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I know the the Fusion/Milan are identical. But were are the Mercury Milan Reviews. I'm very interested in hearing what the so called "experts" have to say about a Mercury.
the brochure says "late availability" under the MPG ratings for the 4 cyl AT. Not quite sure if that means the model will be late, or just the results.
They switched from the 4 speed AT to the 5 speed AT at the last minute which meant they had to go back through the EPA certification. Not sure if that means that production will be delayed or not - it's possible.
Actually, the price difference is even more than that, since you didn't add the Audiophile stereo system. The Sonata V6 LX comes with a stereo system that includes subwoofer. That brings the Milan up to $ 26,290.
You would need to purchase an extended warranty for the Milan, plus still miss out on major unavailable features from the Hyundai like VSC and the Shiftronic transmission and significantly more powerful V6 engine.
Regardless, it is abundantly clear that the Milan is not priced lower than the Sonata even when the Milan has somewhat less equipment. The original poster obviously was mistaken about the claim of identical equipment having a lower price on the Milan than Sonata.
The Sonata V6 LX comes with a stereo system that includes subwoofer.
According to Hyudai's site that subwoofer and the 6-disc CD changer are part of the "Package 3" option group which also includes a moonroof and not standard. Not sure if that's what you meant or not.
Be careful when comparing stereos in automobiles. My '04 Mazda6 has the crappy BOSE audio system in it and it can't hold a candle to the MACH 300 system in our 2005 Escape nor is it better than the base stereo we had in our former '02 Escape. If you were to choose between the two without hearing them which brand would you go with?
My point is, the standard stereo in the Fusion might very well be better than the upgraded unit in the Hyundai or vice versa.
The subwoofer comes with it with Package 3, but we are comparing the price of the Sonata LX with Package 3 anyway, so for this purpose, it comes with it and the Milan should be optioned with the subwoofer stereo system also.
There is no way to compare them exactly since they are not exactly the same, but this is matching them as close as you can with the available options on both. It will be subjective which stereo sounds better, just like it is subjective what styling looks better or what colors are better. Even if the Milan audiophile system is better, it is the closest match, just like you cannot exactly match the power of the Hyundai engine or it's Shiftronic. They are both V6s with automatics, but they have different engines and transmissions with different attributes.
Yes, production of Fusions and Mllans with th 5 speed AT is delayed, I've heard 'til late October, and 90+ days from Job 1. Don't know which is accurate but I wouldn't count on any deliveries before the snow flies up here. It's a shame that they don't make the traction control available on the 4 cyl. models too, it's really handy in a Michigan winter I wonder if stability control will be available on the 4 cyl. models when and if they introduce, it was listed as a "future option" on the Fusion site several months ago. I'm not ready to trade my Montego in for a few more years anyway.
No AT/4-cylinder at launch is going to hurt sales. GM made the same mistake with the G6 by launching it without the 4-cylinder. I give them credit for switching to the 5-speed AT, but that should have been part of the plan to begin with. Please Ford, don't muck it up!
No AT/4-cylinder at launch is going to hurt sales. GM made the same mistake with the G6 by launching it without the 4-cylinder.
I'm guessing this is less [of a mistake] than you may think. If there is one engine/tranny combo that could be delayed 90 days, it's the rent-a-car 4cyl auto. Usually, it's the manual transmission model that gets held out but I think Ford realizes the importance of conquest sales from young buyers currently driving imports (and if the image of old folks driving 59 in the fast lane with the 4cyl. auto version is the first seared into the minds of that demographic, the Fusion/Milan twins are doomed).
In marketing speak, early adopters (these will be the folks buying the first 90 days worth of Fusions and Milans) tend to be the young (think manual trans.) and/or more well off (think fully optioned V6s). I don't see many early adopters lining up for 4cyl. autos and, I suspect, neither does Ford. What's 90 days anyway? But enough slushbox talk...
I am excited! Up to this point, if you needed a midsize with a manual, the import dealers were the only game in town. For one, I've been buying imports not because I've wanted to, but because I've had to. All things being the same, I'd rather drive an American make, but all things haven't been the same. And when it comes down to buying an import with a stick or a domestic with a slushbox, I'll take the former every time.
Now if Ford REALLY wants to capture some conquest sales, they'd throw an extra $500 or so in gas rebates on the stick models with fuel prices where they're at. The way I see it, they will have no trouble selling this car in V6 auto guise to folks downsizing from domestic SUVs. But few people think "economy" (or fun for that matter) when they think Ford sedan and thus I see them having some difficulty getting import owners upsizing from Civics and Corollas to consider the Fusion as a possible alternative to the Camcord. Sure, the margins probably stink on the stick models already, but how else are you going to get wary import owners to take a look at a new Ford? They need to light some fires under import owners' butts.
since that is what I want, it could work out if there is a initial oversupply of manuals (the opposite of what usually happens). At least I should be able to find one to drive!
You do make some valid points and perhaps I am overestimating the number of 4-cylinder/auto combinations they'll sell. People buying domestic mid-sizers usually do opt for the V6. Conversely, a LOT of Camrys, Accords and Altimas are sold with 4-cylinders and automatics.
I know Ford is going after "conquest" sales of import buyers and a lot of them will be wanting the 4-cylinder/auto combo. Perhaps the dealers will do a good job of steering them to V6 models that are reasonably priced? Maybe they'll build some V6 models that aren't loaded to the gills to keep the price reasonable.
It might prove to be a plus for those of us who prefer a stick. I'm hoping the dealers will have some in stock to test and maybe offer some deals after the initial excitement wears off.
The take rate on Camry and Accord V6s for their current generations is about 1 4 cylinder to every 3 or 4 V6 cars, putting the percentage at about 20 to 25%. Just an FYI.
New Camry will likely have the 166 hp (revised, accurate SAE figure) 4 cylinder that is being debuted in the RAV4, along with a 5A as standard. The V6 is likely the 268 horse 3.5L coupled to the revised 5A that is in the Avalon.
Along with the revised and currently available Accord, the impressive new Sonata, and these dapper new Fords, this is a very interesting segment.
I think you have that backwords. IIRC< they sell about 75-80% 4 cyls, and 20-25% 6's.
Considering that my local dealers are still talking end of this week/early next week for them to actually show up, there won't be much of a delay until the 4AT shows up anyway!
I bet a lot of people who are trading a current V6 will seriously consider a 4 this time around. I traded out of an Accord 4 that got 28/33 mpg to a Mazda6S that gets 20/24 (if you're nice to it)- some days as I gas up and watch the meter spin out of control I wish I had the Accord back. It wasn't quick, but no slug, either- just ample transportation.
IMHO if the speculation is that Ford is out to get young, flashy, aggressive drivers to switch from Civics and other imports early in the Fusion life cycle then we should expect to see some sort of coordinated launch of appearance and performance kits. If this was a priority then there should have been plenty of time to share spec's with developers of of that sort of hardware and software and perhaps even an application engineering team to help the big/popular vendors of such wares to have toys ready to support the base product launch. And the kits might oughta be readily available at the dealer (ala Scion) - or at least be available from the sales team as referrals. Maybe there'll be synchronized launches of marketing campaigns from the aftermarket?
I'm not in or near the car business. So this may be far off base. Do any of you guys out there who seem to be closer have any insight how Ford might be pursuing this avenue into "coolness"?
This is a Taurus replacement with an automatic that gives you the choice of D and L. They should be looking at the aging Focus for buyers cross-shopping Scions.
They've already had Funkmaster Flex trick out a Fusion and the website lets you do "fusion" photos - "fusing" two photos into one. So I'd say their advertising is definitely going that way. As for the aftermarket, they certainly have the ability to coordinate aftermarket parts before the car leaves the factory - witness the 05 mustang. Whether they've done it here probably depends on whether the aftermarket companies think there is a market for it.
Thanks for the clarification. I knew that the 4-cylinder was by far the bigger seller on Accords and thought it was so on the Camry as well.
Like I said earlier, hope this doesn't hinder too many Fusion sales. I think they've got a great car on their hands and a strong value, but it doesn't matter if people can't get the engine/tranny combo they want.
Now all they need to do is make a manual transmission available with the V6. Does anyone know if there is any plan to mate a manual with the upcoming 3.5L Duratec in any model?
IMHO if the speculation is that Ford is out to get young, flashy, aggressive drivers to switch from Civics and other imports early in the Fusion life cycle then we should expect to see some sort of coordinated launch of appearance and performance kits.
Well, not that young I suspect. I think I read somewhere that Ford's target was the 25-40 group. Tuners are 25 and under. By and large, this group shows a penchant for buying and modifying used compacts. Not too many can afford $20K cars (unless they get creative with financing) and if they can, they're probably looking at sport coupes rather than midsize sedans. Young is relative in the world of auto sales. As far as new car sales go, 35 is considered very young.
I have no idea what this Flexy Funkmeister Fusion is all about. Is Flexy a band or something? And if so, what the heck ever happened to good music? Thank God I have a vast library of Depeche Mode, New Order and Smiths albums to fall back on.
An SVT Fusion really has my interest. Ford hasn't had an exciting sedan since the demise of the Contour SVT which was a great car in itself. Ford/Lincoln/Mercury don't really have an sport sedans worth the name. The LS was the only one but it is outdated and no longer in production.
Too bad the Falcon isn't available for LHD, otherwise such a powerful car would do wonders for Ford's image.
Au contraire - the LS is still in production for the upcoming model year (06).
I think it's almost a given that we'll see a SVT Fusion in another year or two. The Mazdaspeed6 parts are already there for the taking. A high ouput 3.5L putting out 275 hp would be nice and would differentiate it from the Mazdaspeed6.
a couple showed up today at one of the local dealers. Good thing I happened to stop by.
Took a quick spin in an SE 5 speed. Very nice car. Seems pretty quick, excellent ride/handling, nice firm responsive steering. Also quite roomy inside, with lots of neat features. My daughter really loved the info center display.
Best thing is, the seats were great. Driver's was very comfy, roomy enough to not be constraining but with side support, perfect adjustable lumbar, and the bottom cushion was nice and long for thigh support. The front even tilted up higher than I wanted, which is very rare.
At least I know what my next car is going to be. Now just have to pick a color and work a deal.
A guess getting out of third gear on a test drive would be a good idea (I just kind spun around the back lot), but I know how nice the drivetrain is in the Mazda, and the seats and interior sold me. That, and my daughter really liked it!
What part of the country do you live in? I've been looking to drive one in the DC area for awhile now. They are shown in the FordDirect.com web site as being in inventory, but they have not shown up on the dealers lots yet. (I know, when they are released to transport they go on the web.)
just outside Phila. I happened to stop at one of the largest dealers in the area (Holman), and the guy said they usually get thing sfirst because they are so big.
They should be everywhere by the end of this week, beginning of next week at the latest.
Priobably will have a more normal full stock condition by the end of October (depending on how fast they go out!)
I don't know how much pent up demand there is for the Fusion, but IMO once review are out and word of mouth (plus seeing some on the road) gets going, they will sell well.
Has two Milan's in stock. One a 4 cyl.- 5 speed and a V-6 auto. I sat in the 5-speed car and it seemed pretty nice. I'm going to go back and drive one next week.
2012 Mustang Premium, 2013 Lincoln MKX Elite, 2007 Mitsubishi Outlander.
sat in a loaded V6 today at another dealer (no drive, it was inside). Interior is similar to the SE, with a few gadgets added (analog clock ala Infiniti, auto CC). The leather seats were pretty soft, and perforated, but very comfortable. Nicer than the leather on our Odyssey.
I still like the SE. I don't really need or want the stuff included on the SEL the best as I can tell, so I might as well save the $. I also will probably stay with the cloth for this car. The fabric seems very nice, hopefully it will wear well.
Just got back from Mercury dealer in Troy, MI (Detroit suburb). They had two Milans in stock. Got to sit in the red one, which was being prepped. Much more leg room that I had anticipated (I'm 6'2", with long legs).
Seemed quite nice (didn't drive it). Did notice that the upward sloping rear deck was fairly high. A little difficult to see out the back window because of that, but probably not a deal breaker.
All in all it looks nice. Will test drive in a few weeks.
Sat in one tonight - the Tungsten Silver is a GREAT color, especially with the dark charcoal interior. It had much more room than I expected and the trunk is huge. Just have to drive one and figure out the details, but I think I'm sold on a loaded SEL V6.
Went into the local dealer today looking at 500's and was just blown away by the 1 and only Fusion they had in stock. A black SEL and 2 hours later was driving it off the lot. Wow what a nice driver, doesn't look bad either. Looks like Ford has a winner here.
I am so disappointed to learn, after I let my son take over my V6 Contour 5-speed, that a v6 5speed is an automatic. I did love driving my Contour; and 4 out of 5 my friends that also bought one, - were manual transmission. I thought the 'auto one' drove like an old Buick, in comparison. I should try to be more knowledgeable, before I set my mind on a new vehicle.
The V6 Fusion is a 6-speed auto. I too am a stick and biggest engine they got guy so the Fusion is out for me. Take a look at the Mazda6 for something similar with a V6 and a stick.
From the Edmund's Review; " clear-corner taillights lend the Fusion a hint of street-racer style". OK fine, but its a stretch for promotional journalism. But the car is not, nor is the target market in any way interested.
I dislike tailights that look like a cross between aluminum foil and sun bleached lenses after years in a junkyard, and to me its a deal breaker (as it was for the Altima). Otherwise the car has appeal. So when a traditional taillight option arrives, or the aftermarket makes one available, I'll be interested.
There will be no aftermarket part that will make the lights look "traditional." There are bigger issues that can be deal breakers on this car than rear tail light lenses. If that is the "only" problem with the car to you, seems odd to make a buying decision based only on that one item.
You might consider looking at the Milan. Its looks are more subdued, particularly with the taillights, which are LEDs. I will say that I think Ford used all the leftover Cadillac Catera taillights on the Milan. Not an exact match, but that's what it reminds me of.
Overall, I'll likely be buying a Milan. Overall a nice package.
Hi I'd just like to say that i am pretty dissapointed with the Ford Fusion. I've seen it and it looks like a half-assed version of the 2003 Ford 427 concept. I would have definitley liked that car a lot more than the Fusion. Also, that Mercury Milan looks great I really like its styling. The taillights remind me of the Seat Leon.
just curious, but what are the "bigger issues" that can be deal breakers that you refer to? I haven't really figured out any, so I'm curious.
I guess I'm not as attuned to taillights. I noticed them, but they didn't make much of an impression on my one way or the other. I also haven't seen a Milan yet, so I'll have to find one to compare.
Where in the world did you get those pictures of the Fusion? Or who altered pictures to make them look like that? Its obvious that you work for a competitor or have a malicious mind. You have made them look like a 300 which I think is a horrible looking car I think that your post should be removed.
Lots of things are bigger issues than rear tail light appearance. VSC not available. Crash test ratings not yet available (why buy now without waiting for test results?). Automatic transmission that gets negative comments in most reviews, Ford sedan resale value etc.. Even not having an AUX input jack for the stereo is more of an issue than the chrome trim around the rear taillights. So-so fuel economy with 4 cylinder only getting slightly better mileage than V6. People can use that as an excuse to get the V6, but the 4 cylinder should really do better.
Comments
Amazingly it got high water makers even though it was tested in Import heaven of Cali.
-juice
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
You would need to purchase an extended warranty for the Milan, plus still miss out on major unavailable features from the Hyundai like VSC and the Shiftronic transmission and significantly more powerful V6 engine.
Regardless, it is abundantly clear that the Milan is not priced lower than the Sonata even when the Milan has somewhat less equipment. The original poster obviously was mistaken about the claim of identical equipment having a lower price on the Milan than Sonata.
According to Hyudai's site that subwoofer and the 6-disc CD changer are part of the "Package 3" option group which also includes a moonroof and not standard. Not sure if that's what you meant or not.
Be careful when comparing stereos in automobiles. My '04 Mazda6 has the crappy BOSE audio system in it and it can't hold a candle to the MACH 300 system in our 2005 Escape nor is it better than the base stereo we had in our former '02 Escape. If you were to choose between the two without hearing them which brand would you go with?
My point is, the standard stereo in the Fusion might very well be better than the upgraded unit in the Hyundai or vice versa.
There is no way to compare them exactly since they are not exactly the same, but this is matching them as close as you can with the available options on both. It will be subjective which stereo sounds better, just like it is subjective what styling looks better or what colors are better.
Even if the Milan audiophile system is better, it is the closest match, just like you cannot exactly match the power of the Hyundai engine or it's Shiftronic.
They are both V6s with automatics, but they have different engines and transmissions with different attributes.
I'm guessing this is less [of a mistake] than you may think. If there is one engine/tranny combo that could be delayed 90 days, it's the rent-a-car 4cyl auto. Usually, it's the manual transmission model that gets held out but I think Ford realizes the importance of conquest sales from young buyers currently driving imports (and if the image of old folks driving 59 in the fast lane with the 4cyl. auto version is the first seared into the minds of that demographic, the Fusion/Milan twins are doomed).
In marketing speak, early adopters (these will be the folks buying the first 90 days worth of Fusions and Milans) tend to be the young (think manual trans.) and/or more well off (think fully optioned V6s). I don't see many early adopters lining up for 4cyl. autos and, I suspect, neither does Ford. What's 90 days anyway? But enough slushbox talk...
I am excited! Up to this point, if you needed a midsize with a manual, the import dealers were the only game in town. For one, I've been buying imports not because I've wanted to, but because I've had to. All things being the same, I'd rather drive an American make, but all things haven't been the same. And when it comes down to buying an import with a stick or a domestic with a slushbox, I'll take the former every time.
Now if Ford REALLY wants to capture some conquest sales, they'd throw an extra $500 or so in gas rebates on the stick models with fuel prices where they're at. The way I see it, they will have no trouble selling this car in V6 auto guise to folks downsizing from domestic SUVs. But few people think "economy" (or fun for that matter) when they think Ford sedan and thus I see them having some difficulty getting import owners upsizing from Civics and Corollas to consider the Fusion as a possible alternative to the Camcord. Sure, the margins probably stink on the stick models already, but how else are you going to get wary import owners to take a look at a new Ford? They need to light some fires under import owners' butts.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I know Ford is going after "conquest" sales of import buyers and a lot of them will be wanting the 4-cylinder/auto combo. Perhaps the dealers will do a good job of steering them to V6 models that are reasonably priced? Maybe they'll build some V6 models that aren't loaded to the gills to keep the price reasonable.
It might prove to be a plus for those of us who prefer a stick. I'm hoping the dealers will have some in stock to test and maybe offer some deals after the initial excitement wears off.
New Camry will likely have the 166 hp (revised, accurate SAE figure) 4 cylinder that is being debuted in the RAV4, along with a 5A as standard. The V6 is likely the 268 horse 3.5L coupled to the revised 5A that is in the Avalon.
Along with the revised and currently available Accord, the impressive new Sonata, and these dapper new Fords, this is a very interesting segment.
~alpha
Considering that my local dealers are still talking end of this week/early next week for them to actually show up, there won't be much of a delay until the 4AT shows up anyway!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
20 to 25% take rate on the V6s.
Sorry again!
~alpha
I'm not in or near the car business. So this may be far off base. Do any of you guys out there who seem to be closer have any insight how Ford might be pursuing this avenue into "coolness"?
Like I said earlier, hope this doesn't hinder too many Fusion sales. I think they've got a great car on their hands and a strong value, but it doesn't matter if people can't get the engine/tranny combo they want.
Now all they need to do is make a manual transmission available with the V6. Does anyone know if there is any plan to mate a manual with the upcoming 3.5L Duratec in any model?
Well, not that young I suspect. I think I read somewhere that Ford's target was the 25-40 group. Tuners are 25 and under. By and large, this group shows a penchant for buying and modifying used compacts. Not too many can afford $20K cars (unless they get creative with financing) and if they can, they're probably looking at sport coupes rather than midsize sedans. Young is relative in the world of auto sales. As far as new car sales go, 35 is considered very young.
I have no idea what this Flexy Funkmeister Fusion is all about. Is Flexy a band or something? And if so, what the heck ever happened to good music? Thank God I have a vast library of Depeche Mode, New Order and Smiths albums to fall back on.
It may be an exclusive for the Lincoln Zephyr....
AWD and hybrids ARE coming for Fusion, though.
To me, the $64 question is what transmission they will use with the AWD models. The GM/Ford JV Six Speed or a CVT?
An SVT Fusion really has my interest. Ford hasn't had an exciting sedan since the demise of the Contour SVT which was a great car in itself. Ford/Lincoln/Mercury don't really have an sport sedans worth the name. The LS was the only one but it is outdated and no longer in production.
Too bad the Falcon isn't available for LHD, otherwise such a powerful car would do wonders for Ford's image.
I think it's almost a given that we'll see a SVT Fusion in another year or two. The Mazdaspeed6 parts are already there for the taking. A high ouput 3.5L putting out 275 hp would be nice and would differentiate it from the Mazdaspeed6.
Took a quick spin in an SE 5 speed. Very nice car. Seems pretty quick, excellent ride/handling, nice firm responsive steering. Also quite roomy inside, with lots of neat features. My daughter really loved the info center display.
Best thing is, the seats were great. Driver's was very comfy, roomy enough to not be constraining but with side support, perfect adjustable lumbar, and the bottom cushion was nice and long for thigh support. The front even tilted up higher than I wanted, which is very rare.
At least I know what my next car is going to be. Now just have to pick a color and work a deal.
A guess getting out of third gear on a test drive would be a good idea (I just kind spun around the back lot), but I know how nice the drivetrain is in the Mazda, and the seats and interior sold me. That, and my daughter really liked it!
Ford should do real well with this car IMHO.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
They should be everywhere by the end of this week, beginning of next week at the latest.
Priobably will have a more normal full stock condition by the end of October (depending on how fast they go out!)
I don't know how much pent up demand there is for the Fusion, but IMO once review are out and word of mouth (plus seeing some on the road) gets going, they will sell well.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Dealer just called - they're unloading 2 fusions as we speak.
I still like the SE. I don't really need or want the stuff included on the SEL the best as I can tell, so I might as well save the $. I also will probably stay with the cloth for this car. The fabric seems very nice, hopefully it will wear well.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Seemed quite nice (didn't drive it). Did notice that the upward sloping rear deck was fairly high. A little difficult to see out the back window because of that, but probably not a deal breaker.
All in all it looks nice. Will test drive in a few weeks.
I dislike tailights that look like a cross between aluminum foil and sun bleached lenses after years in a junkyard, and to me its a deal breaker (as it was for the Altima). Otherwise the car has appeal. So when a traditional taillight option arrives, or the aftermarket makes one available, I'll be interested.
There are bigger issues that can be deal breakers on this car than rear tail light lenses. If that is the "only" problem with the car to you, seems odd to make a buying decision based only on that one item.
Overall, I'll likely be buying a Milan. Overall a nice package.
Also, that Mercury Milan looks great I really like its styling. The taillights remind me of the Seat Leon.
I guess I'm not as attuned to taillights. I noticed them, but they didn't make much of an impression on my one way or the other. I also haven't seen a Milan yet, so I'll have to find one to compare.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Or who altered pictures to make them look like that? Its obvious that you work for a competitor or have a malicious mind. You have made them look like a 300 which I think is a horrible looking car
I think that your post should be removed.
http://www.fordvehicles.com/dealerships/locate/
Automatic transmission that gets negative comments in most reviews, Ford sedan resale value etc.. Even not having an AUX input jack for the stereo is more of an issue than the chrome trim around the rear taillights.
So-so fuel economy with 4 cylinder only getting slightly better mileage than V6. People can use that as an excuse to get the V6, but the 4 cylinder should really do better.