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  • scotth6scotth6 Posts: 43
    1) to the guy who is comparing an Escape to an X3
    you need areality check. I bought my 2001 X5 3.0(in May of 2000) and i paid sticker or $45K. I have had it over 31/2 years and the retail value is $32K or a loss of $13K. You buy you Escape for $25K keep it 31/2 years and its worth the $12K if your real lucky. We both lose $13K but you lost 52% of your value and I lost 29% except I drove an X5 and you drove a Ford. The point is Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, Explorer etc will not hold their value or Infiniti like a BMW.
    2) people over 50 do buy X3's, I'm 51 and wanted something more agile with better gas milage than the X5
    3) I thought a ton was 2000 lbs.
  • scotth6scotth6 Posts: 43
    Can anyone explain the cost of this option because my dealer can't. My understanding is your car most be prewired (appr. $150) but then it requires an installation of a receiver for the stock radio which costs about $500. I know Sirrus has a promotion that pays for one year of your monthly payments if you sign up for 3 years.
    Does anyone have any details or purchased this for another BMW or another make? Living in South Carolina the radio station options are pitiful.
  • jjmanjjman Posts: 77
    of course math might be an elective course on saugatak's planet ;-)

    to put in my 2 cents I think the FX's leather and most interior design is nice but the front console cries cheap like all Infiniti and Nissan products
  • saugataksaugatak Posts: 488
    yikes. normally my math is good but of course jjman is right. 4,000 pounds or 2 tons.

    scotth6, resale value is not something I'm too concerned about. I have about 25 relatives about to be driving cars in my family (lots of cousins, nephews and nieces hitting 18). When I or my dad want to dump a car, we just give it away as a B-day or Christmas present. every car i get either gets run into the ground either by myself or by a relative. never a problem.

    as to your age scott, i'm only pointing out my opinion (not doing any empirical testing) that the composition of this board has pretty obviously changed and has gotten younger. that doesn't mean everyone is younger, just that the average age of the board has gotten younger. again, it's just my opinion.

    and for your information scott, you are by far the oldest person i know that is getting an X3.

    as for the interior of the X3, i have my opinion and you have yours, and there are plenty of people on both sides of fence on this one.
  • saugataksaugatak Posts: 488
    Wondering if it'd be a good idea to start a comparo on these 2 cars b/c they seem to represent the best of the good handling small SUV segment.

    This way, people in the know about the FX35 can respond to jjman's bashing of the FX interior. Also, it'd be interesting to see a comparison of how they handle.
  • Hi Everyone, I have been considering the X3 for about a month now. While I have never posted any messages, I have enjoyed reading all of your informative posts. My dealer called me this morning and offered to take $500.00 -- $1,000.00 off the MSRP of either the 2.5 or 3.0. We live in New York, and he told me that he wasn't authorized to give us this discounted price prior to today. Do you think that this is a good deal? Does anyone else have experience in dealing with any NY dealership? I know that someone mentioned that some of the New Jersey dealerships were willing to work with you on the price of the 3.0. What about the 2.5? Any feedback would be most appreciated.
  • tps3tps3 Posts: 17
    I think you can probably do a bit better than that... sounds like people are getting as much as 1,500 off msrp. Not being authorized to give discounts would be a dealer-level decision, not a BMW NA decision, because it sounds like folks have been getting them for a while now. (If he said otherwise, he's lying.) I would guess that either this dealer is realizing that other dealers are, um, dealing, or he realizes that demand is more slack than expected. Or both. Either way, I think it's a good sign that you have some negotiating power.

    It's hard to say which engine choice would give you more negotiating room. If this forum is any indication, there's more interest for the 3.0 than the 2.5. But we don't know what the production flow at the factory is like; if they're making say 2x the 3.0s to the 2.5s, despite less # number demand for the 2.5s the relative demand could be higher, leading to less negotiating power.

    Regardless, if you live in the NY City area (yes, there is a "NY" other than the city, but from your mention of NJ I assume you mean downstate) there are a ton of dealers around; I would write up a fax with exactly what you're looking for and when you want it (to try and ensure you don't go with a low price but then get pushed back inordinately on delivery), and send it to a bunch of dealers asking for their best offer. Make 'em compete for your business.

    good luck
  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    you: In any case, the Escape vs. X3 2.5 race comment was said in jest (as indicated by the :) ).

    me: I should hope so! You don't want to give the impression that you'd buy either a Ford Escape or an X3 for racing-type performance. Unless you want to have a shop stick a hemi in there. :-)

    When measuring the performance of a vehicle like the X3, I think you have to look at value(standard features, warranties/cost), comfort, utility, and most important in my mind is capability in inclement weather. I could care less whether it runs to 60mph in 8, 9, or 10 sec. What I'd want to know is how good is the AWD and stability systems. Is this rig going to get me thru blizzards, and icestorms safely (higher probability than others). Does it get reasonable mpg otherwise? Is it comfortable and feel decent to drive?

    To me an X3 is not a perfromance or sports car. It is not a luxury car. It is not a heavyduty SUV or truck. It is a compromise - decent at all, master of none. It is an option to upgrade from the Xterras, and such.
  • vsromanvsroman Posts: 95
    is a great idea. IMO, the best comparison is the FX35 and the X3 3.0. What is interesting about the FX is that the FX45 is often compared to Cayenne and SRX, all 50K plus. But, the SAME vehicle with a smaller engine (3.5) is offered for much less money. And that smaller engine is not so small when compared to the X3!
  • overtime1overtime1 Posts: 134
    I'd stick the Forester XT in the comparison with the X3 and FX35 as well. Another high performance small AWD SUV. Of course there are tradeoffs...but that is what comparos are all about...

  • vsromanvsroman Posts: 95
    although from what I've read, the Forester XT is quite capable, I do not think that most shoppers considering the FX and X3 would consider it, mainly because it doesn't have the premium label. At least that's why I wouldn't buy one.

    Plus you could argue that 10 others could be in the comparison as well. Reading the posts here and under the FX, lots of folks are considering both the X3 and the FX35 and a head to head discussion would be very interesting.
  • overtime1overtime1 Posts: 134
    ...most people have never heard of the XT. Its not "premium" but that doesn't mean it isn't as good in many ways and that people wouldn't cross-shop it if they knew about it. Not only that, one of the editor's in C&D review of the X3 made a direct comparison between the X3 and the XT...

    I don't see 10 other cars that realistically fit the category of sporty, fast, small, awd SUVs. True, the X3 and FX aren't that fast but they handle well.

  • Below is the price I have been quoted for an X-3 with zero deposit and just drive off fees. Anybody know if these residual values are accurate and if 2.4 is the best rate BMW has? Also please see my response at the end of the quote and feel free to correct me if I am wrong!!!

    This is the dealer quote:
    Sticker Price on X3: $35,520
    Internet Price: $34,495
    Res Value 15K 57% of sticker price & 12K 59%.
    Money Factor: 2.4 This is the Best Rate BMW has.
    Drive Off : $1414.99 (Lic Fees $274 + $525 Lease Fee + 1st payment)
    Monthly Payment 12k $509.45 + Tax =$551.45
    Both 3 YEAR 15K$527.45 + Tax =$570.99

    All of the terms of your offer sound good with the exception of the monthly payments. Please check them.
    Specifically, please note that:
    (a) Given an "Internet Price" of $34,495 and a residual value (assuming 12k miles/year) of $20,956.80 (59% of the $35,520 MSRP), the amount financed is approximately $13,538.20 (the "Financed Amount"); and
    (b) Given a money factor of 2.4, which is approximately equal to an annual interest rate of 5.9% (1.0024 ^24)
    (c) An amortization of the Financed Amount yields a pre-tax monthly payment of approximately $411.30 per month (and assuming an 8.25% tax rate, an after tax monthly payment of approximately $445.20).
    According to my calculations, at a 2.4 money rate (or a 5.9% apr) a pre-tax monthly payment of $509.45 corresponds to a "capitalized cost" in the neighborhood of $37,726.77).
    Please let me know if my analysis is mistaken.
  • vsromanvsroman Posts: 95
    that someone interested in the high-end x3/fx is going to decide to go the suburu route. Even edmunds compares the Forester to the Rav4/Tribute/etc. This is not to insult the Forester, if I had only 28K to spend I would certainly consider it. It is a lot of performance for the money. Of course, at 28K, I might go for the Murano, but that's a whole other issue!
  • saugataksaugatak Posts: 488
    i think it's not a bad idea to stick the forester in the comparo. it's not a luxury vehicle but neither is the X3, although the X3 is a premium vehicle.

    a lot of times when i'm looking at a "premium" vehicle i start wondering, why am i paying this premium? how much extra car am i getting for my money? and when i compare the premium vehicle to the best of the slightly downmarket vehicles, my answer often turns out to be, not a lot.

    i'm not too familiar with subaru but people who like 'em really like 'em a lot so i'd be interested in hearing their observations.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Posts: 5,751
    "and when i compare the premium vehicle to the best of the slightly downmarket vehicles, my answer often turns out to be, not a lot."

    Well that's the whole value equation. Might was well include every type of SUV/SAV in the comparo. saugatak you are absolutely right in the scheme of things a RAV4 or CRV would be fine. You could include all of the Subaru turbos against an X3 and say the X3/FX35/MDX loses on value, but that doesn't help anybody who is looking to purchase the vehicle.

    If anything the comparo should NOT include the Subaru, but SHOULD include the RX330, MDX etc. At least they are premium vehicles.
  • jjmanjjman Posts: 77
    subaru just doesn't have the cache of the others though I would have to say infiniti isn't quite up there with the big boys yet.
    To add to the comparo I haven't yet driven an fx but i have ridden in one and it is powerful and the seats are nice and plush. Technologywise I'd say they cancel out because both have some things that the other doesn't.

    So to sum up my objections to the fx:

    1. No Manual
    2. Heavier
    3. Interior not as good lookin (no wood options) or roomy
    4. exterior too flashy (depends on taste of beholder)
    5. not a bmw

    Maybe if the fx offered a manual and was 4k cheaper then I would consider it more
  • overtime1overtime1 Posts: 134
    I'm not saying the cars are equivalent...just that they fill a similar niche in terms of function and performance. An XT v. X3 v. FX35 would make a for a fun thread.

    BTW vsroman, I could have spent upwards of 40k (our other car is a LOADED mdx) but just couldn't get past what a fun and useful vehicle the XT was when I was shopping around and the bang-for-buck is just AMAZING. I do have to disclose that I am an XT owner so my views might have a tinge of bias ;-).

    I'm not here to crap on the X3 at all...just thought that it might be a good thing to put in the comparo since I did compare the XT to the X3/X5 and FX35/45 and Murano and S4. Those didn't offer the 'fun' I was looking for (speed over luxury) but I did consider them before making a purchasing decision.

  • Thank you for the advice, tps3. You made some excellent points and were quite helpful. I am not a BMW aficionado by any means and can use all the help I can get!
  • saugataksaugatak Posts: 488
    Just added this discussion for comparos of the above 3 vehicles. I know most of you wanted just an X3 vs FX35 thread but I threw in the XT b/c I am value-minded and am always eager to learn more about cars that provide the "fun" factor without the hefty "prestige and pay" factor.

    Besides, I've read Overtime's contributions on other boards and like what he has to say.

    jjman, I like your initial comparison of the FX35 to X3 and hope that you'll start off the discussion by reposting in the X3 vs FX35 vs XT board.
  • steverstever Posts: 52,572
    Here's the link (I tweaked the discussion some):

    BMW X3 vs Subaru Forester/XT vs Infiniti FX 35

    Steve, Host
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Posts: 5,751
    jjman - fwiw I agree with you. However, in the world of Edmunds one can cross shop any car with any other car. If you want to go strictly by the published performance numbers you can go one way. But I don't know anybody who buys a car based on 0-60.
  • erickplerickpl Posts: 2,735
    Many do... just look at those who buy the cars for street drag racing.

  • kdshapirokdshapiro Posts: 5,751
    eric - I submit they are in the minority. I should never say never, as someone, somewhere is always the exception. I have to add in my world, people are fairly conversative and won't for example, cross shop an Excursion with an Sti. But I'm sure someone, somewhere will come up with the case of why these two vehicles should be compared side-by-side.
  • clpurnellclpurnell Posts: 1,087
    The thing about the VQ is I don't have to rev it to redline to get the acceleration I want. It has gobs of torque through the entire powerband that I seldom go over 4500 rpm. Either way my mileage is going about 80-90mph on the hwy. That is effortless in the fx and still pulls 21 mpg+.

    Overtime I guess along with the BMW fanatiscim comes subaru fanatiscism too. I will see you all on the VS thread.
  • I am planning to order a x3 2.5L next week in NJ.
    The MSRP with options(moon roof & steptronic) comes to $33,620. When I last spoke to the salesman, he told he would only be able to take about 500$ off and the wait time is 2 months.

    It would be great if someone can tell how much are they are paying and what is the wait time.

    Thank you.
  • jjmanjjman Posts: 77
    sorry lakshman i think you are one of the few so you may have more info then the rest
  • vsromanvsroman Posts: 95
    interest in the 3.0, however, my dealer tells me that orders for the 2.5 far exceed the 3.0. I can't wait to here some feedback once folks start picking up their 2.5s.
  • jjmanjjman Posts: 77
    so far lakshman is one of the few interested in the 2.5 thats why his experience will help others though we can't help him. Personally I believe the 2.5 is too weak but then I have been driving nothing but 4cylinder cars so I thirst for a little power to brighten up my day. >:-|
  • vsromanvsroman Posts: 95
    I am surprised so many people are ordering the 2.5 w/o a test drive. I think many people are going to be :( about a 9.3 0-60. And it's not just 0-60, it's overall get up and go, whether passing on the highway, etc. I hope I am wrong about the 2.5's performance, because it's the 2.5 that is much more fairly priced. The 2.5 price compares directly with the FX35 price.

    If the better perfoming X3 3.0 was = in price to the FX35, I'd buy the X3. Since there is a 6K difference, I'm not so sure.
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