downhill). You get to a certain speed and the gas engine has to turn to protect the electric motor from overspeeding.

 

Mileage: I've been consistently getting between 27 and 28 mpg in mixed driving. This is the 4x4 version and part of my commute involves a large hill climb that can't be avoided. Generally my mileage goes down during the work week, and climbs during the weekend.

 

Price: We walked into the dealership cold and paid cash with a trade-in. We ended up givng about $1500 over sticker by the time it was over and done with. We had not expected to be able to purchase on the spot but they had a vehicle so we decided to go for it.

 

Trailer hitch: I'm struggling with this right now. I have a small tent trailer (900 lbs) that I need to be able to tow. The hybrid hotline at Ford claims I should be able to find an aftermarket fitment without any trouble. So far, nothing.

stevedebi

" Trailer hitch: I'm struggling with this right now. I have a small tent trailer (900 lbs) that I need to be able to tow. "

 

Would that be the total weight, or empty? Max is 1000 lbs...

stevewa

Supposed to weigh 900 lbs ready to roll. There's not a lot of space for storage when the top is cranked down...

ynotcal

I send an E-mail to the trailer hitch people discussed above (trailer.com) and they send a reply that said there is not a trailer hitch available for the Escape Hybrid as of yet. The response came 20 Dec 04

ynotcal

Have you thought about the Toyota Prius??

 

I have owned the following Hybrids:

Honda Insight, Honda Civic, the First Prius and the Second newly done Prius. I have a Escape ordered, but the room of the Prius may suit you well, while not quite the room of a Escape, its hatch back with fold down seats does provide quite a bit of room.

stevewa

I have yet to hear of an Escape Hybrid without the Audiophile system. I can tell you it's a very nice stereo and a decent navigation system. The nav system would be better with a larger screen and with touch screen instead of joystick. Since most factory nav systems run in the $2k range $1850 for the upgraded stereo with nav seems, while not truly reasonable, unsurprising.

gagrice

I just followed an Escape Hybrid up Interstate 8 out of San Diego. On the long grade heading East I could not get around him for several miles. This stretch is posted 70 mph and everyone is going 75-80 mph during rush hour. This guy in the Hybrid was not going 50 miles per hour up that long uphill stretch. He had dozens of cars behind him and we could not get into the left lane as that traffic was moving 75+ mph and we were all going 50 behind this Escape. I don't know if he was watching his gizmo readouts and trying to get the best mileage or what. He had a lot of unhappy people backed up in the right lane. If that is all that car has on a steep grade, it needs to be recalled and scrapped.

rfruth

I've never experienced a numskull in a plain ole ICE before and the hybrids come with a magic wand to prevent this so what happened ?

gagrice

either he had his face in all the gadgetry and not paying attention to his driving or the car had a problem. It is steep but not that steep.

yerth10

http://www.greencar.com/index.cfm?content=news&ArticleID=23

 

Ford may increase Escape-Hybrid production from 20,000 to 30,000. But it depends on Sanyo to ramp up battery production.

dw438

Must be the driver. I've done 80 on the NJ Turnpike in my Escape Hybrid. About the same on hilly I-81 in Pennsylvania. Also there's a nice hill on I-280 just outside Newark that was a zip with my car.

Must be the driver. Did he ever hear of the slow lane?

gagrice

"Must be the driver. Did he ever hear of the slow lane? "

 

He was in the slow lane. It is only two lanes wide for several miles, then goes out to 3 lanes. With a steady stream of homeward bound traffic going 75+ mph changing lanes was nearly impossible. The line of cars behind this guy could not get out into the left lane. This is a about 8-10 miles of uphill driving. I just wondered if any Hybrid Escape owners had difficulty on long uphill grades.

electrictroy

"They are trying to rip off the buyers with their dealer markups and that is just down right wrong."

 

.

 

Supply & demand. There's a high demand, and low supply, therefore dealers can ask high prices. It's not wrong... it's capitalism in action... and helping send your dealer's kid to college.

 

If it bothers you, just wait 6 months for prices to drop back down to MSRP.

electrictroy

"This guy in the Hybrid was not going 50 miles per hour up that long uphill stretch. He had a lot of unhappy people backed up in the right lane. If that is all that car has on a steep grade, it needs to be recalled and scrapped."

 

.

 

50 mph is the most efficient speed for a car, so obviously he was trying to get the maximum mpg possible. I do the same in my Insight. It's not the engine, but the driver.

 

Although I agree with you, it was discourteous to back up all the traffic. He could have gone 60 and still got decent mpg and not make everyone angry with him.

 

Troy

hyescape

I had contacted Ford about all the pricing and of course they said they could do nothing. So I had contacted Ford of Dublin on 11/22/04 and they had the one we wanted and wanted to sell it at $2000.00 over MSRP. I called them on 12/22/04 and they said the same and still had the same hybrid there. I told the sales guy he has to do better and he called back with $1000.00 over MSRP. I told him I will check with my wife. Of course my wife said no and only at MSRP would we buy. I called him back and told him I will only pay MSRP and it was going to be cash. HE called an hour later and said I cought the boss in a good mood and they would do the deal at MSRP. Listen to this NEW BUYERS. After doing the deal the guy who does all the final paperwork told us that they thought they would be selling better. Apperantly they are not selling as well as ford thought they would. So prices will come down soon. As a matter of fact some will get them under MSRP. They had two left. So demand is not that great like the prius was. I told the guy it was because of all the attention dealers were getting on their outragous mark ups and people bought eleswhere and different makes. We were almost ready to go with a different make but the deal came through. Our local dealership lost out because they too had one we wanted on their lot but again 2000.00 over mSRP. It was their loss and Dublin's gain.