No, I get it. You are a Mazda salesperson. You would love it if you could sell every car at MSRP (or more). If the Mazda3 "justified" its price, then my local dealers would not be selling them at significant discounts. Even my local "no haggle" Mazda dealer sells each and every Mazda3 at a discount. Maybe you should work at a Scion dealership. Then you really could sell each and every car at MSRP.
OTOH, claiming that having everyone buying Mazda3's at MSRP is to the benefit of the consumer is one of the funniest lines I've heard in a long, long time. Thanks for the day-brightener!
Thank you for blending my words by stating that I claimed that everyone should pay MSRP on a MAZDA 3... I'm one of the good guys and feel that fair pricing can be attained by just asking. Why should I give em' away? :P
My valid point(and it seems that all media facets feel the same way) is that MSRP is still great value for what you get regarding the Mazda 3. :shades:
The most requested car for the 2006 model year for the Mazda 3 will be the "i Touring" with an automatic transmission. This configuration has an invoice(16,331) to MSRP(17,450) margin of $1,119. Take into consideration that all these websites don't account for the MNAO Co-op advertising assessment which Mazda dealerships have to pay, so you can see all those Zoom Zoom commercials. This is added into the costs and clearly stated on factory invoice. Ours assessment for the Dallas/Fort Worth district is $176... calculating adjusted factory invoice on a unit equipped like this to be $16,507.
How much of that $943 margin do you want? I know, I know... all of it plus the 2% invoice holdback of $331?
As I said, I'm one of the good guys and feel fair pricing can be attained by just asking. A car like this... what's fair profit out of the $1,274 that can be made on this $17,450 MSRP 2006 Mazda 3 i Touring w/Auto? $1,200? $800? $400? $0? :confuse:
Many folks have been extremely satisfied with their Mazda 3 sedans and hatchbacks... knowing they got a great car at a great price with a great warranty that's an overall great value. Proof's in the pudding... just ask Edmunds.
Take into consideration that all these websites don't account for the MNAO Co-op advertising assessment which Mazda dealerships have to pay, so you can see all those Zoom Zoom commercials.
WHAT Zoom Zoom commercials? I haven't seen one in two months, and our TV is on every night from 6 p.m. until 11:30 p.m.
I test drove an '06 s 5 speed yesterday (they didn't have an i to drive). My question, for those that have driven both, is how noticable is the performance difference between the s and i for 2006? Not much diff on paper, and it does get a bit better mileage.
I was thinking of trying to get a loadedish i instead of an s (save some $, better mpg, and I believe it has a more relaxed cruising RPM).
Actually, can anyone confirm that the 5 speed i turns less RPMs in 5th gear than the s? I'm not a fan of buzz bombs at highway speed (soemthing I hate about my current tC).
Of course, fiscal conserativeness might have gone out the window when I discovered how much nicer the leather seats felt than the cloth!
at the risk of incurring the wrath of Pat, I found the leasther seats in the 3S gt more comfortable than that expensive car we can't mention, especially since they have a longer bottom cusion for more thigh support.
I'm one of the good guys and feel that fair pricing can be attained by just asking.
You're also a very funny guy... or don't have much knowledge of what it's like to buy a car. But I will give you the benefit of the doubt, and the next time I go car shopping I will ask the salesperson, "May I please get a fair price on this car?" and see what happens.
As for what profit is appropriate on a Mazda3... that's for you and your dealership to determine. And for me to determine if I think the price you have offered me is "fair"--if not, I can always go someplace else.
I think his point is valid, and also used to apply to Hondas. That is, they try to put a minimal mark up (keep MSRP close to invoice), so that even paying MSRP isn't a "ripoff" (like the domestics) since it ins't inflated so they can show huge discounts.
Of course, no one still pays it, butere there just isn't as much margin to work with as on some cars.
I can't say anything about the i, but I can say that the 3s 5-speed turns much more slowly at highway speeds than the Protege ES 5-speed I had before it. The Protege would be around 4,000 rpm at 70 mph. The 3s is at least 1,000 rpm lower.
Your comment is fine. We just can't get into a side by side comparison of two cars of such different classes in the dedicated discussion for one of them, that's all.
As a multi line dealer I understand what mikezoom is saying....some of the folks on here missed his point.
Let me give an example. The Mercury Monterey was intentionally priced $4000 high by Mercury to have alot of room for rebtates. The Mazda3 did not come in with an inflated MSRP to later have huge rebates...The Tribute has built in rebate room because it shares a marketing strategy with Ford....whereas the MZ3 does not share the Ford way of marketing.
Now that new Civic has come out will MZ3 have massive rebates? I am willing to forfeit 8mpg advantage for not having to drive fugly-saturn styled sedan.
is gone. They now have base, touring and grand touring (s only). So, the SP32 has effectively been replaced by the GT model, although when I priced them out, I think the GT is actually cheaper.
mazda doesn't have their web site updated for the '06s yet, but Edmunds does, and I think they have the list of colors.
I'm totally satisfied with my 2006 3i 5-speed. I'll get back to you on the RPM (not RPMs) at higher speeds. But, the interior is very quiet at x-way speeds. We were running 85 MPH (not MPHs) with AC on & all four of us in the car conversing normally, unaware of the engine speed.
Did you also drive an s 5 speed at all? Notice any real difference in sound/power? I think I might go for an i if I decide I don't need leather, to get the 16" wheels, and I don't mind the normal (non-optitron) guages. Plus it's cheaper to buy and feed, and should drive the same.
Also, what kind of mspg (miles per gallon (sorry Pat) do you get highway, especially moving at 85?
I haven't driven an S 5-speed. But the V V T in the 2.0 makes it noticeably stronger at low rpm than the '05 2.0.
Only three tanks so far, so too early for good data. Earlier this week took a trip that included 30 miles of climbing from elevation fo 2,000 ft. to 9,000 feet with AC on, most of the drive in third gear, 4 adult occupants, then some city traffic & 85 MPH cruising. For the 245 mile tank, I got 34.4 MPG.
I can say that the ES 5-speed I had before it. The Protege would be around 4,000 rpm at 70 mph. The 3s is at least 1,000 rpm lower.
That's amazing. How is it that my 2002 Protege5 2.0L 4 speed automatic does much better than your ES 5 speed manual? I just got off the highway to check the the numbers for the P5.
2800 rpm 100 km ( 62mph ) 3000 rpm 110 km ( 68mph ) 3200 rpm 120 km ( 75mph )
I did not want to "test" the 4000 rpm this aft in traffic, but I think we're talking in the 80s not the 70s for the Mazda Protege.
No need to hope (or worry, depending on your viewpoint) about the new Civic driving more rebates on the Mazda3. The Mazda3 is actually priced lower than comparably-equipped Civics. And the Mazda3 is a better car overall, IMO, unless fuel economy is Priority 1.
That's amazing. How is it that my 2002 Protege5 2.0L 4 speed automatic does much better than your ES 5 speed manual? I just got off the highway to check the the numbers for the P5.
It was all in the gearing, my friend.
Well, first of all, keep in mind that your 2002 Protege5 has a 2.0-liter four. The 2000 Protege had a 1.8-liter four. Also, the 2000 Protege manual got LOWER mpg (EPA rating) than the automatic version. I have a friend in town who bought his 2000 Protege ES automatic one week after I bought my 2000 Protege ES manual, and we used to do comparos side-by-side on the highway. Sure enough, his engine was going a lot more slowly (like about 500 rpm more slowly) at 70 mph.
We went on and on about this in the Protege discussion way back when (I'd say summer of 2000). Real observations were made and logged. It's here somewhere, but I'm too busy at work right now to go on that detailed an archeological expedition (although something tells me I'm about to go off and do just that -- work be damned, right?). :P
("Jeopardy" theme plays)
Actually it wasn't that hard at all, and I made it back here in time to add the info as an "edit" to this post. Here's an excerpt of a post yours truly made on July 20, 2000:
Some of you may remember my mention about a month ago that a friend of mine here in Richmond bought the EXACT same Protege I have except it's an automatic. We took them out on a highway here a few weeks ago and did some RPM comparisons (keeping in touch via ham radio in the process), and I must say I was shocked: At 70 mph, I'm pushing 3700 RPMs in fifth gear, while he's only doing about 3100! That's a big difference!
Okay, so it wasn't "quite" 4,000 rpm -- but fairly close, and a lot higher than the automatic at the same speed. I won't be able to post again until Monday, but I'll be taking a highway trip down to Va. Beach tomorrow and I'll try and remember to take a look at the tach in the 3 at 70. This might be interesting. See you guys, gals and other assorted biologies Monday!
are actually perforated leather. I think the cushion might be the same, but the top makes it softer. The cloth seems to be pretty firm. Maybe it is just stretched tighter.
sat in them again today. I think the leather helps because you can slide on it. On the cloth, I tend to get bunched up if that makes sense.
The 3 GT would be perfect (well, nearly) if it had a power drivers seat, or at least a front cushion tilt adjustment.
Meade - Since you mention it, sometimes using caps for acronyms is an advantage when it comes time to pluralize them. For example, the plural of CPA can be CPAs rather than cpas, GUIs rather than guis, LANs rather than lans. It's more readable and the acronym doesn't get obscured. Some people like to use an apostrophe which, as you know, is incorrect as apostrophes are normally only used for possessives or contractions (as in Meade's car, or Meade's a nice guy) but not plurals. The other day I saw a big sign on the front of an office, something like "Jones and Smith CPA's".
I've been checking for a few weeks now and Mazda still isn't showing '06 information or inventory on their website. This seems a bit out of date since the dealers have only a handful of '05 models, but a lot of '06s. Ugh!
I was just looking at Mazdas today, brought my 6 in for a minor problem. Don't recall if the '06 Mazda 3s had those two options, but the hatch I looked at had the following upgrades...... Trip Computer, auto on/off xenons, and rain sensing wipers, all standard. Also, now a BOSE system is optional, and it had seat heaters. What's odd is, those first three aren't available at all (i don't believe) on the 6.
Forgot one....it also had climate control. The sticker on it was abt $22,000, IMO a ton of car fot the money. I agree with Edmunds, this is the New Jetta VW shouldda built. But I'm glad Mazda builds it instead.
That's what I paid for a 1998 Honda Odyssey, the smaller one that's close to the size of the MZ5. It had a 150hp Vtech engine. Much roomier than the 5 though.
Every test drive and all performance statistics I've seen are for the 3 s. Has anyone seen any sort of review or test of the 2.0L 3 i? Or even any published 0-60 times?
I realize the 2.0L is upgraded slightly for 2006, but information on the old one would be very useful for comparison purposes when shopping.
I read on one Mazda3 enthusiast site that the "i" is slightly quicker than the "s" 0-60 due to manual transmission shift points. The "i" hits 60 in second while the "s" requires a shift to third. Interesting. Inquiring minds wanna know...
Yup, CR did test one (an '04). They actually rated it their top small sedan, and it got the best mileage of any car they had tested (at leaast in the class).
At the time it was CR's top rated small sedan. Now they rate the Focus ZX4 SES ahead of it, of the cars they've tested. And the Prius and Civic Hybrid got better fuel economy in the class. Of the non-hybrid cars, the 3i did quite well on fuel economy.
Consumer Reports had done one but there is no free way to get it
Actually, there is, and it is perfetly legal..imagine, free and legal! Our local library, and several others that I know of, have online access to data base called (something like "Ebsco host" ask your libraian. Anyway, I can go to the library online site, and enter my library card #, and have access to almost any CR article, and print it out ...includes pictures and charts. I believe the current month isn't available this way, but for free, wow? SWEET Hope this helps someone.
I guess I should rethink before I make statement like "CAN'T". I guess I was just thinking of the while you are sitting here reading this I CAN'T link you to this. my bad. :P
Who would have thought I would get such a responce from a little statement.
So can any of you geniuses out there tell him what the 0-60 time was. I'm not at home to look up the article.
For online library access to Consumer Reports articles:
Log into "iLibrary Online Databases", click on "EBSCOhost Select Databases", click on "EBSCOhost Web", under the heading "MasterFILE Premier" click on "Title List", type in "Consumer Reports" in the box labeled "Browse Publications", then click on "Consumer Reports".
Most recent three months will not be available for viewing (right now June 2005 and before are available). Be sure to click on PDF files in order to get pictures and all.
that at least confirms my suspicion that there really isn't a need to get the 2.3 (that is, the 2.0 has enough performance for normal use). Sure, the 2.3 is fun, but it is probably overkill for most people, especially with a 5 speed.
Since the 2.0 is cheaper and a little less thirsty, it certainly is a viable option.
With 150 hp, the 3i has one of the highest power ratings in its class-maybe the highest?? More than enough for most people. My two compacts have "only" 135 and 138 hp now, and one has an automatic; it's more than enough power for "normal" use (i.e. if racing from light to light isn't important to you). I last drove the 3i when it had 148 hp, both stick and automatic, and it had power to spare.
Comments
No, I get it. You are a Mazda salesperson. You would love it if you could sell every car at MSRP (or more). If the Mazda3 "justified" its price, then my local dealers would not be selling them at significant discounts. Even my local "no haggle" Mazda dealer sells each and every Mazda3 at a discount. Maybe you should work at a Scion dealership. Then you really could sell each and every car at MSRP.
OTOH, claiming that having everyone buying Mazda3's at MSRP is to the benefit of the consumer is one of the funniest lines I've heard in a long, long time. Thanks for the day-brightener!
My valid point(and it seems that all media facets feel the same way) is that MSRP is still great value for what you get regarding the Mazda 3. :shades:
The most requested car for the 2006 model year for the Mazda 3 will be the "i Touring" with an automatic transmission. This configuration has an invoice(16,331) to MSRP(17,450) margin of $1,119. Take into consideration that all these websites don't account for the MNAO Co-op advertising assessment which Mazda dealerships have to pay, so you can see all those Zoom Zoom commercials. This is added into the costs and clearly stated on factory invoice. Ours assessment for the Dallas/Fort Worth district is $176... calculating adjusted factory invoice on a unit equipped like this to be $16,507.
How much of that $943 margin do you want? I know, I know... all of it plus the 2% invoice holdback of $331?
As I said, I'm one of the good guys and feel fair pricing can be attained by just asking. A car like this... what's fair profit out of the $1,274 that can be made on this $17,450 MSRP 2006 Mazda 3 i Touring w/Auto? $1,200? $800? $400? $0? :confuse:
Many folks have been extremely satisfied with their Mazda 3 sedans and hatchbacks... knowing they got a great car at a great price with a great warranty that's an overall great value. Proof's in the pudding... just ask Edmunds.
WHAT Zoom Zoom commercials? I haven't seen one in two months, and our TV is on every night from 6 p.m. until 11:30 p.m.
Meade
Can't figure out your statement,intent, since there are no lubrication points on the Mazda 3.
Pay dealer $22.00 for 5000 mile service- oil filter etc.
Get a life
I was thinking of trying to get a loadedish i instead of an s (save some $, better mpg, and I believe it has a more relaxed cruising RPM).
Actually, can anyone confirm that the 5 speed i turns less RPMs in 5th gear than the s? I'm not a fan of buzz bombs at highway speed (soemthing I hate about my current tC).
Of course, fiscal conserativeness might have gone out the window when I discovered how much nicer the leather seats felt than the cloth!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
You're also a very funny guy... or don't have much knowledge of what it's like to buy a car. But I will give you the benefit of the doubt, and the next time I go car shopping I will ask the salesperson, "May I please get a fair price on this car?" and see what happens.
As for what profit is appropriate on a Mazda3... that's for you and your dealership to determine. And for me to determine if I think the price you have offered me is "fair"--if not, I can always go someplace else.
Of course, no one still pays it, butere there just isn't as much margin to work with as on some cars.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Meade
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Let me give an example. The Mercury Monterey was intentionally priced $4000 high by Mercury to have alot of room for rebtates. The Mazda3 did not come in with an inflated MSRP to later have huge rebates...The Tribute has built in rebate room because it shares a marketing strategy with Ford....whereas the MZ3 does not share the Ford way of marketing.
I am willing to forfeit 8mpg advantage for not having to drive fugly-saturn styled sedan.
Is SP32 coming any other colors this year?
mazda doesn't have their web site updated for the '06s yet, but Edmunds does, and I think they have the list of colors.
Of course, Audi can probably tell you for sure!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
It's "rpm" and "mph". No need for all caps.
Meade
:shades:
Also, what kind of mspg (miles per gallon
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Only three tanks so far, so too early for good data. Earlier this week took a trip that included 30 miles of climbing from elevation fo 2,000 ft. to 9,000 feet with AC on, most of the drive in third gear, 4 adult occupants, then some city traffic & 85 MPH cruising. For the 245 mile tank, I got 34.4 MPG.
That's amazing. How is it that my 2002 Protege5 2.0L 4 speed automatic does much better than your ES 5 speed manual? I just got off the highway to check the the numbers for the P5.
2800 rpm 100 km ( 62mph )
3000 rpm 110 km ( 68mph )
3200 rpm 120 km ( 75mph )
I did not want to "test" the 4000 rpm this aft in traffic, but I think we're talking in the 80s not the 70s for the Mazda Protege.
It was all in the gearing, my friend.
Well, first of all, keep in mind that your 2002 Protege5 has a 2.0-liter four. The 2000 Protege had a 1.8-liter four. Also, the 2000 Protege manual got LOWER mpg (EPA rating) than the automatic version. I have a friend in town who bought his 2000 Protege ES automatic one week after I bought my 2000 Protege ES manual, and we used to do comparos side-by-side on the highway. Sure enough, his engine was going a lot more slowly (like about 500 rpm more slowly) at 70 mph.
We went on and on about this in the Protege discussion way back when (I'd say summer of 2000). Real observations were made and logged. It's here somewhere, but I'm too busy at work right now to go on that detailed an archeological expedition (although something tells me I'm about to go off and do just that -- work be damned, right?). :P
("Jeopardy" theme plays)
Actually it wasn't that hard at all, and I made it back here in time to add the info as an "edit" to this post. Here's an excerpt of a post yours truly made on July 20, 2000:
Some of you may remember my mention about a month ago that a friend of mine here in Richmond bought the EXACT same Protege I have except it's an automatic. We took them out on a highway here a few weeks ago and did some RPM comparisons (keeping in touch via ham radio in the process), and I must say I was shocked: At 70 mph, I'm pushing 3700 RPMs in fifth gear, while he's only doing about 3100! That's a big difference!
Okay, so it wasn't "quite" 4,000 rpm -- but fairly close, and a lot higher than the automatic at the same speed. I won't be able to post again until Monday, but I'll be taking a highway trip down to Va. Beach tomorrow and I'll try and remember to take a look at the tach in the 3 at 70. This might be interesting. See you guys, gals and other assorted biologies Monday!
Meade
sat in them again today. I think the leather helps because you can slide on it. On the cloth, I tend to get bunched up if that makes sense.
The 3 GT would be perfect (well, nearly) if it had a power drivers seat, or at least a front cushion tilt adjustment.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
"Too much information"!!
80 MPG in 3i, 5-speed manual is ~ 3550 rpm. 85 would be about 3770.
Side mirror defrosters / a button on the remote to open the trunk - or any other "minor" upgrades -
It does have ambient temperature in the message center above the radio.
I believe there was a post a few weeks ago that hi-lited all the changes. I found it very informative.
Trip Computer, auto on/off xenons, and rain sensing wipers, all standard. Also, now a BOSE system is optional, and it had seat heaters.
What's odd is, those first three aren't available at all (i don't believe) on the 6.
fowler3
I realize the 2.0L is upgraded slightly for 2006, but information on the old one would be very useful for comparison purposes when shopping.
I read on one Mazda3 enthusiast site that the "i" is slightly quicker than the "s" 0-60 due to manual transmission shift points. The "i" hits 60 in second while the "s" requires a shift to third. Interesting. Inquiring minds wanna know...
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Consumer Reports is available at almost any library. There's more to life than the internet...
Actually, there is, and it is perfetly legal..imagine, free and legal! Our local library, and several others that I know of, have online access to data base called (something like "Ebsco host" ask your libraian. Anyway, I can go to the library online site, and enter my library card #, and have access to almost any CR article, and print it out ...includes pictures and charts. I believe the current month isn't available this way, but for free, wow? SWEET Hope this helps someone.
Who would have thought I would get such a responce from a little statement.
So can any of you geniuses out there tell him what the 0-60 time was. I'm not at home to look up the article.
Log into "iLibrary Online Databases", click on "EBSCOhost Select Databases", click on "EBSCOhost Web", under the heading "MasterFILE Premier" click on "Title List", type in "Consumer Reports" in the box labeled "Browse Publications", then click on "Consumer Reports".
Most recent three months will not be available for viewing (right now June 2005 and before are available). Be sure to click on PDF files in order to get pictures and all.
http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/cc/05mazda3.htm
Since the 2.0 is cheaper and a little less thirsty, it certainly is a viable option.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.