As it happens I just finished a mpg experiment. I decided to see how high I could get driving my normal route.
I drove no more than 5mph over the speed limit. Shifted at 2800-3200 rpm with light throttle; and had the AC on most the time. Occasionally I would get to 4500rpm when merging.
Driving miles consisted of 25% rural and 75% highway. Elevation is approx 600ft above sea level with temperatures around 75-85F.
The best I could get (just re-fueled) is : 30.17mpg
I thought the way I was driving I would smash the EPA and get high 30’s heh. I think I’ll go back to my normal driving (maniac on the road) and get my average of 27mpg.
Some reasons why you need more than one fill-up: - the car could be on a different slope on the "before" and "after" fill-ups - the pump nozzles could click off on different levels - the weather (wind, humdity, temperature, etc.) will affect the mileage
Using multiple fill-ups tends to average out the variations in the calculations, as some will be low and some will be high.
PLEASE, NOT A REFERENCE TO COLLEGE MACRO-ECONOMICS!!!
What, do ya wanna make me lose my breakfast?! Some memories are wonderful.
That class?
UH-UH!!!
I thought I'd never hear the term "standard deviation" again -- well, at least not in economic terms. I do still hear it, when my wife tells her friends about my propensity to veer off our route to the mall to visit car dealerships.
Well ... not to stray too far off-topic ... but my only brush with the term came in macro (not micro) economics, way back in 1988. Seventeen years and all the memories just came back! OUCH!
"Standard deviation is actually a statistical term applied to many disciplines."
Yeah, you can even calculate the standard deviation of the tasks in a project's critical path to get an early and late finish date, if have no real life!
Variation in every facet of life is as inescapable as gravity. Ignore or deny gravity & we get hurt. Ignore or deny variation, and we lose out (get hurt)
The standard deviation is the measure of variation. Smaller is better.
Unfortunately, there have been way too many poor teachers of statistics. If you've had a good teacher, I'm sure you agree with the value of being able to properly calculate & apply standard deviation.
I've had my 2004 3S since March 2004 and have consistently gotten back about 27 MPG with the automatic in mixed driving conditions. Mixed meaning I sometimes flog it and other times I baby it. Not bad at all, IMHO.
Rest assured your 2005 MAZDA3 2.3L is still rated at 160hp.
The PZEV (for five states) is a new addition to the 2006 MAZDA3 2.3L engine. For this reason, it is not shown in the 2005 specs.
I hope this clarification helps.
Again, thank you for contacting Mazda. It has been my pleasure to assist you. Please feel free to reply to this message with any further questions or comments.
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I prefer to control my own car without a complex, expensive-to-repair piece of electronics thinking for me. I prefer a brake pedal that feels like a brake pedal instead of the stick-shaker on a 737. I prefer to choose my own safety equipment, and ABS is not a piece of said equipment I'm enamored with. Besides, with a manual tranny, I don't see the need for ABS. ABS is mostly for people who tailgate or otherwise put themselves in positions where they need an electronic savior.
They may rumble, but the point is that they slow you with locking up. They allow you to steer while slowing. Engine braking can be effective in normal driving, but in a panic stop it's asking a lot of your car. You can drive as safely as possible, but me, I wouldn't assume I'll never need assistance from the modern safety features. I don't know where every deer is lurking just off the road. Or when a half asleep driver will sweve into my oncoming lane, etc. And if those things occur, you'll want to have ABS...and Stability Control would help too
Well, Meade, it's story time. Last fall I was in a fork in the road where the view from my left was blocked by shrubbery that had overgrown. As I was trying to merge a fellow bombed through to make the light; he obviously did not see me due to the folly-age . Had I or the driver behind me not had ABS we may have escaped but ... more likely I would have been clobbered by the fellow flying through on the left and/or been bumped by the car behind. ABS did not interfere with my driving; it assisted in my braking. You're right that we shouldn't put ourselves in positions where we need to brake needlessly; in this case I did not bring a pair of clippers to shave those bushes down to a safe size so I appreciated having all the braking power facing that runaway train. It's also worth remembering that if anyone makes a mistake driving, it's likely they won't be alone paying for the lesson.
Every test I have ever seen, automobile magazine-consumer union-NHTSA, has shown that ABS decreases stopping distances reduces skids and increases safety.
Whether its snow, ice,water or just bare pavement all the tests indicate improved stopping distance performance skid reduction and safety.
ABS simply improves the braking performance and is definitely NOT just "for people who tailgate or otherwise put themselves in positions where they need an electronic savior."
ABS is for people who recognize technological advances can improve driving performance, even for superb drivers.
well what about those of us who have been driving for a very long time, and pump the brakes in an emergecncy situation... abs would be worse no?????... bet there are no studies/tests for people who have reflexes to "pump the brakes" in emergencies.....
well what about those of us who have been driving for a very long time, and pump the brakes in an emergecncy situation... abs would be worse no?????... bet there are no studies/tests for people who have reflexes to "pump the brakes" in emergencies....."
I think Darwin had some thoughts on this subject...
Every test I have ever seen, automobile magazine-consumer union-NHTSA, has shown that ABS decreases stopping distances reduces skids and increases safety.
Really?
I’ve heard that stopping on gravel is longer with ABS. In certain situations on snow and ice it is longer with ABS and a “good” driver can stop in a shorter distance properly modulating the brake as opposed to pulsating the brakes on and off.
ABS is simpler to use (stomp and aim), but I don’t think the distances are shorter.
I don’t have them on my car, but on my wife’s I have them (as well as anti-slip, vehicle stability, air bags all around etc).
Pretty sure that in most situations ABS will stop in shorter distances than not.
In certain gravel and snow covered road situations non-ABS will stop shorter. Loose gravel and snow can build up in front of a locked tire - causing a snow plow effect and stopping the vehicle quicker.
I would think most people would benefit from ABS. The main benefit is that you can still steer your vehicle - maybe even out of harms way.
The ABS system is pumping the brake system faster than is humanly possible. For the sake of argument lets say in some situations the system takes longer to stop because of the pumping action. The benefit is your ability to steer your vehicle which is not possible when your front tires are locked.
There are times when one would say the ABS is not as good as foot pumping because of driver error. Many drivers are not aware that by pumping the brakes on a ABS equipped car creates a greater stopping distance. Always apply firm pressure and do not pump to get the best stopping distance.
I have lived in MN and ND with and without ABS. I can say based on my years of experience ABS is superior when correctly used .
I'm with you 100% on non wanting ABS. I can modulate the brakes myself and don't electronic "nannies" like ABS, stability control, etc.
ABS is great for anyone who wants it, the Maxima I have now had it standard, so I had no choice (other than another car). I've had a few cars with it over the years and my preference has always been non-ABS equipped cars.
I appreciate some companies giving the choice (Ford and some Mazda models).
It is nice to see that a (admittedly small) percentage agrees with me. We all have our own reasons, and we all have stories to tell. I could tell you my story -- where the ABS control unit on my 1994 Mazda B2300 pickup caused my rear brakes to LOCK on the freeway (and my foot was nowhere near the brake pedal) -- but I guess most of you would launch a new set of admonitions my way. Fact is, I simply don't want ABS and I think it's yet another move toward disconnecting the driver from the road, and I thank Mazda for holding out as long as it could on making it an option for people like me.
Yes, ABS helps a lot of people. Me, I weigh these kinds of options over the 24 years I've been driving, the nine cars I've owned, the accidents I've had, and how these options would or would not have made enough difference to be worth their (a) purchase price, and (b) maintenance/repair cost. Same reason many people decide not to put burglar alarms or fire sprinklers in their homes. And I consider the cost of repairing these items too. Any of you ever priced a replacement ABS control unit for the Mazda3? I'll betcha you haven't, and I'll betcha you'll have to sit down when you hear how much it costs. The replacement control unit for my '94 Mazda pickup was $1,200 (and that's the part price; no labor).
There will always be the rare exceptions of a driver who's life was saved because they were not wearing a seatbelt or who fared better in accident because their vehicle was not equipped with ABS.
A failed part on an ABS system does not make all ABS system inherently bad. How many times have brakes failed on a non ABS equipped vehicle? I doubt there is a worldwide conspiracy by the automotive industry to have us pay more for a vehicle equiped with the ABS system that is unsafe.
I bet most people are willing to pay the price of a replacement part than the "ultimate price."
If your wife, daughter, or other person important to you were to take a long driving trip that included snow & rainy conditions, would you want them to have a vehicle equipped with ABS?
Yes in fact I do have a fire sprinkler system in my house in the garage area.
No I do not have Halon in my kitchen,obviously, since Halon is a life threatening substance, but we do have a fire extinguisher.
When a driver is able to determine which wheel will lock up first in cars I will agree with you that ABS is unneccesary. Unfortunately brakes are not that well balanced in any car.
When I replaced my non ABS 2002 Protege 5 with the Mazda 3 I selected the ABS system, not because I follow too closely or have had accidents, but because it has been proven over many years to prevent loss of control during braking in all conditions, including gravel etc.
A person with very good driving skills can stop a car without ABS just as fast as one with ABS - all ABS does is prevent the wheels from locking so you can steer.
However -
ABS will - without any doubt - help an average driver - safely stop and control a car in a panic situation.
Many people on this board think that they have excellent driving skills - no way we can test them - so we can not prove them wrong - and since they really do deep down in their hearts believe they have great driving skills no one could ever convince them that they should have safety features like ABS.
In my experience - most people who think they are great at something are usually just average.
You see it all the time - someone with a manual tranny thinking they are "Mr. Power Shifter" when in reality most of these guys would be slower than someone (driving the same car) with an automatic who just floors it and lets the auto tranny pick the shift points - again no way you can ever convince them - because they really do believe it.
ABS braking apparently has some advantage if used correctly. Unfortunately, most drivers with ABS equipped vehicles will never read about the correct way to use their ABS braking, nor will they practice using their ABS braking --- and that is absolutely essential to mastering the correct use of ABS braking.
Many cars have added another feature to the brake system - it goes by different names - but the system has the ability to determine that you are in a panic situation - I think the normal way it does this is when you quickly "hit the brake pedal" once this happens the computer applies 100% maximum brake force to stop the vehicle.
I have not driven a car with this yet - but was a passenger in a Nissan Murano that had a - OH MY GOD THAT JERK IS GOING TO RUN THE RED LIGHT AND T-BONE US experience!!
The driver said that was the first time the auto brake feature had kicked in - he said it felt a little strange - but the vehicle did stop pretty fast. In this case - with this driver I think he would have been able to stop just as fast without the system.
I will guess that anyone that is still not accepting the 1980's technology of ABS will find 100 reasons to not want this new feature - some people just get set in their ways when they get older - I knew a guy (he was about 95) that had a black and white TV set - when it finally stopped working he went to buy a new one and all they had was COLORED TV sets. He didn't want a color set and there was no way anyone was going to convince him that a color TV was better.
Many cars have added another feature to the brake system - it goes by different names - but the system has the ability to determine that you are in a panic situation - I think the normal way it does this is when you quickly "hit the brake pedal" once this happens the computer applies 100% maximum brake force to stop the vehicle. "
I think you mean Electronic Brake Distribution with Emergency Brake Assist - we have it on the MZ3 (if you have ABS)
I believe the first statement may be true only for certain load and pavement conditions.
If a vehicle's front-to-rear brake balance (by design)is optimized for a 4-passenger load, then when the load is driver-only, the rear brakes will lock up before the fronts produce 100% of their braking ability.
Add 250# of luggage to the 4-passenger load, & the situation is reversed ... the front brakes lock up before the rears are at 100%.
Non-ABS brakes are a compromise. The front-to-rear balance is based on someone's idea of an average load. Driver skill simply cannot overcome this compromise. Nor can driver skill overcome side-to-side variation in tire-to-road friction.
I ask the highly talented drivers on this forum: If you're in a panic braking situation & sense lock-up (tire squeal)of one wheel, what do you do?
Reduce force on brake pedal? Increases stopping distance.
Pump the brake? Several times a second? I don't think so. Even if you could, you'd be reducing the braking effort of the tires that have good traction.
Comments
I drove no more than 5mph over the speed limit. Shifted at 2800-3200 rpm with light throttle; and had the AC on most the time. Occasionally I would get to 4500rpm when merging.
Driving miles consisted of 25% rural and 75% highway. Elevation is approx 600ft above sea level with temperatures around 75-85F.
The best I could get (just re-fueled) is : 30.17mpg
I thought the way I was driving I would smash the EPA and get high 30’s heh. I think I’ll go back to my normal driving (maniac on the road) and get my average of 27mpg.
Why is that?
I did it calculating from a full tank to the amount entered to fill it up again.
I'm at 2.5K miles.
The last three tanks before this one I was averaging 27mpg so I altered my driving to see the difference.
- the car could be on a different slope on the "before" and "after" fill-ups
- the pump nozzles could click off on different levels
- the weather (wind, humdity, temperature, etc.) will affect the mileage
Using multiple fill-ups tends to average out the variations in the calculations, as some will be low and some will be high.
What, do ya wanna make me lose my breakfast?! Some memories are wonderful.
That class?
UH-UH!!!
I thought I'd never hear the term "standard deviation" again -- well, at least not in economic terms. I do still hear it, when my wife tells her friends about my propensity to veer off our route to the mall to visit car dealerships.
:P
Meade
Not knowing what class you are in (micro / macro) would make it a little bit harder to understand!
Meade
Yeah, you can even calculate the standard deviation of the tasks in a project's critical path to get an early and late finish date, if have no real life!
Variation in every facet of life is as inescapable as gravity. Ignore or deny gravity & we get hurt. Ignore or deny variation, and we lose out (get hurt)
The standard deviation is the measure of variation. Smaller is better.
Unfortunately, there have been way too many poor teachers of statistics. If you've had a good teacher, I'm sure you agree with the value of being able to properly calculate & apply standard deviation.
Might we be a bit off-topic now?
Everyone has his or her own talents. That's "diversity," which also helps ol' Earth keep spinning happily around.
I'll let you worry about keeping a standard on deviation. Meanwhile my Mazda3 and I will not deviate from our zoom-zoomin' course of fun and frolic.
(Don't ya just love how I bring it all back on-topic? That's my contribution to the world, for I is a retired journalist and I can rite.)
:P
Meade
I didn't think journalists ever retired, I thought they just blogged 'til they dropped.
I deviated from the standard and bought a Mazda 3 - how's that
So, that would make you a "non-standard deviant"? Sounds kinda kinky to me.
I am a NY resident. The PZEV (Or whatever) for the 2006 is rated at 153.
It was not mentioned in the 2005 brochures. There was mention of the 2.0 liter engine (144 vs. 148) in the 2005 specs.
Is my car 160 hp or 153 hp?
Does this PZEV rating apply to the 2005 as well?
Capitol149
Thanks for contacting Mazda.
Rest assured your 2005 MAZDA3 2.3L is still rated at 160hp.
The PZEV (for five states) is a new addition to the 2006 MAZDA3 2.3L
engine. For this reason, it is not shown in the 2005 specs.
I hope this clarification helps.
Again, thank you for contacting Mazda. It has been my pleasure to
assist you. Please feel free to reply to this message with any further
questions or comments.
Please take a moment to give us your opinion about our e-mail service.
Click or paste the link below to complete a brief, online survey.
http://www.zoomerang.com/survey.zgi?p=WEB2248YQE39U6
Regards,
Heather B.
Specialist, Customer Assistance E-Business
Meade
i have a question.
i have a 05 m3 and today when i made a left hand turn i heard a grinding noise.
any thoughts????/
thanks
Scraping Noise Over Bumps From Right Rear Wheel
http://www.finishlineperformance.com/mazda3/docs/0006.pdf
Brake Squeak / Grind Noise From Rear Brakes
http://www.finishlineperformance.com/mazda3/docs/0028.pdf
I links do not work go to:
http://www.finishlineperformance.com/mazda3/bulletins_index.html
Good Luck
Why don't you want ABS? You prefer skidding?
Meade
Last fall I was in a fork in the road where the view from my left was blocked by shrubbery that had overgrown. As I was trying to merge a fellow bombed through to make the light; he obviously did not see me due to the folly-age . Had I or the driver behind me not had ABS we may have escaped but ... more likely I would have been clobbered by the fellow flying through on the left and/or been bumped by the car behind. ABS did not interfere with my driving; it assisted in my braking. You're right that we shouldn't put ourselves in positions where we need to brake needlessly; in this case I did not bring a pair of clippers to shave those bushes down to a safe size so I appreciated having all the braking power facing that runaway train. It's also worth remembering that if anyone makes a mistake driving, it's likely they won't be alone paying for the lesson.
Whether its snow, ice,water or just bare pavement all the tests indicate improved stopping distance performance skid reduction and safety.
ABS simply improves the braking performance and is definitely NOT just "for people who tailgate or otherwise put themselves in positions where they need an electronic savior."
ABS is for people who recognize technological advances can improve driving performance, even for superb drivers.
I think Darwin had some thoughts on this subject...
Really?
I’ve heard that stopping on gravel is longer with ABS. In certain situations on snow and ice it is longer with ABS and a “good” driver can stop in a shorter distance properly modulating the brake as opposed to pulsating the brakes on and off.
ABS is simpler to use (stomp and aim), but I don’t think the distances are shorter.
I don’t have them on my car, but on my wife’s I have them (as well as anti-slip, vehicle stability, air bags all around etc).
In certain gravel and snow covered road situations non-ABS will stop shorter. Loose gravel and snow can build up in front of a locked tire - causing a snow plow effect and stopping the vehicle quicker.
I would think most people would benefit from ABS. The main benefit is that you can still steer your vehicle - maybe even out of harms way.
There are times when one would say the ABS is not as good as foot pumping because of driver error. Many drivers are not aware that by pumping the brakes on a ABS equipped car creates a greater stopping distance. Always apply firm pressure and do not pump to get the best stopping distance.
I have lived in MN and ND with and without ABS. I can say based on my years of experience ABS is superior when correctly used .
I'm with you 100% on non wanting ABS. I can modulate the brakes myself and don't electronic "nannies" like ABS, stability control, etc.
ABS is great for anyone who wants it, the Maxima I have now had it standard, so I had no choice (other than another car). I've had a few cars with it over the years and my preference has always been non-ABS equipped cars.
I appreciate some companies giving the choice (Ford and some Mazda models).
It is nice to see that a (admittedly small) percentage agrees with me. We all have our own reasons, and we all have stories to tell. I could tell you my story -- where the ABS control unit on my 1994 Mazda B2300 pickup caused my rear brakes to LOCK on the freeway (and my foot was nowhere near the brake pedal) -- but I guess most of you would launch a new set of admonitions my way. Fact is, I simply don't want ABS and I think it's yet another move toward disconnecting the driver from the road, and I thank Mazda for holding out as long as it could on making it an option for people like me.
Yes, ABS helps a lot of people. Me, I weigh these kinds of options over the 24 years I've been driving, the nine cars I've owned, the accidents I've had, and how these options would or would not have made enough difference to be worth their (a) purchase price, and (b) maintenance/repair cost. Same reason many people decide not to put burglar alarms or fire sprinklers in their homes. And I consider the cost of repairing these items too. Any of you ever priced a replacement ABS control unit for the Mazda3? I'll betcha you haven't, and I'll betcha you'll have to sit down when you hear how much it costs. The replacement control unit for my '94 Mazda pickup was $1,200 (and that's the part price; no labor).
Meade
A failed part on an ABS system does not make all ABS system inherently bad. How many times have brakes failed on a non ABS equipped vehicle? I doubt there is a worldwide conspiracy by the automotive industry to have us pay more for a vehicle equiped with the ABS system that is unsafe.
I bet most people are willing to pay the price of a replacement part than the "ultimate price."
There are risks that are weighed in life. Please accept mine and let's move on.
Meade
No I do not have Halon in my kitchen,obviously, since Halon is a life threatening substance, but we do have a fire extinguisher.
When a driver is able to determine which wheel will lock up first in cars I will agree with you that ABS is unneccesary. Unfortunately brakes are not that well balanced in any car.
When I replaced my non ABS 2002 Protege 5 with the Mazda 3 I selected the ABS system, not because I follow too closely or have had accidents, but because it has been proven over many years to prevent loss of control during braking in all conditions, including gravel etc.
However -
ABS will - without any doubt - help an average driver - safely stop and control a car in a panic situation.
Many people on this board think that they have excellent driving skills - no way we can test them - so we can not prove them wrong - and since they really do deep down in their hearts believe they have great driving skills no one could ever convince them that they should have safety features like ABS.
In my experience - most people who think they are great at something are usually just average.
You see it all the time - someone with a manual tranny thinking they are "Mr. Power Shifter" when in reality most of these guys would be slower than someone (driving the same car) with an automatic who just floors it and lets the auto tranny pick the shift points - again no way you can ever convince them - because they really do believe it.
fowler3
The best web page I've seen re ABS braking is at :
http://www.mucda.mb.ca/aboutabs.htm
ABS braking apparently has some advantage if used correctly. Unfortunately, most drivers with ABS equipped vehicles will never read about the correct way to use their ABS braking, nor will they practice using their ABS braking --- and that is absolutely essential to mastering the correct use of ABS braking.
Many cars have added another feature to the brake system - it goes by different names - but the system has the ability to determine that you are in a panic situation - I think the normal way it does this is when you quickly "hit the brake pedal" once this happens the computer applies 100% maximum brake force to stop the vehicle.
I have not driven a car with this yet - but was a passenger in a Nissan Murano that had a - OH MY GOD THAT JERK IS GOING TO RUN THE RED LIGHT AND T-BONE US experience!!
The driver said that was the first time the auto brake feature had kicked in - he said it felt a little strange - but the vehicle did stop pretty fast. In this case - with this driver I think he would have been able to stop just as fast without the system.
I will guess that anyone that is still not accepting the 1980's technology of ABS will find 100 reasons to not want this new feature - some people just get set in their ways when they get older - I knew a guy (he was about 95) that had a black and white TV set - when it finally stopped working he went to buy a new one and all they had was COLORED TV sets. He didn't want a color set and there was no way anyone was going to convince him that a color TV was better.
I think you mean Electronic Brake Distribution with Emergency Brake Assist - we have it on the MZ3 (if you have ABS)
http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/tw/s-class.htm
If a vehicle's front-to-rear brake balance (by design)is optimized for a 4-passenger load, then when the load is driver-only, the rear brakes will lock up before the fronts produce 100% of their braking ability.
Add 250# of luggage to the 4-passenger load, & the situation is reversed ... the front brakes lock up before the rears are at 100%.
Non-ABS brakes are a compromise. The front-to-rear balance is based on someone's idea of an average load. Driver skill simply cannot overcome this compromise. Nor can driver skill overcome side-to-side variation in tire-to-road friction.
I ask the highly talented drivers on this forum: If you're in a panic braking situation & sense lock-up (tire squeal)of one wheel, what do you do?
Reduce force on brake pedal? Increases stopping distance.
Pump the brake? Several times a second? I don't think so. Even if you could, you'd be reducing the braking effort of the tires that have good traction.