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Comments
Perhaps Lexus did this to get good EPA numbers, but since you are driving in 4th, the non-recommended way, you will take a gas mileage hit, perhaps small, but still there, not to mention increased wear and tear (since engine wear will be related to a parameter called piston travel per mile, and others) and noise and even increased CO2 and Nox emissions.
My opinion is that Lexus has a [non-permissible content removed] (technical term
I am sorry, but I cannot accept these "work-arounds" while letting Lexus off the hook.
Actually, my Lexus salesperson was the first one to suggest driving in this fashion. I will ask the service manager about his thoughts too. Anyway, the car seems to shift smoother when I drive in this way.
I agree with you that this is not a perfect situation, but we have committed our dollars to drive these cars so I will make the best of it. I applaud those who are trying to get the attention of Lexus.
More seriously, I agree with you that trying to make the best of the situation given the invested amount is the right thing to do, and you are also right that Lexus should be pushed to fix these cars for a problem that they will not admit to.
I do not have any issue with an ES300 anymore since I just traded mine in, and have since moved on in my vehicular life. I just want to continue to do my share in helpng others still stuck with the lousy drivetrain that is simply not what one would expect of a Lexus.
And, incidently, what do you think will happen to the resale value of these cars when the problem becomes public knowlege?
You are somehow under the assumption that because you have a "problem" with your transmission everybody else would also. What you might think is a problem could very well be the characteristic of the car. Just because it doesn't fit your driving style doesn't make it a problem. I personally drive an 03 Camry that has the same engine and transmission and it has been flawless. Then again I don't like to drive aggressively or stomp on the gas pedal all of a suddenly. Maybe if I did I could have felt the so called problem. Most ES300 owners don't drive like a maniac and therefore probably don't feel the "problem". If you really think the lemon law is on your side, sue Lexus again. Maybe this time Lexus will give you an ES330 or better yet an LS430.
I DON'T drive like a maniac!!
I've owned three ES300's and I NEVER had anything negative to say about the transmissions in any of them. I traded in my 1994 ES for an 2003 ES, and from day one I experienced what many of these other owners have experienced...shifting hesitations...transmission having problems deciding what gear to shift into, etc.
Funny, when I drive my wifes 2001 Toyota Corolla I enjoy how the transmission responds in all instances, and that car cost $25,000 less then my Lexus!
That's all that we're all looking for.....a car that responds properly to the input of the accelerator pedal.
True, I can overcome the inherent problems of this transmission, but why should I allow the car to think for me? I want to decide these things myself.
One other thing. I've driven over twenty 2002-3-4 ES's and everyone of them exhibited the same problems.
It doesn't matter whether I'm driving calmly or aggressivly.....it CAN be reproduced!
http://www.autosafety.org/fileacomplaint
http://www.odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/.php
http://www.consumerreports.org/main/detailv2.jsp?CONTENT%3C%3Ecnt_id=719&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=703&bmUID=1065148507227-
Whenever someone says "the ES300 is just like a Camry" they tend to forget to add the "except, except, except, except....."
could I take a ES330 for a couple of hours and
detect transmission problem? If I don't does
that mean I have one free of this problem.
Right now the ES330 is my next purchase. If I
can "find a good one" I'll feel a little better
about spending the money.
My opinion is that the hesitation is in every car and can be repeated on a test drive. It is a design problem, not an individual automobile problem.
that are test driving the ES330 are not picking
up on this problem. Most all reviews heap praises
on this car.I've done the BMW thing and having retired am ready for some long road miles. I'm
gonna try and detect the tranny glitch on my test drive. Probably purchase in mid January.
Will keep posted on what I find.
Anyway..... the problem I have is just like yours and others. It's periodic.... and varies from week to week, day to day and hour to hour. I mentioned there was a period when I thought it was fixed. In stop and go traffic I get a slip and surge that makes it hard to change lanes safely. This is at speeds from 5 to 20 mphs. I gently press the gas pedal and nothing..... then the car lurches forward a few feet. Also, like many others, I have run into problems where I needed to accelerate. The sensation is somewhat like putting the car in neutral and watching the RPM's float up, sometimes to redline. The car goes no where while the engine revs. I had the upgrade and it got rid of the shudder for the most part. I notice it a little bit, but it's tolerable. It also got rid of that rearended feeling. Sometimes I could let off the gas and it would feel like someone bumped me from behind. I would do the Lemon Law route again, except that Lexus will be more prepared this time. Since this is a manufacturers defect it isn't technically covered in the Texas Lemon Law. Also, after the upgrade it's a little harder to duplicate the problem consistently. A lot depends on your drive with the judge. In my first attempt, it was easy to duplicate things and the judge had no problem getting the transmission to fail. Unfortunately I was stupid enough to believe in Lexus and got another ES 300. I don't believe most cars have the problem. If you have the problem you will know it within days. Believe me, no special driving tricks will be necessary. Then get ready to contact a Lexus corporate rep and have him tell you it's all in your mind. Right Mowtownusa?
Note that on post 274, motown says "..I personally drive a Camry". Post 274 more than implies mowtown has been referring to a Camry all along.
If he is trying to repeat the problem in the Camry, assuming his car is identical to the ES300, it explains why he cannot repeat the problem!!
Then we can eliminate one "Lexus plant". :-)
You would not be the first one to assume the Camry is just like the ES300. That (mis)info is all over the place. And I know there would be no way for you to know otherwise unless you had driven both cars.
An interesting experiment might be for someone like myself who can repeat the ES300 transmission problem without fail, to go try the same thing on a Camry.
I'd be rather perturbed if Toyota fixed the problem on the Camry, while not admitting there is one on the ES300.
At least you are not a Lexus plant!!!! :-)
That aside, I also appreciate your comments and don't want to see you get kicked off the board, either, which may just happen if you don't calm down a little. :-)
And if these troubles don't rise to this level of merit, then a) grin (or frown) and bear it, or b) move on to another vehicle.
I went to the dealership yesterday and my rep said he thought they could make further adjustments, but he was wrong. There's nothing further coming. It was just a waste of my time.
I asked him if it was the same tranny as the Camry. He said he didn't know. I called a Toyota dealership today, and they said they didn't know. Sounds fishy to me.
Mowtownusa go drive your Camry. Atoews mind your own business. Really... I don't need your help or comments. Thank you.
Believe it or not, I was not trying to help you. I personally appreciate your comments and don't want to see you get kicked off the board for my own sake.
I find your info helpful, despite your rudeness.
Anyone have any answers to my questions in post # 292?
Frankly, I think those of us with concerns about the way the transmission works on the ES would be further ahead directing frustrations to the source (Lexus) and quit being so paranoid about who might write something on this website.
Since you are a very experienced driver and have built cars yourself, please explain why my car DOES have the shudder when the it downshifts from 5 to 4. The hesitency thing seems to vary from one day to the next - and
seems to have been getting worse as I have put more miles on it (6K now). But I have NEVER noticed any "racing" of the rpms when accelerating as Texas and others have described. When I bought the car I noticed the shudder right away but didn't notice the hesitency thing for several months. As I said before, my '95 Avalon shifts much more smoothly than this new ES.
Did you have the transmission upgrade? And if so, did it help any?
My vehicle, as delivered, had a pronounced "shudder" at 40/45 mph. It was slightly noticeable at other speeds. A tech at my dealer told me that they were aware of the problem and that it was caused by a "lean mixture" to improve emissions. This bothered me because a mixture lean enough to cause a stumble will also, in time, burn valves and piston tops. Lexus Customer Service acknowledged the problem and said a cure would be available by July 2003. Other than the shudder, the car performed very well. When the upgrade became available, my car was the first one done by my dealership. For a couple of months, it drove differently every day. It has finely settled down, I hope, to its present level of performance. With regard to the 1/2 and 2/3 shifts, it will drive fine for hours and then suddenly, when accelerating from a stop, will sound and feel like a slipping transmission or clutch. Each shift taking 2 to 3 seconds. At any speed at which it is "locked up"(40mph+), if you put it to the floor as in a passing or avoidance situation,RPM climb, forward momentum slows, and the transmission takes its sweet time deciding on a gear to use. This takes about 3 to 4 seconds sometimes. When it finely decides, it takes off like a shot. Both problems are annoying, but, this second one could be very dangerous if you are about to be rear ended etc. If you were to ask me if I preferred upgrade or pre-upgrade it would be like asking me if I would prefer cancer in my right lung or my left lung. Hard to decide. I would prefer neither. And I would prefer my automobile to function as well as other automobiles.
The overall impression is that the tranny is still clunky and does not respond the way you would expect it to. It seems to surge suddenly at different speeds now whereas it did not do that before. Also, the gas mileage while bad before has become worse. I am only getting 18 mpg with a mix of city and hwy driving.
Now that I have had the car for two years, my main hope is that the car holds up over time (e.g., this is the primary reason that I bought the car, quality). I will continue to post any new issues with the car.