Nice to see that everyone is on friendly terms again. Now that that's over with what do we talk about now? What's the title of this topic again? Just kidding....
I just picked up my 2000 Ram QuadCab LB v10 and want to change the muffler as the truck now sounds like a sewing machine. I've been told the v10's won't sound as good as a v8 b/c of the firing order. Some muffler shops i've talked with have said the Flowmaster muffler doesn't make the truck sound very good. Has anyone changed to a more free-flowing muffler and achieved a good sound?
Installed a gibson muffler on my 97 V10 and still sounds like a 6 cylinder car. Last year Trailer Life installed a complete Borla system including headers and it still didn`t give it a v8 sound. This is the only thing I don`t like about my V10. Not to bad considering. P.S. Didn`t seem light muffler made that much different, would just leave stock exhaust alone if I were to do it again.
Someone else that did some mods to their V-10 (not sure if it was a Dodge or Ford) said the same thing. They said it made a difference, but still didn't have that throaty V-8 rumble. They said it sounded like a V-6 on steroids.
I raise my "Non-Combatant" flag, and cautiously set out these facts: I pull a 8500 lb 5th wheel with a (God forbid) '97Chev Vortac V-8. No problem at sea level or up to 1500ft. At altitude (above 3500) climbing or with strong headwinds really slow me down (35-45 MPH)So I am going to buy either a diesel or a V-10. While the Diesel can compensate for altitude with the Turbo I really don't want a diesel. All the sales material compare the diesel with the V-10 at sea level. So does anyone have experience with the V-10 with a load at altitude Vs. the diesel. Any comments? Thanks.
well i guess the V10 would be the way to go if you want less fuel mileage than you have now , everything i hear puts it in the 8 to 12 mpg when towing , especially that kind of weight , really the diesel is the way to go , there are alot of pros and cons to diesel ownership , drive one first , then check out . www.turbodieselregister.com and www.ford-diesel.com , there is alot of info to be had on both sites one big thing you will notice ,both sites are pretty well biased towards their brand ,so look at both with an open mind, the biggest reason i didn't go ford was vehicle choice , the superduty is just to big , at least the 2500 dodge is the same size as my present 1500 dodge
the TDR iced my choice to go to a cummins powered ram ,it was a tough choice , i am a speed demon , and it will take some getting used to switching to the diesel , but i think it will be worth it in the long run. good luck
Surprisingly I hear 8.5 mpg commonly when talking about pulling fifth wheels with a gas engine. The current Trailer life reviews the Lexas SUV that gets 17.5 solo yet 7.5 towing. I hear 8.5 from Dodge V10 owners and Chevy 6.0 owners. Yet the Chevy gets several more solo than the Dodge. It seems to me the air resistance of a tall fifth wheel is sort of an equalizer. I too pull currently with a 350 chevy. Guess what, I get 8.5 on average towing, 15.5 solo. I have never owned a V10 or Cummins Diesel but have a V10 on order with 4.10 rearend. I suspect if I lived in higher altitude than Ks I might have considered the Diesel more strongly. Diesels are more popular than the V10 (or is that more noticable) for towing. I hear a negative of the diesel is its initial cost, but never hear anyone say you recoup some of that when you sell it. so do you really have to keep it 100K to break even. But even though I don't plan to keep My new Dodge 45K, Cost was not my consideration. The Dodge auto needs one more gear to suit the diesel. And the diesel is loud ( which draws some), but I don't care to go back 25 year to when I thought loud pipes were cool. I hope I've made the right choice, but in 2003 or so I can correct it. I suspect all of the big three will have 5 speed autos to pick from then with quieter diesels to boot. .... Rich
I thought the new dodge allison auto trans (with the Cummins) was "supposed" to appear in 2002? I know nothing is etched in stone, but that's what I thought I've been hearing from other people...
That would be great, Chevy is planning on the Allison too. And maybe by 2003 they'll both have their act together. But Chevy's will be a "new model" of the allison 1000. I wonder if that means with cheaper parts. I guess I'm kind of pesamistic about these things. Macculock chainsaws and Coleman are a couple of top brands I've seen go sour over the years. I guess I just don't trust upper management. .. Rich
brett , don't hold your breathe on that trans option , its been the rumor for 2 years so i've been told , the latest buzz , is a japanese built 4 speed auto from AIKEN (sp)??? it is a company owned by DC that is making the trans for Freightliner , which is also owned by DC anyway its supposed to weigh in a 195 lbs and be able to handle in the neighborhood of 800-900 ft/lbs torque ... but now i went back top to the buzzwatcher , check this out , now DC is supposedly keeping the 47/re and changing software to make it live , heres the link .. www.car-truck.com/chryed/buzz/b111099.htm ... check it out , what i like is that it says i can uprate my 2000 which i should have within a month to the uprated ETH , with just a computer change . if its true i like it ...
You've got to figure that Ford will have another tranny for their new diesel, but I haven't heard any rumors as to what it might be. The new 6.0L PSD is suppose to put out 550 ft-lb of torque. I know the Ford auto is only rated to 500 and that's pushing it.
The difference in quickness between the diesels and the gassers may be getting smaller. The Duramax from Chevy and the new Ford diesel are both supposedly going to have more than 300 hp. That's more horses than my 99 Ford V-10. I think it will get harder for me to justify another gasser when I'm ready to buy again in 5-6 years.
I've nothing but good things about the power of the Dodge V-10. It's definitely got more torque and horses than the 99 Ford V-10. As for mpg, if you got the 3.54 (or 3.55?), I think you can hit that empty mpg figure. Even with the 4.10, you should be close. I've got a 1 ton dually 4x4 with my Ford V-10 with a 4.30 rearend and I can get close to 12 running empty. The guys with the SRW 2wd and 3.73 are getting 2+ mpg better than me and the 2000 V-10s appear to be doing even better. I was counting on 10-12 empty and 8-10 towing and I'm pretty much right on target. I'll be interested to hear your tow mpg. That load is bigger than what I carry, although we obviously carry it different.
The Dodge V10 is now 310 hp(305 in NY & Cal.)and 450 ftpds. This is basically the same engine that lives in the Viper,just detuned because Chrysler doesn't have an auto tranny to hold it. In it's pre-production incantation for the Viper it produced in the nieghborhood of 750 hp. The Viper produces 450 hp & 490 ftpds. of torque with the same engine,it has a 6 speed no auto. This means that I hope Chevy or Ford do produce an engine to challenge it,it will force Dodge to produce a tranny to hold an upgrade. I am shopping for a new truck and so far nothing I drove seems to touch the V10. When pulling a heavy load,there is no substitute for torque and correct gearing.
No offense but I think if Chrysler made S#!T on a stick you'd say it was the best. While I favor Fords and drove ALL of them. The G.M. 6.0l clearly had more acceleration empty than both Ford and Dodge V-10's. Unless your test drive allowed you to hook up a 10,000 lbs. load I'm not sure I agree with your comment. Also could not tell any seat of the pants difference between the V-10's. Your g-force meter must be calibrated better than mine.
For instance I have a '97 Cobra I know Firebirds and Camaros are faster. Will most likely order V10 Ford for many reasons but know the 6.0l G.M. motor in the lighter truck is also faster. The 5.4l Ford in many tests has shown to be quicker than Chevy and your Dodge. I'm open to all vehicles and try not to buy on brand loyalty alone. From your posts it seems Mopar is better than everything, period end of discussion. I actually like Dodge trucks but from friends experiences that have been repeated many times on these posts I ruled them out. Again, no disrespect intended.
I too suspect the Chevy 6.0 is faster than the Ford V10, but I hope folks aren't basing it soling on the Motortrend TV show where the Ford had the standard 3.73 and the Chevy the optional 4.10 . Not exactly apples to apples. I have test drove both and I doubt if theres much difference with equal axles. Havn't driven a Dodge v10 with the 4.10 but it also isn't very quick with the 3.54 . But its difficult to compare the three as the Chevy is lighter and has several thousand pound less towing capacity when similarly equiped. Also the show was for 99's where the Ford had 25 less horse power than 2000. ...... Rich
but I think Road and Track did a V-10 comparo in '99 and even with a heavier truck, less horsepower and torque, the Ford was DEAD EVEN in all performance tests. They said it was because of the torque curve more than anything. I couldn't find the article in the archives so take it for what it's worth. I'm not basing my opinion on that alone,however. The Ford offers a crew cab, rear disc brakes(over the Dodge) and a full floating rear axle(over the chevy)Features I like which may mean nothing to someone else.
Truck Trend did a comparison of the V-10's and the Ford was, like, .1 sec behind when empty, but actually beat the Dodge when loaded. They were very impressed especially since the Ford is a much smaller motor. This article is not online yet, but I'll try to find my back issue and give you guys all of the details.
But with the truck trend article did they give detail of the ford vs dodge as far as rear end ratio? So many of these test are squewed because they make no effort to get identically equiped vehicles. I've even seen comparisons of vehicles where one is stick and the other auto in the past. And they leave out pertainant details for the reader to be able to make a judgement. How could you compare a Dodge with a 3.55 vs Ford with 4.30? But even standard the Dodge is 3.54 to Ford 3.73. The Dodge optional is 4.10 vs the Ford 4.30. I guess thats because the Dodge has much more torque (450).
Most test I've seen are not apples to apples. I've seen test where Ford is penalized for having a higher tow rating. Instead of trying to get the most equal trucks as far as cab size, axle ratio, tranny, etc., they tried to match the tow ratings. In one of the test I saw (it may have been the Truck Trend test), they ended up matching a 3.73 axle ratio in the Ford vs 4.10 in the Dodge.
It seems to me that the apples to apples test has to be 3.73 vs 3.55 or 4.30 vs 4.10 because those are the two offerings by each manufacter. I suspect that Dodge will eventually come out with something in the 3.73 range for their 3/4 and 1 ton trucks, but for now, they don't have that option. I've heard the reason that Ford went with the 4.30 in the V-10, rather than the 4.10 they offer in the 5.4L V-8 and the PSD, is because the 4.10 didn't work right with their V-10 because of the two extra cylinders.
Anyway, a good equal test in my opinion for towing purposes would be a 3/4 ton extended cab Dodge V-10 4x4 with 4.10 and auto trans vs Ford 3/4 ton extended cab V-10 4x4 with 4.30. Run them empty and make comparisons and then strap a fifth wheel on them that has a weight equal to the max tow rating of the lowest rated of the two trucks. For example, if the Ford with that setup has a 13,500 and the Dodge has a 13,000, hook a 13,000 pound fifth wheel up to both. My guess is that both trucks fare pretty equal.
If you want to test the Chevy 6.0, get a 3/4 ton extended cab 4x4 with the 4.10 and auto trans. and do the same thing. The max tow rating of the Chevy will obviously be less, so both the Dodge and Ford will get to strap on fifth wheels that will be well below their max tow ratings. I think you can be pretty certain that, although the Chevy will have no problem holding it's own running empty, it won't fare as well as the V-10s with a max tow load. Now, if you just want to strap a 5000 pound boat on for the test, the 6.0L Chevy should still do fine compared to the V-10s because all three vehicles will be well below their two ratings. If last months Trailer Life Magazine is to be believed, the 6.0L won't do much better in mpg. The article was generally a positive article for their test truck (2000 Silverado 6.0L 4x4 with 4.10), but they said their max mpg running empty was 13.8 on flat interstate and they got 9.5 towing.
As far as I can remember, they were evenly matched (well, as evenly as you can get when comparing across brands). However, like I said, I'll have to find the actual article so I can give you guys all of the numbers. Maybe someone else has the old article, too, and can dig it up before I get a chance.
I have a Dodge 3/4 V10 on order with auto and 4.10 rearend. But also I am getting the (new for 2000 ) LT265 tires. Their larger diameter will give me the equivalant of a 3.73 when compared to the Dodge 4.10 with LT245 tires. I am losing some acceleration but don't mind as I feel the truck has plenty to spare and I like the looks of the slightly larger tire. Another point about tow ratings. Dodge gives the same rating wether 3.54 or 4.10 . whereas Chevy and Ford give different tow ratings for the 6.0 or 6.8 V10 depending on the axle ratio. Several Dodge salesmen tried to get me to accept a 3.54 they had on the lot saying they will pull as much. But I beg to differ and told them so. Yes all three may handle the same weight no matter what the rearend ratio, but a lower gear will allow a person to accelerate a little quicker on an access ramp etc. And when your talking about a tow rating there is more to it than when the axle will break. Acceleration and braking also play a roll. And stability in the wind going down the road. .... Rich
It's sort of Ironic that a higher numerical gear is actually a tad weaker than a lower numerical gear in the same housing due to number of teeth etc. I think the reason for different ratings is due to strain on trannys and engine torque specs more so than the strength of the rear axle. Lugging an auto trans is about the worst thing you can do. Same with slipping a clutch too much to get a load moving.
With a lower gear in the dodge (4.10) the engine is turning more rpm for a given speed, which allows it to run smoother and develope more power. There is also less strain on the transmission but more on the rearend as you say. But my least concern is the rearend which is the easiest to beef up. My biggest concern with the Dodge is the transmission (auto) although I've never met anyone at a camp ground that had transmission problems with their Dodge. ....... Rich
With the 4.10, you will be able to cruise in a higher gear longer when towing before the engine needs to downshift. With the 4.30 in my Ford with my slide-in camper on, it takes a pretty good hill before my truck needs to downshift out of OD. Running empty, it takes a pretty steep incline before I drop out of OD. The trade-off of having the 4.10 or 4.30 axle ratio is at least 1mpg when running empty compared to the alternative axle ratio.
Comments
I pull a 8500 lb 5th wheel with a (God forbid) '97Chev Vortac V-8. No problem at sea level or up to 1500ft. At altitude (above 3500) climbing or with strong headwinds really slow me down (35-45 MPH)So I am going to buy either a diesel or a V-10. While the Diesel can compensate for altitude with the Turbo I really don't want a diesel. All the sales material compare the diesel with the V-10 at sea level. So does anyone have experience with the V-10 with a load at altitude Vs. the diesel. Any comments? Thanks.
the TDR iced my choice to go to a cummins powered ram ,it was a tough choice , i am a speed demon , and it will take some getting used to switching to the diesel , but i think it will be worth it in the long run. good luck
Brett
The difference in quickness between the diesels and the gassers may be getting smaller. The Duramax from Chevy and the new Ford diesel are both supposedly going to have more than 300 hp. That's more horses than my 99 Ford V-10. I think it will get harder for me to justify another gasser when I'm ready to buy again in 5-6 years.
JJ
It seems to me that the apples to apples test has to be 3.73 vs 3.55 or 4.30 vs 4.10 because those are the two offerings by each manufacter. I suspect that Dodge will eventually come out with something in the 3.73 range for their 3/4 and 1 ton trucks, but for now, they don't have that option. I've heard the reason that Ford went with the 4.30 in the V-10, rather than the 4.10 they offer in the 5.4L V-8 and the PSD, is because the 4.10 didn't work right with their V-10 because of the two extra cylinders.
Anyway, a good equal test in my opinion for towing purposes would be a 3/4 ton extended cab Dodge V-10 4x4 with 4.10 and auto trans vs Ford 3/4 ton extended cab V-10 4x4 with 4.30. Run them empty and make comparisons and then strap a fifth wheel on them that has a weight equal to the max tow rating of the lowest rated of the two trucks. For example, if the Ford with that setup has a 13,500 and the Dodge has a 13,000, hook a 13,000 pound fifth wheel up to both. My guess is that both trucks fare pretty equal.
If you want to test the Chevy 6.0, get a 3/4 ton extended cab 4x4 with the 4.10 and auto trans. and do the same thing. The max tow rating of the Chevy will obviously be less, so both the Dodge and Ford will get to strap on fifth wheels that will be well below their max tow ratings. I think you can be pretty certain that, although the Chevy will have no problem holding it's own running empty, it won't fare as well as the V-10s with a max tow load. Now, if you just want to strap a 5000 pound boat on for the test, the 6.0L Chevy should still do fine compared to the V-10s because all three vehicles will be well below their two ratings. If last months Trailer Life Magazine is to be believed, the 6.0L won't do much better in mpg. The article was generally a positive article for their test truck (2000 Silverado 6.0L 4x4 with 4.10), but they said their max mpg running empty was 13.8 on flat interstate and they got 9.5 towing.
And when your talking about a tow rating there is more to it than when the axle will break. Acceleration and braking also play a roll. And stability in the wind going down the road. .... Rich
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